Guild Wars 2

I’m sorry, but really? Increased C/D on RTL is really THAT much of a deal-breaker? Other than closing a gap or running away, why would you even NEED RTL? Change seem fine to me… we really ought to save our Ele whining for ACTUAL nerfs and not changes which barely affect gameplay at all.

From what I read, the nerfs are minor and the buffs are great, so I’m with you, don’t know what all the complaining is about, except that it’s a change and no matter what the change is, someone will complain about it.

Too many people overreact.
Cantrips 40% nerf – I can understand that. People without any boon duration and glyph as heal won’t have perma regen as they used to. But tbh, I’m fine with that.
With RTL I had one good non-waiting circle of combo mostly every 2nd time I switch every attunement. But It’s not that much, I will get used to it, so you, people, should.
And as they wrote: shocking aura was bugged. It doesn’t count as nerf.

SlimGenre.6417:

From what I read, the nerfs are minor and the buffs are great, so I’m with you, don’t know what all the complaining is about, except that it’s a change and no matter what the change is, someone will complain about it.

QFT.

Frost Aura buff alone = Gold

I was expecting D/D Eles to get eviscerated this patch based on all the cries of OP-ness (read that a couple of times and giggle). All in all I think the profession as a whole got buffed. I could see if the travel range of RTL got nerfed, but the C/D? Really? Was anyone actually spamming this every time it came off of cooldown? I sincerely doubt it.

i was

what you expect me to run everywhere?

screw that

Michael.3279:

I’m sorry, but really? Increased C/D on RTL is really THAT much of a deal-breaker? Other than closing a gap or running away, why would you even NEED RTL? Change seem fine to me… we really ought to save our Ele whining for ACTUAL nerfs and not changes which barely affect gameplay at all.

It might be that people are use to the low cd and are still switching to air expecting it to be ready and see it still has a couple seconds of cd still. I’ll probably just adjust and in the greater scheme not really be effected but currently its causing some pain for me. The ZB nerf was expected, same with EA and Restam. Im suprised that they left water trident at 1.0 and instead went after our mobility. Imo it’s always been the healing and boons that were op about ele’s. The mobility people complained about was just a l2p issue imo.

I keep kittening casting RTL with 5 second cooldown >.< it sucks lol

Fire Aura is no longer completely worthless as anything other than “being an Aura.” That’s all I care about.

DeusVolt.3298:

i was

what you expect me to run everywhere?

screw that

Applauded for sincerity.

DeusVolt.3298:

i was

what you expect me to run everywhere?

screw that

lol, it could be worse, you could be a class that can’t maintain swiftness… I get so bored trying to get somewhere on anyone but my ele…

with buffs on aura’s getting you up to like 5m of swiftness, what else ya gonna do besides sit there and spam RTL, Burning Speed and Lightning Flash to increase our already rediculously easy to maintain mobility.

I’m a D/D auramancer, and nothing has changed for me. In a bad way, I mean. Sure, +5 seconds on RTL makes me sad, but I understand why they did it. They corrected Shocking Aura, which also makes me sad, but they buffed other aura stuff so it’s fine. It doesn’t affect my gameplay much, anyway (sPvP, dungeons, WvW).

I run 0/10/10/30/20, and I don’t feel like I have to change anything. I may experiment with 0/20/0/30/20, but that’s all I may change. My gear will remain the same. (Berserker’s in sPvP, similar gear in dungeons and WvW.)

I’m still a very effective Elementalist. I don’t understand all the QQ.

0/10/0/30/30 is often called an auramancer build on these forums for a reason I don’t know. It’s usually a cantrip or a arcane burst set-up. Auramancer’s are builds that rely on fire’s embrace and signet’s to gain fury & swiftness and/or protection from traits. With the changes to fire aura these builds might actually make a come back. I hope so, we need some new viable spvp builds. I think i’ll try it out again soon, haven’t played a auramancer build since beta.

Nikkle.4013:

0/10/0/30/30 is often called an auramancer build on these forums for a reason I don’t know. It’s usually a cantrip or a arcane burst set-up. Auramancer’s are builds that rely on fire’s embrace and signet’s to gain fury & swiftness and/or protection from traits. With the changes to fire aura these builds might actually make a come back. I hope so, we need some new viable spvp builds. I think i’ll try it out again soon, haven’t played a auramancer build since beta.

