Guild Wars 2

Fire = AoE Burn
Air = AoE Blind
Earth = AoE Bleed
Water = AoE… heal? Why?

1. AoE Chill when you dodge in Water Attunement fits with what the other 3 Attunements do.

2. It would make the trait less of a must-have for every situation/build.

3. It would allow other traits in Water/Arcane to be buffed or reworked to make them more interesting.

I kinda agree and maybe that they change the trait stop drop and roll (or whatever its called) gets turned in a defensive evasive aarcana while making original more offensive. But this is justmy oopinion.

And it would nerf the elementalist extremly hard. Heal is his only defense.

I would prefer it too, if you leave an ice field (little bit smaller than staff water 4) when dodge rolling, but not as long as you need your heal so desperatly. Give the elementalist the healing ripple permanently as a passive when attuning to water, maybe 50% weaker, then you can take this heal away. With the 15 points minor traits (sun spot, discharge, magnetic wave, healing ripple) as a passive, like it was once in beta, elementalists wouldn’t be forced anymore to spend points on water and arcana. But if you take this heal away now, every elementalist would have to have 15 points in water, because otherwise he becomes unplayable.

Well if they changed water dodge trait to a defensive evasive arcana it won’t nerf them that hard. So water dodge is healing ripple and in another attunements something defensive. I don’t think that will give too much problems. You can then choose between the offensive one in 30 arcana and a defensive one in 20 water

The reason water and arcana feel mandatory are because of the important stats on top of nice traits.
Lowest hp bracket=need more vitality and heals= water
All builds need swapping=intelligence=arcana (except for fresh air and burst builds)

The line would still feel as mandetory tbh, this is just nerfing EA, which is only used for the heal and blast finish as it is. Doing this would just turn things into a “don’t spec past 20 unless you’re running arcane or staff bunker” situation.

Navzar.2938:

The reason water and arcana feel mandatory are because of the important stats on top of nice traits.
Lowest hp bracket=need more vitality and heals= water
All builds need swapping=intelligence=arcana (except for fresh air and burst builds)

The line would still feel as mandetory tbh, this is just nerfing EA, which I feel competes with elemental surge fairly well as it is.

Who in their right mind would take Elemental Surge over Evasive Arcana…?

OP do you even use evasive arcana..?

or better yet, do you even play an ele?

Somoe.3621:

Navzar.2938:

The reason water and arcana feel mandatory are because of the important stats on top of nice traits.
Lowest hp bracket=need more vitality and heals= water
All builds need swapping=intelligence=arcana (except for fresh air and burst builds)

The line would still feel as mandetory tbh, this is just nerfing EA, which I feel competes with elemental surge fairly well as it is.

Who in their right mind would take Elemental Surge over Evasive Arcana…?

It’s better than EA when running arcane wave and power.

It’s better than EA when running arcane wave and power.

Elemental surge is crap. There is no senseful possibility to specc into condition dmg, not as long as there aren’t any useful traits to traits to support it. EA > ES in absolutly every point. EA gives you a blast finisher, that’s extremly important and useful for team play and for stacking might especially. It offers you strong defense with it’s healing and it’s crippling when using the earth dodge and sometimes its even useful just to inflict burn.

Navzar.2938:

Somoe.3621:

Navzar.2938:

The reason water and arcana feel mandatory are because of the important stats on top of nice traits.
Lowest hp bracket=need more vitality and heals= water
All builds need swapping=intelligence=arcana (except for fresh air and burst builds)

The line would still feel as mandetory tbh, this is just nerfing EA, which I feel competes with elemental surge fairly well as it is.

Who in their right mind would take Elemental Surge over Evasive Arcana…?

It’s better than EA when running arcane wave and power.

trying to fit 2 arcanes in your utilities already makes it worse.

Razor.6392:

Navzar.2938:

Somoe.3621:

Navzar.2938:

The reason water and arcana feel mandatory are because of the important stats on top of nice traits.
Lowest hp bracket=need more vitality and heals= water
All builds need swapping=intelligence=arcana (except for fresh air and burst builds)

The line would still feel as mandetory tbh, this is just nerfing EA, which I feel competes with elemental surge fairly well as it is.

