Guild Wars 2

Ok so I play quite a bit of pvp/wvw as thief or mesmer and so far every ele i have encountered has insane mobility/sustain/burns – so my question is how do i fight against this?

As mesmer : always use staff/GS + PU for condi shatter build, as d/d is mele you have the luxury of playing counter-attack when the ele is forced to get close; I suggest using mantra of resolve for cleansing of burn stacks, snare the ele into chaos field

As thief : D/P is your answer, but you must know ele CD and skills/utilities and realize when you can land a safe backstab/steal to chain chill; never face an ele directly and on his own terms, you have stealth for a reason

Remember to be always patient, being overly aggressive never help, bait dodge, wait to attack

1vs1 is tough deal, I think only Signet Necro has real good chance came on top every time.

Mesmer, if can burst Ele out of stealth the to around %15-20 then it can stun lock and kill him, before the mirror blade and mantra nerf, Mesm can instagib D/D Ele out of stealth.

A Thief should not 1vs1 a D/D Ele, it is not its role, it should gang the Ele when Ele is already fighting somebody preferably at %50 HP then it will have no time to react.

Supreme.3164:

As mesmer : always use staff/GS + PU for condi shatter build, as d/d is mele you have the luxury of playing counter-attack when the ele is forced to get close; I suggest using mantra of resolve for cleansing of burn stacks, snare the ele into chaos field

As thief : D/P is your answer, but you must know ele CD and skills/utilities and realize when you can land a safe backstab/steal to chain chill; never face an ele directly and on his own terms, you have stealth for a reason

Remember to be always patient, being overly aggressive never help, bait dodge, wait to attack

what if i am playing shatter mesmer?

posthumecaver.6473:

1vs1 is tough deal, I think only Signet Necro has real good chance came on top every time.

Mesmer, if can burst Ele out of stealth the to around %15-20 then it can stun lock and kill him, before the mirror blade and mantra nerf, Mesm can instagib D/D Ele out of stealth.

A Thief should not 1vs1 a D/D Ele, it is not its role, it should gang the Ele when Ele is already fighting somebody preferably at %50 HP then it will have no time to react.

thank you for the response

yeah, you have to get out of the mentality of “Dueling” it is a team based game for a reason. Dueling is never the best option.

As a guardian, I get always facerolled when Ele starts fight with me alone QQ

Mesmer condi is the way to go but it’s still a hard fight. D/p thief can win with patience. P/d thief can win also but just through being annoying and making them leave especially in wvw.

Signet necro and minion necro currently seem to be the only real counter to ele

I don´t play d/d but als ele i know that necro is a nemesis and condi mesmer follows close up :-). The thief is a long fight. Either the thief makes a mistake (like coaking but being hit by my AE attacks like cleansing flame and dies or i see hes a good thief and better run when he cloaks :-).

Wolfric.9380:

I don´t play d/d but als ele i know that necro is a nemesis and condi mesmer follows close up :-). The thief is a long fight. Either the thief makes a mistake (like coaking but being hit by my AE attacks like cleansing flame and dies or i see hes a good thief and better run when he cloaks :-).

Run from a Thief, why Shocking Aura and Lightning Whip are you friends, if you are running around with Ele always be in Air, Thief opens up on you, Shocking Aura and his opening burst is in toilet off course he can abuse Stealth but that is quite predictable isn’kitten

Count to 4 and do something about it and Lightning Whip cleave is the best medicine for them.

Dodge fire attunement, avoid lightning aura, save stunbreaks for updraft and earthquake, attack when ele goes or just left water.

^this

and count dodge to be sure you dont waste huge damage spell

and run doom sigil if you have no acces to poison

PS:
and wait for burning nerf ^^

Focus on dodge/cc when they attune to fire. They lose burn opportunity and might stacking opportunity. Save your condi/damage spike for when they attune to water.

Last ele i fought cought me in his ring.
I simply didn´t move and continued firing (I have range 900).
He came back to breath — one side dodge through the ring. Not 1 stack burn got me.
The problem was more his incredible regneration + cleanse and disengage ability coming back full….
And thiefs usualy don´t get me with openning burst…. Its the 4+ attempt when my cooldowns are in bad shape, if he isn´t dead befor :-). The only class that constantly kills me is necro… But yeserday i got one down in a duel …

Nah, ele can’t disengage, unless you’re playing necro, in which case you signed to get disengage by creating the character ^^

Even mesmer are more mobile than ele nowadays

Mattmatt.4962:

Nah, ele can’t disengage, unless you’re playing necro, in which case you signed to get disengage by creating the character ^^

Even mesmer are more mobile than ele nowadays

Ele can’t disengage, wut?

Ride the Lightining, Lightning Flash, FGS?

Lol we were next to Thief so they have to nerf the ride the lightning to oblivion.