I call myself an auramancer ‘cause of aurashare. I don’t really know what makes someone an auramancer otherwise. >.>

Though I don’t use aurashare in sPvP/solo WvW/PvE roaming… I use the condition removal on regen thing… so I dunno’. I’m a hybrid? o_o;

This update was definitely a nerf, but the exchange for survivability/mobility and frost aura nerf was 1/3-1/4 compensated for in dmg via fire aura boost and better fire elemental healing glyph. As mentioned by someone else, bunker ele in spvp went from A+ to A- ish, everything else gets kittened (a huge shame). PVE wise, ele is much the same, slightly less survivable but capable of doing a little more damage and a bit more support. I don’t think i’ll pvp with ele any more though, so much easier to roll a guardian for defense/ support or mesmer for damage.

It now takes 4 more seconds for me to reach where I was supposed to be 4 seconds ago.

This means that every minute I spend playing I lose 20 extra seconds because of the nerf.
Since I’ve played for about 1000 hours already, if this was after the nerf I’d had to play 1333 hours to arrive where I am currently.

That’s a 33% nerf of my real life time.

Game breaking.

Michael.3279:

All in all I think the profession as a whole got buffed. I could see if the travel range of RTL got nerfed, but the C/D? Really? Was anyone actually spamming this every time it came off of cooldown? I sincerely doubt it.

I take it you don’t play any WvW.

SlimGenre.6417:

lol, it could be worse, you could be a class that can’t maintain swiftness… I get so bored trying to get somewhere on anyone but my ele…

with buffs on aura’s getting you up to like 5m of swiftness, what else ya gonna do besides sit there and spam RTL, Burning Speed and Lightning Flash to increase our already rediculously easy to maintain mobility.

5m of swiftness? What are you talking about? I really have a hard time stacking enough swiftness since the latest patch. Reduced Swiftness and Fury uptime hits me very hard.

for once, it forced me into another spec.

Im mostly exclusivly playing WwW on my ele, and 15 sec CD was just the right timeframe to dive into something, do your stuff, and get out again, the typical thing d/d eles do, we all know it.

so i specced 0/20/0/20/30 now, am squishier than before, but i got my cd back (+ 1 sec, but who cares). 20 sec CD on aura and 32 on Updraft help aswell to ease my pain for losing 10 in water.

It forced me to another class and it’s the best choice I’ve ever made. Just lawn mowing every mob I see now. Guess what I’m rolling?

Raptured.9307:

It forced me to another class and it’s the best choice I’ve ever made. Just lawn mowing every mob I see now. Guess what I’m rolling?

That was easy:

pve = warrior; wvw = thief

People seem to underestimate these sort of changes.

It’s a pvp game (or pvp aspect) what we’re talking about. Even one second increased cooldown could mean the difference between victory and defeat. Even that autoattack you failed to dodge or land…

It’s more complex than you could possibly imagine, judging by the responses in this thread.

Bunker eles got hit, but every other build (balanced ones) were also hit in the process just as hard if not harder. That’s what annoys me, and many more people as well. Because the effing 0/10/0/30/30 was the one that caused the “ele op” cries, and the one that caused these nerfs, and even after all of this, it will still be used and abused while my own personal spec was severely nerfed more in comparison! So my build is now less effective against anyone and even less effective against those bunkers.

Tis annoying man.

Sure its less effective then before. But its not that bad, that it cannot be compensated by the way you are acting. You dont need that extra seconds in every fight. So not every fight is affected by this change.

I think 20s cooldown is ok. Its en par now with similar skills like warriors Rush. Its pretty well balanced now.

teg.1340:

SlimGenre.6417:

lol, it could be worse, you could be a class that can’t maintain swiftness… I get so bored trying to get somewhere on anyone but my ele…

with buffs on aura’s getting you up to like 5m of swiftness, what else ya gonna do besides sit there and spam RTL, Burning Speed and Lightning Flash to increase our already rediculously easy to maintain mobility.

5m of swiftness? What are you talking about? I really have a hard time stacking enough swiftness since the latest patch. Reduced Swiftness and Fury uptime hits me very hard.

Obviously I was exaggerating (well, not really, if you did nothing but run around for an hour stacking swiftness because you were bored, then yes, you could easily achieve any number of minutes of swiftness), but I could easily get that much swiftness if I cared to back prior to the patch with 2xwater and 2xmonk runes on an D/D aurashare build, it just takes longer now.

I am able to maintain fury easily with my usual S/D build I run in dungeons and wvw as long as I’m quick with my attunement swaps, there’s no doubt we can still maintain perm swiftness in d/d even if it has been nerfed some. As long as it will maintain 1s or more longer than it takes to cycle back through aura’s and attunement swap back to air, then yes you can still get many minutes of swiftness… not that you need it.