Who in their right mind would take Elemental Surge over Evasive Arcana…?

It’s better than EA when running arcane wave and power.

trying to fit 2 arcanes in your utilities already makes it worse.

mogwow plays 2 arcanes and that guy is undoubtedly one of the best players in europe.

He uses them in his S/D build to great effect vs Team paradigm in the recent european tour finals.

You don’t use elemental surge for damage conditions.

Regardless of if yout like elemental surge or not, if EA water was a frozen burst, people mostly wouldn’t bother using it aside from blast finishers in water fields.

EA is not just used for the water heal. People also use it as a blast finisher for earth and also aoe fire puts out nice direct damage. The only weak one is the air where you have to dodge into the target to blind.

EA heal is huge to survivability. People either need it OR the 15 water trait for extra heals. If they nerf EA heal to a chill effect (it would be a complete nerf) then everyone would just spec 15 water as the new mandatory trait. That would make already crappy build diversity worse.

They need to buff our terrible traits, not nerf our only useful ones.

Mek.2947:

also aoe fire puts out nice direct damage.

It hits for 57 direct damage on a light golem :p

EA heal is huge to survivability. People either need it OR the 15 water trait for extra heals. If they nerf EA heal to a chill effect (it would be a complete nerf) then everyone would just spec 15 water as the new mandatory trait. That would make already crappy build diversity worse.
They need to buff our terrible traits, not nerf our only useful ones.

This is true, and 15 water is already close to mandetory as it is :/

Mek.2947:

EA is not just used for the water heal. People also use it as a blast finisher for earth and also aoe fire puts out nice direct damage. The only weak one is the air where you have to dodge into the target to blind.

EA heal is huge to survivability. People either need it OR the 15 water trait for extra heals. If they nerf EA heal to a chill effect (it would be a complete nerf) then everyone would just spec 15 water as the new mandatory trait. That would make already crappy build diversity worse.

They need to buff our terrible traits, not nerf our only useful ones.

If Elementalists need Healing Ripple and/or Evasive Arcana to be viable it’s unhealthy for the class as a whole and needs to be fixed. Obviously this would include reworking or buffing other traits to more evenly distribute power across the class’ trait trees.

Somoe.3621:

Mek.2947:

EA is not just used for the water heal. People also use it as a blast finisher for earth and also aoe fire puts out nice direct damage. The only weak one is the air where you have to dodge into the target to blind.

EA heal is huge to survivability. People either need it OR the 15 water trait for extra heals. If they nerf EA heal to a chill effect (it would be a complete nerf) then everyone would just spec 15 water as the new mandatory trait. That would make already crappy build diversity worse.

They need to buff our terrible traits, not nerf our only useful ones.

If Elementalists need Healing Ripple and/or Evasive Arcana to be viable it’s unhealthy for the class as a whole and needs to be fixed. Obviously this would include reworking or buffing other traits to more evenly distribute power across the class’ trait trees.

Go back to LoL please.

Somoe.3621:

Fire = AoE Burn
Air = AoE Blind
Earth = AoE Bleed
Water = AoE… heal? Why?

1. AoE Chill when you dodge in Water Attunement fits with what the other 3 Attunements do.

2. It would make the trait less of a must-have for every situation/build.

3. It would allow other traits in Water/Arcane to be buffed or reworked to make them more interesting.

That sounds like a huge nerf to a dead class.

I fail to see any logic. Just because they nerf something doesn’t mean something else gets buffed. In fact, for an ele it just means 3 more nerfs are coming.

Air Dodge: AoE Blind?
lolwut?

Somoe.3621:

Mek.2947:

EA is not just used for the water heal. People also use it as a blast finisher for earth and also aoe fire puts out nice direct damage. The only weak one is the air where you have to dodge into the target to blind.

EA heal is huge to survivability. People either need it OR the 15 water trait for extra heals. If they nerf EA heal to a chill effect (it would be a complete nerf) then everyone would just spec 15 water as the new mandatory trait. That would make already crappy build diversity worse.

They need to buff our terrible traits, not nerf our only useful ones.

