Guild Wars 2

I’ve been away for quite some time, and only just hopped back after seeing some of the video footage.

Well, the base attunement cd is dropping as well so arcana won’t be as necessary just to make our mechanic function properly. I’m thinking that Elemental Attunement will be the more popular choice personally as it synergizes with water better than evasive, but who knows?

We may be dropping Arcana entirely if tempest or even the updated Geomancers Defense give us enough survivability outside of the Arcana line :/

Aerathnor.8305:

Well, the base attunement cd is dropping as well so arcana won’t be as necessary just to make our mechanic function properly. I’m thinking that Elemental Attunement will be the more popular choice personally as it synergizes with water better than evasive, but who knows?

We may be dropping Arcana entirely if tempest or even the updated Geomancers Defense give us enough survivability outside of the Arcana line :/

In all honesty, dd ele will just go earth, water and arcana. I don’t think anything will change there. I assume the elite spec will be dps oriented so nothing dd ele would take to be able to face the buffs mesmers and thieves recieved. Then again, dd ele will be shifting from a support sustained build to just a bunker build and that might push it out of meta.

Fresh air might not be viable at all because of the nerfs, who knows. The important part there is to know what will be the new specialization.

They said they might change lots of things still and that they’re thinking about some of the changesb if they’re good or not. Let’s hope they will figure out what they want to do is not really good for the game.

Laraley.7695:

Aerathnor.8305:

Well, the base attunement cd is dropping as well so arcana won’t be as necessary just to make our mechanic function properly. I’m thinking that Elemental Attunement will be the more popular choice personally as it synergizes with water better than evasive, but who knows?

We may be dropping Arcana entirely if tempest or even the updated Geomancers Defense give us enough survivability outside of the Arcana line :/

In all honesty, dd ele will just go earth, water and arcana. I don’t think anything will change there. I assume the elite spec will be dps oriented so nothing dd ele would take to be able to face the buffs mesmers and thieves recieved. Then again, dd ele will be shifting from a support sustained build to just a bunker build and that might push it out of meta.

Fresh air might not be viable at all because of the nerfs, who knows. The important part there is to know what will be the new specialization.

They said they might change lots of things still and that they’re thinking about some of the changesb if they’re good or not. Let’s hope they will figure out what they want to do is not really good for the game.

I’m not defending the decision at all, I think it’s stupid compared to the GM’s that are getting baked into mesmer especially. I don’t think D/D is an over performing build particularly and I’m confused about the motivation behind this change (other than to make arcana seem less “necessary”).

Just trying to throw out some hope that we’re getting something to compensate for losing one of our core traits.

Aerathnor.8305:

Laraley.7695:

Aerathnor.8305:

Well, the base attunement cd is dropping as well so arcana won’t be as necessary just to make our mechanic function properly. I’m thinking that Elemental Attunement will be the more popular choice personally as it synergizes with water better than evasive, but who knows?

We may be dropping Arcana entirely if tempest or even the updated Geomancers Defense give us enough survivability outside of the Arcana line :/

In all honesty, dd ele will just go earth, water and arcana. I don’t think anything will change there. I assume the elite spec will be dps oriented so nothing dd ele would take to be able to face the buffs mesmers and thieves recieved. Then again, dd ele will be shifting from a support sustained build to just a bunker build and that might push it out of meta.

Fresh air might not be viable at all because of the nerfs, who knows. The important part there is to know what will be the new specialization.

They said they might change lots of things still and that they’re thinking about some of the changesb if they’re good or not. Let’s hope they will figure out what they want to do is not really good for the game.

I’m not defending the decision at all, I think it’s stupid compared to the GM’s that are getting baked into mesmer especially. I don’t think D/D is an over performing build particularly and I’m confused about the motivation behind this change (other than to make arcana seem less “necessary”).

Just trying to throw out some hope that we’re getting something to compensate for losing one of our core traits.

At the moment it doesn’t seem like it. Geomancer’s defense could be good, but the problem is that it is indeed situational. Staff eles will get nothing to compensate. It’s also changing the way ele was played till now. DD is great at supporting allies and that’s why it’s a good pick for teams, the problem that they’re taking away that support. I don’t believe ele deserves such a nerf, especially when you look at the changes to other classes.

If their intention was indeed to nerf dd ele, they failed miserably by touching all other specs that are at least a bit viable in pvp. If their intention was to create a wider build diversity, they failed miserably again. Since eles have the lower base hp pool and armour, they will be forced to pick up the traits that will buff survability. That is accelerated by the fact eles will lose 220 vitality, which is a huge deal for a class that has a 10800 base hp. The protection and regeneration is indeed crucial for the class. So far we don’t know if there will be any compensation for the loss of boon duration, which could mean more problems for the supporter role dd ele tries to fulfull.