Radamanth.9048:

for once, it forced me into another spec.

Im mostly exclusivly playing WwW on my ele, and 15 sec CD was just the right timeframe to dive into something, do your stuff, and get out again, the typical thing d/d eles do, we all know it.

so i specced 0/20/0/20/30 now, am squishier than before, but i got my cd back (+ 1 sec, but who cares). 20 sec CD on aura and 32 on Updraft help aswell to ease my pain for losing 10 in water.

Perhaps spec 0/15/0/25/30 if you’re not running aurashare, you don’t get that 1s CD back, but you do still get the increased damage for each boon, which as a d/d ele you should be stacking a lot of those.

switching to 10/10/0/30/20 now from the usual 0/10/0/30/30 builds. So far i like it. RTL nerf sucks at times but if that is the final nerf to the ele i can live with that.

It breaks my PvE rotation because when I flip back to air, it’s still on a 3-5 second cooldown. It breaks my PvP because my timing is off because it’s still on cooldown. Combined with the fact that I can’t stack swiftness anymore for travelling pisses me off. I love(d) my mobility.

Razor.6392:

Bunker eles got hit, but every other build (balanced ones) were also hit in the process just as hard if not harder. That’s what annoys me, and many more people as well. Because the effing 0/10/0/30/30 was the one that caused the “ele op” cries, and the one that caused these nerfs, and even after all of this, it will still be used and abused while my own personal spec was severely nerfed more in comparison! So my build is now less effective against anyone and even less effective against those bunkers.

Tis annoying man.

Please tell me how mesmers and guardians were hit in this patch. Guardians are more op than ever and i’ve been facerolling with mesmer and guard every round.

http://i.imgur.com/cAih7Xn.jpg
What i got on my 2nd day of zerker mesmer. Amazing how much you can escape with a simple stealth and blink.

I never said they weren’t OP.

Personally I harbor a deep hatred for anything related to mesmers and their apparent high skill cap that deceives most of the playerbase when they’re nothing more than a facerolling bunch of wannabes.

A skill-kit can be complex, only if it’s balanced to use. Mesmer’s tricks and assets can indeed require a high skill ceiling, but due to the nature of their mechanics, the simplicity of them and how forgiving they are even for bad players… that high skill ceiling ends up really kitten close to their skill floor.

About guardians, they can be defined by what I’ve heard ever since I started playing and noticed people complaining about ele’s low leveling speed in pve: “a guardian can tank with ease 4+ monsters that outlevel him greatly, and still come on top with lots of hp left”.

In other words, mind numbingly easy to play, and very rewarding at the same time.

Anyway… all of this was kinda off topic was it?

I think most of you other eles that see the patch as buffs with minor nerfs (if any worth noting at all) are running the ‘standard’ 10/30/30 build or some variant. Which is cool, we’re supposed to be able to play ‘our way’ and all right?

However I personally feel the effect rather greatly as I refuse to run the ‘bunker’ spec and run a damage burster spec and believe me I took a big hit to my survivability which depended entirely on mobility and hit and run tactics. Yeah I already had 20 pts in air but now instead of grabbing zephyrs boon and shock to the heart for finishing blow burst increase (+20% damage when enemies are <33% hp) now I HAVE to grab the air cd reduction trait, or be stuck in the middle of hostiles longer after dropping my target. Either way it’s a huge hit.

Couple that with the other minor adjustments and what the patch really did was slap non standard bunker spec eles in the face and really just kind of tells us ‘spec bunker like you were meant to in the first place, how dare you try to do something else’.

Just how it feels anyways. I still refuse to run the bunker spec and I’ll adapt I suppose but it’s still pretty lame being punished for running an already ‘sub-par’ spec because I didn’t want to play the cookie cutter build and bunker for eternity.

*For reference purposes the spec I was running was:
15/25/0/15/20
(VI/I/VI/VI/V/VI)
Ether renewal, Cleansing fire, Armor of Earth, Lightning Flash, Elite varies
Mix of Valk/Knights/Zerker gear
Zerker daggers (fire/battle)

Edit: Also for reference I mostly run WvW with some solo SPvP mixed in, could care less about PvE

I personally believe that all those c/d on those nice skills and attunement rotation were calculated and implemented on a very efficent “logic” way, the same logic which allow a “melee” class (cause the D/D is a melee right?!) to stay in touch of its opponent.
I am not saying Ele d/d were not a bit on top respect other classes in some scenarios, but you are destroying it piece by piece.

