Guild Wars 2

Thieves are getting nerf (right or wrong; that is a matter of opinion but the nerf is coming). They basically took thieves ability to fight 1vX. Can they still do it? Yes, but it will be 10x harder with the upcoming changes.

Since Ele is the only other class that can reliably 1vX, thief player will probably flock to the D/D Ele and we will see a surge of them in WvW. QQs will continue on the forum and the Ele will get nerf. The FOTM was thief, now it will be D/D ele, then so on. The problem is that after the FOTM is over, the class is left underpowered.

What’s your prediction after the March 26 patch?

No. Backstab Thief still works great after the change.

Since Ele is the only other class that can reliably 1vX

Such a laughable statement to make.

Aren’t boons also (possibly) taking a hit? Won’t that affect bunker builds?

skupuz.6940:

Thieves are getting nerf (right or wrong; that is a matter of opinion but the nerf is coming). They basically took thieves ability to fight 1vX. Can they still do it? Yes, but it will be 10x harder with the upcoming changes.

Since Ele is the only other class that can reliably 1vX, thief player will probably flock to the D/D Ele and we will see a surge of them in WvW. QQs will continue on the forum and the Ele will get nerf. The FOTM was thief, now it will be D/D ele, then so on. The problem is that after the FOTM is over, the class is left underpowered.

What’s your prediction after the March 26 patch?

How do you know Thief will be nerfed? Are you just guessing or is there detailed info on the patch somewhere?

There will exist more means to counter boons, which should make it eaiser to counter dd bunker eles.

Intigo.1653:

No. Backstab Thief still works great after the change.

Since Ele is the only other class that can reliably 1vX

Such a laughable statement to make.

What is there to laugh about? Sorry but the only classes that can reliably 1vx and get away are ele and thief. Sorry, forgot to include “get away.”

Can other classes do it too? Yes, but not as effective as ele/thief.

DiogoSilva.7089:

There will exist more means to counter boons, which should make it eaiser to counter dd bunker eles.

It is in discussion. Using “will exist” is speaking about something that is definite…

Turbofakitten69:

skupuz.6940:

Thieves are getting nerf (right or wrong; that is a matter of opinion but the nerf is coming). They basically took thieves ability to fight 1vX. Can they still do it? Yes, but it will be 10x harder with the upcoming changes.

Since Ele is the only other class that can reliably 1vX, thief player will probably flock to the D/D Ele and we will see a surge of them in WvW. QQs will continue on the forum and the Ele will get nerf. The FOTM was thief, now it will be D/D ele, then so on. The problem is that after the FOTM is over, the class is left underpowered.

What’s your prediction after the March 26 patch?

How do you know Thief will be nerfed? Are you just guessing or is there detailed info on the patch somewhere?

They will lose their ability to chain stealth thus making it harder to fight multiple targets. It will be in the March 26 patch.

I think I can hear angels singing. I’m so kitten tired of seeing thieves fearlessly charge into a group of five people only to disappear forever when things go wrong due to their own stupidity. Between the removal of culling and “revealed” debuff change, I’ve been waiting for this a long time.

I find it funny how the ability to run away is the deciding factor on if a class is OP or FOTM in alot of people’s minds. I doubt ppl will flock to D/D ele, consider they also said they are going to add more movement skills to thief.

With the nerf to RTL cooldown, D/D elementalists lost a big part of their mobility edge already. Kick boons in the newts and we’ll probably be seeing less D/D eles, not more.

When specced a certain way, my warrior can already outrun D/D eles (also, he has about 12k more HP and 800 more armor, permaswiftness with 2 buttons instead of 7, aoe heals with condition removal every 7 seconds, automatic stability on CC, 2 immobilizes with cripple, automatic invulnerability at 25%HP) but he can also facetank so much that I usually don’t have to run. But yeah, D/D eles are sooo OP, lol.

(Edit: Just noticed this thread was started by a thief player….. For whatever that’s worth.)

kicked in the newts.. haha genius Thrash.

I’m looking forward to the double buffed banners, might be worth taking them over shouts :o

Ele can cripple on all attacks with the Glyph at least, and protection+regen kinda makes up the armour and hp difference.

The “boon-hate” traits are going to be interesting… I already run signet of nullification on my ele, and it’s pretty nice.

I’m concerned about this boon-hate thing. I’m hoping it’s not an example of the developers being months behind the meta in their planning, or basing the entire game balance off a few tPvP teams.

In tier 2 NA WvW at the moment, boons are already often a liability. The sheer amount of necros and mesmers specced specifically to remove/corrupt boons makes front line combat dangerous for any class that leaks boons out their ears.