If Elementalists need Healing Ripple and/or Evasive Arcana to be viable it’s unhealthy for the class as a whole and needs to be fixed. Obviously this would include reworking or buffing other traits to more evenly distribute power across the class’ trait trees.

There’s this saying “Don’t try to fix something if it ain’t broken. You might end up breaking it instead.”

As per our tooltip:

Fire Attunement – Gain Heavy damage and burning abilities.
Water Attunement – Gain superior support and healing abilitites
Air Attunement – Gain Heavy damage and control abilities.
Earth Attunement – Gain superior damage over time and defensive abilities

This means Water EA is fine but rather Air EA should be the one fixed. TBH Water and Arcana trait lines are good already, they should rework Fire Traits before “fixing” Water and Arcana.

Somoe.3621:

Mek.2947:

EA is not just used for the water heal. People also use it as a blast finisher for earth and also aoe fire puts out nice direct damage. The only weak one is the air where you have to dodge into the target to blind.

EA heal is huge to survivability. People either need it OR the 15 water trait for extra heals. If they nerf EA heal to a chill effect (it would be a complete nerf) then everyone would just spec 15 water as the new mandatory trait. That would make already crappy build diversity worse.

They need to buff our terrible traits, not nerf our only useful ones.

If Elementalists need Healing Ripple and/or Evasive Arcana to be viable it’s unhealthy for the class as a whole and needs to be fixed. Obviously this would include reworking or buffing other traits to more evenly distribute power across the class’ trait trees.

The reason we need those is because we’re in the lowest base hp bracket. So to fix this while removing either of those two, you’d have to do some serious work to rebalance it.

Somoe.3621:

3. It would allow other traits in Water/Arcane to be buffed or reworked to make them more interesting.

Explain. Because as of right now, it would be a huge nerf. I want your opinion on what you’ve said.

Horrible idea across the board and would be a pretty huge nerf. Doubtful poster plays the class.

Vaught.5198:

Razor.6392:

Navzar.2938:

Somoe.3621:

Navzar.2938:

The reason water and arcana feel mandatory are because of the important stats on top of nice traits.
Lowest hp bracket=need more vitality and heals= water
All builds need swapping=intelligence=arcana (except for fresh air and burst builds)

The line would still feel as mandetory tbh, this is just nerfing EA, which I feel competes with elemental surge fairly well as it is.

Who in their right mind would take Elemental Surge over Evasive Arcana…?

It’s better than EA when running arcane wave and power.

trying to fit 2 arcanes in your utilities already makes it worse.

mogwow plays 2 arcanes and that guy is undoubtedly one of the best players in europe.

He uses them in his S/D build to great effect vs Team paradigm in the recent european tour finals.

Is Mogwog the ele who got downed 40+ times against TP in the EU qualifier finals? He was more of a detriment to his team than a help. In WvW we call players like that “rally bait” because that’s about the extent of their contribution.

Caffynated.5713:

Vaught.5198:

Razor.6392:

Navzar.2938:

Somoe.3621:

Navzar.2938:

The reason water and arcana feel mandatory are because of the important stats on top of nice traits.
Lowest hp bracket=need more vitality and heals= water
All builds need swapping=intelligence=arcana (except for fresh air and burst builds)

The line would still feel as mandetory tbh, this is just nerfing EA, which I feel competes with elemental surge fairly well as it is.

Who in their right mind would take Elemental Surge over Evasive Arcana…?

It’s better than EA when running arcane wave and power.

trying to fit 2 arcanes in your utilities already makes it worse.

mogwow plays 2 arcanes and that guy is undoubtedly one of the best players in europe.

He uses them in his S/D build to great effect vs Team paradigm in the recent european tour finals.

Is Mogwog the ele who got downed 40+ times against TP in the EU qualifier finals? He was more of a detriment to his team than a help. In WvW we call players like that “rally bait” because that’s about the extent of their contribution.

That’s cute, he’s also the only ele to make it to the finals in a meta that’s unforgiving for eles in general. In PvP they don’t have names for wvw players because they simply don’t care.

Vaught.5198:

That’s cute, he’s also the only ele to make it to the finals in a meta that’s unforgiving for eles in general.

