Bad Elementalist
Help with Fresh Air vs Thief
Bad Elementalist
Have lightning reflexes (pun intended) and burst them fast. Seek them out and start the fight. Don’t wait for them to attack first.
use dagger for ez wins against thieves. scepter is awful against thief
I regulary beat thiefs with scepter. But i trait tempestious aria + gale song.
The thief is constantly weakened which helps enormous. Also superspeed for a breath is good. Flash freeze is nice if he cloaks. When a thief attacks my initial reaction is klick feel the burn. Then the thief is usually already in a bad position when attackin into protection and fire aura. He must constantly disengage and you can heal or hunt him. The main problem for me is not that he kills me, its hard to catch a good one ;-).
I had a thief attacking me in WvW out of stealth. He ran away after the initial strike …
My WvW build has traited fire/earth and is not fresh air but its just the burn here.
He came out of steath with basilisk venom:
It triggered gale song. And as a reflex i fired feel the burn. I had a nightmare rune at this moment which added to the fun.
So after one stike and my klick:
He:
about 1k damage from feel krit.
2x weakness
My torment sigil triggered — torment
My generosity sigil triggered — his poison went back.
My nightmare rune triggered — He got feared away
Burned from burning precision + feel the burn = 2 stacks.
Blinded
Me:
4 stacks of might
40% protection
Superspeed
Fire aura
Healed his blow (which was a glancing blow, it seems gale song weakness hit befor damage calc).
My fastest WvW thief kill was a freaking 5s. Also a stealth attack, but he continued his attack chain into my fire aura for 2 seconds and i fired cleansing flame + magnetic wave + one earth auto chain which is three bleeds. He cloaked and died a few feet from me …
In pvp a single thief usually cant kill me even when i am at 50%. But its important that i swap to earth. A good thief striking in another attunement as a +1 is a killer and did his job well.
For an offensive build without healing power tempestious aria is a great addition and i take it over stab or regen. You are not an auramancer. Auras just add nicely.
I see the problem here. For fresh air you overload air a lot and propably need the stab on OL, which prohibits aria … In that case i can only suggest stone heart which is powerful against thief bursts.
(edited by Wolfric.9380)
I regulary beat thiefs with scepter. But i trait tempestious aria + gale song.
The thief is constantly weakened which helps enormous. Also superspeed for a breath is good. Flash freeze is nice if he cloaks. When a thief attacks my initial reaction is klick feel the burn. Then the thief is usually already in a bad position when attackin into protection and fire aura. He must constantly disengage and you can heal or hunt him. The main problem for me is not that he kills me, its hard to catch a good one ;-).
I had a thief attacking me in WvW out of stealth. He ran away after the initial strike …
My WvW build has traited fire/earth and is not fresh air but its just the burn here.He came out of steath with basilisk venom:
It triggered gale song. And as a reflex i fired feel the burn. I had a nightmare rune at this moment which added to the fun.So after one stike and my klick:
He:
about 1k damage from feel krit.
2x weakness
My torment sigil triggered — torment
My generosity sigil triggered — his poison went back.
My nightmare rune triggered — He got feared away
Burned from burning precision + feel the burn = 2 stacks.
Blinded
Me:
4 stacks of might
40% protection
Superspeed
Fire aura
Healed his blow (which was a glancing blow, it seems gale song weakness hit befor damage calc).My fastest WvW thief kill was a freaking 5s. Also a stealth attack, but he continued his attack chain into my fire aura for 2 seconds and i fired cleansing flame + magnetic wave + one earth auto chain which is three bleeds. He cloaked and died a few feet from me …
In pvp a single thief usually cant kill me even when i am at 50%. But its important that i swap to earth. A good thief striking in another attunement as a +1 is a killer and did his job well.For an offensive build without healing power tempestious aria is a great addition and i take it over stab or regen. You are not an auramancer. Auras just add nicely.
I see the problem here. For fresh air you overload air a lot and propably need the stab on OL, which prohibits aria … In that case i can only suggest stone heart which is powerful against thief bursts.
I actually play a build like this.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFAQJArdhcMozhVOwnB8RM0AYVW4KkIpjQN4HIByAwHE-TJBFABiXGggTAQN7PAwDAAA
Usually if I miss my pheonix I know that I won’t kill them since the only close range damage is from magnetic wave and arcane shield. Weakness would be nice to have, but you can’t really apply it in this build.
