Guild Wars 2

Valento.bugFix(NOW);

Actually upon reflection, the worse consequence of this nerf is that all sort of synergy with the arcana trait line is gone.

Kodiak.3281:

They killed the old Auramancer because it required too many lines to be effective in the simplistic “3 lines” system compared to partial traits in the old system (IE: 20 fire, 10 air, 10 earth, 30 water). You have One with Fire (Fire), Zephyr’s Boon (Air), Elemental Shielding (Earth), and Powerful Auras (Water). When you throw on the fact that they got rid of Signet generation as well it left you with very few ways to generate auras.

Aura traits are still spread out into every single line. Two in fire/air/water, one in earth/arcane, and three in tempest.

Khalic.3561:

Aura traits are still spread out into every single line. Two in fire/air/water, one in earth/arcane, and three in tempest.

Yes but you had to take Fire before to generate any kind of real amount of Auras for the Signet aura generation. So you’d be trapped in Fire/Water/Tempest. With the new system you have generation on Shouts and you’re only trapped into Water/Tempest with Fire/Air as the alternatives (or Earth, if you’re masochist).

It should really be limited to certain boons because it was wildly strong with how it spread quickness and the entirety of Armor of Earth. That said, it is incredibly weak in its current form just spreading might. I suggest the following.

Heat Sync: Grant yourself 3 stacks of might and then spread might, fury, and swiftness you have to nearby allies.

To be honest, outside of Quickness and Resistance, I don’t see what’s wrong with sharing the other boons.

It has to be noted that taking Tempest and Warhorn requires two major sacrafices:
-Taking Tempest
-Taking Warhorn

Seriously. The Tempest line is a huge damage and survivability loss to take relative to almost any other trait line. Taking Warhorn means you lose out on the massive DPS of Staff in PvE or the incredibly good kits of OH Dagger or Focus in PvP. Seriously. Outside of Heat Sync, there is very little reason to take Warhorn over OH Dagger and Focus.

The thing is that Ele Offhands or Staff are already super strong. Just look at the OH Dagger kit. It has so many strong skills. Same with Focus, and same with Staff. Warhorn, without Heat Sync, makes 0 sense to be run with any build over these other 3 options. Even a condi option like some people have suggested like “Convert condis to burning” or “convert condis to might” or whatever would be so utterly situational that you would never seriously consider running Warhorn over any other weapon set.

The range of boons needs to be large. Might, Swiftness, Regeneration, Protection, and Fury at least. Warhorn has to compete against superstar skills such as:
-Obsidian Flesh
-Magnetic Wave
-Swirling Winds
-Ride the Lightning
-Updraft
-Ring of Fire
-Cleaning Wave
-Healing Rain
-Static Cage
-Frozen Ground

Warhorn has like… Warhorn Air 5.

Seriously. Even the “good” skills on Warhorn would be the MOVING Water Field and Sand Squall, which while strong, has been bugfixed to now only give 4 sec of Protection and only extend other boons 2 sec instead of 4. Right now, it’s basically Sand Squall versus the kits of the other weapons, and the fight does not look good for it.

Heat Sync, simply put, makes Warhorn a competitive weapon choice with OH Dagger, Focus, or Staff. Without it, or with the very much weaker suggestions put out, Warhorn will never be taken over the incredible Staff in PvE and WvW, or the OH Dagger in sPvP, or even the occasional Focus, which still has an incredible kit. An OH weapon set has to be at least as strong as Focus in order to ever be seriously considered. With a complete nerf to Heat Sync, I can safely say that no one will seriously use Warhorn at any high level of play in PvP, PvE, or WvW. Heck, even with Heat Sync as strong as it was, it still makes more sense to run OH Dagger in PvP and Staff in WvW and PvE. Warhorn is barely hanging on as a Tier 2 weapon choice and it’s being pushed to garbage tier, and that’s just really what amazes me.

Please don’t nerf Heat Sync, or at the very least, allow the skill to share Ele boons like Might, Swiftness, Regeneration, Protection, and Fury.

coax.2951:

No, it’s too powerful in its current form. You can stack crazy amounts of low duration boons (e.g. quickness/resistance) for your party in seconds. It’s crazy OP currently.

Make up your minds, community. Either Tempest is bad, or it’s very good. Augh. -.-

Jski.6180:

Killyox.3950:

It’s OP. Herald’s ton of boons + heat sync + mesmer share..neeeveeereeendiiiing proooootectioooooon XD I agree it should get something more interesting to compensate.