For all those saying “5 seconds is nothing” or “i ll just use the RTL every 2 times i attune to Air..”, let me just say, for PVE it can be the same but PvP is a different environment.

I guess i ll just make up a new build carrying only focus in off hand and leaving the main hand for popcorn :p

the RTL nerf only effected S/D weapon setup, it had very little effect on D/D auramancers

it was a very poorly thought out change actually, its blatantly obvious very little testing was involved

Does it really matter?

The same classes/builds that could out run us before can now and the ones that were slower are still slower.

its just kittening boggles my mind why they nerfed s/d with this change more than d/d..
just for the bunker build

madatom.5218:

the RTL nerf only effected S/D weapon setup, it had very little effect on D/D auramancers

it was a very poorly thought out change actually, its blatantly obvious very little testing was involved

I disagree. Same affect on both. In fact, speaking strictly of RTL, I would say it affects D/D more than S/D. At least S/D has some range.

The change to frost aura was pretty big by the way. You could stack a crap ton of chill on someone hitting you, depending, before the change. I would rather have that than a paltry 10% damage reduction.

Anyways, the biggest issue to me is that it ruins the flow of the class for me.

Elementalists are in a great place. I maxed mine to 80 and had a good time with it. Not my style, but fun none the less.

Now I’m working on my Engineer to 80. Elementalist is looking pretty good by comparison.

All this kitten aside, renewing stamina got buffed!

a buff?! WHAT IS THIS?!

For me ,this was huge …Example.

I would use Burning speed to close gap ,then drop ring of fire…Switch to earth and hit earthquake to get the knockdown and combo finisher ,then hit ring of earth to apply bleed . Then go to air hit updraft to knockdown again ,then ride the lightning to reclose gap so Ican hit lightning touch then water 3 to slow and get regen .Just an example ,but this messed my whole rotation up on many different combos I would use .

Game breaker , certainly not ,annoying —Hell yes !

Actually, the RTL cooldown nerf has changed nothing. The real nerf no one seems to see is the one pointed at our auras. “ZOMG what are you talking about, 10% damage reduction, so sweet!!1!one!”. The damage reduction was the last thing d/d eles needed, and what’s the price for it? Internal cooldowns on auras main effects, cutting literally in half theyr usefullness.

I’m not sure if you realize this, but frost aura was incredibly broken and insanely overpowered. Its “nerf” (10% damage for 7 seconds is kittening massive, especially for eles) was more like a fix to a ridiculous aura. An aura share ele with frost aura will ruin anybodys day in a team fight. Stacking 10+ seconds of chill on someone was not uncommon. I’ve seen 20+ seconds on my engi with grenades. And frost aura is STILL incredibly strong and is the best applicator of chill in the game.

The ride the lightning nerf was to reduce mobility and make sure that people understand what they’re about to do before they waltz in and out of a fight on air swaps.

Ostricheggs.3742:

I’m not sure if you realize this, but frost aura was incredibly broken and insanely overpowered. Its “nerf” (10% damage for 7 seconds is kittening massive, especially for eles) was more like a fix to a ridiculous aura. An aura share ele with frost aura will ruin anybodys day in a team fight. Stacking 10+ seconds of chill on someone was not uncommon. I’ve seen 20+ seconds on my engi with grenades. And frost aura is STILL incredibly strong and is the best applicator of chill in the game.

The ride the lightning nerf was to reduce mobility and make sure that people understand what they’re about to do before they waltz in and out of a fight on air swaps.

I’m not sure if you realize it but forst aura was by far not the best way to stack chill for an ele, there are way more easy and convenient methods to stack chill for far longer, frost aura is a punitive skill , given to the eles as a defense mechanism for staying at close range.

Should we start complaining when we die because of confusion stacks? What strategy engineers use to spamm their pistols? There are other punitive skills in this game and me as player need to pay close attention to it

The reality of frost aura is that it is still the best applicator of chill in the game and the previous version of frost aura was blatantly overpowered. Anyone hitting you at any range would be chilled (an overpowered condition by the way) for vast amounts of time. It was not a deterrent to attack an ele as waiting out a frost aura was and always will be a stupid tactic in 80% of all scenarios. 7 seconds of complete inactivity usually means a fight is lost.