Seeing as they got rid of damage mutlipliers from air, fresh air won’t have a great time either. Without elemental attunement fresh air will have to spec more into survability because of other classes recieving huge buffs and losing these modifiers will mean the sustained dps will get hurt quite a lot. I’m not sure if fresh air will be able to compete with mesmers and thieves after the patch.

So far it seems they just made certain traits and tratlines completely unvaible and will be left unsued. I don’t like the direction ele is heading either. I’m not a fan of passive procs and the aura buffs seem really silly. If anything, I’m sure I won’t have fun playing that. Not even mentioning that you have to get hit to make a use of those auras and ele will again have to invest a lot in survability.

So, it rather seems like they either have this idea what ele should be, which is completely wrong and players themselves do not like the direction their class is heading or they indeed thought it’s time ele should be pushed out of meta in all aspects of the game.

Well thinking it though i think they should just remove Evasive Arcana from the game and split up its effect in the 4 atument trees. Maybe tie them into the 1 3 or 5 point effect. Then take the old places for EA and make it an aggressive version of Elemental Attunement. So swapping to water is an aoe chill fire is a burn air is weakness earth is blind. To me the arcana line should not be making ele more “thf” like such as making more of an evasion line it should make an ele more Ele like in that atuments do something when you swap to them not staying in an atument dose something for you. Staying in a atument to get an effect should be under the 4 atuments lines.

Added note i guess it would be ideal to put them on a lower cd a kind of reward for staying in that atument. I just think this point of new that you should have your effects in all atuments by just getting one line that realty dose not effect your ability to dodge roll seems odd. Yes there is vigor in that line but even that seems out of places now that the line is losing its boon duration.

So i am suggesting that you add dodge effect both on dodge and vigor effect to other lines and make the arcana line purly about atument swapping and arcana ability.

Silly mortals the double EA nerf is not to weaken ele’s against the ever growing condition META anet it will make your team die and then you look really bad and die. (Bad as my non English writing skills)

I currently can hold points 1v3 in Spvp mid and down but not flag 1 player. If I fight a dedicated premade team I can still hold against 3 non condition player but not more than 1 condition player and 2 non condition players. I lose to two dedicated condition players that are designed to focus spike ever class with over 6 conditions nonstop, but I can stall the fight to about a minute if forced not to flee.

When I remover one of the EA’s, I lose super fast. I can only beat 1 condition player. I can survive and hold 1 vs 3 non condition players, but they take way less damage from lack of might stacking and rotation roll damage from Evasive Aracana.

But preventing double EA you greatly reduce elementalist’s survivability vs condition classes let alone fighting of and protecting a team or taking on dual condition classes you’d most likely insta death. The only new benefit to trait is s the new stability to earth is now attainable which will great help with res or stomps.

So this is a 25% Physical resistance buff but a 50% condition resistance nerf . Since the last 4 weeks I pay around 4-5 hours or unrank spvp premade or not premade so yes. If we want to focus spvp this is a great NERF!!!!!!!!!! if its roaming spvp and you fighting 1v2or 1v3 or running from a 1v7 this is still a incredible nerf. Don’t even talk about pve since the mechanics is purely mathematics.

Look at that Mesmer power creepy you alone will have a hell fighting her let a lone defending your team that just got ripped apart by other new crazy metas.

Losing sustainability, team play, burst stacking and ele-sexy well as most of you say destroys are class definition. Unless they gave us wards back like in the first game. CRAZY OP wards or Tempest (Sounds incredible please don’t be like giving us a Porsche but having it equipped with a Honda Fit engine)

When the guy/team responsible for balancing professions says that CORE functionality of said profession needs to be a choice, then goes on to handout OP traits as baseline mechanics for nearly every other profession but yours, exactly what is the conclusion that can be drawn?

The Ele has only been competitive in the last year or so thanks to the Celestial amulet and Strength runes, not due to any whiz bang OPness of the profession itself.

My only conclusion is that the balance team hates Eles, and as long as people keep buying gems with credit cards, ANet corporate doesn’t give a skritt’s heiny about what the balance team does. From everything I’ve read and seen, they might as well just bar Eles from PvP entirely, and make our new HoT weapon an actual crutch that our character can limp around with.

Kaleban.9834:

When the guy/team responsible for balancing professions says that CORE functionality of said profession needs to be a choice, then goes on to handout OP traits as baseline mechanics for nearly every other profession but yours, exactly what is the conclusion that can be drawn?

The Ele has only been competitive in the last year or so thanks to the Celestial amulet and Strength runes, not due to any whiz bang OPness of the profession itself.

