Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Blackjack.5621

Blackjack.5621

As a high level tPvP player I have to say that those skills are designed very poorly.

I´m playing staff ele since the last major balance patch and it works pretty well, but those 2 skills are just not fun to use/clunky/frustrating.

Gust misses its target from 3 meter range if both players are moving with swiftnes, a waste of a 30 second cooldown. It´s extremely frustrating how frequently this happens.

Lightning surge is a 1,5 sec cast for a blind. Blinds are intended to be used reactively to mitigate damage. How on earth are 1,5sec casttime helping to mitigate damage. You are tanking damage for 1.5 seconds and you can´t even choose what skill to blind. Lightning surge must be reactive, the damage can be reduced then.

Both changes wouldn´t hurt pve/wvw and the fact that ele is in a good state doesn´t mean you can´t fix this class.

I Zapdos I
WTS Boston winner
Esl profile: http://play.eslgaming.com/player/7930634/

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: SonOfKrypton.4357

SonOfKrypton.4357

I´m playing staff ele since the last major balance patch and it works pretty well, but those 2 skills are just not fun to use/clunky/frustrating..

I don’t think you understand how to play this weapon set. To play it correctly you drop a static field on point and shout, “I’m so stunning!” as people run into it to really immerse yourself in the game and become more hyped about the current match.

Lightning surge is a 1,5 sec cast for a blind. Blinds are intended to be used reactively to mitigate damage.

Yet again you show your lack of knowledge in this class. You just use all the abilities that are off CD in one attunement then go on to the next. It’s very simple once you’re as experienced at Elementalist as I am.

Try out these pro tips and get back to me with how you went. Good luck! <3

Attempting to contact arenanet.support seeking counselling expenses.

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Swimsasa Stoon.8936

Swimsasa Stoon.8936

I just use gust on people that’re stomping and I use 2 as I’m charging into a fight while charging the skill, the blind at the start of the fight always comes in handy.
Nothing broken about those two skills, they’re just somewhat situational

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: cheese.4739

cheese.4739

I just use gust on people that’re stomping and I use 2 as I’m charging into a fight while charging the skill, the blind at the start of the fight always comes in handy.
Nothing broken about those two skills, they’re just somewhat situational

Also, a well-timed Blinding Surge on someone in an invuln transform (Mist Form Ele, Mini Engi…) or timed block will get you a high-damage hit and a blind as they come out.

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Blackjack.5621

Blackjack.5621

I just use gust on people that’re stomping and I use 2 as I’m charging into a fight while charging the skill, the blind at the start of the fight always comes in handy.
Nothing broken about those two skills, they’re just somewhat situational

Also, a well-timed Blinding Surge on someone in an invuln transform (Mist Form Ele, Mini Engi…) or timed block will get you a high-damage hit and a blind as they come out.

how can you time lightning surge when it casts 1,5 seconds? you simply can´t because it´s bad design, random blinds shouldn´t be in the game either.

I just use gust on people that’re stomping and I use 2 as I’m charging into a fight while charging the skill, the blind at the start of the fight always comes in handy.
Nothing broken about those two skills, they’re just somewhat situational

somewhat situational means more like useless during the fight because they don´t land or you die before it goes off.

I Zapdos I
WTS Boston winner
Esl profile: http://play.eslgaming.com/player/7930634/

(edited by Blackjack.5621)

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: cheese.4739

cheese.4739

I just use gust on people that’re stomping and I use 2 as I’m charging into a fight while charging the skill, the blind at the start of the fight always comes in handy.
Nothing broken about those two skills, they’re just somewhat situational

Also, a well-timed Blinding Surge on someone in an invuln transform (Mist Form Ele, Mini Engi…) or timed block will get you a high-damage hit and a blind as they come out.

how can you time lightning surge when it casts 1,5 seconds? you simply can´t because it´s bad design, random blinds shouldn´t be in the game either.

Mist Form and Elixir S both transform the user for 3 seconds, and can’t be cancelled. Start your Blinding Surge 1.5 seconds in, and your foe will have to spend a dodge or take that big hit and a blind. It’s not random if used like that – you know exactly when the skill will land (or when your foe will spend a valuable dodge/block/etc).

Situational means ‘useful in certain situations’. Use it while running up to an enemy (start cast while out of that 1200 range) and so have them blinded for the start of your battle. Charge it up when they’re otherwise busy – like casting it just as a Warrior is coming out of their Endure Pain, since you probably can’t use many other attacks on them while they’re stanced anyway. I’ve even used it numerous times to blind a foe and give my ally a safestomp – that 1.5s cast time is surprisingly good for catching enemies who wait until the last moment to use their #2.