Bad Elementalist
Oh yes i ran arcane before hot. And its nice.
But i traited for arcane skills and used arcane brilliance + shield. 20s brilliance blasting your oponent is quite good with a faster casting time and adding the ferocity buff!
Also had never been a fan of mistform. I use cleansing flame. -3+1 condis + offensive + lower CD. For stomp i have obsidian flesh.
Ele lives and dies with his 40% protection. If the thief crits you without it you die.
Suggestion: trait elemetal surge. Put arcane brilliance on the toolbar and change mistform for cleansing flame. This lets you absorb a condi bomb and burn close range + blind in air with the heal and shield + extra crit and blast.
(edited by Wolfric.9380)
Zerk thief is easiest kill for fresh air imho. Like someone said earlier all you really need is super fast reflexes. Obsidian Flesh needs to land just on time or you are dead.
Näin on.
Do you mean fresh air with arcane or tempest?
Because if you run the old SF fresh ari build its only about timing your burst and blind. Try to apply the more pressure you can. Cast dragon thoot, flamewall and shatterstone on you when they are stealthed. Try to be the First One to attack. And you have to hit them 3 times wit Phoenix if not you dont have enought burst to counter pressure. Run fire sigil and use AoE to spot them (air auto work very nice here since the channel stil track them stealthed). If you are near 50% health cast FGS, the usually autoattacking you while immobilized from panic strike, cast GS 3 and gg.
If you are running tempest I cant help you, I hate it so I don’t play it.
Parabrezza
Oh and run shocking aura trait. It counter their steal.
Parabrezza
Most ppl here haven’t played against good thieves I guess. The problem aren’t the spikes, it’s the pressure with impacting disruption headshots and steal/shadowshot/shadowstep into autoattacks – at least for me it was.
Best advice is to LoS well and set up overloads, use absorb/reflect/blinds against the ranged interrupts and spike him down when he tries to come in for AA’s.
On certain nodes, where you can’t really LoS the thief, it’s IMHO almost unwinnable.
Most ppl here haven’t played against good thieves I guess. The problem aren’t the spikes, it’s the pressure with impacting disruption headshots and steal/shadowshot/shadowstep into autoattacks – at least for me it was.
Best advice is to LoS well and set up overloads, use absorb/reflect/blinds against the ranged interrupts and spike him down when he tries to come in for AA’s.
On certain nodes, where you can’t really LoS the thief, it’s IMHO almost unwinnable.
^this, unwinnable it’s the correct word
Most ppl here haven’t played against good thieves I guess. The problem aren’t the spikes, it’s the pressure with impacting disruption headshots and steal/shadowshot/shadowstep into autoattacks – at least for me it was.
Best advice is to LoS well and set up overloads, use absorb/reflect/blinds against the ranged interrupts and spike him down when he tries to come in for AA’s.
On certain nodes, where you can’t really LoS the thief, it’s IMHO almost unwinnable.
^this, unwinnable it’s the correct word
Zerk fresh air should be taking tempest defense. Thief has literally 0 answers to shocking aura. It’s one of the most onesided matchups in the game.
Stormbluff Isle – Syliara
Elementalist – Necromancer – Warrior
Elementalist – Necromancer – Warrior
Most ppl here haven’t played against good thieves I guess. The problem aren’t the spikes, it’s the pressure with impacting disruption headshots and steal/shadowshot/shadowstep into autoattacks – at least for me it was.
Best advice is to LoS well and set up overloads, use absorb/reflect/blinds against the ranged interrupts and spike him down when he tries to come in for AA’s.
On certain nodes, where you can’t really LoS the thief, it’s IMHO almost unwinnable.
^this, unwinnable it’s the correct word
Zerk fresh air should be taking tempest defense. Thief has literally 0 answers to shocking aura. It’s one of the most onesided matchups in the game.
ooookay….. ^^’
Let me explain how a good thief plays this MU:
- stay ranged, spam headshots to interrupt the overloads or any other spells, this will also trigger tempest defense, making it utterly useless in this MU. It will also proc impacting disruption, dealing huge amounts of dmg.
