Guild Wars 2

Alright so my necro hit 80 and a few of my other classes (guardian, thief and Mesmer) are around 30-50’s I’m trying to learn as much about all the classes for pvp as possible.

I started my ele recently and just want to provide my feedback to the ANET devs as a brand new ele player. Please do not flame or troll this thread as I do not want this to be locked or deleted.

Previously I have watched some ele pvp videos and PVE play videos.
This info is just on m experience in leveling in PVE.

I started as a human, and right away I immediately unlocked all of my weapon skills while leveling. I had a ridiculously frustrating time taking on mobs while trying to unlock staff abilities, especially water.

I really enjoyed the attunements play style, after I became use to the spells of d/d and s/d (s/d I use for champs) I began to get a feel of swapping through the attunements and linking abilities for combos. It was a lot of fun, after I was comfortable with spells in each attunements I was blazing through the attunements using all of the abilities in combos never sticking in one attunement, my god is it such a blast, and very rewarding to learn all of that.

A few extremely important things I noticed while playing, I was being downed unbelievably fast even 1-10 (level 7 skritt bottle lobber took me from full to downed with 1 attack) I was completely caught off guard. I know my abilities and I am extremely confident in my playstyle. (I play a lot of pvp and have always done very well in PVE, not saying I’m the best but I’m confident) I ended up with a 1.2 silver armor repair fee from levels 5-10 from daily events and story. I couldn’t believe how frequently I was being downed in the beginning levels. I see a problem with this as there is really no way for a player to spec into toughness 1-10 or vitality, I ended up taking all toughness and vitality gear from my story and drops, but it wasn’t helping much. I was downed so many times that I actually died from downed penalty!? (Never experienced that in my ~250 hrs of play on 4 other professions). This might even out as I begin to acquire more trait points and place them into vitality and toughness, but I can easily see how new players coming into the game/profession could be turned off immediately without much chance to boost toughness, or vitality.

The 2nd thing that completely floored me was how rough under water fighting for my ele was. My ele’s at level 10 auto attack in fire was hitting for 6 damage… After unlocking all but the last fire ability I immediately noticed that it is impossible to kill skale ridge backs that were equal to my level! They OUTHEALED my damage, everytime I aggroe’d one of these mobs by mistake I had to run as I had no chance to kill it underwater in fire… I strongly feel that a newer player coming into the game finding out he is hitting for 6 (six) damage underwater in fire, and that he can’t even kill a skale mob that regents with the first 4 fire abilities. I didn’t even make it to unlocking the 5th as I was so frustrated that I had no chance to kill these mobs that I will never take my ele anywhere near water again.

These were points I felt were important to bring to the devs, in a constructive way, I’m not complaining, just trying to inform.

Overall I enjoy the elementalist and the class is a blast with attunement swapping as soon as able, flying through attunements cc’ing is a rewarding experience when it is nailed down, but the survivability in the early levels of the eles life, when it matters most to new players and players newly trying out this profession is so frustrating. A 1.2 silver repair free when I damaged armor piece costs 5 copper in 1-10 is pretty eye opening.

Ele is indeed hard to start, especialy underwater skills are kitten to unlock. I think that should be looken into by devs.

But once one gets over the first phase, it´s fun fun fun.

Ele is hard at the lower levels but it does get better as you get more used to the skills as well as getting gear/traits/utilities. At 80 I have no problem in underwater combat, either. It feels as versatile as staff to me with decent enough damage if you know what skills to use and enough cc to keep mobs off of me. I agree that the lower levels could be easier for sure, but until they do that I do think you should stick with it. It gets better.

Thanks for the responses, I’m glad it gets better, I’ll adapt, I really enjoy the profession so it won’t stop me from playing, but I could easily see how a new player to gw2 could be completely frustrated.

Free Advice: Level with Scepter/Dagger and spec into Air. get gear with high precision and crit %. Learn to use the powerful combos that S/D has and you will be nuking things. Use that from 10-60.

At 60-80, go full earth and water. You’ll be bleeding mobs out before they even make it to you from max range.

Lastly, Kite. Always, always kite. I see too many new Ele’s just face tanking mobs and wondering why they die so much. It’s he one class that can get destroyed in 3 hits, so you always have to keep moving.

Also @your sig: USMC 1st Battalion 10th Marines.
Thanks for your service to our country!

vitigis.4160:

Free Advice: Level with Scepter/Dagger and spec into Air. get gear with high precision and crit %. Learn to use the powerful combos that S/D has and you will be nuking things. Use that from 10-60.

At 60-80, go full earth and water. You’ll be bleeding mobs out before they even make it to you from max range.

Lastly, Kite. Always, always kite. I see too many new Ele’s just face tanking mobs and wondering why they die so much. It’s he one class that can get destroyed in 3 hits, so you always have to keep moving.

