Guild Wars 2

Replace Signet of Restoration’s heal on spell cast with passive regeneration (Same as the warrior), change also affects thief counterpart.

It because of this heal that elementalists have the overwhelming survivability that is allowing us to beat every other class.

Signet of Restoration has nothing to do with while dd eles are so strong, lots of bunkers don’t even run it anymore.

Elementalist d/d is fine.

Rather see them change the water attunement to a ae snare instead of a heal and move RTL to a mainhand weapon. Scepter for example could have #2 and #3 merged into a single spell and RTL moved to Scepter #3.

The reason d/d is annoying is because it is so hard to kill, they will either lower the amount we heal or make it easier to catch us. Both ways make it harder for us to bounce back to full hp in the multiple times during a fight.

lol first RtL and now SoR. Just destroy the cantrip synergy in the water trait line and be done with it, no need to nerf other things.

I’m leveling a thief and I’m amazed at how inferior SoR is compared to signet of malice.

They need to tone down RTL to the level of normal dash skills (actual range is 1500 right now despite the tooltip saying its 1200 and affected by cripples and chills).

The next nerf that I would say is to be deserved is probably updraft cooldown or the knockdown duration and catnip synergy with traits.

After that they should buff the stupid scepter already.

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

They need to tone down RTL to the level of normal dash skills (actual range is 1500 right now despite the tooltip saying its 1200 and affected by cripples and chills).

The next nerf that I would say is to be deserved is probably updraft cooldown or the knockdown duration and catnip synergy with traits.

After that they should buff the stupid scepter already.

Lol what? 40s CD is short?
Rather than improving trait for signet and glyphs…you make worst the the only good traits we have, because you assume every ele is a bunker..thx god you’re not a developer

And let’s stop complaining about RTL ,an immobilize and the ele goes nowhere ….you haven’t got an immobilize ready? too bad learn not to spamm skills

Arheundel.6451:

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

They need to tone down RTL to the level of normal dash skills (actual range is 1500 right now despite the tooltip saying its 1200 and affected by cripples and chills).

The next nerf that I would say is to be deserved is probably updraft cooldown or the knockdown duration and catnip synergy with traits.

After that they should buff the stupid scepter already.

Lol what? 40s CD is short?
Rather than improving trait for signet and glyphs…you make worst the the only good traits we have, because you assume every ele is a bunker..thx god you’re not a developer

And let’s stop complaining about RTL ,an immobilize and the ele goes nowhere ….you haven’t got an immobilize ready? too bad learn not to spamm skills

Yes because every single profession in the game has at least 5 immobilizes that they can place every 15 seconds >.>

And FYI most immobilizes are simply be dodged by just strafing.

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

Arheundel.6451:

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

They need to tone down RTL to the level of normal dash skills (actual range is 1500 right now despite the tooltip saying its 1200 and affected by cripples and chills).

The next nerf that I would say is to be deserved is probably updraft cooldown or the knockdown duration and catnip synergy with traits.

After that they should buff the stupid scepter already.

Lol what? 40s CD is short?
Rather than improving trait for signet and glyphs…you make worst the the only good traits we have, because you assume every ele is a bunker..thx god you’re not a developer

And let’s stop complaining about RTL ,an immobilize and the ele goes nowhere ….you haven’t got an immobilize ready? too bad learn not to spamm skills

Yes because every single profession in the game has at least 5 immobilizes that they can place every 15 seconds >.>

So you use all your CC without even watching the attunement the ele is in and without planning ahead or read the battle, no wonder people keep losing over and over.

You see?… nothing would change even if you’d double the CD of rtl, I can still time your CC and use my escape ( in the case I…cough cough..need to escape) accordingly.

With a staff I can time static field and plan ahead where to better place it so that you can’t avoid it, I time your defenses to use shockwave+lava font and more….paying attention to the ongoing fight is what matter in the end, spamming skills on recharge bring you nowhere

Arheundel.6451:

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

Arheundel.6451:

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

They need to tone down RTL to the level of normal dash skills (actual range is 1500 right now despite the tooltip saying its 1200 and affected by cripples and chills).

The next nerf that I would say is to be deserved is probably updraft cooldown or the knockdown duration and catnip synergy with traits.

After that they should buff the stupid scepter already.