If the damage boon-hate causes is negligible, then why add it at all? If it is considerable damage, classes with boons really will be hated. Good thing I leveled up my warrior, I’ll just switch “great justice” to balanced stance or endure pain or a banner or something, don’t want to give off too many boons while healing after all….

Boonhate as a trait is ok, you have to give up something else to get it, so it’ll mix up the builds, maybe it’ll be something only condition warriors can get? Who knows.

I’m always looking forward to seeing the meta get mixed up.

And wrangler, just because the most effective ele spec is the most mobile doesn’t mean other classes can’t spec for similar or greater mobility. They will just lose some effectiveness in combat.

Thief was fotm?

Major Kaldash.3542:

I find it funny how the ability to run away is the deciding factor on if a class is OP or FOTM in alot of people’s minds. I doubt ppl will flock to D/D ele, consider they also said they are going to add more movement skills to thief.

I just like seeing kitteny, inept players get crushed instead of having a free out for their mistakes. I’ve started carrying an excess of immobilize and cripple in WvW on my warrior just so that I can target and kill thieves and /laugh at them for thinking they’d get to escape like usual.

Wranglerist.5489:

Warrior same mobility or more than ele? LOL TROLL

Nuff saaid kthxbai.

Greatsword Rush (1200 range, 20s cd like RtL) + Sword Savage Leap (600 range, 8s cd), 1800 range combined (and you could use Whirlwind for another 450 range for a total of 2250 if you want). And all these skills break immobilize if you spec for it (RtL is a self stun if you use it while immobilized)
So, yes, warriors can be very mobile if they want.

Sil.4560:

Major Kaldash.3542:

I find it funny how the ability to run away is the deciding factor on if a class is OP or FOTM in alot of people’s minds. I doubt ppl will flock to D/D ele, consider they also said they are going to add more movement skills to thief.

I just like seeing kitteny, inept players get crushed instead of having a free out for their mistakes. I’ve started carrying an excess of immobilize and cripple in WvW on my warrior just so that I can target and kill thieves and /laugh at them for thinking they’d get to escape like usual.

You can still chain stealth WHILE stealthed though

Will that be the next thing you QQ about?

DiogoSilva.7089:

There will exist more means to counter boons, which should make it eaiser to counter dd bunker eles.

This is what should have happened in the first place instead of just nerfing eles.

Wranglerist.5489:

Warrior same mobility or more than ele? LOL TROLL

Nuff saaid kthxbai.

It’s incredible how ignorant people choose to be.

Warriors can go faster than eles, most just aren’t specced to do so since the class isn’t really meant to do mobile damage in the way eles are. Only time I see warriors go faster is skipping in dungeons like arah 3 when you have time to change equip before moving on.

Really don’t see many people flocking to the Ele to 1vX when they nerf the thief. A few might but your average player just doesn’t casually discard the character they put a jack ton of time into.

Razor.6392:

You can still chain stealth WHILE stealthed though

Will that be the next thing you QQ about?

Sounds like they’re fixing that actually. So no, I don’t need to “QQ” about an inherent balance flaw. Since apparently any sort of negative regard for broken mechanics is “QQ” to some people. Sigh.

If they go through with the boon hate concept, then I’m figuring the few staff eles will switch to D/D just to survive.

The difference between thieves and eles doing 1vsX in WvW is that decent thieves are able to actually kill + (stealth) stomp enemies whereas bunker eles just cannot be killed because when things go bad they RTL away.

You never see a bunker ele actually kill + stomp enemies nearly on such a high rate than thieves do. Look at all those vids out there (e.g. daphoenix). You rarely see them actually kill + stomp stuff in 1vsX (sorry bros, no offense).

Will thieves bandwagon to bunker ele after march patch? I dont know. But when they do I predict they will regret.

given the FACT ele cannot kill bunkers.

Given another fact that actually we have 2 aoe (necro/mesmer) that wreak havoc on battlefields making life hard expecially for D/D ele…

Reducing the number of ele D/D prey means people won t choose to have a profession really situational (unless they revise those AoE).

i’d like to be able to kill a warrior or a guardian….
I use a balanced ele and i cannot do enough damage…..with recent rtl nerf i cannot even keep the pace.

Also if you read they will enhance thief mobility…..i bet thief will be nearly as broken as now as roamers in WWW while becoming completely immune to D/D ele.

Also despite what people says playing ele is not so easy…..unless your opponent is really bad.

