Guild Wars 2

Here is my take on this to some degree… some are saying " well it works just fine just learn to CC and stuff" and i’ll agree that its easy enough to toss a few snares, or blinds out MY issue is that…

ANY OTHER CLASS!

can do what we do easier, faster, more effienctly and with less effort. As someone that played a warlock in pre-BC in WoW i quite understand the idea that we are functional, and strong in hands of someone skilled. The issue is that the other classes preform just as well if not better by using less skills, hitting less attacks, and in less time.

Some call it skill i call it class issues its one thing to have a class requires more talent to bring out full potential its another to have other classes are doing all same things in less time, and more efficiently.

Lvl 26 elementalist here set up for close range and loving it (dagger/dagger). I enjoyed spending an entire group fight right in the face (shin bone) of a champion giant who was ravaging a town. The giant has three or for attacks only one which you have to watch for to dodge. So once you get that its not too hard to melee him.

I do wish that ele could switch between weapons in combat if for no other reason than “it would be fun!”. But mainly because I find myself wishing I could switch to d/d from staff when being swarmed. On my thief I just pop those pistols or bow away and whip out the daggers. If that fails I just pop on some stealth…. Actually bow on thief is not too bad up close I just shoot over and over again at my own feet if being swarmed works not too bad imo.

Most satisfying ele skill used so far is Tornado. That thing feels like it actually does something.

oh ya my comments refer to pve only

As I pondered the classes I would like to play before getting the game I had the choices narrowed down to Elementalist, Necromancer, or Warrior. After a very long internal struggle, I chose Elementalist, seeing as I wanted to get back to an arcane class and blast stuff to smithereens.

I hear that we’re weak, and that we’re unwanted, and though sometimes I do become overwhelmed by some of the things I fight, I can usually bring down 3-5 mobs my level if I’m paying attention. I’ve unlocked all the skills for each weapon, and I’m enjoying the scepter dagger combo. It’s got a nice combination of range and damage output. I like tinkering with double daggers, it’s very very nice in terms of damage. I only really use the staff when I’m with a group in an instance, to support them.

This is the very first class I’ve played, and so far it’s the only class I’ve played, and I have to say… in spite of a lot of what’s said, while I can’t compare it to other classes, the Elementalist isn’t too had to learn if you’re mildly decent at gaming and have common sense. Yes, we can get overwhelmed easily, but it’s a very fun class to play with enough damage output that you can get what you want done.

I certainly wouldn’t complain about having more damage output, but as it is.. we’re not insanely underpowered from what I can tell, at least not from the PvE side of things.

elchulo.3148:

All of you “L2P” kids need to look at more than just PVE. You think that because you can AOE 5 mobs at once then elementalists are fine? That doesn’t take any skill. PVE mobs are a joke that run straight at you and act predictably. What does that have to do with SPVP/TPVP? Elementalists are seriously underpowered in SPVP/TPVP. They were nerfed down to the ground. We’re just asking for some damage boosts since afterall we are supposed to be glass cannons. Anet forgot to add the cannon part. I can do more damage in 3 seconds with my thief than I can do in 10 seconds with my elementalist. Is that fair? I know the class inside and out better than most of you “L2P” kids. They are broken. Try any other class in PVP and you will see.

I watch a lot of video’s like kryos’ trying to get in my head that the class isn’t weak, but even brainwashing myself isn’t working. Seriously, I do not feel that weak, yes we can kill things DECENTLY. The problem I have is how easy other people do it. I watch my wife play her ranger and I worry about what this character will be like at 80 if I’m having to use a ton of buttons now.

Fight a ranged creature in an open area and yourkittennear SOL. (Even though i remedied that a bit with a focus)

Eles are best in combo with another player coz we are a bit squishy but with the correct weapon set and build we are rly deadly.. i love my ele and won’t change it
somehow i dont like the other classes enough

if u’r bad it doesnt rly matter what class u’r going to play so pls

Seems like some people are misunderstanding here (or they’re just too pro and obviously everyone else sucks).
The issue is not regarding whether the elementalist is a viable class or not, or whether stuff can be done with it or not.
It’s about how after the second beta weekend event, this class got nerfed so badly that it simply can’t compare anymore to any other class under equal conditions.