We don’t have many blinds as Elementalists, and most of them are instant-cast, yes… but just because this one isn’t, doesn’t mean it’s not useful. It’s non-projectile, non-ground-targeted, AoE damage (something that Staff has very little of – the only other being Flame Burst, which is condi rather than direct damage) – the blind is a great bonus on top of that. The skill’s not great when in a busy fight, no, but it’s certainly not without its uses.

If the skill was changed to be an instant/quick-cast blind, it would have to deal very little damage (if any at all) and would almost certainly end up being identical to Scepter Air #3 (oh look, variety in the skills available to weaponsets!). An AoE instant blind at Staff’s 1200 range would probably also have a much longer cooldown (wooo, another long cooldown to keep track of) and if you’re really desperate for that you should just take Signet of Air with its passive buff and short-cooldown stunbreak.

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Wyrden.4713

Wyrden.4713

I just use gust on people that’re stomping and I use 2 as I’m charging into a fight while charging the skill, the blind at the start of the fight always comes in handy.
Nothing broken about those two skills, they’re just somewhat situational

Also, a well-timed Blinding Surge on someone in an invuln transform (Mist Form Ele, Mini Engi…) or timed block will get you a high-damage hit and a blind as they come out.

how can you time lightning surge when it casts 1,5 seconds? you simply can´t because it´s bad design, random blinds shouldn´t be in the game either.

Mist Form and Elixir S both transform the user for 3 seconds, and can’t be cancelled. Start your Blinding Surge 1.5 seconds in, and your foe will have to spend a dodge or take that big hit and a blind. It’s not random if used like that – you know exactly when the skill will land (or when your foe will spend a valuable dodge/block/etc).

Situational means ‘useful in certain situations’. Use it while running up to an enemy (start cast while out of that 1200 range) and so have them blinded for the start of your battle. Charge it up when they’re otherwise busy – like casting it just as a Warrior is coming out of their Endure Pain, since you probably can’t use many other attacks on them while they’re stanced anyway. I’ve even used it numerous times to blind a foe and give my ally a safestomp – that 1.5s cast time is surprisingly good for catching enemies who wait until the last moment to use their #2.

We don’t have many blinds as Elementalists, and most of them are instant-cast, yes… but just because this one isn’t, doesn’t mean it’s not useful. It’s non-projectile, non-ground-targeted, AoE damage (something that Staff has very little of – the only other being Flame Burst, which is condi rather than direct damage) – the blind is a great bonus on top of that. The skill’s not great when in a busy fight, no, but it’s certainly not without its uses.

If the skill was changed to be an instant/quick-cast blind, it would have to deal very little damage (if any at all) and would almost certainly end up being identical to Scepter Air #3 (oh look, variety in the skills available to weaponsets!). An AoE instant blind at Staff’s 1200 range would probably also have a much longer cooldown (wooo, another long cooldown to keep track of) and if you’re really desperate for that you should just take Signet of Air with its passive buff and short-cooldown stunbreak.

i guess i am not the only one who loves staff air 2 :0

just my ytb channel

FeintFate~

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: cheese.4739

cheese.4739

i guess i am not the only one who loves staff air 2 :0

I don’t ’love’ it... but it’s far from the utterly useless skill that OP claims it to be! ^__^
I just tried to cover a wide variety of reasons why it’s *not* useless and why it’s been balanced the way it is (rather than with a faster cast or whatever), with some realistic examples of situations to use it in.

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Razor.6392

Razor.6392

I use surge to open, or to tag people as I’m approaching a fight (you can start casting surge even while out of range). It’s also a great nuke from afar (how many ways do you have to burst people fleeing, when using a staff? spam the ever so reliable fireballs?)

never in middle of a fight.

when used against me, it kinda throws me off to know when exactly to dodge, even though I’ve played ele for so long…

Level 60 pvp
Ele & thief main (full ascended)
Down with the braindead faceroll classes.

(edited by Razor.6392)

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: cheese.4739

cheese.4739

when used against me, it kinda throws me off to know when exactly to dodge, even though I’ve played ele for so long…

I run into so many static fields. I put it down to lack of practice against other Staff Eles – it really felt like I was the only one in soloq for about 8 months after I got into pvp.

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: ThiBash.5634

ThiBash.5634

For PvE, a staff trick I sometimes use is start with Eruption, followed by Ice Spike, followed by Blinding Surge, followed by Lava Font.

If you time it right, they all hit at the same time, and often end the fight right there.

If you can read this then it is proof that ArenaNet’s moderators just, kind and fair.

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Celtus.8456

Celtus.8456

Hi Blackjack, I’ve had a problem with these skills too for a long time. Despite the many adjustments to Gust (I think they’ve added piercing, improved cone, etc), it is still one of the most difficult skills in the game to actually land on a target. Unless the target is: stationary, moving toward you, or right next to you…there is a good chance the skill will miss. Despite having used this skill so much, I still amaze myself with some of the misses I get (missing on someone ~300 range from me).