Ride the lightning + lightning flash isnt enough to disengage:
mesmer
guardian (in this case you’ll be able to create distance, but not leaving combat mode, and he will end up catching you)
thief
warrior
ranger (assuming they know they have a weapon switch :x)
engi (if rocket bots sloted) (but you dont see many engi nowadays anyway)

I’m not counting FGS cause it’s an ele’s elite and to me they dont exist (and you can still apply a well timed root to disrupt it, and almost forgot to mention it got nerfed pretty hard by the switfness not affecting it)

Conclusion: only necro has less mobility, exactly what i said

Play trap ranger. At least from the ranger end, I win 1v1 nearly every time. Harder when you’re attacking, but you need to dive onto point and start laying down the traps and evades.

Did someone just claim ele is 2nd worse class in terms of mobility?

Wow

Yes and i confirm that.

Explain me why am i wrong if you’re so sure i’m mistaking.

Mattmatt.4962:

Yes and i confirm that.

Explain me why am i wrong if you’re so sure i’m mistaking.

Necro
Guard
Ranger
Mesmer
Engi

You’ll out run all of them. The only time you won’t beat a mesmer is in PvP when portal is used.

from pvp pov
good ele is hard to take
if he pressure too much he can disengage fast heal himself and come back in 3 sec
he can kite alot so even in 1v3 he can kite for 1 min use los area heal and kite again
in 1v1 if he got the point dont bother as he can get fast help so you can outnumbered
if you got the point with all the burning field try to stay out of them and do fast pressure so he will heal and get of the point till you can get help

dont try to lose time in 1v1 unless he is bad ele

regarding which class can take him
necro
condi mes – against good ele .the ele can get help so careful

ele atm are very strong and versatile and can adapt to every scenario of fights with the same build . this is the reason why ppl claim OP

But what about perma burn berserkers now?

T raw.4658:

Did someone just claim ele is 2nd worse class in terms of mobility?

Wow

Thank you. I was afraid I’m the only one thinking this is a ridiculous claim.

You better not try to 1v1 ele as a thief or mesmer. It’s a complete waste of your time. Even 2v1 may not be worth it. Because a good ele will be able to disengage and outrotate you.

Try to find better fights somewhere else. Leave the more tanky bruiser build to 1v1 ele, e.g. soldier engi, cele/soldier necro, shoutbow warrior etc.

Their power decreases in teamfight and they won’t be able to survive a team focus fire. So basically for dd ele into two situations: 1. Leave them in duel with other tanky spec 2. fight them in a teamfight and chain cc+focus fire to down them quickly.

If they have 1 DD cele you can win, if they 2 just leave the game.

T raw.4658:

Guard

Every weapon got something to follow, hammer and staff beiing the worst tho. GS isnt great but 2 & 5 used together allows to almost follow. But the real pvp weapon (outside of point bunkering) is sword with medit
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Flashing_Blade
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Judge%27s_Intervention

T raw.4658:

Ranger

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Swoop
go check sword by yourself

The only build that do not have any of thiose 2weapon is axe condi bunker . Bunker isnt made to chase, it’s made to BUNKER (same than guardian by the way :p )

T raw.4658:

Mesmer

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blink
Can be used twice if combined with echoe (instant leave combat mode … you know … the exact reason why ride the lightning got hammer-nerfed ? :x ). But even alone its enough to follow ele
Play just 2min in wvw and you’ll see how you can’t escape mesmer. He shouldn’t be able to kill you but you’re forced to run to your blob or your spawn

T raw.4658:

Engi

As i said, for engi, it really depend on what is slotted, but rocket boot and tool kit is pretty common. Both allows to gap close pretty heavily
Anyway you dont see many engi nowadays
But well, i agree that engi is slower

Listing random class is nice, but providing proof is better

PS:
I skipped necro cause i said he’s the slowest class in the game and you sign up for this when you create your char

I can’t believe you’re still defending this claim with statements like this:

Play just 2min in wvw and you’ll see how you can’t escape mesmer. He shouldn’t be able to kill you but you’re forced to run to your blob or your spawn

So obviously you cannot escape a mesmer BUT what you can do is run to your spawn.

…

Seriously?

What? A ranger with swoop has more mobility than an ele? You can’t be serious.

1) learn their invuln frames
1a) Evasive Arcana is a strong incentive to dodge in a certain element in a certain point in the fight, it’s different for every ele, but you can often see a pattern in a player’s style
2) Immobilize/condiburst/burst after they just left water. This one is huge and will force them to burn through their long-cooldown utilities quickly.
3) dodge fire, stunbreak air/earth. Almost every fire move is worth burning a dodge on, so you have to make do with stunbreaks/stab/teleports on the ele cc imo
4) cele ele is stronk
5) earth/water and air→fire are often coupled in the rotation, so the ele has a defensive phase (earth protection up, frost armor, water dodge roll, water condi cleanse) and an offensive phase (transitioning from earth#4, trying to land air control and connect fire damage)

During the first one to two rotations d/d gets stronger (building might stacks, working towards perma fury especially for fire cele, swiftness uptime especially for air cele etc). On the other hand d/d longevity is hardcapped by their long cd utilities. I think this is the one big thing you have to understand about d/d cele, besides the attuning-out-of-water thing.
If you can’t overwhelm them quickly or force them to burn through their cds it might not be in your interest to fight them at this point in the game. If you got them on the defensive they are your kitten though.