The point of this thread, as I understood it, was that new players shouldn’t play the class because it’s difficult to learn and doesn’t offer great results. While the results aren’t the best the class isn’t as hard to learn as some people make it out to be.

I used to think elementalists were fine, too. Now that I’m in my mid 70s there are such glaring problems with the class that it gets frustrating.

Number one on that list is the downed state (especially PvP). I can’t kill anyone in a 1vs1 so I have to stand on a wall or something and be sneaky. When I finally do get in an advantageous situation and am able to down someone, half the time I wonder if I should let someone else deal with it. Thieves and mesmers are still threats while downed. Meanwhile, when I go down I am DEAD. I have a 0% chance to recover as I will get stomped by anyone who doesn’t flat out suck.

Number two is dungeons. As an elementalist the only way to be useful is to do the support thing – which is incredibly boring to me. I was glad they took the monk out. I didn’t pick the elementalist to support others. I want to destroy and be an offensive powerhouse. Nope. You’ll get insta-gibbed in a dungeon if you have a build that does any meaningful damage (which other classes can do in nice, balanced builds that don’t die instantly).

It’s a bad class right now. I don’t want to be harder to kill. I want my defense to be my offensive arsenal which, as of right now, is not possible in this game.

This is sounding like Eles are GW2’s enhancement shamans.

Go figure, as I played the weakest PvP class in WoW, so too do I in GW2! I must be cursed.

If you can’t kill anything 1v1 stop using a staff, if you aren’t using a staff its because you aren’t good. PRACTICE

Bunzy.8674:

If you can’t kill anything 1v1 stop using a staff, if you aren’t using a staff its because you aren’t good. PRACTICE

“If you rolled a mage, stop playing mage and play cookie cutter lol melee range squishie”.

Vaerah.4907:

Bunzy.8674:

If you can’t kill anything 1v1 stop using a staff, if you aren’t using a staff its because you aren’t good. PRACTICE

“If you rolled a mage, stop playing mage and play cookie cutter lol melee range squishie”.

an elementalist is not a mage… o.O

Bunzy.8674:

Vaerah.4907:

Bunzy.8674:

If you can’t kill anything 1v1 stop using a staff, if you aren’t using a staff its because you aren’t good. PRACTICE

“If you rolled a mage, stop playing mage and play cookie cutter lol melee range squishie”.

an elementalist is not a mage… o.O

Yeah it’s a pink bunny.

My limited view on the elementalist problem.
It seems that elementalist is lacking in many aspects making the class limited to few roles AND builds that is exactly what Anet didn t want with GW2.

On the other side they did say they are working on balance and they didn t say anywhere ele is good as it is.

There are just few players that says l2p and that is frustrating….and surely would be cool if someone at Anet staff rather than a rush random buff would say if they agree there are some balancing issues with the class or not so they can take their time while reassuring players.

After all its best to use the class you like because OP classes are at risk of nerfing as well…

In the mean time i could just say that in PvE (maybe not at 80 but for sure at 60) your earth elemental can serve as a tank if you get surprised by too many enemies.

And then you can decide to flee safely or AoE yur opponent.

Op is right. I have been playing an eles since day 1 and I have to say that the learning curve is really high and the effort the you put into it just to do “ok” in spvp is quite challenging. Sometimes you just want to pull your hair out. I have had moments like “really? after all the effort almost killing the thief 1v1, he stealthed and came back almost full life, press one I win button and kill me in 3 secs” or “really? this mesmer can just pop illusion and hit me for 7k nonstop while he mindlessly running around doing little to nothing while I am having to fight for my life and trying to kill him at the same time” if you played an eles, you know what i am talking about.