- As soon as ele switches out of air, he goes in for autoattacks (often with a steal, to take away your prot).
- Then he goes ranged and likely invis again and does it all over again.
There’s no way you’ll outsustain it, since you deal no dmg to the thief if you don’t land an insane stun/knockback-combo, which good thiefs won’t let happen.
I would build the basic fresh ait like this.
You can take shoking aura over cooldown reduction in air, but that extra precision is nice in the build.
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFAQJArdnMIC9MgdOAOOA8RghGATCkBgPYVIvCRhJF0BmhA-TJBFAB6s/ABnAAAeAAiXGAA
This should be much more suited. I have good experience with arcane brilliance and the shield traited. Vamire rune + brilliance rocks too ;-).
Earth + stone heart + FSG is dam good. You put up rock barrier and draw the sword.
I personally used scavenger rune but the power of vamire suits well too. My build was condi.
I also used leeching sigil for maximum drains but air hurts a bit more.
(edited by Wolfric.9380)
I would build the basic fresh ait like this.
You can take shoking aura over cooldown reduction in air, but that extra precision is nice in the build.http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vFAQJArdnMIC9MgdOAOOA8RghGATCkBgPYVIvCRhJF0BmhA-TJBFAB6s/ABnAAAeAAiXGAA
This should be much more suited. I have good experience with arcane brilliance and the shield traited. Vamire rune + brilliance rocks too ;-).
Earth + stone heart + FSG is dam good. You put up rock barrier and draw the sword.I personally used scavenger rune but the power of vamire suits well too. My build was condi.
I also used leeching sigil for maximum drains but air hurts a bit more.
The only reason fresh air is only semi-bad and not complete trash is cuz you get air-overload every 10 seconds (if you always fully channel it), why would you not run tempest?
There you go; fresh air, teamfight build:
You can also go stoneheart+marauder amu.
(edited by PowerBottom.5796)
Most ppl here haven’t played against good thieves I guess. The problem aren’t the spikes, it’s the pressure with impacting disruption headshots and steal/shadowshot/shadowstep into autoattacks – at least for me it was.
Best advice is to LoS well and set up overloads, use absorb/reflect/blinds against the ranged interrupts and spike him down when he tries to come in for AA’s.
On certain nodes, where you can’t really LoS the thief, it’s IMHO almost unwinnable.
^this, unwinnable it’s the correct word
Zerk fresh air should be taking tempest defense. Thief has literally 0 answers to shocking aura. It’s one of the most onesided matchups in the game.
ooookay….. ^^’
Let me explain how a good thief plays this MU:
- stay ranged, spam headshots to interrupt the overloads or any other spells, this will also trigger tempest defense, making it utterly useless in this MU. It will also proc impacting disruption, dealing huge amounts of dmg.
- As soon as ele switches out of air, he goes in for autoattacks (often with a steal, to take away your prot).
- Then he goes ranged and likely invis again and does it all over again.There’s no way you’ll outsustain it, since you deal no dmg to the thief if you don’t land an insane stun/knockback-combo, which good thiefs won’t let happen.
I’m so tired of people who are simply bad at the game assuming that their personal failings should be addressed by balance changes.
You’re literally losing to headshot spam playing fresh air. And still have the balls to come and pretend like you know what you’re talking about. Maybe it makes you feel better about your losses to think that the matchup is a bad one, but it’s doing the rest of the community a disservice to spread delusions as facts.
Stormbluff Isle – Syliara
Elementalist – Necromancer – Warrior
Elementalist – Necromancer – Warrior
Most ppl here haven’t played against good thieves I guess. The problem aren’t the spikes, it’s the pressure with impacting disruption headshots and steal/shadowshot/shadowstep into autoattacks – at least for me it was.
Best advice is to LoS well and set up overloads, use absorb/reflect/blinds against the ranged interrupts and spike him down when he tries to come in for AA’s.
On certain nodes, where you can’t really LoS the thief, it’s IMHO almost unwinnable.
^this, unwinnable it’s the correct word
Zerk fresh air should be taking tempest defense. Thief has literally 0 answers to shocking aura. It’s one of the most onesided matchups in the game.
ooookay….. ^^’
Let me explain how a good thief plays this MU:
- stay ranged, spam headshots to interrupt the overloads or any other spells, this will also trigger tempest defense, making it utterly useless in this MU. It will also proc impacting disruption, dealing huge amounts of dmg.