People don’t have to die if they know how to stack Vitality and/or Toughness as well as how to use CC’s and Blinds. Even with Scepter/Dagger you can fight most mobs mostly in melee if you want, provided you use your blinds, knockdowns, shields, and burst combos effectively. I mean Ele’s do need to know how to kite, but being in melee for a bit is fine if people know what they’re doing.

@Leiloni (neat name)

You can still kite in Melee range and use the blinds,etc. I’m talking about the guys that think they’re still playing their warrior/guardian just standing in front of a mob while it 2 shots them. Gotta keep moving.

Oh, and one other thing; Use your Water attunement heals early. Don’t wait until you are half dead….save that for your utility heal. Low level Ele healing just sucks

vitigis.4160:

@Leiloni (neat name)

You can still kite in Melee range and use the blinds,etc. I’m talking about the guys that think they’re still playing their warrior/guardian just standing in front of a mob while it 2 shots them. Gotta keep moving.

Yea I agree. Also what is a bit dumb is the people who solo with staff and just stand there hitting it with Fire Spells all day.

@Vitigis Thanks a ton!

I am starting to get a feel for it, my necro was way more tanky as of now, so I’m just adjusting playstyles, about the Water Heals that helps a lot. I was saving them for when I was at 50% or less, I’ll definitely start popping them earlier.

I played my necro dagger and dagger through Arah explorer (used staff on lupicus so I have the basics of melee combat and blinds, I was shooting for maybe 10 air 20 earth 20 water and 2 arcana or 30 arcana (evasive arcana just sounds kitten) 20 water 10 earth 10 air and using knights gear but I still need some more do with the class.

With this post I was just hoping to give Some feedback from an unbiased or as little biased point of view as possible, anyone else have these issues at lower lev as well?

I didnt have these problems at low level. Or most PvE in general really.
You said you tried D/D right? For me the change from staff to D/D was basically all it took for me to start decimating monsters.

fire
3, 4, 5, back off using 2. Monsters were usually dead, if not, water, 3,4,5,2 and kite with water 1 (longest range) as needed

Though, I was a charr. Im not sure how the difficulty of our starting zone stacks up to the human one.

Traiting for Lesser Elemental and summoning an elemental of your current attunement helps a ton. They will grab the agro of the mobs and divert their dps. The Earth Elemental makes a decent tank. I rarely Pve without one. Don’t use it much, but when needed it’s very handy.

I’m leveling multiple characters at once and my elementalist is I guess my main (my highest level char) and my experience is the same thing.

The problem is the way the class is designed its the frailest of all the classes. Comparatively all the other classes are much more ‘tankier’ than elementalist.

To me it seems like the class was originally designed as a ranged class but then they added the option for melee but didnt implement enough shields or toughness buffs into the melee stances. It also doesnt help that a lot of the elementalist abilities in the melee specs are also directional attacks with cast times. So even if you kite you still have to stand still and in range to actually get the abilities off. Other classes have much better blocking and shielding abilities to use while in melee range or actual multiple regen abilities that counter the damage they take while standing toe-to-toe with mobs.

In contrast the elementalist pretty much relies almost totally on stuns, chill (not that great) and speed boosts in melee which is a weakness when fighting mobs that have immunity or other players, especially when combined with the bugginess of half the stuns.

It seems they have actually delegated the class to being more of a support class which is kind of a shame. Others in this thread say that you are supposed to kite and sure I can agree with that, but the way a lot of the skills of the elementalist class work (AOE and/or directional casts/channels) makes this a lot more work that it should be especially considering that most of the skills have medium/melee range.

I personally enjoy the class just because I generally like to play casters in most MMOs. But comparatively to say Necromancers its night and day. Necros can fight groups of mobs with adds and not die due to their great regen mechanics and CC.

My solution would without totally revamping the entire class would be to give elementalists weapon swap, but at the same time only allow you to pick 3 of the five elemental attunements. This would give the class more defense, burst, AOE and healing utility but would prevent the ‘ZOMG’ OPness of having the swap with all five attunements.

The easiest way to lvl your other attunements is attunement swapping. This advice is probably to late but if you start killing something in fire you can latter swap to what you need to lvl and the kill will count to that element (as long as you land the last hit) and only that element (you wont lvl fire and x, only the last element landing the attack). I found that out the hard way trying to lvl a warrior in beta and not unlocking any skills for my weapon swap weapon (tried using auto attack then would change cause the creature was killing me)

@ oflow

It´s true that weapon skills, closer ranged sets do lack passive defenses, which indeed is torublesome when levelling, however once traits start to become more readily available they remedy that very well.
Also, the active defenses even in melee are still preferrale to passive. It´s possible to weave in and out of melee range so that your hits land while mobs can´t touch you, cripples and chills help enormously here, as do stuns etc.
Staff really is more of a support weapon, but can still handle well in solo situations too.