The idea of it being a punitive skill makes sense, but its length and effect were far exaggerated for its cooldown. The new frost aura fits well in your own description of its purpose as hitting an ele with frost aura still applies chill, but it won’t apply chill until a condi cleanse is up (a luxury on most classes further hampered by chilled) AND it gives a large amount of reduced damage for 7 seconds. I’d say that’s fair and balanced for its cooldown. I’m not so sure if you’ve ever been on the receiving end of frost aura, but it completely destroyed some classes in combination with aura share.

And what other skill in the game would apply over 10 seconds of chill? I’m curious.

Melkiah.2496:

Actually, the RTL cooldown nerf has changed nothing. The real nerf no one seems to see is the one pointed at our auras. “ZOMG what are you talking about, 10% damage reduction, so sweet!!1!one!”. The damage reduction was the last thing d/d eles needed, and what’s the price for it? Internal cooldowns on auras main effects, cutting literally in half theyr usefullness.

I disagree with you about the RTL cool down changing nothing. It changes the entire flow. Not game breaking by any means nor what it a heavy handed nerf, but it most certainly changes things.

covenn.7165:

Melkiah.2496:

Actually, the RTL cooldown nerf has changed nothing. The real nerf no one seems to see is the one pointed at our auras. “ZOMG what are you talking about, 10% damage reduction, so sweet!!1!one!”. The damage reduction was the last thing d/d eles needed, and what’s the price for it? Internal cooldowns on auras main effects, cutting literally in half theyr usefullness.

I disagree with you about the RTL cool down changing nothing. It changes the entire flow. Not game breaking by any means nor what it a heavy handed nerf, but it most certainly changes things.

It only changes the flow because that’s the flow everyone got used to.

After PvP’n for the past few days, I’ve figured out the new flow, and it’s really not much different. My only issue is not having RTL when I need to run away sometimes.

In fact, I’d argue that I’m doing better now than I was before… though that may be because I didn’t PvP much before the patch.

People just need to adapt.

Reckless.6325:

All this kitten aside, renewing stamina got buffed!

a buff?! WHAT IS THIS?!

It was not a buff.

It means two cycles in and out of air attunement (which you really need to keep on top of now since shocking aura doesn’t give as much swiftness) vs one cycle + a few seconds.

It’s pretty meaningful when traveling. In fact unless you’re willing to let swiftness drop off, you’re not even going to be using it every 20 seconds, more like every 22-23 as there’s the “global cooldown” before you can switch from an attunement after entering it, as well as the fact that you can’t RTL and then immediately leave air. You have to wait for RTL To end.

Whereas before, with shocking aura giving more swiftness, you could afford to wait the few seconds in air and RTL immediately on cooldown every time without swiftness dropping off. To maintain perma swiftness now and still actually use RTL every 20 seconds, you likely need to fiddle with updraft or the glyph heal while in air.

And this is coming from someone that has +70% boon duration.

Old way: RTL, leave air, come back to it, wait a few seconds for cooldown, RTL. (using shocking aura and frost aura as needed).

New way: RTL, leave air, come back to it, leave air, come back to it, RTL (which actually came off cooldown a couple seconds ago). same deal with shock/frost aura.

It’s wonky.

If this is insisted on, my suggestion is adding one second of additional base swiftness to what is gained from elemental attunement trait by switching to air.

zTales.4392:

It only changes the flow because that’s the flow everyone got used to.

After PvP’n for the past few days, I’ve figured out the new flow, and it’s really not much different. My only issue is not having RTL when I need to run away sometimes.

Not quite what I meant.

Minion of Vey.4398:

If this is insisted on, my suggestion is adding one second of additional base swiftness to what is gained from elemental attunement trait by switching to air.

I completely disagree. Eles are still the fastest roamers in the game even without perma swiftness and the RTL nerf in TPvP.

Why don’t they nerf the teleport range on theives now? Because there’s no way to catch these guys at all now. It’s like a 1000 yard radius in any direction they’ll just randomly be at. Plus, stealth. Plus they get a huge burst. The more targets a thief has to ping-pong off of, the more OP the porting becomes. I just leave when I see some guy doing this.

One thing you have to keep in mind is that elementalist has mobility. Strong mobility.

Our mobility is the thief’s stealth. This RTL was pretty strong with only 15 seconds CD, people were spamming it like Thieves mashing Heartseeker. Did it annoy me? of course it did, have to change my rotation – make sure I keep vigor up with cantrips.

Is it class breaking? No, just no

You can’t ever be too reliant on one skill in this game, maybe in other MMO’s but here you’ll get killed fast if you do. Every single time you NEED that skill, it will be on CD.

Besides elementalists can stack permanent swiftness. Other classes are just snails to me.