Lol what? 40s CD is short?
Rather than improving trait for signet and glyphs…you make worst the the only good traits we have, because you assume every ele is a bunker..thx god you’re not a developer

And let’s stop complaining about RTL ,an immobilize and the ele goes nowhere ….you haven’t got an immobilize ready? too bad learn not to spamm skills

Yes because every single profession in the game has at least 5 immobilizes that they can place every 15 seconds >.>

So you use all your CC without even watching the attunement the ele is in and without planning ahead or read the battle, no wonder people keep losing over and over.

You see?… nothing would change even if you’d double the CD of rtl, I can still time your CC and use my escape ( in the case I…cough cough..need to escape) accordingly.

With a staff I can time static field and plan ahead where to better place it so that you can’t avoid it, I time your defenses to use shockwave+lava font and more….paying attention to the ongoing fight is what matter in the end, spamming skills on recharge bring you nowhere

This isn’t about staff ele, its about D/D ele
And the air atunement is just simply too good, you can create a distance of 1000 between you and the enemy and all it takes is 1 button to close that gap no matter what conditions you have on you, immobilizes also don’t affect RTL mid way through the channel.

You can say whatever you want to save face, but having doubt you play that many other professions for more than 200 hours before I’m only going to believe that your answer is, “KEEP IMMOBILIZING”.

Arheundel.6451:

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

Arheundel.6451:

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

They need to tone down RTL to the level of normal dash skills (actual range is 1500 right now despite the tooltip saying its 1200 and affected by cripples and chills).

The next nerf that I would say is to be deserved is probably updraft cooldown or the knockdown duration and catnip synergy with traits.

After that they should buff the stupid scepter already.

Lol what? 40s CD is short?
Rather than improving trait for signet and glyphs…you make worst the the only good traits we have, because you assume every ele is a bunker..thx god you’re not a developer

And let’s stop complaining about RTL ,an immobilize and the ele goes nowhere ….you haven’t got an immobilize ready? too bad learn not to spamm skills

Yes because every single profession in the game has at least 5 immobilizes that they can place every 15 seconds >.>

So you use all your CC without even watching the attunement the ele is in and without planning ahead or read the battle, no wonder people keep losing over and over.

You see?… nothing would change even if you’d double the CD of rtl, I can still time your CC and use my escape ( in the case I…cough cough..need to escape) accordingly.

With a staff I can time static field and plan ahead where to better place it so that you can’t avoid it, I time your defenses to use shockwave+lava font and more….paying attention to the ongoing fight is what matter in the end, spamming skills on recharge bring you nowhere

This isn’t about staff ele, its about D/D ele
And the air atunement is just simply too good, you can create a distance of 1000 between you and the enemy and all it takes is 1 button to close that gap no matter what conditions you have on you, immobilizes also don’t affect RTL mid way through the channel. Its travel speed is also faster if not as fast as most projectiles.

You can say whatever you want to save face, but having doubt you play that many other professions before I’m only going to believe that your answer is “USE IMMOBILIZE”

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

Arheundel.6451:

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

Arheundel.6451:

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

They need to tone down RTL to the level of normal dash skills (actual range is 1500 right now despite the tooltip saying its 1200 and affected by cripples and chills).

The next nerf that I would say is to be deserved is probably updraft cooldown or the knockdown duration and catnip synergy with traits.

After that they should buff the stupid scepter already.

Lol what? 40s CD is short?
Rather than improving trait for signet and glyphs…you make worst the the only good traits we have, because you assume every ele is a bunker..thx god you’re not a developer

And let’s stop complaining about RTL ,an immobilize and the ele goes nowhere ….you haven’t got an immobilize ready? too bad learn not to spamm skills

Yes because every single profession in the game has at least 5 immobilizes that they can place every 15 seconds >.>

So you use all your CC without even watching the attunement the ele is in and without planning ahead or read the battle, no wonder people keep losing over and over.

You see?… nothing would change even if you’d double the CD of rtl, I can still time your CC and use my escape ( in the case I…cough cough..need to escape) accordingly.

With a staff I can time static field and plan ahead where to better place it so that you can’t avoid it, I time your defenses to use shockwave+lava font and more….paying attention to the ongoing fight is what matter in the end, spamming skills on recharge bring you nowhere

This isn’t about staff ele, its about D/D ele
And the air atunement is just simply too good, you can create a distance of 1000 between you and the enemy and all it takes is 1 button to close that gap no matter what conditions you have on you, immobilizes also don’t affect RTL mid way through the channel.

