Alerie Despins
(edited by Alekt.5803)
Glyph, Conjure, and Tornado Ideas
2. Disallowing conjures to be casted in pair and other random buffs (and over buffs) from your arbitrary selection is telling: you probably do not have enough experiences with Conjures.
On the other hand, conjures suck when used just by the elementalist alone, and are still niche when used in groups. Maybe if they lost their group functionality, at least by default (untraited) they could actually get power worth using by the elementalist alone and be more generalized in their use in a group.
And I still hold to the most repeated idea concerning conjures on these forums, that they need to overwrite an attunement when cast. Example, you’re heavily fire spec’d, you slot lava axe, attune to earth, and cast lava axe, you now have a lava axe attunement in place of the earth attunement, acting as a second fire attunement.
There is no over exaggerating how much this one change would help our class both mechanically and thematically.
And I still hold to the most repeated idea concerning conjures on these forums, that they need to overwrite an attunement when cast. Example, you’re heavily fire spec’d, you slot lava axe, attune to earth, and cast lava axe, you now have a lava axe attunement in place of the earth attunement, acting as a second fire attunement.
Actually, I use the Conjured Weapons for the exact opposite of this proposition. You want conjures to act as if you were attuned to the represented element (Fire axe= benefit from fire passives while used; Hammer benefits from air passives while used)
I am using conjures for the opposite. For instance, I can use Conjure Earth Shield with Pyromancer’s puissance, so I can stack might every 1/2 seconds due to the fast auto-attacks and casts. I can also manipulate attunements for super speed while wielding it.
Though, if you meant that using the conjure grans an additionnal attunement representing the element of the weapon (Attuned to fire while wielding earth shield = benefiting from Earth + Fire at the same time), the idea needs discussion. Some combinaison might be way too good. For instance, Stone Heart + Pyromancer’s Puissance at the same time.
Alerie Despins
And I still hold to the most repeated idea concerning conjures on these forums, that they need to overwrite an attunement when cast. Example, you’re heavily fire spec’d, you slot lava axe, attune to earth, and cast lava axe, you now have a lava axe attunement in place of the earth attunement, acting as a second fire attunement.
Actually, I use the Conjured Weapons for the exact opposite of this proposition. You want conjures to act as if you were attuned to the represented element (Fire axe= benefit from fire passives while used; Hammer benefits from air passives while used)
I am using conjures for the opposite. For instance, I can use Conjure Earth Shield with Pyromancer’s puissance, so I can stack might every 1/2 seconds due to the fast auto-attacks and casts. I can also manipulate attunements for super speed while wielding it.
Though, if you meant that using the conjure grans an additionnal attunement representing the element of the weapon (Attuned to fire while wielding earth shield = benefiting from Earth + Fire at the same time), the idea needs discussion. Some combinaison might be way too good. For instance, Stone Heart + Pyromancer’s Puissance at the same time.
I use that same trick, though I usually throw sandstorm on top of it, lots of fun.
But to answer your question, I’m specifically talking about attunement overwriting, because there has to be a drawback.
Simple fact is being able to do too many things at the same time without any drawback is both why we have had so little build diversity since launch and why we have so consistently been nerfed in what few builds we have. We need build options that require us to choose clear strengths and weaknesses. It’s far from the only thing we need in order to have decent build diversity but it’d be a good start.
I use that same trick, though I usually throw sandstorm on top of it, lots of fun.
But to answer your question, I’m specifically talking about attunement overwriting, because there has to be a drawback.
Simple fact is being able to do too many things at the same time without any drawback is both why we have had so little build diversity since launch and why we have so consistently been nerfed in what few builds we have. We need build options that require us to choose clear strengths and weaknesses. It’s far from the only thing we need in order to have decent build diversity but it’d be a good start.
If you want a Conjured Weapon to overwrite the attunement, I adamantly oppose it. When choosing a Conjured Weapon as a utility, you pick the weapon itself, not the attunement it would force to claim a plethora of passives with. Even more if you would not be allowed to attunement swap while wielding the conjured weapon (which is the exact difference between the good and the great users of conjures)
Alerie Despins
I use that same trick, though I usually throw sandstorm on top of it, lots of fun.
But to answer your question, I’m specifically talking about attunement overwriting, because there has to be a drawback.
Simple fact is being able to do too many things at the same time without any drawback is both why we have had so little build diversity since launch and why we have so consistently been nerfed in what few builds we have. We need build options that require us to choose clear strengths and weaknesses. It’s far from the only thing we need in order to have decent build diversity but it’d be a good start.
If you want a Conjured Weapon to overwrite the attunement, I adamantly oppose it. When choosing a Conjured Weapon as a utility, you pick the weapon itself, not the attunement it would force to claim a plethora of passives with. Even more if you would not be allowed to attunement swap while wielding the conjured weapon (which is the exact difference between the good and the great users of conjures)
Then you want conjured weapons to remain weak forever, and the elementalist to continue have the game’s lowest build diversity.
I slotted GoEP and conjures every minute I played for the first two years on my elementalist. It’s a blast and I’d hate to see it go too. But its far from the first time we’ve seen functionality from a specific ability removed for the good and overall health of the class.
So long as people won’t consent to give up any of the defensive power we get from attunement swapping, and refuse to accept that more of our build choices are going to have to affect the output of our swapping, we’re never going to improve our build diversity. That’s just a plain and simple fact.
And why on earth would you not be able to swap attunements under what I described? That doesn’t even make any sense, that’s just being contrary for contrarieties’ sake.