To a few of you who came to this thread and say “learn to play”, come on who are you kidding? You people are obviously came here to troll and trying to fake it like you did play an eles but the fact is that you’re playing an op class like mesmer. I don’t think Arenanet is dumb enough to fall for that.

So my advice is the same as the op, new players should stay away from this class until they fix it. The amount of frustration you are about to endure is not worth your time unless you really want a challenge. And that was the reason why I am still playing an eles. If I can somehow master an underpowered class, when they fix it, i’d be amazing

Having played an Ele up to 80 and in all forms of the game, I really enjoy the class and its attunement swap mechanic, but the balance between DPS and survivability is terrible.

I’ve now got a warrior to lvl55, and it is already hitting considerably harder than my Ele does, which is pretty depressing. The only time I feel really useful is when using a staff in dungeons for the large area heals and earth elemental tank.

I’m not overly concerned yet since I never expected the game to be balanced on release, however its pretty clear that Ele needs a fairly large buff and thief/mesmer/warrior need a fairly large nerf.

flyaway.9257:

my lvl 22 warrior does twice single target damage i can do on my lvl 80 full rare gear elle

Does it do twice AoE damage as well or are you only comparing 1/10th of one class to 1/10th of another?

Without anyone illustrating why a class is unbalanced, I can only surmise that the player hasn’t figured out how to play said class.

In the case of eles, I wonder if it the same eles in GW who start the fight with their biggest nuke and then complain when they get immediately, appropriately squished. (I played ele and I played warr in GW and was the silly ele and was the annoyed “tank”)

I don’t want bursty damage; I want to deal appropriate damage without drawing attention to myself, denying hostiles the ability to deal damage, and to enable nearby allies to do the same (allies help that whole not-getting-attention-from-foes thing).

I am far from mastering the class and I had the same knee-jerk perceptions but I’m going to “L2P” before I have the hubris to tell Anet that they don’t know what they’re doing and “demanding” they turn my ele into a thief (who, in my last dungeon was getting squished the entire time—CM story, mind you!—and the two eles weren’t—I and the ranger almost got monthly survivor but there just wasn’t enough XP in the dungeon—and none of us were in CM before except the guardian who disconnected from ISP issues right after we entered and never returned).

Right now I’m playing 30 water w/staff and sceptre/focus and like it. I don’t kill things quickly solo but champion plus two veterans plus respawning trash doesn’t make me fret either (man that was a fun fight…long fight but fun fight and I learned to dodge-roll better and I felt nigh invincible rather than squishy, so there’s a continuum here).

I intend to revisit D/D after I hit a certain level of competence with S/F. A fire-centric build doesn’t appeal to me but I will eventually try it (I like trying different things to find what clicks for me and to see what fits best in different contexts—I just wish we could change traits more easily), which is all part of mastering a class anyway.

My advice to a new player would be if you want something more straightforward, then avoid Elementalist and Engineer and maybe Necromancer. If said new player is bent on only dealing damage and without doing anything else,—errrrrmmmm….GW2 might not be for you; go in with a group with specific builds perhaps or just get with the program.

Note that I am not saying eles are “just fine”—I don’t know enough to say either way—but I am asserting that neither does most anyone else, who’s posts reflect such.

With everyone complaining so much if anet makes a mistake of over buffing ele to appease the complaints I will literally be a god.

Rolo.9248:

flyaway.9257:

my lvl 22 warrior does twice single target damage i can do on my lvl 80 full rare gear elle

Does it do twice AoE damage as well or are you only comparing 1/10th of one class to 1/10th of another?

Without anyone illustrating why a class is unbalanced, I can only surmise that the player hasn’t figured out how to play said class.