You can say whatever you want to save face, but having doubt you play that many other professions for more than 200 hours before I’m only going to believe that your answer is, “KEEP IMMOBILIZING”.

So? A short bow thief can even go horizontally and truly lose you , an ele can only go vertically with rtl, you can block its pathway, follow him with a leap and immobilize him later.

Say what you want dude, let the game be dumbed down to your level but don’t try to use logic with this argument, RTL cannot be compared to skills like: infiltrator arrow, phase retreat, decoy and more.

If I want I can chase a RTL ele np with a staff and even focus! An ele cannot get away with RTL alone like a thief or mesmer can, even engineers can escape more easily.
That you like it or not a mele spec is supposed to have mobility, tough luck if you get outsmarted..get better!

This just in: A dash > A blink.

At least you can counter RtL with immobilizes, you cannot do anything about thief’s short bow #5, mesmer’s blink, and other forms of stealth escapes.

Ele is labeled as op because that build is too good, not because of RtL, learn to kittening play. I’m tired of these kittening monkeys that think that are balance geniuses.

You are not.

RTL has some insanely huge draw backs, as well as bugs, that no other dash in the game has, and until that gets changed, it shouldn’t be touched. If it’s really doing 1500 instead of 1200 now, then fine fix that, but neither cooldown or distance should be changed beside that unless the skill gets buffed/bugfixed elsewhere.

Yay! Another “Ele is OP” thread. Can I haz some thread merging nao mods, please?

Maybe reduce the effectiveness of healing power and add a little to the base health?

Would hit bunkers while buffing glass cannons…win/win for the ele I’d say.

I want any player suggesting D/D general nerfs to come in high level fotm with D/D and show me how strong they are….

I like alot thieves that are the main complainers that in PvE are so BAD that gives the class a bad reputation while its completely viable….

Tell me that you saw even a single BAD D/D ele on high lvl fotm….i dare you….

Players wants just to nerf the impact of skill on battles……that is all.

No. Eles need SERIOUS buffs, even the “omg so OP” D/D Eles, in order to be more viable in dungeons and high end PVE (see: melee range and subpar damage). While not “bad” by any means they are certainly and without a doubt completely subpar to many other profs (see Warriors and Guardians) in PVE. That is what is need to be addressed first, and maybe sPVP balance.
Nerfing D/D Eles due to PVP balance (WvW in this case because sPVP has its own skillset) is a very bad move. The prof is already performing subpar compared to other profs, D/D Eles need buffs not nerfs, and lots of them.

Make RTL require a target, similar to magnetic grasp part 2.
I believe its intention was a gap closer but it is used as a getaway.

If that change isn’t made then they will either reduce healing, or nerf RTL distance to the ground.

My other suggested change was to move Cleansing Wave to focus.

ATM x/D has the best heal (except standing in geyser for its full duration) on it and the best movement skill

The focus has some good skills, but no heal on it making the x/D better in most situations.

TGSlasher.1458:

Make RTL require a target, similar to magnetic grasp part 2.
I believe its intention was a gap closer but it is used as a getaway.

If that change isn’t made then they will either reduce healing, or nerf RTL distance to the ground.

My other suggested change was to move Cleansing Wave to focus.

ATM x/D has the best heal (except standing in geyser for its full duration) on it and the best movement skill

The focus has some good skills, but no heal on it making the x/D better in most situations.

RtL does not need a nerf. Why the kitten do people want it nerfed so badly? Nerf the root of the problem, not everything else.

Let’s pretend that condi necro is gamebreakingly OP. But instead of just nerfing the condition themselves, you come up and say that we should nerf death shroud.

That’s basically what you’re doing right now.

I don’t want RTL nerfed it was a suggestion

Just following the previous conversation bro. Chillaxe.

You’re not the first guy wanting to kill RtL just for the heck of it.

The logical nerf is: dealing with the root of the problem.

But like in other games, once X is deemed Op for Z reason, people will find the way to complain for just about every little thing that X brings to the table, instead of just dealing with Z.

At the end, X gets nerfed to oblivion in every single aspect. I’ve seen it happen way too much so that’s why I’m so vocal about this whole thing.

The reason D/D is OP is the crazy healing, not damage or control or RTL etc.
Just fought one D/D Ele, not even a very good one, got him to 10% health 3 times and every time he healed back to full.
Some even manage to rally while in mist form due to some bugs.
It reminds me of WoW paladins that would simply refill their health all the times… not good design really.