They would have beaten TP if Mogwog wasn’t weighing them down. Even an average necro would have pushed them over the top.

I realize you’re riding the guy’s jock, but I was actually pointing out that it doesn’t matter how good the player is when the spec is that bad. A burst ele is a liability to his team and it was made abundantly clear by how much time Mogwog spent on the ground.

In PvP they don’t have names for wvw players because they simply don’t care.

Caffynated.5713:

Vaught.5198:

That’s cute, he’s also the only ele to make it to the finals in a meta that’s unforgiving for eles in general.

They would have beaten TP if Mogwog wasn’t weighing them down. Even an average necro would have pushed them over the top.

I realize you’re riding the guy’s jock, but I was actually pointing out that it doesn’t matter how good the player is when the spec is that bad. A burst ele is a liability to his team and it was made abundantly clear by how much time Mogwog spent on the ground.

In PvP they don’t have names for wvw players because they simply don’t care.

debatable, they might not have made it to the finals without mog’s contributions in earlier rounds.

In the final TP shut mog down hard, which yeah, cost them the tournament. Im not going to pretend that they couldnt have swapped him out for a spirit ranger and probably won but it still doesn’t take away from individual skill which Mog definitely has. This is was what I was saying when I said “mog has found success using 2 arcane utilities.” Riding his jock? sure whatever, I appreciate a skilled player, if that’s a bad thing sue me.

Mek.2947:

The only weak one is the air where you have to dodge into the target to blind.

Kyon.9735:

This means Water EA is fine but rather Air EA should be the one fixed.

Not sure what you’re talking about!

If they change EA Air I’ll be a very sad panda. Ever tried dodge rolling over a downed Warrior, Guardian, Necro, Engi, or Ranger while attuned to Air? Try it pl0x. Why waste a mistform when you can blind stomp.

SonOfKrypton.4357:

Mek.2947:

The only weak one is the air where you have to dodge into the target to blind.

Kyon.9735:

This means Water EA is fine but rather Air EA should be the one fixed.

Not sure what you’re talking about!

If they change EA Air I’ll be a very sad panda. Ever tried dodge rolling over a downed Warrior, Guardian, Necro, Engi, or Ranger while attuned to Air? Try it pl0x. Why waste a mistform when you can blind stomp.

So Air EA is just for stomping? The fact that you gave a situational use of it makes it bad. If you want to keep the blind, at least make the radius of the AoE blind larger or or maybe add 1 more stack of blind. BTW you can dodge roll to avoid some #2 downed skills, why waste mist form? I only use mistform stomping when there are other enemies who can CC/burst me while stomping.

Razor.6392:

Navzar.2938:

Somoe.3621:

Navzar.2938:

The reason water and arcana feel mandatory are because of the important stats on top of nice traits.
Lowest hp bracket=need more vitality and heals= water
All builds need swapping=intelligence=arcana (except for fresh air and burst builds)

The line would still feel as mandetory tbh, this is just nerfing EA, which I feel competes with elemental surge fairly well as it is.

Who in their right mind would take Elemental Surge over Evasive Arcana…?

It’s better than EA when running arcane wave and power.

trying to fit 2 arcanes in your utilities already makes it worse.

Lightning Hammer + Arcane Power + Arcane Blast with Elemental Surge (Crazy PvP)
Start with hammer equipped then Arcane Blast in Earth for imob
Auto Attack with hammer using Arcane Power
Target immobilized for a large amount of that damage. Bring your S/F buddy to the fight, and get the 20% extra for KD damage

Frost Bow + Arcane Power (PvE)
Start with Frost Bow equipped, Frost 5 target (with a teleport for more fun)
Pop Arcane Power and jump on into fire
Frost Bow 3 for 35 seconds of burning (you heard correctly, 7×5 seconds of burning – “bug fix” inc)

Kyon.9735:

So Air EA is just for stomping?

That is one use for it. I believe you mentioned another, blind in general.

Kyon.9735:

The fact that you gave a situational use of it makes it bad.

Hmmm, I think the fact that I gave it a situational use makes it USEFUL.

Kyon.9735:

BTW you can dodge roll to avoid some #2 downed skills, why waste mist form?