Here is the true problem: by giving eles the lowest health and armor, they have to give some very powerful active capabilities to deal with both power damage and conditions (as they are very susceptible to both). Whereas other professions can play around with minimal condi clear, like mesmer and engineer, or rely on in-built defense mechanics, like thief, guardian, or warrior, eles need to be given access to very powerful defenses on both fronts.

This creates 2 problems: 1. they die to stiff breeze without traiting heavily for defense, and 2. they become too strong when going full-tank. If they made some of that defensive capability baseline, they wouldn’t have to give such OP options that get out-of-hand when stacked together.

I like how people think they are reducing attunement swap time by a good amount, but in reality its reduced by like .3 seconds. They want it at 8.7 seconds and it says 9 on the attunement you just swapped from, so you think you are being kitten now, then you should be very upset to learn this. Dont change EA and EA from what it is now, or you will just make people very upset.

Kaleban.9834:

When the guy/team responsible for balancing professions says that CORE functionality of said profession needs to be a choice, then goes on to handout OP traits as baseline mechanics for nearly every other profession but yours, exactly what is the conclusion that can be drawn?

Unfortunately Elementalist appears to have the worst designer in charge of it in contrast to say Engineer and Mesmer the designers of which I’m far more impressed with.

BlackBeard.2873:

Here is the true problem: by giving eles the lowest health and armor, they have to give some very powerful active capabilities to deal with both power damage and conditions (as they are very susceptible to both).

It must be said though that with HOT from what I understand the base health of all classes will be standardised to the same value so Ele’s will get some value from that.

morrolan.9608:

It must be said though that with HOT from what I understand the base health of all classes will be standardised to the same value so Ele’s will get some value from that.

Where do you get that from?

How EAtt can be considered not baseline worthy while at the same time making the 2 strongest mesmer GM traits, IP and PU, baseline (plus 1 master and 3 adept traits as well)?

scerevisiae.1972:

How EAtt can be considered not baseline worthy while at the same time making the 2 strongest mesmer GM traits, IP and PU, baseline (plus 1 master and 3 adept traits as well)?

Because everyone QQ’s that eles are OP due to d/d ele being strong in the pvp meta (even though every other spec can’t compete), while mesmers QQ they are unviable b/c thieves hard-counter them (even though they can quickly get out of hand if thieves are keeping them in check).

Also, the people balancing eles think zephyr’s speed (+10% movespeed while attuned to air) is a good trait, while those balancing mesmers really thing critically about creative ways to create new options.

I can understand why IP was made baseline for mesmer, PU on the other hand…

EAtt is not borderline to Ele, is borderline to Eles that constant att swap (and therefore keep the buffs active). It should just be kept as a T2 trait and EA T3, while improving other trait lines to make them viable options to it (mostly air and fire).

The thing is, the constant att swap to get vigor, protection and regen (and soothing mist) is the only way, at the current state of the game, an Ele can keep itself alive in combat when being focused.
As pointed out, Eles don’t have any baseline defense, be it passive (high armor or hp) or active (stealth or clones). So if you want to be anything besides a backline caster you need arcana to get those buffs that will let you get in combat and able to sustain.

That is why D/D needs water, earth and arcana in PvP. Survive being focused or being in cleave/aoe range. And this option should be kept.

I don’t care if the new elite spec brings new options to do the same. Having a new way to do a role should not justify removing another.

What it should be done is a better look into the fire and air lines to improve their values and make them options (not better, just viable) for the water/earth/arcana.
And also improve the Lingering Elements trait to work with all attunement exclusive traits, opening up room for the ele to choose other things besides EAtt.

lLobo.7960:

EAtt is not borderline to Ele, is borderline to Eles that constant att swap (and therefore keep the buffs active).

The fact that staying in one attunement is a viable way to play the class makes me sad. Sitting in Fire and using 1/2/3 is just such a waste of other abilities especially since the entire class is balanced around having all these abilities. It’s why they all have such long cooldowns.

It should be baseline, comepletely. A solo version only as you should be rewarded for swapping attunements and using the class mechanic, not completely ignoring it.

Raif.9507:

The fact that staying in one attunement is a viable way to play the class makes me sad.

It is only viable in PvE. And only if your group is at least decently efficient. And only because PvE is designed with a philosophy that is completely different from the rest of the game: your opponents do not move dynamically. For this reason, absurdities like the power of staff fire camping can sadly exist.

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867:

Raif.9507:

The fact that staying in one attunement is a viable way to play the class makes me sad.

It is only viable in PvE. And only if your group is at least decently efficient. And only because PvE is designed with a philosophy that is completely different from the rest of the game: your opponents do not move dynamically. For this reason, absurdities like the power of staff fire camping can sadly exist.