How hard would it be to grant allies something akin to thief venoms but that does burn?

My proposition

Heat Sync 30s CD

3x Might (10s)
Radius: 600
Range:: 600
Grant Fire Aura to your allies (3s)
Your allies’ next attack burns (3s)
nr of Targets: 5

I think Herald could give perma protection on there own as is.

At a great cost. Combined with Ele HS and Mesmer’s signet this could be done without any penalties for Rev, allowing him to spend energy on different things.

Kain Francois.4328:

coax.2951:

No, it’s too powerful in its current form. You can stack crazy amounts of low duration boons (e.g. quickness/resistance) for your party in seconds. It’s crazy OP currently.

Make up your minds, community. Either Tempest is bad, or it’s very good. Augh. -.-

Heat Sync is like the diamond in the rough. It’s really the only decent reason to take Warhorn. The problem is if they nerf it to only share Might, then taking Warhorn is largely pointless. If we wanted to share/generate Might, we already do so with /F or /D in our off hands and with Fury with Persisting Flames.

Tempest, as a whole, is bad. The Auramancer style play they are pushing as lackluster and inferior to the base Elementalist play styles already established.

How could you nerf Warhorn Heat Sync when Signet of Inspiration does the same thing it was doing on a class that can 1-shot people from stealth? Where is the logic?

How can it be overpowered for ele but fine for another class with a better health pool that has stealth?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Inspiration

Xillllix.3485:

How could you nerf Warhorn Heat Sync when Signet of Inspiration does the same thing it was doing on a class that can 1-shot people from stealth? Where is the logic?

How can it be overpowered for ele but fine for another class with a better health pool that has stealth?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Inspiration

I agree with this. Water Globe isn’t gonna cut it I’m afraid, despite being an awesome skill it is not what makes Warhorn shines, Heat Sync is.

Kodiak.3281:

Khalic.3561:

Aura traits are still spread out into every single line. Two in fire/air/water, one in earth/arcane, and three in tempest.

Yes but you had to take Fire before to generate any kind of real amount of Auras for the Signet aura generation. So you’d be trapped in Fire/Water/Tempest. With the new system you have generation on Shouts and you’re only trapped into Water/Tempest with Fire/Air as the alternatives (or Earth, if you’re masochist).

When I was playing the last BWE, I felt obligated to take Earth for the protection on aura (which should be in the tempest trait line), and the -10% in melee range.

The Great Al.2546:

Kodiak.3281:

Khalic.3561:

Aura traits are still spread out into every single line. Two in fire/air/water, one in earth/arcane, and three in tempest.

Yes but you had to take Fire before to generate any kind of real amount of Auras for the Signet aura generation. So you’d be trapped in Fire/Water/Tempest. With the new system you have generation on Shouts and you’re only trapped into Water/Tempest with Fire/Air as the alternatives (or Earth, if you’re masochist).

When I was playing the last BWE, I felt obligated to take Earth for the protection on aura (which should be in the tempest trait line), and the -10% in melee range.

The trick is to go d/wh tempest water earth max aura and healing out put and use heat sync to ecoe back the gurd stab effect so you do not lose out on giving up a gurd for a tempest.

Xillllix.3485:

How could you nerf Warhorn Heat Sync when Signet of Inspiration does the same thing it was doing on a class that can 1-shot people from stealth? Where is the logic?

How can it be overpowered for ele but fine for another class with a better health pool that has stealth?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Inspiration

Because that other classes doesn’t have access to the same level of boon generation as an ele. The other issue is that ele can stack vigour better than any other class, I would think this is the boon they are trying to limit.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Xillllix.3485:

How could you nerf Warhorn Heat Sync when Signet of Inspiration does the same thing it was doing on a class that can 1-shot people from stealth? Where is the logic?

How can it be overpowered for ele but fine for another class with a better health pool that has stealth?

https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Signet_of_Inspiration

Because that other classes doesn’t have access to the same level of boon generation as an ele. The other issue is that ele can stack vigour better than any other class, I would think this is the boon they are trying to limit.

I think its going to be boons like quickness and resistances that are the main reason why they are chasing heat sink (i hope stab can stay but stab maybe part of the problem too). I have a feeling even the signet of inspiration will see a changes once these boons are out in full forces from the new elite specs. The problem is that quickness was never a boon before i think they broke the balances of it when they made it into a boon (i wish resistances was not a boon too).