ThiBash.5634:

If they go through with the boon hate concept, then I’m figuring the few staff eles will switch to D/D just to survive.

Staff doesn’t have nearly the same boon up time on multiple boon types that a D/D does.

Wranglerist.5489:

Warrior same mobility or more than ele? LOL TROLL

Nuff saaid kthxbai.

Yes, they actually have better mobility.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGcHHFnDxwY
And this is before the rtl CD nerf.

Wranglerist.5489:

Warrior same mobility or more than ele? LOL TROLL

Nuff saaid kthxbai.

Wars have exceptional mobility, half of their non-util skills are leaps or gap closers and then you still have stuff like Bull’s (which seems to have a much longer range than the one listed). People just don’t “feel” as mobile on a Warrior in PvP because your condition management isn’t that hot and you’re only effective in melee.

Want to know why Warrior’s laugh at your comments about thier mobility? Because unlike every other movement skill in the game, their movement skills are affected by movement impairing abilities.

I’d love to see the forums light up when that 1200 RTL on a 20 second cooldown actually only went 600 yards because you were chilled. Whirlwind, Rush, and Bull’s charge combined wouldn’t keep up with an Ele if both were snared.

Another problem is the obvious where Greatsword really isn’t the greatest choice and they’re forced to use it because of the kitten movement abilities it has. I’d wager most warriors out there would give anything to be able to use Hammer/Axe+Shield instead of GS.

So no, Bull’s Charge, Rush, Whirlwind, and Leap don’t really work as well as Mistform, RTL, and Blink. And most warrior’s only use sword+horn on their offswap for running around in the open terrain out of combat. In combat they’re almost always axe/gs.

It means like thief FoTM D/P and CnD spam thieves will be replaced with more skilled players who’ve already made the transition from using stealth so much and instead using mobility. Which they’ll be buffing anyways.

They clearly said in the SOTG that the thief was envisioned to be the slippery class with high dmg. Just because they’re changing the “slippery-ness” of that profession from stealth to something else doesnt necessarily constitute a nerf. As well as it doesnt mean another class cant be slippery either.

Hopefully after this Condi thieves, D/D smart-spikers, and S/D will also be valued for what they are, even though they are often over shadowed by the allure of “Stealth on Demand” even though your gimping yourself relying on constant Black Powders and Cloak and Daggers which skilled players can navigate around.

Eles aren’t OP. If people invested more into paying attention when fighting an ele like they did with other classes, it’d be easier for them. You GTFO when a warrior switches to greatsword/rifle as is anywhere near remotely high dmg, but not when you see the ele switch into Fire? Count the seconds before rolling to avoid Churning Earth? Slap the immobilze after hes in water, going into air?

Your cries of OP and profession inbalance seem like ignorance to me.

Atherakhia.4086:

Want to know why Warrior’s laugh at your comments about thier mobility? Because unlike every other movement skill in the game, their movement skills are affected by movement impairing abilities.

I’d love to see the forums light up when that 1200 RTL on a 20 second cooldown actually only went 600 yards because you were chilled. Whirlwind, Rush, and Bull’s charge combined wouldn’t keep up with an Ele if both were snared.

Another problem is the obvious where Greatsword really isn’t the greatest choice and they’re forced to use it because of the kitten movement abilities it has. I’d wager most warriors out there would give anything to be able to use Hammer/Axe+Shield instead of GS.

So no, Bull’s Charge, Rush, Whirlwind, and Leap don’t really work as well as Mistform, RTL, and Blink. And most warrior’s only use sword+horn on their offswap for running around in the open terrain out of combat. In combat they’re almost always axe/gs.

I play both warrior and elementalist. My warrior can facetank things that my elementalist HAS to run from. Specced for highest possible mobility and survivability it’s no contest which wins.

Warriors can spec to remove immobilize with every movement skill, warhorn clears all chill/cripple/immobilize, so if you are having problems with those conditions, it’s you or your build choices. Elementalists have to spec into a cookie cutter setup and use only one weapon set to achieve much survivability, warriors have choices of many viable specs, that’s the only difference.

Last night, on my warrior, I ran solo into a guild group of about 15 which was taking a camp, casually picked up some supply, knocked a few of them over the head and ran off just as easily, or moreso, than I could on my elementalist.

People are just frustrated that their expectations of a cloth class to simply stand still and die under melee pressure aren’t fulfilled in this game, but I bet they’d complain just as much if elementalists could easily oneshot them from range like the cloth classes in those other games which have programmed their subconscious expectations. For example, people mention mist form a lot in their complaints, compare it to endure pain and tell me which is better (hint: endure pain allows you to keep attacking….).