You’re most certainly right. OR, I could just dodge roll in air and blind them and make their #2 skill useless.

Kyon.9735:

I only use mistform stomping when there are other enemies who can CC/burst me while stomping.

Oh wow, really? Congrats!

I only use Dragons Tooth for stomping when there are enemies who can burst me.
I like to call it: Dragons Tooth lol, run away.
If there are allies nearby, signet of air or EA dodge for a down are very useful, both provide an aoe blind. Then for backup you have air 3 on sceptre.

Heck if I’m really wanting someone dead, nothing better then Swirling Winds or Magnetic Wave (for thieves or warriors) or Obsidian Flesh. But you wont find those on daggers.

r u crazy? it’s the best insta heal we have and it also remove a condition! -.-" no need for another crap chill skill imho.

If it would become a frozen burst instead of cleansing wave, the ele needs healing ripple and signet of restoration restored to their former state to compensate – that’s for sure.

Air = AoE stun 2 seconds!

BÄM.

We would need some serious compensation if this were to happen, as we are already on the weaker side in general right now. Also, I think Anet is happy with the burst-healing that we have the capability to do, and it is good that it is all in water so that we are susceptible to counter-attacks after we leave water.

SonOfKrypton.4357:

Kyon.9735:

So Air EA is just for stomping?

That is one use for it. I believe you mentioned another, blind in general.

Kyon.9735:

The fact that you gave a situational use of it makes it bad.

Hmmm, I think the fact that I gave it a situational use makes it USEFUL.

Kyon.9735:

BTW you can dodge roll to avoid some #2 downed skills, why waste mist form?

You’re most certainly right. OR, I could just dodge roll in air and blind them and make their #2 skill useless.

Kyon.9735:

I only use mistform stomping when there are other enemies who can CC/burst me while stomping.

Oh wow, really? Congrats!

This conversation isn’t going anywhere. You aren’t really giving out any concrete answers or suggestions, instead you try to pull off pointless /sarcasm.

YOBO – You Only Blind Once.

1. People who think will spam #1 and wait for you to start stomping. They’ll use their #2 skill when you’re usually in the middle of casting stomp. Blind EA can only be used once every 9 seconds. After dodging and blinding them once, they can just hit #1 to remove that blind and still be able to pull off #2 before you finish casting the stomp.

2. Try giving out other uses for it. It only has 180 radius and gives a single stack of blind. IMO even if I have perma Vigor I’d still save my dodge for either Water or Earth EA. This applies even more in PvE. I’d rather dodge in Water/Fire/Earth for decent healing or damage instead of a single stack of blind.

Don’t be so close minded. People try to point out the flaws of a skill which you like and give suggestions then you go “I’m so Pro, have you ever tried Blah Blah Blah? It’s so OP, you don’t know how to play. 1 stack of blind is so OP, I can stomp anybody in any given situation.” and starts pulling off /sarcasm instead of giving out more informative tips.

Kyon.9735:

This conversation isn’t going anywhere.

I didn’t mean to ruin your day babe, for that I am honestly sorry!

Kyon.9735:

1. People who think will spam #1 and wait for you to start stomping.

People who think…I can’t say I come across too many of those which is why this method must work for me, haha!

Kyon.9735:

I’d rather dodge in Water/Fire/Earth for decent healing or damage instead of a single stack of blind.

Alrighty!

Kyon.9735:

Starts pulling off /sarcasm instead of giving out more informative tips.

This isn’t sarcasm! .__.
I was just contributing my experiences and thoughts to this thread the same as you were. We clearly have different opinions on the issue babe, and that’s perfectly okay with me!

You’re a cutie! n_n
I never said this, “I’m so Pro, have you ever tried Blah Blah Blah? It’s so OP, you don’t know how to play. 1 stack of blind is so OP, I can stomp anybody in any given situation.”

But I am immeasurably flattered, Kyon.9735!

But we digress! This thread is about Water Evasive Arcana, not Air!

Have a lovely day, Kyon!

- Attunejam

People can read between the lines. Whether you try to sugarcoat your words or not, it was obvious.