I know, but it makes me so sad. The class isn’t difficult, it’s not the “piano blah blah blah” it’s simply keeping track of cooldowns. Even the fact that PvE is geared that way makes me sad. The whole fun of elementalist (in my eyes) is the comboing, the weaving of attunements.

I also do think that conjure builds are gimmicky in my eyes (powerful, but gimmicky), but that’s another topic.

Raif.9507:

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867:

Raif.9507:

The fact that staying in one attunement is a viable way to play the class makes me sad.

It is only viable in PvE. And only if your group is at least decently efficient. And only because PvE is designed with a philosophy that is completely different from the rest of the game: your opponents do not move dynamically. For this reason, absurdities like the power of staff fire camping can sadly exist.

I know, but it makes me so sad. The class isn’t difficult, it’s not the “piano blah blah blah” it’s simply keeping track of cooldowns. Even the fact that PvE is geared that way makes me sad. The whole fun of elementalist (in my eyes) is the comboing, the weaving of attunements.

I also do think that conjure builds are gimmicky in my eyes (powerful, but gimmicky), but that’s another topic.

So you are asking for DF
You are right my friend, this is the only build that is worthy of true elementalists. Unfortunately it has been nerfed and HoT may nerf it even more.
But I believe that aang DF can save the world.

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867:

Raif.9507:

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867:

Raif.9507:

The fact that staying in one attunement is a viable way to play the class makes me sad.

It is only viable in PvE. And only if your group is at least decently efficient. And only because PvE is designed with a philosophy that is completely different from the rest of the game: your opponents do not move dynamically. For this reason, absurdities like the power of staff fire camping can sadly exist.

I know, but it makes me so sad. The class isn’t difficult, it’s not the “piano blah blah blah” it’s simply keeping track of cooldowns. Even the fact that PvE is geared that way makes me sad. The whole fun of elementalist (in my eyes) is the comboing, the weaving of attunements.

I also do think that conjure builds are gimmicky in my eyes (powerful, but gimmicky), but that’s another topic.

So you are asking for DF
You are right my friend, this is the only build that is worthy of true elementalists. Unfortunately it has been nerfed and HoT may nerf it even more.
But I believe that aang DF can save the world.

I personally use D/D, but D/F is also fun. I hope you’re right. Or at least that Tempest can save us.

OT: EAttunement for all, just solo, shorter duration boons with GM making it AoE and more boons.

Removing the boons from the boon-dependent Ele…
Rather, make survival even more difficult to access (e.g. 06044 Fresh Air/60044 Arcane Staff has a significant increase in survival due to the 4 points in Elemental Attunement).
Sword better be as good as we envision it to be.

I just don’t get the logic.

It’s so core, everyone uses it → let’s remove!

Gaab.4257:

I just don’t get the logic.

It’s so core, everyone uses it -> let’s remove!

The problem with this mentality is not everyone does use it. I haven’t used Elemental Attunement in over a month. In fact I’d have zero points in Arcane if it wasn’t for Blasting Staff in most cases.

As for the Logic…he probably had someone somewhere tell him to nerf D/D Celestial Elementalists and this was the decision he came up with. Honestly when you think about it….kinda the logical move. If you were going to nerf Elemental Attunement and make a worse version of it, you pretty much have Elemental Contingency. Swap the two, call it a day, and move on to your next brilliant decision: Make the Guardian specialization a Ranger.

Kodiak.3281:

Gaab.4257:

I just don’t get the logic.

It’s so core, everyone uses it -> let’s remove!

The problem with this mentality is not everyone does use it. I haven’t used Elemental Attunement in over a month. In fact I’d have zero points in Arcane if it wasn’t for Blasting Staff in most cases.

Are we talking PvP?

Kodiak.3281:

The problem with this mentality is not everyone does use it. I haven’t used Elemental Attunement in over a month. In fact I’d have zero points in Arcane if it wasn’t for Blasting Staff in most cases.

As for the Logic…he probably had someone somewhere tell him to nerf D/D Celestial Elementalists and this was the decision he came up with. Honestly when you think about it….kinda the logical move. If you were going to nerf Elemental Attunement and make a worse version of it, you pretty much have Elemental Contingency. Swap the two, call it a day, and move on to your next brilliant decision: Make the Guardian specialization a Ranger.

Except… that requires getting hit… something no DPS elementalist wants. And to be perfectly honest, I can’t think of a single PvP build that doesn’t use it that’s worth anything.

The only thing making Celestial ele “OP” as the masses call it is Celestial. It wasn’t even in the meta till the amulet itself was buffed. This is overboard, just like RTL.