But yeah, to get back to the point of this thread, barrier of entry is very high, and it should be remedied somehow.
I strongly disagree with the idea that complete revamp of the mechanics is needed, especialy since good players can still shine in pve atleast.

Strang.8170:

@ oflow

It´s true that weapon skills, closer ranged sets do lack passive defenses, which indeed is torublesome when levelling, however once traits start to become more readily available they remedy that very well.
Also, the active defenses even in melee are still preferrale to passive. It´s possible to weave in and out of melee range so that your hits land while mobs can´t touch you, cripples and chills help enormously here, as do stuns etc.
Staff really is more of a support weapon, but can still handle well in solo situations too.

But yeah, to get back to the point of this thread, barrier of entry is very high, and it should be remedied somehow.
I strongly disagree with the idea that complete revamp of the mechanics is needed, especialy since good players can still shine in pve atleast.

Well I play mostly D/D have my 30 pt trait unlocked as well as my 30pt elite and like I said compared to other classes elementalists feels really frail. Its mainly due at least for me to a lot of the stuns often bugging and not going off so when you are stance dancing in a rotation missing one throws the entire thing off.

I love my elementalist but I’ll probably change my Necro to my main just because I feel like i can do a lot more with the skill set offered. My Necro can actually kite a pack of mobs around with DoTs and kill all of them without taking damage. My elementalist can do the same thing but its a struggle as far as having to do so much work to accomplish the same thing.

All these guys saying it gets easier as you get higher lvl……yeah it really,really does not-if
anything it gets harder (mobs get more health,more skills and non of the ele traits are groundbreaking or will make things easy for you) the only thing you do get is experience with the class.
As for underwater combat my advice is-DO NOT DO IT.EVER. seriously if any weapon set can be called underpowered without anyone objecting to it – it is the ele’s trident.
Water combat is torture kinda rubbing the inside of your eyelids with sandpaper while someone punches you in the balls repeatedly.
If you truly have to do it water(i know wtf?) has the biggest burst in the set with exploding skills 2 and 3 while 5 is very nice if you can hit it right-after you do that switch to whatever attument you want and mash buttons and stuff then back to water for more wosh and swosh.Things get kinda easier when you get WHOORPOALH as your elite,but that has a sick cd and has been nerfed recently cause ele’s had one useful underwater skill and that is against the design of the class.
Wrote some general pointers for S/D pve in another thread so ill just give em here for you.
CIRCLE KITE ALL THE MOBS.
No,seriously circle kiting and killing it before it kills you,for which the S/D combo is great for.
So in short what you do is-take arcane wave,arcane shield and whatever else you want for the third utility-like sig of water for those annoying conds that the risen have (remember to keybind the first two to something easy to reach-i have them on E and Q) and a flaming greatsword as the elite (best kill them b4 they kill you elite we have)NOTE:if you are fighting an veteran/champ mob take both summon glyphs and cast them in earth attu – gives you two epic tanks that can tank the vet for hours and hours.
So your average fight should go like this:
A-aggro3-5 mobs,stand in one place with the mobs around you (you should be able to take 1-2 hits from them,if you cant you are too low lvl for the content and should get moar lvlz)cast ring of fire,dragons tooth,arcane wave(instant cast ftw) then phoenix so that is hits the mobs with both the travel dmg and the end explosion dmg AND explode in the ring of fire (which is the main reason you are standing still since risen are on crack all the time and the combo is very hard to hit),you should only be standing in spot for the time it takes you to do DT and PHX after which you should dodge and keep kiting (risen are fast but they cannot hit you in melee if you are moving at normal run speed)by that time the mobs should be quite low,so line em up and hit fire grab if its off cooldown(btw you now also have 9 stacks of might for the next 30 secs from the combo so FG should hit like a truck-a very slow truck that can often miss and can only be cast once in a blue moon,but a truck non the less)and with DTooth being only 4,5secs (if traited which you should do) if thing are not dead yet throw another DT on them so they learn their place or
B-you have done everything i just said and the mob isnt dead or you want to move to the next one without waiting for cooldowns that are too long since Anet thinks we would totally be op if fire aura got a 5 sec cd reduction(oh the horror)-so enough QQing and more pew-pewing – switch to air (omg we have other attuments except fire)dont get to excited air is crap for pve-just use ride the lightning
to the next group of mobs and then go earth and start churring some earth,while hitting arcane shield (its instant so it doesnt stop the skill)in the middle of the chanel so you can soak up the hurtful comments about your fashion sense,because face it you are full grown man/norn/charr running around in a dress doing ‘magic’-if the shield explodes YAY more numbers!,after churring earth has finished casting(you should still have the 9 might stacks from the fire combo so it should hit like another truck-this one exploding or something) hit earthquake,pop the scepter skill no2 and run around auto attacking(or not whatever) and wait for them all to bleed to death.
I complain a lot but i still <3 Anet and the mighty master of the elements

Upgrade your gear…

If your underwater attack was hitting for 6 at level 10 then you were definitely still using the starter water weapon.