(edited by Conncept.7638)
Please define “attunement overwriting” because I clearly do not understand it.
Alerie Despins
Please define “attunement overwriting” because I clearly do not understand it.
Sorry, by the time I got back to the forums this thread was long off the front page, never even thought anyone responded.
I mean that when you cast a conjured weapon utility, its will replace the attunement you are currently in for the conjure’s duration.
Example, you are a scepter/focus fresh air elementalist. You decide you have no need for earth attunement, so you slot Lightning hammer on your utility bar, attune to earth, and cast lightning hammer. You now have lightning hammer as a second air attunement in earth attunements place.
Additionally, while in ‘lightning hammer attunement’ you will get all the passive bonuses that come with being in air, and get the on attunement bonuses from attuning to lightning hammer that you will also get from air. Any spells you cast while attuned to lightning hammer will be considered air spells for the purposes of procs and effects, such as with glpyhs.
It would basically be as if you have no earth attunement for the duration of lightning hammer, but have a second air attunement instead.
(edited by Conncept.7638)
That tornado rework would be an awesome elite for tempest… if only
D/F frontline for [PUSH]
Please define “attunement overwriting” because I clearly do not understand it.
Sorry, by the time I got back to the forums this thread was long off the front page, never even thought anyone responded.
I mean that when you cast a conjured weapon utility, its will replace the attunement you are currently in for the conjure’s duration.
Example, you are a scepter/focus fresh air elementalist. You decide you have no need for earth attunement, so you slot Lightning hammer on your utility bar, attune to earth, and cast lightning hammer. You now have lightning hammer as a second air attunement in earth attunements place.
Additionally, while in ‘lightning hammer attunement’ you will get all the passive bonuses that come with being in air, and get the on attunement bonuses from attuning to lightning hammer that you will also get from air. Any spells you cast while attuned to lightning hammer will be considered air spells for the purposes of procs and effects, such as with glpyhs.
It would basically be as if you have no earth attunement for the duration of lightning hammer, but have a second air attunement instead.
So if I use Earth Shield, I am stuck in Earth Attunement? No swapping while in earth shield to get air super speed?
Alerie Despins
Please define “attunement overwriting” because I clearly do not understand it.
Sorry, by the time I got back to the forums this thread was long off the front page, never even thought anyone responded.
I mean that when you cast a conjured weapon utility, its will replace the attunement you are currently in for the conjure’s duration.
Example, you are a scepter/focus fresh air elementalist. You decide you have no need for earth attunement, so you slot Lightning hammer on your utility bar, attune to earth, and cast lightning hammer. You now have lightning hammer as a second air attunement in earth attunements place.
Additionally, while in ‘lightning hammer attunement’ you will get all the passive bonuses that come with being in air, and get the on attunement bonuses from attuning to lightning hammer that you will also get from air. Any spells you cast while attuned to lightning hammer will be considered air spells for the purposes of procs and effects, such as with glpyhs.
It would basically be as if you have no earth attunement for the duration of lightning hammer, but have a second air attunement instead.
So if I use Earth Shield, I am stuck in Earth Attunement? No swapping while in earth shield to get air super speed?
You can’t rework conjures to make them good if you keep all of their functionalities the same, something has to be sacrificed. The only way to rework them and have the attunement swap procs that you like would be to make them exactly like kits. I can’t see engineers being happy with that while they have no weapon swap.
Please define “attunement overwriting” because I clearly do not understand it.
Sorry, by the time I got back to the forums this thread was long off the front page, never even thought anyone responded.
I mean that when you cast a conjured weapon utility, its will replace the attunement you are currently in for the conjure’s duration.
Example, you are a scepter/focus fresh air elementalist. You decide you have no need for earth attunement, so you slot Lightning hammer on your utility bar, attune to earth, and cast lightning hammer. You now have lightning hammer as a second air attunement in earth attunements place.
Additionally, while in ‘lightning hammer attunement’ you will get all the passive bonuses that come with being in air, and get the on attunement bonuses from attuning to lightning hammer that you will also get from air. Any spells you cast while attuned to lightning hammer will be considered air spells for the purposes of procs and effects, such as with glpyhs.
It would basically be as if you have no earth attunement for the duration of lightning hammer, but have a second air attunement instead.
So if I use Earth Shield, I am stuck in Earth Attunement? No swapping while in earth shield to get air super speed?
No you’re not stuck in earth attunement, you can attune out of the earth shield, to fire, water, and your earth attunement, then attune back to the earth shield, and everything will proc its own traits according to its elemental tree. You don’t lose any ability to swap between four attunement, you just lose one element attunement to gain one conjure attunement, in this case losing air and gaining earth shield. But it is your choice what element you lose, doesn’t have to be air, could be fire or water, or you could even write earth shield over earth if you don’t want two earth attunements.
But yes, in the case presented above you do lose air attunement, if you write earth shield over air, you can’t proc the super speed trait because attuning to the shield will proc earth attunement traits. You will however proc earth traits twice as often by attuning to both earth or the earth shield. But if you have the superspeed trait, that means you have the air tree slotted and depend on its procs, in which case, why on earth would you write earth shield over air? Writing it over fire or water would almost certainly fit your build better.
Logically, with the way conjures would work under this system you would want to overwrite the elements you are not dependent on, not the ones you’ve spent a trait tree slot on. I mean, strictly speaking there wouldn’t be anything to stop you from picking the earth, air, and arcana trees then slotting frostbow over earth and lava axe over air, leaving you with only the ability to swap between fire and water and never proc your air and earth traits, but that would just be a really bad idea.
(edited by Conncept.7638)