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867:

morrolan.9608:

It must be said though that with HOT from what I understand the base health of all classes will be standardised to the same value so Ele’s will get some value from that.

Where do you get that from?

The original livestream 2 weeks ago on the changes to existing traits. And I’ve had it confirmed by someone in the know. They stated that base stats will be standardised across all classes.

morrolan.9608:

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867:

morrolan.9608:

It must be said though that with HOT from what I understand the base health of all classes will be standardised to the same value so Ele’s will get some value from that.

Where do you get that from?

The original livestream 2 weeks ago on the changes to existing traits. And I’ve had it confirmed by someone in the know. They stated that base stats will be standardised across all classes.

You are mis-interpreting what was said. What they are doing is increasing all the base stats by a few points to partially counteract the loss of stats from traitlines. The rest of those stats are going on gear/amulets. They have never insinuated that all classes were going to be getting the same health pools.

Raif.9507:

lLobo.7960:

EAtt is not borderline to Ele, is borderline to Eles that constant att swap (and therefore keep the buffs active).

The fact that staying in one attunement is a viable way to play the class makes me sad. Sitting in Fire and using 1/2/3 is just such a waste of other abilities especially since the entire class is balanced around having all these abilities. It’s why they all have such long cooldowns.

It should be baseline, comepletely. A solo version only as you should be rewarded for swapping attunements and using the class mechanic, not completely ignoring it.

I agree that camping is not as much fun as att swaping, but I think it should be a valid option. You still have the other attunements, but when camping, you swap to them for the utility (CC, heal/cleanse, burst), and not as often as you do in the att dance playstyle.

I think Eatt is a great trait in the arcana line and it does provide great value to any ele that is going to change att constantly. But its not baseline to all eles.

I think that focusing on one att and using others as needed only is, and should still be a viable playstyle for the ele. And those that like it should not be seen as “not using the class potential” for playing it. Just as much as att dancing should not be seen as “not using your best dps”. Just different ways of doing things. This is the diversity Ele could have.

So you could go on staff and cap fire, only going to other attunements when their skills are needed.
You could go fresh air and by constant air and include more att dance while still mostly camping air for the dmg (plus using other attunements for blasts and utilities)
You could go conjure in water to get the most of piercing shards…

I think if Lingering Elements could work with other att traits it would be a great way to promote more att swap and even include att rotations in some camping builds.

I usually go D/F fresh air in dungeons, as I don’t find the fire camping fun.
And I’m glad no one tells me, even on the most elitist groups, to change that. I’m also glad that I can see a fire camping staff ele and not tell him he is doing a bad job by playing different (poor necros). I do run fire staff on overland pve “raids” and I’m happy to be able to change between the different styles.

I do hope a lot of the changes get reviewed so we can see more diversity both in dungeons, overland pve, wvw and pvp…

I want to see tanky earth eles being a option to keep CP on conquest.
I want to see conjure eles being an option in dungeons, along with d/f fresh air and fire staff…
I want to see water eles (with lower CD and greater healing) being viable in wvw just as much as other specs.

What Anet doesn’t understand, is that you shouldn’t put 2 traits that serve the same function in the same trait tier.

Evasive arcana: gives regen blinds, blast in earth, burns
Elemental Attunement: gives regen, swiftness, might and protection

Elemental Attunement is obviously better because of the protection, but they both serve the same defensive function and now you are forced to choose one or the other. Basically you might as well take Evasive Arcana out of the game completely… Great balancing there… not!

And same thing in air, do you want extra dps from Lightning rod, fresh air or Bolt to the heart… Well I don’t know, let me take out my calculator and see the numbers. At the end of the day you might as well discard Bolt to the heart.

Literally what is happening here is the destruction of build variety. Just like when they nerfed Mist-Form-healing/utilities/elite they removed a lot of cool combos that defined the way the elementalist used to work.

Overall I understand why they wish to redesign the classes, but it’s like Anet forgot the reason why these traits were not in the same tier in the first place. It’s like a new person doing the balancing has no clue what the first designer did.

Yes, I agree with you that the proposed changes don’t seem very well thought and even seems that they were not sure over some of them (what might be a good thing).

Thats why I think we need to propose better changes, but with a good idea of the different elementalist playstyles and game modes. Even if you don’t like a certain playstyle or game mode, there should be options there for everyone.

So no, I disagree that Eatt should be baseline, but Yes, it should not compete with EvArcana for GM slot. They both fit the active playstyle (use attunments in an active form to keep sustain – heal, might, blasts, mobility) and this active playstyle should not be removed or nerfed. Yet, it would be nice to open EAtt to be paired with ECont to provide a more boon centric elementalist, that gains boons actively and passively. But then ECont needs to change to provide different boons to have more synergy with EAtt and provide boons that are good enought to compete with EA for the GM slot. (See my suggestion on other topic)

Raif.9507:

Except… that requires getting hit… something no DPS elementalist wants. And to be perfectly honest, I can’t think of a single PvP build that doesn’t use it that’s worth anything.