Rev can up out going boons by 50% mez gets an out going boon + too a gurd can give high quickness do to the rev out going boon + then the mez can bonce it back with the signet with another added +50%. I think you can get some high quickness duration with just 3 classes combing. So about 6 to 9 sec of quickness from the first set then add another 9 to 13 sec coming from the mez. About 15 to 22 sec of quickness from the combo maybe more if you push boon duration all on 30 sec cd of both the shout and the signet so perma quickness!

So what i am saying is rev’s elite spec has broken the games balances NOT heat sync.

Making Quickness a boon was such a strange thing to do anyway. It was just begging to be broken by doing that.

I can understand blacklisting Quickness from being copied by Heat Sync, but stripping down every other boon from the list just because Quickness copying is possibly overpowered is crazy. Copying the other common Ele boons (Swiftness, Fury, Regeneration, Protection) is something the class does anyway, and would honestly be fine for the Tempest in my opinion.

I still think there’s additional issues with AoE Armor of Earth (10 stacks…)

Valento.9852:

I still think there’s additional issues with AoE Armor of Earth (10 stacks…)

See this is what is confusing to me if the AoE Armor of Earth was seen as op by the dev then a lot of the ele who hate tempest are comply out of touch with what is op or up becuse they would not bat an eye over this trick. This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Any way ya it was a very powerful 2 to 3 step combo for tempest but i have a feeling it had more to do with quickness up time and resistance up time. All though mez can do this trick now with rev and i have a feeling its rev elite spec that braking all boon duration effects more so then the copy boon ability.

Can “Aftershock!” please get Blast finishers on each pulse? That would justify its long cool down.

Please don’t do this baby.

Neko.9021:

To be honest, outside of Quickness and Resistance, I don’t see what’s wrong with sharing the other boons.

It has to be noted that taking Tempest and Warhorn requires two major sacrafices:
-Taking Tempest
-Taking Warhorn

Seriously. The Tempest line is a huge damage and survivability loss to take relative to almost any other trait line. Taking Warhorn means you lose out on the massive DPS of Staff in PvE or the incredibly good kits of OH Dagger or Focus in PvP. Seriously. Outside of Heat Sync, there is very little reason to take Warhorn over OH Dagger and Focus.

The thing is that Ele Offhands or Staff are already super strong. Just look at the OH Dagger kit. It has so many strong skills. Same with Focus, and same with Staff. Warhorn, without Heat Sync, makes 0 sense to be run with any build over these other 3 options. Even a condi option like some people have suggested like “Convert condis to burning” or “convert condis to might” or whatever would be so utterly situational that you would never seriously consider running Warhorn over any other weapon set.

The range of boons needs to be large. Might, Swiftness, Regeneration, Protection, and Fury at least. Warhorn has to compete against superstar skills such as:
-Obsidian Flesh
-Magnetic Wave
-Swirling Winds
-Ride the Lightning
-Updraft
-Ring of Fire
-Cleaning Wave
-Healing Rain
-Static Cage
-Frozen Ground

Warhorn has like… Warhorn Air 5.

Seriously. Even the “good” skills on Warhorn would be the MOVING Water Field and Sand Squall, which while strong, has been bugfixed to now only give 4 sec of Protection and only extend other boons 2 sec instead of 4. Right now, it’s basically Sand Squall versus the kits of the other weapons, and the fight does not look good for it.

Heat Sync, simply put, makes Warhorn a competitive weapon choice with OH Dagger, Focus, or Staff. Without it, or with the very much weaker suggestions put out, Warhorn will never be taken over the incredible Staff in PvE and WvW, or the OH Dagger in sPvP, or even the occasional Focus, which still has an incredible kit. An OH weapon set has to be at least as strong as Focus in order to ever be seriously considered. With a complete nerf to Heat Sync, I can safely say that no one will seriously use Warhorn at any high level of play in PvP, PvE, or WvW. Heck, even with Heat Sync as strong as it was, it still makes more sense to run OH Dagger in PvP and Staff in WvW and PvE. Warhorn is barely hanging on as a Tier 2 weapon choice and it’s being pushed to garbage tier, and that’s just really what amazes me.

Please don’t nerf Heat Sync, or at the very least, allow the skill to share Ele boons like Might, Swiftness, Regeneration, Protection, and Fury.