As for Lightning Surge, I am not sure what can be done. But notice this:

Slot 2 skills for staff

-Lava Font: 6 second cooldown
-Ice Spike: 4 second cooldown
-Lightning Surge: 10 second cooldown
-Eruption: 6 second cooldown

I am not necessarily suggesting that Lightning Surge be given a 4 or 6 second cooldown to match. But I am suggesting that the long cooldown of Lightning Surge + unreliability of Gust is why Air Attunement is so unsatisfying for staff.

It is hard to argue for buffs right now because, as you point out, elementalists are in a strong spot. But in the future (if not now), I think these two skills should be considered for redesign.

For now, I’d say use Lightning Surge when you can for a pre-emptive 1200-range blind with decent damage, and try to mitigate the error risk with Gust.

Josre
Zulu Ox Tactics [zulu]

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Pichichi.1975

Pichichi.1975

Lightning Surge hits like a freight train, the blind is an added bonus. Lightning bolt from air attune swap -> Lightning Flash + Lightning Surge + Arcane Wave is one of the strongest bursts a staff ele can dish out.

You’re completely wrong about the 1.5s lead time being impossible to predict too. Hey look an Axe/Shield warrior is running at me with his shield block up. Lightning flash the shield bash, what a surprise. There are lots of situations like this.

Gust OTOH is broken garbage. The fact that I can’t even use it to reliably interrupt things that are meant to be interrupted as counterplay… like ether renewal… is idiotic.

Tukuku – Mesmer / Mimiyukii -Thief / Sailor Mimi – Necromancer
[DERP] [iRez]

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Dragzter.3810

Dragzter.3810

Gust is not intended to be a “use when off cd skill”. It has a short cast time, a decent travel time and it pierces. It is reliable to use when the enemy is nearby however when far away (1200 range) the main uses are on stationary targets which can be:
-an enemy stomping an ally
-an enemy ressing someone
-obvious channeled skills which root the person (barrage, meteor shower, empower, frost bow 4 and 5)
-stunned or immobilised targets

Observing and using gust when the target is in the situations above + doesnt have stability encourages skillfull gameplay

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Einlanzer.1627

Einlanzer.1627

Gust and Lightning Surge are clearly not effective enough and it drags the entire Attunement into the dirt.

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Linda Shors.5629

Linda Shors.5629

Gust and Lightning Surge are clearly not effective enough and it drags the entire Attunement into the dirt.

Yes, they should just rename it Earth Attunement (0.5) . . .

Sorry, couldn’t resist >.>

I feel this is one of the weaknesses of staff in general. In exchange for awesome damage potential, great aoe, and 1200 range, you get this sort of clunkiness. Staff isn’t like s/d; there’s little frantic button mashing here, and you lack the speed and responsiveness of the other builds. While that kind of sucks, I actually like the feel of it a lot. From a roleplaying perspective, one could say the staff elementalist casts the most powerful spells, but these take more time to weave. In terms of gameplay, you’re limited more to staying at range, using the time it takes for someone to get to you to prepare a counter, unless you have others to protect you.

I do wish lightning had some better dps options. Sitting in fire attunement most of the time makes for boring play.

PS: Don’t forget the lovely cast animation on Lighting Surge! Would we really want to give that up?

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Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Swimsasa Stoon.8936

Swimsasa Stoon.8936

I just use gust on people that’re stomping and I use 2 as I’m charging into a fight while charging the skill, the blind at the start of the fight always comes in handy.
Nothing broken about those two skills, they’re just somewhat situational

Also, a well-timed Blinding Surge on someone in an invuln transform (Mist Form Ele, Mini Engi…) or timed block will get you a high-damage hit and a blind as they come out.

how can you time lightning surge when it casts 1,5 seconds? you simply can´t because it´s bad design, random blinds shouldn´t be in the game either.

I just use gust on people that’re stomping and I use 2 as I’m charging into a fight while charging the skill, the blind at the start of the fight always comes in handy.
Nothing broken about those two skills, they’re just somewhat situational

somewhat situational means more like useless during the fight because they don´t land or you die before it goes off.

If you die before it goes off that either means your opponent was too good or you missed an opportunity to practice dodging.

Fix Gust and Lightning surge please

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Posted by: Avead.5760

Avead.5760

How about they double up the velocity of all autoattacks beside the homing air one..?
I find it ridiculous that i actually need to setup with cc in order to land a few stupid rocks at my target at anything besides point blank.Its not like you aiming these things either..you just press 1 and hope that the enemy doesnt take 1 of the million possible directions he can take that ll make him sidestep it..