Also, runes. Runes make a major difference in lower levels.
I have an 80 Warrior, Thief, Necro and Guardian. On the first 3 (guardian was my first 80) I bought level 1 gear that had upgrade slots and purchased runes to enhance them. For these classes specifically, I went all power runes (+10 per rune). Doing so I one-shot everything on each class up until level 10.

I do agree that Ele is too squishy, however, make sure you are gearing up regularly and are not fighting too far out of your own level.

Alright so I grinder out a few levels, and now my ele is 30 the toughness points/armor for traits isn’t helping much.

I have all the attunements and rotations down (d/d) which has helped immensely, but it still isn’t changing that fact that When I get hit, (not if) with low vitality cloth armor and lower toughness (even though I’m traited into it) I am still getting hit for 1/3 of my life by ranges mobs. Only thing that helps a little is the protection I get from swapping to earth, and even then I’m still getting wrecked by ranged adds mixed with melee.

It feels like all the mobs were tuned to hit classes pretty hard if not in heavy armor, with the though process that well classes either have heavy armor and more durability or light classes like necro have high health and death shroud, mesmers clones distract mobs, and have decent health, but that they forgot that the light armor ele has no real toughness early on AND light armor without any of the above defensive mechanisms for PVE earlier on. Thiefs have stealth, and medium armor to take heat off from mobs, engineers have turrets and decent health, and rangers have good vitality AND a pet. Guardians low base health, but TONS of survival tools and way to negate damage PLUS heavy armor, and warrior has heavy armor AND high vitality plus high dps to kill anything first, plus signets to reduce damage intake.

The ele is missing ALL of those combinations, low base health low toughness, we get regens, but when PVE mobs are hitting you for 1/3-1/2 health every hit regen isn’t going to do anything.

This is a serious issue for early on PVE for ele’s we ARE getting 3 shotted by mobs it is happening and it is nothing but frustrating for players.

At early stage lv, I would recommend using S/D and D/D. Dragon’s tooth and phoenix will clear most mobs relatively fast. Burning Speed and Dragon’s Breath are the same. Burning is really a strong condition especially in teh early stage. Dont use staff if you are not in a group. Not that staff is bad or anything, it is an AoE weapon and require a little timing. There are not many AoE situation early lv either.

And dont fight mob with high lv gaps just because your dmg will be glanced and they will 1 shot crit you as ele.

Def like Vanillea said, fight mobs near or under your level and try not to take on more than one or two mobs at a time. Also make use of our active defenses – obviously evades and heals, but also in your D/D setup you have a knockback, a knockdown, and a stun which can help prevent damage while you get in a few attacks, as well as various chills, immobilize, and cripples to help you kite melee mobs. Also definitely equip a few Cantrips and the Lesser and Elite Elementals are also helpful. Also throw some points into Arcane (I might suggest at least 20) so you can switch between attunements faster and really make use of all the extra skills, plus the Elemental Attunement trait is nice for the free boons on every switch (there are also a lot of nice things in the Water trait line as well).

I might also suggest going Scepter/Dagger instead of D/D at lower levels because it gives you more defenses with 2 blinds, Rock Barrier, and extra Vigor and longer range while still providing good damage. It’s overall an easier weapon setup for soloing than D/D. But make sure you always have a Staff in your bag and know how to use it. The Staff comes in handy when you have many mobs on your hands but also provides a lot of defensive and control capabilities. It’s less damage and the damage it does do is AoE, but can certainly help in sticky situations that S/D isn’t handling well if you really know how to make best use of the staff.

i have been thinking of starting a new ele but could not think of how, this thread has had many useful info about easier starting weapons and proper playstyle to ensure survival. But 1 thing that i dun know is the traits, unlike the other classes ele trait system seems to be so much more complicated, so can someone help with a basic trait setup for a new ele that has no clue what he wanna do? mainly pve though, i dun really like pvp though i dun mind WvW

kitai it will help you a good deal to spend about an hour in the mists messing with different combinations and fighting the practice npcs.

a basic 30/0/30/.. (10)
or a (10) /30/30 build.

it will help you a great deal in pve if you get yourself to about rank 10 or so in spvp.

at 41 i can take on 2 level 44 mobs pretty easily and 3 level 44’s if do it right.

hmm ic guess i’ll do just that, thanks

edit lol after messing with builds in the mist i ended up with 15/10/15/15/15 to take advantage of changing attunment from air to fire then to earth( for water i also took it to 15 and traited so that by just attuning to water i heal, cleanse and grant regen to allies) is this even feasible? feels wierd that my traits dont focus on any line