100% Agree^

I’m ok if they change Heat Sync, but Staff and other OH weapons have SOOO much more flavor Warhorn, Warhorn had HeatSync and SandSquall, if that nerf goes through, I would laugh at any ele with a Warhorn equipped.

1. Either keep it how it is, limit boons to not grant quickness/resistance.
2. Or give us a totally different AMAZING ability.

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

I want it to still share all boons but be on a longer cooldown

I don’t know why people fear this skill when the functionality has existed for so long already. It’s not like Boon Copying is very practical for sPvP, and taking Tempest is a pretty severe DPS loss for PvE Ele. There’s no way you were gonna stop running Staff Ele for WvW. That people feared this particular skill shows how off people’s perceptions of game balance is.

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

If you’re running Scepter Ele you’re gonna be doing like no damage after the initial burst, unless you wanna rock the Lightning Hammer.

You also give up quite a bit of damage going into Tempest. And even more by not taking Staff.

So yes, you are taking a huge DPS hit by using a Warhorn and Tempest.

Neko.9021:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

If you’re running Scepter Ele you’re gonna be doing like no damage after the initial burst, unless you wanna rock the Lightning Hammer.

You also give up quite a bit of damage going into Tempest. And even more by not taking Staff.

So yes, you are taking a huge DPS hit by using a Warhorn and Tempest.

Yes but we are comparing it to a mesmer that is giving up Dueling, Domination, and Illusions. The trees that have damage modification associated with them. You can exactly compare the mesmer and ele in terms of who is giving up something to achieve a goal.

If you want mesmer tier damage then by all means keep heat sync. But don’t make comparisons to builds that give up almost everything in traits and damage.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Neko.9021:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

If you’re running Scepter Ele you’re gonna be doing like no damage after the initial burst, unless you wanna rock the Lightning Hammer.

You also give up quite a bit of damage going into Tempest. And even more by not taking Staff.

So yes, you are taking a huge DPS hit by using a Warhorn and Tempest.

Yes but we are comparing it to a mesmer that is giving up Dueling, Domination, and Illusions. The trees that have damage modification associated with them. You can exactly compare the mesmer and ele in terms of who is giving up something to achieve a goal.

If you want mesmer tier damage then by all means keep heat sync. But don’t make comparisons to builds that give up almost everything in traits and damage.

I understand you were looking at that terrible Mesmer build the other poster put, and I would not defend it. I also understand that taking Signet of Inspiration is an opportunity cost for the Mesmer (since Mesmers have so many valuable, useful utility slots that compete for each of their utilities).

However, it has to be understood that Warhorn + Tempest is also a massive cost for the Ele. Probably more so. They have to take the entire Tempest line which offers very little in the way of Damage or self-sustain, and then they have to take Warhorn, which has mostly terrible skills outside of Heat Sync and Sand Squall.

Mind you, Heat Sync is a desirable skill, and it definitely opens up a new (tier 2) build for the Ele, which I happened to very much enjoy. It would never take over DPS Staff Ele in PvE or Cele D/D Ele in PvP, but it was an interesting build that had the potential to see play in some other meta as an underdog spec. Now it’s being killed before it even gets to see live, because people are afraid of the currently overpowered specs that Ele currently has. That’s crazy. Warhorn Ele has little damage, little self-survivability, and does one trick really well (boon sharing). The spec didn’t deserve to die, and certainly wasn’t “overperforming”.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

What i am talking about how boon sharing is going to be op due to rev +50% out going boon. It is the more op effect that anet is going to add to the game and its starting to brake other classes and builds. Heat sync is the first changes to make another class balanced and the gurd shout for quickness going on a longer cd is another balanced changes for another class.

Rev’s +50% to out going boons destroys the game in spvp and wvw it may even kill pve.

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

What i am talking about how boon sharing is going to be op due to rev +50% out going boon. It is the more op effect that anet is going to add to the game and its starting to brake other classes and builds. Heat sync is the first changes to make another class balanced and the gurd shout for quickness going on a longer cd is another balanced changes for another class.

Rev’s +50% to out going boons destroys the game in spvp and wvw it may even kill pve.

The ele would still give max stacks of fury with or without revenant. The guard quickness was on too high of a duration given its cd.

This was about elementalist’s ability to generate boons without investing into boon duration. By comparison mesmer boon generation is largely RNG, and requires heavy trait involvement.