In the case of eles, I wonder if it the same eles in GW who start the fight with their biggest nuke and then complain when they get immediately, appropriately squished. (I played ele and I played warr in GW and was the silly ele and was the annoyed “tank”)

I don’t want bursty damage; I want to deal appropriate damage without drawing attention to myself, denying hostiles the ability to deal damage, and to enable nearby allies to do the same (allies help that whole not-getting-attention-from-foes thing).

I am far from mastering the class and I had the same knee-jerk perceptions but I’m going to “L2P” before I have the hubris to tell Anet that they don’t know what they’re doing and “demanding” they turn my ele into a thief (who, in my last dungeon was getting squished the entire time—CM story, mind you!—and the two eles weren’t—I and the ranger almost got monthly survivor but there just wasn’t enough XP in the dungeon—and none of us were in CM before except the guardian who disconnected from ISP issues right after we entered and never returned).

Right now I’m playing 30 water w/staff and sceptre/focus and like it. I don’t kill things quickly solo but champion plus two veterans plus respawning trash doesn’t make me fret either (man that was a fun fight…long fight but fun fight and I learned to dodge-roll better and I felt nigh invincible rather than squishy, so there’s a continuum here).

I intend to revisit D/D after I hit a certain level of competence with S/F. A fire-centric build doesn’t appeal to me but I will eventually try it (I like trying different things to find what clicks for me and to see what fits best in different contexts—I just wish we could change traits more easily), which is all part of mastering a class anyway.

My advice to a new player would be if you want something more straightforward, then avoid Elementalist and Engineer and maybe Necromancer. If said new player is bent on only dealing damage and without doing anything else,—errrrrmmmm….GW2 might not be for you; go in with a group with specific builds perhaps or just get with the program.

Note that I am not saying eles are “just fine”—I don’t know enough to say either way—but I am asserting that neither does most anyone else, who’s posts reflect such.

Sounds like you’re talking about pve. No one really care about pve. If you can’t handle pve and complain about it, you’re just plain bad. But the problem most people are having is how underpowered eles is in pvp especially in spvp. Let’s be clear on that.

Guys your just doing it wrong I am a pro at this and I study all the pro vods. I make my own min/max builds speccing earth and I tell you elementalist is strongest class in the game bar none. I am snapping necks and cashing checks not sure what you guys are doing. My DPS is probably more then all the other classes combined in pvp and wvw so I think your all just bad players so l2p.

I am snapping necks and cashing checks .

lost it right about there :P

I’m split between the “the class is good, the class is bad” part. Sometimes I struggle a lot more than should be needed to, other times I feel like I’m wiping everything out with little effort. Depends a lot on the mob type and how tired I am, I guess.. and the players I meet in sPvP.
I do agree with OP that new players to the MMO genre might have more trouble with elementalists than with other classes. But mostly because of the quick element swapping that is required. Without my multi button mouse, I would never have even considered this class.

Just increase the Elem’s damage a bit. I don’t understand how a warrior’s normal attack deals the same or might be more damage than the Ele’s flame burst. Even if you sum up all the damages dealt by your fire spells, you cant compare with the warrior’s 100 blades’ damage. Every patch, the warrior class gets buffed! Is there a favoritism here?

Rolo.9248:

I am far from mastering the class and I had the same knee-jerk perceptions but I’m going to “L2P” before I have the hubris to tell Anet that they don’t know what they’re doing and “demanding” they turn my ele into a thief (who, in my last dungeon was getting squished the entire time—CM story, mind you!—and the two eles weren’t—I and the ranger almost got monthly survivor but there just wasn’t enough XP in the dungeon—and none of us were in CM before except the guardian who disconnected from ISP issues right after we entered and never returned).

The Thief is easily the squishiest class. I would expect Elementalist to do better in PvE.

The Elementalist has an awful lot of defensive, healing and control spells. Surely, the class runs more of those spells at once than any other class in the game. Look at the focus: complete projectile denial? Oh, and Invulnerability! Insane! No question, a skilled Elementalist can Blind, Knockdown, Vulnerable, Cripple and Chill everything they look at, all at once. Trouble is, they do not have a lot of options for damage on a sceptre, staff or focus (dagger seems to have all our offensive spells). This results in either a close-range glass-canon, or a mid- or long-range control-heavy character who has less offensive options than other classes. More of those options are AoE than other classes, but they have less.