The only thing making Celestial ele “OP” as the masses call it is Celestial. It wasn’t even in the meta till the amulet itself was buffed. This is overboard, just like RTL.

I never said it was a good solution, it was simply a logical one. In fact everyone’s arguments against Elemental Contingency (in short: it’s worse than Evasive Arcana) are all reasons why it should be in a lower tier than Elemental Attunement.

lLobo.7960:

I can understand why IP was made baseline for mesmer, PU on the other hand…

EAtt is not borderline to Ele, is borderline to Eles that constant att swap.

IP and PU were already seriously good traits and probably many mesmer specs had 1 or the other… all my mesmer specs sure did.

With eles however, virtually every non-PVE, non-pure zerker spec was based around 4+ water, 4+arcane. With the current changes, this will not change. The only difference will be that the new core spec will be earth/water/arcane.

Point being, making EAtt GM achieves nothing other than nerfing EA eles…. the main design goal – improving choice and diversity has not been achieved.

lLobo.7960:

Yes, I agree with you that the proposed changes don’t seem very well thought and even seems that they were not sure over some of them (what might be a good thing).

Thats why I think we need to propose better changes, but with a good idea of the different elementalist playstyles and game modes. Even if you don’t like a certain playstyle or game mode, there should be options there for everyone.

So no, I disagree that Eatt should be baseline, but Yes, it should not compete with EvArcana for GM slot. They both fit the active playstyle (use attunments in an active form to keep sustain – heal, might, blasts, mobility) and this active playstyle should not be removed or nerfed. Yet, it would be nice to open EAtt to be paired with ECont to provide a more boon centric elementalist, that gains boons actively and passively. But then ECont needs to change to provide different boons to have more synergy with EAtt and provide boons that are good enought to compete with EA for the GM slot. (See my suggestion on other topic)

I kinda disagree. For example, let’s look at the mesmer. Two heavily build defining traits that have nothing to do with each other, that are completly different in the way the build would be played, PU and IP, are both becoming baseline. Not only are these traits build defining but they are also currently GM traits.

Making EA baseline wouldn’t change anything for those that prefer staying in one attunement. While they may not get the consistent boons from swaping attunements actively, I’m pretty sure no ele would complain about occasionally getting certain boons when swaping attunements because of a certain skill that is currently needed.

I very much enjoy playing out all the boons on ele depending on the situation as by playing PvP and WvW you get to learn to use them to your advantage while other classes that don’t have such a wide access to different boons have blocks, stealth or similar mechanisms.

So yeah, I do agree with the suggestion that EA should be baseline with EvAr if really needed being in the GM tier. However, as many others have said before, the duration of the boons should be a little bit shorter and the boons should only be applied to you while a GM trait could make them apply to allies.

Why I played elementalist

• class mechanics/traits rewarding active gameplay with an appropriate bonus (i.e. defensive boons in earth and water, offensive boons in fire and air, fury on swap)
• Fun mechanics (effects on dodge roll, self-combos)

What looks like is happening

• potentially gaining passive traits and procs (20% damage reduction in a 600 radius?)
• potentially losing active gameplay (chosing between EAttunement and EArcana)
• Tunnel-vision nerf on D/D ele (RIP staff and scepter)

The changes in water and earth maybe enough to compensate for the potential loss of EAttunement, but losing active gameplay for passive traits in my opinion is a step backwards for elementalists.

What I propose is what many others have already suggested, make a solo version of EAttunement a baseline mechanic with a shorter boon duration and make the GM trait extend the boons to teammates with a longer duration. This way you are really making a decision between two supportive options, party-wide boons or AoE heals and blasts.

BlackBeard.2873:

morrolan.9608:

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867:

morrolan.9608:

It must be said though that with HOT from what I understand the base health of all classes will be standardised to the same value so Ele’s will get some value from that.

Where do you get that from?

The original livestream 2 weeks ago on the changes to existing traits. And I’ve had it confirmed by someone in the know. They stated that base stats will be standardised across all classes.

You are mis-interpreting what was said. What they are doing is increasing all the base stats by a few points to partially counteract the loss of stats from traitlines. The rest of those stats are going on gear/amulets. They have never insinuated that all classes were going to be getting the same health pools.

Nope no misinterpretation, they said all base stats were going to be standardised.

morrolan.9608:

BlackBeard.2873:

morrolan.9608:

Zelyhn Lekovitch.2867:

morrolan.9608:

It must be said though that with HOT from what I understand the base health of all classes will be standardised to the same value so Ele’s will get some value from that.