What the revenant enables is for classes to maintain close to perma of boons they before incidentally gave off.

It won’t destroy the game in pvp, null field, conversions, malyx, steal, rip all exist. It won’t destroy it in wvw because its a 5 person aoe effect, and the effects of pvp apply their as well.

I don’t know if it will destroy pve. That remains to be seen.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

What i am talking about how boon sharing is going to be op due to rev +50% out going boon. It is the more op effect that anet is going to add to the game and its starting to brake other classes and builds. Heat sync is the first changes to make another class balanced and the gurd shout for quickness going on a longer cd is another balanced changes for another class.

Rev’s +50% to out going boons destroys the game in spvp and wvw it may even kill pve.

The ele would still give max stacks of fury with or without revenant. The guard quickness was on too high of a duration given its cd.

This was about elementalist’s ability to generate boons without investing into boon duration. By comparison mesmer boon generation is largely RNG, and requires heavy trait involvement.

What the revenant enables is for classes to maintain close to perma of boons they before incidentally gave off.

It won’t destroy the game in pvp, null field, conversions, malyx, steal, rip all exist. It won’t destroy it in wvw because its a 5 person aoe effect, and the effects of pvp apply their as well.

I don’t know if it will destroy pve. That remains to be seen.

Fury is not a hard boon to get it never realy has and now its everywhere . Its boon like quickness stab and resistance that are the danger boons. If these become too long lasting from effects like +50% boon duration to out going heals you will see many effects start to become very lope sided. So take frost bow and why they are drooping its dmg if you have a group of 3 ele you steam roll though most content making it trivial. When you have the powerful effects easy to get and last for a long time you see a lot of skill and “fun” leave the game. Even with the longer cd gurd with an mez / rev with the +50% out going boons can still get perma quickness my point for making the all in boon support build on mez.

Giving out +50% to all out going boons is too much and to make it work you must removing all boon sharing effects and push the base duration of all powerful boons very low. That was the ideal behind nerfing boon duration becuse things like stab where 100% up time. By adding in an class effect like this you have effectually destroy all balancing in the last 3 years.

It seems right now they are trying to balance arone the +50% out going boon its not going to work with out a lot of out right destroying classes tools. I have a strong feeling that this rev’s effect is going to comply mess up raids/pve, wvw and spvp.

Added note about boon counter play. The thing about this is not every class can do this its will stagier team builds all the more to deal with a very op effect. There also more ways to apply these boons then there are to remove them. Short duration was the only thing holding back the boon vs removing game play mostly even now with longer boon duration you will see boons win out (the counter for the counter of corruption of boons is simply condition removal and dodging there only one counter to boons and you cant make these boons miss the person applying them.)

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

What i am talking about how boon sharing is going to be op due to rev +50% out going boon. It is the more op effect that anet is going to add to the game and its starting to brake other classes and builds. Heat sync is the first changes to make another class balanced and the gurd shout for quickness going on a longer cd is another balanced changes for another class.

Rev’s +50% to out going boons destroys the game in spvp and wvw it may even kill pve.

The ele would still give max stacks of fury with or without revenant. The guard quickness was on too high of a duration given its cd.

This was about elementalist’s ability to generate boons without investing into boon duration. By comparison mesmer boon generation is largely RNG, and requires heavy trait involvement.

What the revenant enables is for classes to maintain close to perma of boons they before incidentally gave off.

It won’t destroy the game in pvp, null field, conversions, malyx, steal, rip all exist. It won’t destroy it in wvw because its a 5 person aoe effect, and the effects of pvp apply their as well.

I don’t know if it will destroy pve. That remains to be seen.

Fury is not a hard boon to get it never realy has and now its everywhere . Its boon like quickness stab and resistance that are the danger boons. If these become too long lasting from effects like +50% boon duration to out going heals you will see many effects start to become very lope sided. So take frost bow and why they are drooping its dmg if you have a group of 3 ele you steam roll though most content making it trivial. When you have the powerful effects easy to get and last for a long time you see a lot of skill and “fun” leave the game. Even with the longer cd gurd with an mez / rev with the +50% out going boons can still get perma quickness my point for making the all in boon support build on mez.

Giving out +50% to all out going boons is too much and to make it work you must removing all boon sharing effects and push the base duration of all powerful boons very low. That was the ideal behind nerfing boon duration becuse things like stab where 100% up time. By adding in an class effect like this you have effectually destroy all balancing in the last 3 years.