I have a Ranger, an Elementalist, a Thief, a Warrior and a Mesmer. The Elementalist, in my opinion, does not have the highest learning curve. I honestly think many players puff it up more than it is. Our attunements are more obvious than weapon swapping for other classes, because they have clear, defined roles and are already determined for us. The Elementalist is not the squishiest, the Thief is. The Elementalist does, however, take the most effort to play. I feel mentally exhausted playing the Elementalist, whereas the other four I can faceroll PvE. It also takes me more hours to attain the same progress compared to the other classes. Elementalists are perfectly viable, but, as many others have said before me, they take more time and effort to attain the same result at the other classes.

Elric of Grans.7684:

The Thief is easily the squishiest class. I would expect Elementalist to do better in PvE.

The Elementalist has an awful lot of defensive, healing and control spells. Surely, the class runs more of those spells at once than any other class in the game. Look at the focus: complete projectile denial? Oh, and Invulnerability! Insane! No question, a skilled Elementalist can Blind, Knockdown, Vulnerable, Cripple and Chill everything they look at, all at once. Trouble is, they do not have a lot of options for damage on a sceptre, staff or focus (dagger seems to have all our offensive spells). This results in either a close-range glass-canon, or a mid- or long-range control-heavy character who has less offensive options than other classes. More of those options are AoE than other classes, but they have less.

I have a Ranger, an Elementalist, a Thief, a Warrior and a Mesmer. The Elementalist, in my opinion, does not have the highest learning curve. I honestly think many players puff it up more than it is. Our attunements are more obvious than weapon swapping for other classes, because they have clear, defined roles and are already determined for us. The Elementalist is not the squishiest, the Thief is. The Elementalist does, however, take the most effort to play. I feel mentally exhausted playing the Elementalist, whereas the other four I can faceroll PvE. It also takes me more hours to attain the same progress compared to the other classes. Elementalists are perfectly viable, but, as many others have said before me, they take more time and effort to attain the same result at the other classes.

From what I’ve read I understand that Thief is your main? Back on topic: I don’t think you understand the elementalist very well. The only way you’re gonna get acces to Invulnerability is if they give up on alot of great AoE abilities. In you’re post you give the impression that we have acces to all these abilities the entire time. I disagree with the statement that Elementalist don’t have the toughest learning curve in GW 2. If you disagree with me, I would like you to specify what class would be harder to learn and why. I’m not a single minded person, so please do share your opinion. There is also a something you forgot to adress in while you were claiming that Thief was the squishiest class right know. I do agree that thieves hardly have any good damage migation abilities. I do however not agree that this makes them easier to kill. Stealth being the obvious reason, but if you disagree on this point please do share your opinion on it. Last point I wanted to adress was that you claimed that Elementalists are viable. I strongly agree with you on this point. Elementalists do require more work to achieve the same things other classes do with little effort, I however think this is also the part of the charm. It makes bosses that warriors just slash away at far more rewarding to kill as a elementalist.
This is my opinion and therefore it will most likely differ from alot of people.
However, if good arguments are made opinions can change, so please try to keep discussions civilised.

Elric of Grans.7684:

Rolo.9248:

I am far from mastering the class and I had the same knee-jerk perceptions but I’m going to “L2P” before I have the hubris to tell Anet that they don’t know what they’re doing and “demanding” they turn my ele into a thief (who, in my last dungeon was getting squished the entire time—CM story, mind you!—and the two eles weren’t—I and the ranger almost got monthly survivor but there just wasn’t enough XP in the dungeon—and none of us were in CM before except the guardian who disconnected from ISP issues right after we entered and never returned).