The reason warriors don’t all run gs/s-wh is because there are ways to survive other than simply running like a wuss every time you take damage.

skupuz.6940:

Intigo.1653:

No. Backstab Thief still works great after the change.

Since Ele is the only other class that can reliably 1vX

Such a laughable statement to make.

What is there to laugh about? Sorry but the only classes that can reliably 1vx and get away are ele and thief. Sorry, forgot to include “get away.”

Can other classes do it too? Yes, but not as effective as ele/thief.

If escaping an undefeated player is “reliable 1vx” then I guess I would have to reconsider my definition of reliable. Though, this is not the first I have heard something like that from a D/D ele. I just thought the concept the first time I heard it was a bit unusual, though truthful. It’s just that I don’t think there are alot players who value the fact they can run from a battle.

It is a bit premature to think upcoming changes will somehow change the thief class and cause massive rage quit. I think most class changes already occured and that the WvW changes were postponed for March. Regardless, the devs seem to be pretty evenhanded in their adjustments. The recent changes to the Ele class seem to demonstrate the devs’ cautiousness. They were far milder than many expected.

The thief class seems so much different to play that I suspect their players will not leave to play a different class, any class, without some unforseen unfathomable event. Learning an entirely new class, especially one as complicated as the Ele, and bringing that class up to speed is not an easy undertaking. For me, the class now seems relitively straight forward, but then I remember I have been playing it since Beta 1 and am still picking up little things I seem to be noticing and implementing for the first time.

Thrashbarg.9820:

Atherakhia.4086:

Want to know why Warrior’s laugh at your comments about thier mobility? Because unlike every other movement skill in the game, their movement skills are affected by movement impairing abilities.

I’d love to see the forums light up when that 1200 RTL on a 20 second cooldown actually only went 600 yards because you were chilled. Whirlwind, Rush, and Bull’s charge combined wouldn’t keep up with an Ele if both were snared.

Another problem is the obvious where Greatsword really isn’t the greatest choice and they’re forced to use it because of the kitten movement abilities it has. I’d wager most warriors out there would give anything to be able to use Hammer/Axe+Shield instead of GS.

So no, Bull’s Charge, Rush, Whirlwind, and Leap don’t really work as well as Mistform, RTL, and Blink. And most warrior’s only use sword+horn on their offswap for running around in the open terrain out of combat. In combat they’re almost always axe/gs.

I play both warrior and elementalist. My warrior can facetank things that my elementalist HAS to run from. Specced for highest possible mobility and survivability it’s no contest which wins.

Warriors can spec to remove immobilize with every movement skill, warhorn clears all chill/cripple/immobilize, so if you are having problems with those conditions, it’s you or your build choices. Elementalists have to spec into a cookie cutter setup and use only one weapon set to achieve much survivability, warriors have choices of many viable specs, that’s the only difference.

Last night, on my warrior, I ran solo into a guild group of about 15 which was taking a camp, casually picked up some supply, knocked a few of them over the head and ran off just as easily, or moreso, than I could on my elementalist.

People are just frustrated that their expectations of a cloth class to simply stand still and die under melee pressure aren’t fulfilled in this game, but I bet they’d complain just as much if elementalists could easily oneshot them from range like the cloth classes in those other games which have programmed their subconscious expectations. For example, people mention mist form a lot in their complaints, compare it to endure pain and tell me which is better (hint: endure pain allows you to keep attacking….).

The reason warriors don’t all run gs/s-wh is because there are ways to survive other than simply running like a wuss every time you take damage.

not surprisingly…this has already happened, before the game would be released , GW2 reddit and GW2 guru forum were “full” of whine thread on the ranged damage of eles, the damage of the auto-attacks has been lowered behind usefulness in most cases

I remember one particular complain:
“Will the ele be the bright wizard of GW2?”

skupuz.6940:

Turbofakitten69:

skupuz.6940:

Thieves are getting nerf (right or wrong; that is a matter of opinion but the nerf is coming). They basically took thieves ability to fight 1vX. Can they still do it? Yes, but it will be 10x harder with the upcoming changes.

Since Ele is the only other class that can reliably 1vX, thief player will probably flock to the D/D Ele and we will see a surge of them in WvW. QQs will continue on the forum and the Ele will get nerf. The FOTM was thief, now it will be D/D ele, then so on. The problem is that after the FOTM is over, the class is left underpowered.

What’s your prediction after the March 26 patch?

How do you know Thief will be nerfed? Are you just guessing or is there detailed info on the patch somewhere?