It seems right now they are trying to balance arone the +50% out going boon its not going to work with out a lot of out right destroying classes tools. I have a strong feeling that this rev’s effect is going to comply mess up raids/pve, wvw and spvp.

Added note about boon counter play. The thing about this is not every class can do this its will stagier team builds all the more to deal with a very op effect. There also more ways to apply these boons then there are to remove them. Short duration was the only thing holding back the boon vs removing game play mostly even now with longer boon duration you will see boons win out (the counter for the counter of corruption of boons is simply condition removal and dodging there only one counter to boons and you cant make these boons miss the person applying them.)

Its all about costs. The perma quickness build guts the mesmers own dps in favour of group dps. Where as the guardian was giving quickness on a shorter cd than any other quickness skill in the game.

A signet of inspiration is either a utility slot or a trait line grandmaster or both. To add in more uses you add in another trait line or another utility slot.

Warhorn share took the skill and only required a traitline minor and a weapon. It was on a class that had a huge amount of boon generation.

Your argument is that revenant will make every boon perma, including the danger boons.

But that won’t work for stability, it won’t work for resistance. The only it will work for is quickness, and the only class that can give quickness perma is also the one with the lowest dps in pve. Currently to get to the level of ele dps a mesmer has to go full chrono alacrity/quickness sharing. Creating a ele, ele, ele, mesmer, revenant meta. But it isn’t even increasing mesmer dps, its increasing party dps to compensate for taking a mesmer.

As for countering boons it is quite simple. Mesmers can rip four every 2.34 seconds. Thiefs can steal at least one every five seconds. Revenants can rip 2 every nine seconds. And these were the boon rips that were tied to cooldowns. I can give of the list of cooldown boon removals, but they are too many. Suffice to say that necro and mesmer have enough boon hate that a simple dodge wouldn’t matter.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

What i am talking about how boon sharing is going to be op due to rev +50% out going boon. It is the more op effect that anet is going to add to the game and its starting to brake other classes and builds. Heat sync is the first changes to make another class balanced and the gurd shout for quickness going on a longer cd is another balanced changes for another class.

Rev’s +50% to out going boons destroys the game in spvp and wvw it may even kill pve.

The ele would still give max stacks of fury with or without revenant. The guard quickness was on too high of a duration given its cd.

This was about elementalist’s ability to generate boons without investing into boon duration. By comparison mesmer boon generation is largely RNG, and requires heavy trait involvement.

What the revenant enables is for classes to maintain close to perma of boons they before incidentally gave off.

It won’t destroy the game in pvp, null field, conversions, malyx, steal, rip all exist. It won’t destroy it in wvw because its a 5 person aoe effect, and the effects of pvp apply their as well.

I don’t know if it will destroy pve. That remains to be seen.

Fury is not a hard boon to get it never realy has and now its everywhere . Its boon like quickness stab and resistance that are the danger boons. If these become too long lasting from effects like +50% boon duration to out going heals you will see many effects start to become very lope sided. So take frost bow and why they are drooping its dmg if you have a group of 3 ele you steam roll though most content making it trivial. When you have the powerful effects easy to get and last for a long time you see a lot of skill and “fun” leave the game. Even with the longer cd gurd with an mez / rev with the +50% out going boons can still get perma quickness my point for making the all in boon support build on mez.

Giving out +50% to all out going boons is too much and to make it work you must removing all boon sharing effects and push the base duration of all powerful boons very low. That was the ideal behind nerfing boon duration becuse things like stab where 100% up time. By adding in an class effect like this you have effectually destroy all balancing in the last 3 years.

It seems right now they are trying to balance arone the +50% out going boon its not going to work with out a lot of out right destroying classes tools. I have a strong feeling that this rev’s effect is going to comply mess up raids/pve, wvw and spvp.

Added note about boon counter play. The thing about this is not every class can do this its will stagier team builds all the more to deal with a very op effect. There also more ways to apply these boons then there are to remove them. Short duration was the only thing holding back the boon vs removing game play mostly even now with longer boon duration you will see boons win out (the counter for the counter of corruption of boons is simply condition removal and dodging there only one counter to boons and you cant make these boons miss the person applying them.)

Its all about costs. The perma quickness build guts the mesmers own dps in favour of group dps. Where as the guardian was giving quickness on a shorter cd than any other quickness skill in the game.