HannaDeFreitas.4236:

The reason D/D is OP is the crazy healing, not damage or control or RTL etc.
Just fought one D/D Ele, not even a very good one, got him to 10% health 3 times and every time he healed back to full.
Some even manage to rally while in mist form due to some bugs.
It reminds me of WoW paladins that would simply refill their health all the times… not good design really.

there is no VAPOR form bug….
Also healing is ele SURVIVING MECHANIC.

How hard is to understand that?

Also did that ele kill u?
no?

So ele is OP for jumping puzzles and map completion in WWW right?

This is just hilarious… personally I play a thief and I can’t agree with any of the “zomg nerf” posters in this thread.

dd ele is not op, annoying perhaps, but not OP.

Razor.6392:

You’re not the first guy wanting to kill RtL just for the heck of it.

The logical nerf is: dealing with the root of the problem.

But like in other games, once X is deemed Op for Z reason, people will find the way to complain for just about every little thing that X brings to the table, instead of just dealing with Z.

At the end, X gets nerfed to oblivion in every single aspect. I’ve seen it happen way too much so that’s why I’m so vocal about this whole thing.

Ask around. RTL is the problem most people bring up. The mobility of the class and its ability to restart a fight on demand is what pisses people off. The healing mechanics for the class make it that much easier to do this. I’ve never once heard anyone complain about the actual damage the elementalist does because, lets face it, the damage just isn’t there regardless of spec. I’d take a hit to both RTL and Healing if it meant a real direct damage or burst option that actually worked.

Without the fancy bunker build, no one would be complaining about anything.

The bunker build gave everyone a reason to set their scope on elementalists, and complain about everything they do.

Too mobile? nerf.
Too much burst? nerf.
Escapes like no other? (lets choose to ignore thieves, mesmers, stealth, etc.) NERF

The only thing broken is the healing (added to the tankiness) and ridiculous condition removal. Other than that, they’re fine.

Atherakhia.4086:

Ask around. RTL is the problem most people bring up. The mobility of the class and its ability to restart a fight on demand is what pisses people off. The healing mechanics for the class make it that much easier to do this. I’ve never once heard anyone complain about the actual damage the elementalist does because, lets face it, the damage just isn’t there regardless of spec. I’d take a hit to both RTL and Healing if it meant a real direct damage or burst option that actually worked.

People will always complain about what annoys them, often disregarding the real root of the problem. Thief stealth gets loads of complaints for resetting fights and making fights “annoying”, but the nerfs suggested by these players would destroy the class

Rtl can be annoying, but bunkering because of consistant strong healing is the real problem.

BTW ppl have complained about the damage of d/d eles… once some build gets on the the hate list, ppl will throw every nerf in the book and would be happy to see their nemesis profession become a free kill.

Cirax.9231:

Atherakhia.4086:

Ask around. RTL is the problem most people bring up. The mobility of the class and its ability to restart a fight on demand is what pisses people off. The healing mechanics for the class make it that much easier to do this. I’ve never once heard anyone complain about the actual damage the elementalist does because, lets face it, the damage just isn’t there regardless of spec. I’d take a hit to both RTL and Healing if it meant a real direct damage or burst option that actually worked.

People will always complain about what annoys them, often disregarding the real root of the problem. Thief stealth gets loads of complaints for resetting fights and making fights “annoying”, but the nerfs suggested by these players would destroy the class

Rtl can be annoying, but bunkering because of consistant strong healing is the real problem.

BTW ppl have complained about the damage of d/d eles… once some build gets on the the hate list, ppl will throw every nerf in the book and would be happy to see their nemesis profession become a free kill.

Except perma stealth and culling are legitimately the issues with the thief class. Much like the extreme mobility is the problem with the ele. RTL isn’t the problem perse, but RTL + Teleport + Mist Form are. The problem is only made that much worse because of all the heals ontop of this.

Now there are options of course… for example, why not improve the other skills so we actually had a real choice to make by getting the arcane skills because they actually did meaningful damage, or more survivability because the class only has RTL and its heals natively?

I don’t think we need anything extreme to fix the class as far as D/D is concerned. RTL boosted to 20 second cooldown and the heal removed from attunement swaps is probably enough to get the build down to where it needs. Especially if we consider AE’s are likely being nerfed (which hopefully means direct damage and burst across the board will be dramatically increased).