- As soon as ele switches out of air, he goes in for autoattacks (often with a steal, to take away your prot).
- Then he goes ranged and likely invis again and does it all over again.There’s no way you’ll outsustain it, since you deal no dmg to the thief if you don’t land an insane stun/knockback-combo, which good thiefs won’t let happen.
I’m so tired of people who are simply bad at the game assuming that their personal failings should be addressed by balance changes.
You’re literally losing to headshot spam playing fresh air. And still have the balls to come and pretend like you know what you’re talking about. Maybe it makes you feel better about your losses to think that the matchup is a bad one, but it’s doing the rest of the community a disservice to spread delusions as facts.
God….can you read what he says before answering back? Any decent thief can trigger tempest defense from distance and in all safety because shocking aura works only in mele…
He doesn’t lose to headshot spam, the thief simply outsustain you easy…I really don’t see how you personal successes can prove anything, as if you say a fresh air ele losing to a thief is bad…are we sure the thief losing to fresh air is any better?
Most ppl here haven’t played against good thieves I guess. The problem aren’t the spikes, it’s the pressure with impacting disruption headshots and steal/shadowshot/shadowstep into autoattacks – at least for me it was.
Best advice is to LoS well and set up overloads, use absorb/reflect/blinds against the ranged interrupts and spike him down when he tries to come in for AA’s.
On certain nodes, where you can’t really LoS the thief, it’s IMHO almost unwinnable.
^this, unwinnable it’s the correct word
Zerk fresh air should be taking tempest defense. Thief has literally 0 answers to shocking aura. It’s one of the most onesided matchups in the game.
ooookay….. ^^’
Let me explain how a good thief plays this MU:
- stay ranged, spam headshots to interrupt the overloads or any other spells, this will also trigger tempest defense, making it utterly useless in this MU. It will also proc impacting disruption, dealing huge amounts of dmg.
- As soon as ele switches out of air, he goes in for autoattacks (often with a steal, to take away your prot).
- Then he goes ranged and likely invis again and does it all over again.There’s no way you’ll outsustain it, since you deal no dmg to the thief if you don’t land an insane stun/knockback-combo, which good thiefs won’t let happen.
I’m so tired of people who are simply bad at the game assuming that their personal failings should be addressed by balance changes.
You’re literally losing to headshot spam playing fresh air. And still have the balls to come and pretend like you know what you’re talking about. Maybe it makes you feel better about your losses to think that the matchup is a bad one, but it’s doing the rest of the community a disservice to spread delusions as facts.
totally knew sth like that was coming.
But good for you if you win against thief. I have played maybe 50 1v1’s against Legend x5+ Thiefs at the start of last season on fresh air (yes, it’s been quite a while) and lost most of them. I’m also not a player who gives up easily and I tried quite a few different ways to approach the MU but didn’t find an answer. I gave up on the build although I felt it was strong in teamfights, because it lost almost all 1v1 MU’s and is too slow for a +1/teamfighter compared to rev.
quite clear that tempest is good. But before hot i loved brilliance and shield playing arcane line. I also prefered elemental contingency over final shield.
Do you mean fresh air with arcane or tempest?
Because if you run the old SF fresh ari build its only about timing your burst and blind. Try to apply the more pressure you can. Cast dragon thoot, flamewall and shatterstone on you when they are stealthed. Try to be the First One to attack. And you have to hit them 3 times wit Phoenix if not you dont have enought burst to counter pressure. Run fire sigil and use AoE to spot them (air auto work very nice here since the channel stil track them stealthed). If you are near 50% health cast FGS, the usually autoattacking you while immobilized from panic strike, cast GS 3 and gg.
If you are running tempest I cant help you, I hate it so I don’t play it.
This is how I do it as well. Dont hesitate to use your CD’s when the thief opens up.
Also time your dodges. If he only uses 1 heartseeker in a smoke you know his stealth is only 3 secs. Try to dogde on right before his stealth ends and 9/10 you will dogde his opening.
D/F frontline for [PUSH]