Anyways, my verdict was Water EA is fine, Air EA should be buffed instead. It was you who dragged this topic longer than it should have been. Seeing how you just went directly to the sarcasm route, I don’t see any need to prolong this discussion.

Whether you just went to the sarcasm route because you can’t back up your words or you are just naturally playful, we’ll never know. Have a nice day and I hope you learn how to say things straight instead of playing with words and sarcasm.

Actually, the good ones are Earth and Water. Earth offers a Blast Finishers and Water offers a good amount of heal AND a remove condition AoE.

If they would change it to a 2-3 seconds freeze, it’s not hard for me to say that I’ll just not pick this trait anymore.

It IS strong because of water and earth. Lightning and Fire are deffinately useless to me and not important.

On the other hand, if lightning would create a Lightning Field and Fire create a fire field, now I’d have more choice.

Seriously – people are complaining about the #1 most useful EA skill?

Fire roll: Trash.
Air roll: Trash.
Earth Roll: Good only for Area Might.
Water roll: Literally life saving.

The water roll is so good, they nerfed it in PvP, so that should tell you something right there. I swear, I have to shake my head at more and more topics these days…

The water dodge-roll is what makes any spec other than the burst-ele viable. Without the healing/condi clear, we are ultra-squishes that die to a light breeze.

Honest question: Are you trying to ruin elementalist?

It isn’t a good thing that you are dependent on EA. I wonder if there will ever be a time where people can make a good PvP build without going into arcana. I don’t approve of mandatory traits and traitlines is what I’m saying..

Malcastus.6240:

It isn’t a good thing that you are dependent on EA. I wonder if there will ever be a time where people can make a good PvP build without going into arcana. I don’t approve of mandatory traits and traitlines is what I’m saying..

I actually agree with this, but I don’t think nerfing EA is the way to go.

Peter Buch.8071:

And it would nerf the elementalist extremly hard. Heal is his only defense.

Huh? I don’t know how you play your elementalist, but mine has all kinds of crowd control. Is crowd control not a form of defense?

darkace.8925:

Peter Buch.8071:

And it would nerf the elementalist extremly hard. Heal is his only defense.

Huh? I don’t know how you play your elementalist, but mine has all kinds of crowd control. Is crowd control not a form of defense?

It is, but it’s not nearly effective enough to stop you from taking lots of damage.

Ryld.1340:

darkace.8925:

Peter Buch.8071:

And it would nerf the elementalist extremly hard. Heal is his only defense.

Huh? I don’t know how you play your elementalist, but mine has all kinds of crowd control. Is crowd control not a form of defense?

It is, but it’s not nearly effective enough to stop you from taking lots of damage.

Just as healing isn’t nearly effective enough to restore lots of taken damage. Staying alive usually isn’t a matter of relying on one thing. Thus I pointed out the hyperbole of the emboldened statement.

darkace.8925:

Ryld.1340:

darkace.8925:

Peter Buch.8071:

And it would nerf the elementalist extremly hard. Heal is his only defense.

Huh? I don’t know how you play your elementalist, but mine has all kinds of crowd control. Is crowd control not a form of defense?

It is, but it’s not nearly effective enough to stop you from taking lots of damage.

Just as healing isn’t nearly effective enough to restore lots of taken damage. Staying alive usually isn’t a matter of relying on one thing. Thus I pointed out the hyperbole of the emboldened statement.

I understand that, but it’s healing and control together that helps keep the Elementalist alive. You take out the healing without a ton of control, and you’re dead. You take out the control without a ton of healing, and you’re dead. Elementalists have a ton of neither and a moderate amount of both. Changing EA’s Water Dodge to a Chill is losing out on a LOT of Healing for a very small amount of control.

Losing my 2.7k heal every 10-12seconds. Sounds like no nerf at all -__-

darkace.8925:

Peter Buch.8071:

And it would nerf the elementalist extremly hard. Heal is his only defense.

Huh? I don’t know how you play your elementalist, but mine has all kinds of crowd control. Is crowd control not a form of defense?

Crowd control is a form of defense, but there are so many way to negate conditions completely, cleanse them, and use gap closers in this game …combined with the extreme short duration of them to begin with, it just isn’t as effective of a defense as it is in other games.