Where do you get that from?

The original livestream 2 weeks ago on the changes to existing traits. And I’ve had it confirmed by someone in the know. They stated that base stats will be standardised across all classes.

You are mis-interpreting what was said. What they are doing is increasing all the base stats by a few points to partially counteract the loss of stats from traitlines. The rest of those stats are going on gear/amulets. They have never insinuated that all classes were going to be getting the same health pools.

Nope no misinterpretation, they said all base stats were going to be standardised.

I cannot remember the exact quote but what they meant is that all attributes will be increased for all classes. All attributes are already standardised at 926 (used to be 916) and they will increase this to 1000. The base derived attributes for each profession – such as health and armour – will not change, as far as we know.

If everything else remains constant then technically it implies that the base profession attribute differences will be slightly less stringent.

Edit:
For example, at the moment the ele has 10,905 base health (926 vitality * 10 + 1,645 base profession health) and the warrior has 18,472 health (926 vitality * 10 + 9,212 base profession health) so the warrior has 69% more base health. With the announced changes the ele will have 11,645 base health and the warrior will have 19,212 which will decrease the base health difference to 65%. Therefore this is nothing tremendous and anyway we do not even know all the facts necessary to draw solid conclusions

scerevisiae.1972:

How EAtt can be considered not baseline worthy while at the same time making the 2 strongest mesmer GM traits, IP and PU, baseline (plus 1 master and 3 adept traits as well)?

Wait what? Please stop spreading misinformation. PU – Prismatic Understanding is not being made baseline for mesmer

http://dulfy.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/gw2-mesmer-chaos-specialization.jpg

Jedge.3619:

scerevisiae.1972:

How EAtt can be considered not baseline worthy while at the same time making the 2 strongest mesmer GM traits, IP and PU, baseline (plus 1 master and 3 adept traits as well)?

Wait what? Please stop spreading misinformation. PU – Prismatic Understanding is not being made baseline for mesmer

http://dulfy.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/gw2-mesmer-chaos-specialization.jpg

Part true – they made the extra second of stealth from PU baseline. The new PU doubled the amount of stealth. Going to be so OP.

Bottom line: mesmer is getting (effectively) 2x GM, 1x master and 3x adept traits all made baseline. It’s a huge power jump.

Meanwhile a core class trait, Elemental Attunement is being made GM after being adept for a year and a half and then master for a year.

scerevisiae.1972:

Jedge.3619:

scerevisiae.1972:

How EAtt can be considered not baseline worthy while at the same time making the 2 strongest mesmer GM traits, IP and PU, baseline (plus 1 master and 3 adept traits as well)?

Wait what? Please stop spreading misinformation. PU – Prismatic Understanding is not being made baseline for mesmer

http://dulfy.net/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/gw2-mesmer-chaos-specialization.jpg

Part true – they made the extra second of stealth from PU baseline. The new PU doubled the amount of stealth. Going to be so OP.

Bottom line: mesmer is getting (effectively) 2x GM, 1x master and 3x adept traits all made baseline. It’s a huge power jump.

Part true. Baseline means you don’t have to trait to get the effect such as IP. You have to trait PU if you want the extra stealth.

“Traits that are made baseline: Illusionary Persona, Illusionary Elasticity, Protective Mantras, Phantasmal damage boost traits,Manipulation range.” -Taken from Livesteam notes

Every stealth speel still got an extra stealth sec, if it snot a buff, then tell me what it is.
So yeah its not “base line” but its not far from it, and the trait himself receive a huge buff

Mesmer is getting a lot of buff for no kittening reason at all (and when you look at how much chronomancer enhance every current mesmer build … its almost disgusting (#chronoshatter))

Mattmatt.4962:

Every stealth speel still got an extra stealth sec, if it snot a buff, then tell me what it is.
So yeah its not “base line” but its not far from it, and the trait himself receive a huge buff

Mesmer is getting a lot of buff for no kittening reason at all (and when you look at how much chronomancer enhance every current mesmer build … its almost disgusting (#chronoshatter))

We don’t even know the traits for chronomancer, so how can you say it will enhance every current mesmer build? Just because you have a new specialization, doesn’t mean you have to go into that trait line.

Mesmer is getting a lot of buff for no reason? That’s jokes. I’m not even going to comment further on that because its obvious that you have no idea what you’re talking about.

Jedge.3619:

We don’t even know the traits for chronomancer, so how can you say it will enhance every current mesmer build? Just because you have a new specialization, doesn’t mean you have to go into that trait line.