A signet of inspiration is either a utility slot or a trait line grandmaster or both. To add in more uses you add in another trait line or another utility slot.

Warhorn share took the skill and only required a traitline minor and a weapon. It was on a class that had a huge amount of boon generation.

Your argument is that revenant will make every boon perma, including the danger boons.

But that won’t work for stability, it won’t work for resistance. The only it will work for is quickness, and the only class that can give quickness perma is also the one with the lowest dps in pve. Currently to get to the level of ele dps a mesmer has to go full chrono alacrity/quickness sharing. Creating a ele, ele, ele, mesmer, revenant meta. But it isn’t even increasing mesmer dps, its increasing party dps to compensate for taking a mesmer.

As for countering boons it is quite simple. Mesmers can rip four every 2.34 seconds. Thiefs can steal at least one every five seconds. Revenants can rip 2 every nine seconds. And these were the boon rips that were tied to cooldowns. I can give of the list of cooldown boon removals, but they are too many. Suffice to say that necro and mesmer have enough boon hate that a simple dodge wouldn’t matter.

Yet rev the only class who has such a powerful effect its maybe the strongest effect in the game. Most AoE effects like this are on the level of 150 to an effect most of the time only in combat and only to very close by players and they tend to be only one per class. Rev has this effect something that comes to much higher then 150 + to something and they can have other Aoe effects like it.

All mesmer needs to do is run one utility to get boon share they can go all in to get many more but tempest needs to run a new line and an set wepon. Tempest needs to give up much more to have any type of boon sharing abitly.

There more then quickness and stab that a danger boon for this effect there resistances and once you start talking about this type of boon you start to removing playable from build times altogether.

The heat sync nerf is more of a symptom of an broken effect in the game rev +50% boon duration is the real problem.

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

What i am talking about how boon sharing is going to be op due to rev +50% out going boon. It is the more op effect that anet is going to add to the game and its starting to brake other classes and builds. Heat sync is the first changes to make another class balanced and the gurd shout for quickness going on a longer cd is another balanced changes for another class.

Rev’s +50% to out going boons destroys the game in spvp and wvw it may even kill pve.

The ele would still give max stacks of fury with or without revenant. The guard quickness was on too high of a duration given its cd.

This was about elementalist’s ability to generate boons without investing into boon duration. By comparison mesmer boon generation is largely RNG, and requires heavy trait involvement.

What the revenant enables is for classes to maintain close to perma of boons they before incidentally gave off.

It won’t destroy the game in pvp, null field, conversions, malyx, steal, rip all exist. It won’t destroy it in wvw because its a 5 person aoe effect, and the effects of pvp apply their as well.

I don’t know if it will destroy pve. That remains to be seen.

Fury is not a hard boon to get it never realy has and now its everywhere . Its boon like quickness stab and resistance that are the danger boons. If these become too long lasting from effects like +50% boon duration to out going heals you will see many effects start to become very lope sided. So take frost bow and why they are drooping its dmg if you have a group of 3 ele you steam roll though most content making it trivial. When you have the powerful effects easy to get and last for a long time you see a lot of skill and “fun” leave the game. Even with the longer cd gurd with an mez / rev with the +50% out going boons can still get perma quickness my point for making the all in boon support build on mez.

Giving out +50% to all out going boons is too much and to make it work you must removing all boon sharing effects and push the base duration of all powerful boons very low. That was the ideal behind nerfing boon duration becuse things like stab where 100% up time. By adding in an class effect like this you have effectually destroy all balancing in the last 3 years.

It seems right now they are trying to balance arone the +50% out going boon its not going to work with out a lot of out right destroying classes tools. I have a strong feeling that this rev’s effect is going to comply mess up raids/pve, wvw and spvp.

Added note about boon counter play. The thing about this is not every class can do this its will stagier team builds all the more to deal with a very op effect. There also more ways to apply these boons then there are to remove them. Short duration was the only thing holding back the boon vs removing game play mostly even now with longer boon duration you will see boons win out (the counter for the counter of corruption of boons is simply condition removal and dodging there only one counter to boons and you cant make these boons miss the person applying them.)

Its all about costs. The perma quickness build guts the mesmers own dps in favour of group dps. Where as the guardian was giving quickness on a shorter cd than any other quickness skill in the game.