OP’s question should rephrase to : how to beat Mesmer?
with 20k burst in 2 sec, almost perma stealth, ridiculously amount of invul skills and teleport how do you exactly kill them?

Mattmatt.4962:

T raw.4658:

Guard

Every weapon got something to follow, hammer and staff beiing the worst tho. GS isnt great but 2 & 5 used together allows to almost follow. But the real pvp weapon (outside of point bunkering) is sword with medit
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Flashing_Blade
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Judge%27s_Intervention

T raw.4658:

Ranger

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Swoop
go check sword by yourself

The only build that do not have any of thiose 2weapon is axe condi bunker . Bunker isnt made to chase, it’s made to BUNKER (same than guardian by the way :p )

T raw.4658:

Mesmer

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blink
Can be used twice if combined with echoe (instant leave combat mode … you know … the exact reason why ride the lightning got hammer-nerfed ? :x ). But even alone its enough to follow ele
Play just 2min in wvw and you’ll see how you can’t escape mesmer. He shouldn’t be able to kill you but you’re forced to run to your blob or your spawn

T raw.4658:

Engi

As i said, for engi, it really depend on what is slotted, but rocket boot and tool kit is pretty common. Both allows to gap close pretty heavily
Anyway you dont see many engi nowadays
But well, i agree that engi is slower

Listing random class is nice, but providing proof is better

PS:
I skipped necro cause i said he’s the slowest class in the game and you sign up for this when you create your char

Thank you for your reply. I can now understand why you think the way you do and it has nothing to do with you being even remotely correct.

Have a nice day

@cursE

He can follow you as long as he desire, if you ever stop running, you get annihilated by mesmer’s balanced burst. While running you dont allow him to place decent shatter (as long as you wisely dodge sometime).
So yes you’re forced to run till he leaves you or till you reach a safe area.

I’m not talkiing about the fact that you can kill him IF you’re running 10011 (any other build is auto loose)

.
@ xarallei
I’ll do the math for you since you seems unable to do basic ones

ele’s mobility burst: 1200 (rtl) + 900 (lf) = 2100 on 40sec cd
sxoop: 1K1 on 12sec cd

2swoop brings you to 2K2, gg you reached the ele in a bit than half his mobility burst!
(not even to mention after the first swoop, you’re in range to use your LB if eqquiped while waiting for the 2nd (if you’re using sword (only other viable possibility with GS) you reach him in one mobility burst)

T raw.4658:

Thank you for your reply. I can now understand why you think the way you do and it has nothing to do with you being even remotely correct.

Have a nice day

Thank you for your valuable imput, such argument, much wow
.

@ EvilHero
10011 is said to be able to kill them thanks to OPburning. Since i’m not using this build (a bit lame to me) i can’t confirm. I tend to think it works on shatter mesmer but not on condi mesmer has they are full dire geared (kinda too many hp ^^)

I’ll do the math for you since you seems unable to do basic ones

ele’s mobility burst: 1200 (rtl) + 900 (lf) = 2100 on 40sec cd
sxoop: 1K1 on 12sec cd

2swoop brings you to 2K2, gg you reached the ele in a bit than half his mobility burst!

Suddenly, ele pulls out fgs. Aaaaand he’s gone.

Wow, didn’t see that one coming!

Mattmatt.4962:

@cursE

He can follow you as long as he desire, if you ever stop running, you get annihilated by mesmer’s balanced burst. While running you dont allow him to place decent shatter (as long as you wisely dodge sometime).
So yes you’re forced to run till he leaves you or till you reach a safe area.

I’m not talkiing about the fact that you can kill him IF you’re running 10011 (any other build is auto loose)

.
@ xarallei
I’ll do the math for you since you seems unable to do basic ones

ele’s mobility burst: 1200 (rtl) + 900 (lf) = 2100 on 40sec cd
sxoop: 1K1 on 12sec cd

2swoop brings you to 2K2, gg you reached the ele in a bit than half his mobility burst!
(not even to mention after the first swoop, you’re in range to use your LB if eqquiped while waiting for the 2nd (if you’re using sword (only other viable possibility with GS) you reach him in one mobility burst)

T raw.4658:

Thank you for your reply. I can now understand why you think the way you do and it has nothing to do with you being even remotely correct.

Have a nice day

Thank you for your valuable imput, such argument, much wow
.

@ EvilHero
10011 is said to be able to kill them thanks to OPburning. Since i’m not using this build (a bit lame to me) i can’t confirm. I tend to think it works on shatter mesmer but not on condi mesmer has they are full dire geared (kinda too many hp ^^)

You’re more than welcome and I hope one day everything works out for you.

Though I will be here when after the nerf stick lands…..we are seeing 3-4 ele comps popping up in the PvP scene now.

Only a matter of time.

he’ll next claim ele is squishier than thieves because thieves wear medium armor.

I would say with thief is to try to get the high hitting backstab and give bleeding and immobile us. Try not to get more then 3 condies at the start once we are low we are kind dead, that is when u burst out, condies. At least that is what I would say to do in wvw