I’m also not apposed to moving RTL to a mainhand other than dagger either, but that is quite extreme.

some nerfs requests are hilarious…. ._.

You can push damage to thieves level but if they do what you say

CD RTL
NERF EA
NERF HEaling on attunement

And maybe changing RTL to another weapon

You just will have one of the most severe nerfs in this game history…

I expect that because ele is famous to get the most severe nerfs for no reasons….

But when you just want to destroy a class via forum complaining remember that is an ability common to every player…..

And ranger/warrior are next just remember this when the next complaint based balancing will hit your beloved classes….

if Anet has to nerf us, which i really cant talk about, most of my experience is spvp and pve, i think they should only touch the healing on water 15 passive and arcane roll in passive

those are our best heals, as they are accessible every 10 seconds and will heal 3-4k with just the healing power from water bunkers have

just bug fix rtl from 1500 range to 1200 range (if it actually is going that far, im not sure) and see how that does

cleansin wave isnt the problem, its a 25s cd, cone of cold isnt either, its healing is pretty low.

mobility isnt the problem, warriors, thieves, rangers all have that. mesmers have portal, which is much better than rtl. just drop that and kite the fight away from it, then drop another far away for a massive range escape. they also have stealth, teleports, and clones

plenty of classes have escape mechanisms like eles

if we have to be nerfed, take a bit off water attune heal and water roll heal. if i need to heal, my first instinct is go to water attune and roll. if im using SoR i try not to use it, as the passive is better imo. ether renewal is also good for healing, but it can be interrupted and is longer cd then water attune

nerf those if anet is positive they are going to nerf us, bug fix things like lightning whip and fire grab, then start building up fire and air trait lines so we actually have decent offensive capabilities

Problem is if you nerf ele healing they’re going to be absolute garbage.

They’re good at staying alive/getting away…and that’s really about it. Damage needs to be buffed at the same time if there’s any meaningful reduction in healing, else the profession will just be a free kill. A fairly significant damage buff at that.

Stuff like RTL needing a target is ridiculous (or even increasing the cooldown, honestly). Then we’re talking warriors being much more mobile than elementalists. With 8000 more base hps and heavy armor. Personally when I signed on I knew I was getting great mobility at the cost of terrible hp and light armor. “This profession lets me have tons of swiftness and I can zip around with RTL”, I wonder how many people selected the profession as their main purely because of that. It’s 90% of why I did and I wasn’t even aware of whether the profession was good or bad. It’s not like there’s great evasive maneuvers on weapons and no aegis. I don’t even know what the point of playing an ele would be if they couldn’t be very mobile. Might as well give people a 1 time use potion that lets them switch over to guardian, because they would outclass eles in almost every way.

Warrior’s would hardly be more mobile for the simple fact that their movement abilities are all affected by movement impairing effects whereas none of the elementalist’s abilities are.

But yes, for what the class is, its damage is quite low. Potential damage is almost there with scepter, but you’ll never land the burst chain and even with it, it’s nowhere near warrior or thief damage despite requiring you to be in melee range to use it.

And then when you factor in the eventual AE nerfs that they’ve been threatening for 2 months now? The class is in for a lot of issues. And with ANet’s past performance we’d be better off changing classes than waiting for them to improve it.

Atherakhia.4086:

Warrior’s would hardly be more mobile for the simple fact that their movement abilities are all affected by movement impairing effects whereas none of the elementalist’s abilities are.

But yes, for what the class is, its damage is quite low. Potential damage is almost there with scepter, but you’ll never land the burst chain and even with it, it’s nowhere near warrior or thief damage despite requiring you to be in melee range to use it.

And then when you factor in the eventual AE nerfs that they’ve been threatening for 2 months now? The class is in for a lot of issues. And with ANet’s past performance we’d be better off changing classes than waiting for them to improve it.

Regarding warriors, I don’t think they should be winning in an out of combat footrace either (using abilities of course, vs ours). Which they would. Right now when I’m running with friends warriors seem to pretty neatly keep up with me side to side or close enough, with me being perma swift and using RTL, burning speed, and blink.

I can even live with that, but under no circumstances should they outrun us.

But at any rate, yes, damage is a thing. It’s a thing we don’t have. Without the thing we can’t lose the other thing, staying alive. If I wanted to not kill people and also not be able to stay alive, I would have rolled a longbow ranger like everyone else.

(Haven’t worked in any ranger zings in a while, I like to go for those on occasion).