They will lose their ability to chain stealth thus making it harder to fight multiple targets. It will be in the March 26 patch.

Dagger/Pistol.

Ele could reliably 1vX? This is incorrect statement. Ele could reliably run away from multiple ppl, but definitely not 1vX, which means taking on multiple foes and winning

sil.4160:

Ele could reliably 1vX? This is incorrect statement. Ele could reliably run away from multiple ppl, but definitely not 1vX, which means taking on multiple foes and winning

I’ll be happy to show you any number of videos where an 80 Elementalist in full Exotic gear 1vXs successfully against another level 80 and a bunch of up leveled scrubs in greens. [/sarcasm]

1vX ? That is mesmer.
1vX killing and stomping 1 (+) and running away… that is thief.
1vX running away… that is Ele DD.

Perceiving is different than being.

Imho mesmer or GS warrior would make more sense. Not even sure you could call it an influx. How many 80s do most of have now lol.

I can’t wait to see how much easier P/D thieves will be after patch.
And I’ll welcome all the new D/D eles, they are more interesting to fight and it’ll be fun to farm them till they L2P the class

Timelord.8190:

Wranglerist.5489:

Warrior same mobility or more than ele? LOL TROLL

Nuff saaid kthxbai.

Yes, they actually have better mobility.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGcHHFnDxwY
And this is before the rtl CD nerf.

How is this video showing what you said?

If anything it shows that a warrior with high mobility (GS + sword/wh) can still be caught up with and killed by the D/D ele filming the video

Did you not realise that when you watched this, that if anything it shows that the ele still has higher mobility?

I’m leveling a d/d ele as a side project. If my thief is worthless after patch I will play ele.

xiv.7136:

Timelord.8190:

Wranglerist.5489:

Warrior same mobility or more than ele? LOL TROLL

Nuff saaid kthxbai.

Yes, they actually have better mobility.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGcHHFnDxwY
And this is before the rtl CD nerf.

How is this video showing what you said?

If anything it shows that a warrior with high mobility (GS + sword/wh) can still be caught up with and killed by the D/D ele filming the video

Did you not realise that when you watched this, that if anything it shows that the ele still has higher mobility?

If he didn’t get downed by my fire condition damage at that point i wouldn’t be able to catch him.

Have to agree with Timelord. Add in bulls charge (he havent used it in this vid) and he would have been gone. That would have been another 900 range.

Savage Leap + Bulls Charge + WW + Rush = 3150 range bye bye

teg.1340:

Have to agree with Timelord. Add in bulls charge (he havent used it in this vid) and he would have been gone. That would have been another 900 range.

Savage Leap + Bulls Charge + WW + Rush = 3150 range bye bye

Cripple (i don’t even talk about chill) while condition remove on cd = bye bye mobility.

Rednik.3809:

Savage Leap + Bulls Charge + WW + Rush = 3150 range bye bye

Cripple (i don’t even talk about chill) while condition remove on cd = bye bye mobility.

The same is true for Ele and Immobilize.

And DD ele got no range cripple/chill. You have to be on top of a warrior to snare him.

I’ve played warrior for month in wvw. With Charge on a 16s cd + Mending a warrior is pretty good in getting rid of snares + immun to immobilize due to Mobile Strikes.

teg.1340:

Rednik.3809:

Savage Leap + Bulls Charge + WW + Rush = 3150 range bye bye

Cripple (i don’t even talk about chill) while condition remove on cd = bye bye mobility.

The same is true for Ele and Immobilize.

And DD ele got no range cripple/chill. You have to be on top of a warrior to snare him.

I’ve played warrior for month in wvw. With Charge on a 16s cd + Mending a warrior is pretty good in getting rid of snares + immun to immobilize due to Mobile Strikes.

I will trade charge+mobile strikes for RTL at any moment. Chill and cripple much more annoying and much more frequent, especially in WvW.

The grass is always greener on the other side.

I’ve played both warrior and ele for a couple of month in WvW. I can say that both mechanics have pros and cons. Sure, cripple/chill is extremely annoying for a warrior. But you dont really know how annoying immobilize is, because of mobile strikes.

As a warrior if you use a gap closer while crippled/chilled, you move forward for 1/2 the normal range. As an ele if you use RTL while immobilized, you dont move forward at all while RTL goes on cd. It can be extremely hard for an ele to free yourself from immobilize when it has been cloaked with 1-2 additional conditions.

Dont forget Anet has already mentioned they want to give warriors more access to condition removers, so in the future it will be easier for them to get rid of cripples and chills.