The Thief is easily the squishiest class. I would expect Elementalist to do better in PvE.

The Elementalist has an awful lot of defensive, healing and control spells. Surely, the class runs more of those spells at once than any other class in the game. Look at the focus: complete projectile denial? Oh, and Invulnerability! Insane! No question, a skilled Elementalist can Blind, Knockdown, Vulnerable, Cripple and Chill everything they look at, all at once. Trouble is, they do not have a lot of options for damage on a sceptre, staff or focus (dagger seems to have all our offensive spells). This results in either a close-range glass-canon, or a mid- or long-range control-heavy character who has less offensive options than other classes. More of those options are AoE than other classes, but they have less.

I have a Ranger, an Elementalist, a Thief, a Warrior and a Mesmer. The Elementalist, in my opinion, does not have the highest learning curve. I honestly think many players puff it up more than it is. Our attunements are more obvious than weapon swapping for other classes, because they have clear, defined roles and are already determined for us. The Elementalist is not the squishiest, the Thief is. The Elementalist does, however, take the most effort to play. I feel mentally exhausted playing the Elementalist, whereas the other four I can faceroll PvE. It also takes me more hours to attain the same progress compared to the other classes. Elementalists are perfectly viable, but, as many others have said before me, they take more time and effort to attain the same result at the other classes.

I would have to disagree with you based on numbers. -posted a while back but here it is again:

………………..Necro.  Elem.    Thief
Power              1729     1216     2054
Precision          916       1016     1166
Toughness      1571     1016     1771
Vitality             1571     1016     1571
Attack             1729     1216     2054
C. Chance        4          9          14
Armor               1571     1091     1771
Health               24922   11805   17355

That’s 80 no gear, weapon, etc..naked. Thieves can spec into toughness/vitality too. Of course we can pop on the focus to play defensive but then our dps becomes even more subpar where as a thief has 6k+ hits then can easily go back into stealth. Personally I try to avoid focus as I don’t get enjoyment out of going invulnerable for a few seconds while doing very low damage. Btw I am not an expert on thieves – no opinion on that profession in terms of balancing. Just wanted to provide the actual numbers.
 

I see some numbers in the thread, but its more about skills (gaming tools)
light armor – so you need a tool to survive

thief – have a combo, that he can use “hide” nearly after every even attack
mesmer – makes a bunch of clones, till he goes invis.
ele -

Anet, Anet… after a bunch of beta testing, how the hell you didn’t recognized it?

mcavellero.8153:

………………..Necro.  Elem.    Thief
Power              1729     1216     2054
Precision          916       1016     1166
Toughness      1571     1016     1771
Vitality             1571     1016     1571
Attack             1729     1216     2054
C. Chance        4          9          14
Armor               1571     1091     1771
Health               24922   11805   17355

That’s 80 no gear, weapon, etc..naked.

Please re-check those numbers. I just went to the Mists with my Ele completely naked and all base attributes (power, precision, toughness, vitality) show as 916.
Attack and armor are 916 too, crit. chance 4% and health 10805.

EDIT, Naked Necro: 997, 916, 1216, 1016, 997, 4%, 1216, 19372
EDIT2, Naked Thief: 1216, 1116, 1116, 972, 1216, 14%, 1116, 11365

EDIT3: Weird to see so much difference in base stats between the professions. Even when the difference is smaller with my numbers. Did you have boons or forgot to take off a weapon or amulet, or why do they seem so off?

EDIT4:

Doh! I still had traits points allocated on the Thief and Necro. Without, all 3 have equal base attributes, only health is different: Necro = 18372, Thief/Ele= 10805. Makes much more sense now.

@mcavellero.8153: I still can’t make sense of your numbers though. As any naked profession can only add a maximum of 300 to any base attribute by spending 30 points in a trait line.

I wish i knew before this was sutch a terrible class. I get almost 2 hitted anywhere pve/pvp and I invested 250+ hours in my Ele.