While we didn’t get a chance to look at them they did mention a few things about the Chronomancer Traits, specifically that Phantasms can be exploded twice and that Shatters Generate Clones. They also said you could have these two traits at the same time meaning different tiers. Both of these would greatly help most Mesmer builds (as most are Shatter or Phantasm focused).

Mesmers needed a buff, they got a big one. Eles didnt need a nerf, they got a big one.

1st and 2nd specialisation, you got every trait related to shatter (exept one in the last one).
You take chronomancer, you can double shatter thanks to F5
Chronomancer trait are said to refresh your phantasm skill or your clone skills after a shatter … so you can double shatter and even use another Fx. And we dont even know yet for every trait. The simple fact of beeing able to double shatter is beyond OP

Im’ not that sure mesmer needed a “big buff”, they got an ham buff. Ele need a buff cause every ele killer class get hammer buff, still they’re probably nerfing it (00666 COULD be OP, but rip build diversity)

MyPuppy.8970:

Mesmers needed a buff, they got a big one. Eles didnt need a nerf, they got a big one.

But the worse is that I don’t really mind a nerf but I really have a problem with losing a playstyle that I have enjoyed for so long

Maybe they’ll listen… there’s still hope…

Elemental Attunement is a profession-defining skill, in that it’s a trait that pretty much every elementalist takes, but it isn’t a spec-defining skill. There is absolutely no elementalist that has ever played this game that has taken Elemental Attunement because it defined their role as a boon-distributor. That is just not at all what the trait is, and that’s not a role that exists in the game. It’s basically a quality-of-life trait that really should have been made baseline for the arcane tree. Contrast that with Evasive Arcana, which absolutely defines D/D elementalist. There honestly isn’t another trait in the game that defines a spec more-so than Evasive Arcana defines how you play D/D. It completely embodies the bruiser-type feel of the spec.

If the devs are truly bent on making Elemental Attunement a grandmaster trait, they really ought to make it a grandmaster trait, because it certainly isn’t one right now. I’ve played a ton of different elementalist builds in this game, and I’ve taken Elemental Attunement on almost all of them, but none of the builds have been defined by my taking of Elemental Attunement. Being able to distribute swiftness and protection every now and then does not define the role that I play in any aspect of the game. I agree with whoever said that the current iteration ought to have been made baseline, but only affect the elemenatlist, and the actual trait should have been improved and be made to affect allies as well.

I don’t understand the people who are worried that Fresh Air is going to die because of the change to Elemental Attunement. You don’t take Evasive Arcana on a Fresh Air build as it is, how is having to choose between those two traits going to kill the spec? The change that hurts Fresh Air most is the fact that they made Bolt to the Heart just a worse version of Executioner instead of leaving it a Master trait. The only people who are going to be taking Bolt to the Heart are people running Fresh Air, and if people are running Fresh Air they’re going to be running Fresh Air. And seriously, on that note, why do thieves get literally the same trait as Bolt to the Heart but with a higher health threshold? The only thing that’s going to come out of making Bolt to the Heart a grandmaster trait is making Fresh Air elementalists that much weaker.

Solaerin.8635:

I don’t understand the people who are worried that Fresh Air is going to die because of the change to Elemental Attunement. You don’t take Evasive Arcana on a Fresh Air build as it is, how is having to choose between those two traits going to kill the spec? The change that hurts Fresh Air most is the fact that they made Bolt to the Heart just a worse version of Executioner instead of leaving it a Master trait. The only people who are going to be taking Bolt to the Heart are people running Fresh Air, and if people are running Fresh Air they’re going to be running Fresh Air. And seriously, on that note, why do thieves get literally the same trait as Bolt to the Heart but with a higher health threshold? The only thing that’s going to come out of making Bolt to the Heart a grandmaster trait is making Fresh Air elementalists that much weaker.

Some people indeed play fresh air with 30 in arcana.

It’s not only BTTH, but also Air Training. The treshold will change.

Not the whole point, but rather mesmers and thieves getting huge buffs while fresh air being rather nerfed.

Here’s your why.

People only want Elemental Attunement to be baseline because of its high protection duration, which single-handely makes elementalists viable (in pvp). Everything else about it is good, but not necessary-good to justify being baseline.

Considering that our new grandmaster minor trait at earth is going to give us 20% damage reduction while in earth, plus a free stone heart/ diamond skin, players will no longer require EA to be viable. Also, the buff to blinding ashes, one with air and the tempest defense + lightning rod combo will help cover the elementalist’s defensive needs.

EA will no longer be necessary to put our baseline defense at a viable level.

That being said, EA is still avery interesting trait, better designed than Elemental Contigency, and I’d rather have a nerfed version of EA at master tier than its pseudo-tank variation.