A signet of inspiration is either a utility slot or a trait line grandmaster or both. To add in more uses you add in another trait line or another utility slot.

Warhorn share took the skill and only required a traitline minor and a weapon. It was on a class that had a huge amount of boon generation.

Your argument is that revenant will make every boon perma, including the danger boons.

But that won’t work for stability, it won’t work for resistance. The only it will work for is quickness, and the only class that can give quickness perma is also the one with the lowest dps in pve. Currently to get to the level of ele dps a mesmer has to go full chrono alacrity/quickness sharing. Creating a ele, ele, ele, mesmer, revenant meta. But it isn’t even increasing mesmer dps, its increasing party dps to compensate for taking a mesmer.

As for countering boons it is quite simple. Mesmers can rip four every 2.34 seconds. Thiefs can steal at least one every five seconds. Revenants can rip 2 every nine seconds. And these were the boon rips that were tied to cooldowns. I can give of the list of cooldown boon removals, but they are too many. Suffice to say that necro and mesmer have enough boon hate that a simple dodge wouldn’t matter.

Yet rev the only class who has such a powerful effect its maybe the strongest effect in the game. Most AoE effects like this are on the level of 150 to an effect most of the time only in combat and only to very close by players and they tend to be only one per class. Rev has this effect something that comes to much higher then 150 + to something and they can have other Aoe effects like it.

All mesmer needs to do is run one utility to get boon share they can go all in to get many more but tempest needs to run a new line and an set wepon. Tempest needs to give up much more to have any type of boon sharing abitly.

There more then quickness and stab that a danger boon for this effect there resistances and once you start talking about this type of boon you start to removing playable from build times altogether.

The heat sync nerf is more of a symptom of an broken effect in the game rev +50% boon duration is the real problem.

Resistance cannot be shared to the degree you assume. Its base duration is too low. Builds that give larges amounts of aoe resistance are just as gutted dps wise as perma quickness. And a mesmer could only share perma resistance or perma alacrity. No one would go for the former.

Giving up a utility slot =/= giving up a weapon. Take elementalist for example. There are d/d, s/d, s/f, d/f, st builds. You are already forced to go offhand focus if you want its utility. The utility comes as a flavour of each weapon set, yes some sets are better for some instances than others, but you aren’t giving up something.

Now look any of the meta elementalist builds, they all run icebow, glyph of storms, and either signet of fire or lightning hammer. There was no way in the past that anyone would consider giving up any of those things for a signet of inspiration type utility.
It would be totally okay if they made it a utility for tempest, and you would have to decide which cantrip you didn’t take. People in this game are far more dependent on their utility skills than their weapons.

As for losing a traitline, mesmer has to invest in a traitline to make that utility skill have any worth, ele does not.

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

What i am talking about how boon sharing is going to be op due to rev +50% out going boon. It is the more op effect that anet is going to add to the game and its starting to brake other classes and builds. Heat sync is the first changes to make another class balanced and the gurd shout for quickness going on a longer cd is another balanced changes for another class.

Rev’s +50% to out going boons destroys the game in spvp and wvw it may even kill pve.

The ele would still give max stacks of fury with or without revenant. The guard quickness was on too high of a duration given its cd.

This was about elementalist’s ability to generate boons without investing into boon duration. By comparison mesmer boon generation is largely RNG, and requires heavy trait involvement.

What the revenant enables is for classes to maintain close to perma of boons they before incidentally gave off.

It won’t destroy the game in pvp, null field, conversions, malyx, steal, rip all exist. It won’t destroy it in wvw because its a 5 person aoe effect, and the effects of pvp apply their as well.

I don’t know if it will destroy pve. That remains to be seen.

Fury is not a hard boon to get it never realy has and now its everywhere . Its boon like quickness stab and resistance that are the danger boons. If these become too long lasting from effects like +50% boon duration to out going heals you will see many effects start to become very lope sided. So take frost bow and why they are drooping its dmg if you have a group of 3 ele you steam roll though most content making it trivial. When you have the powerful effects easy to get and last for a long time you see a lot of skill and “fun” leave the game. Even with the longer cd gurd with an mez / rev with the +50% out going boons can still get perma quickness my point for making the all in boon support build on mez.

Giving out +50% to all out going boons is too much and to make it work you must removing all boon sharing effects and push the base duration of all powerful boons very low. That was the ideal behind nerfing boon duration becuse things like stab where 100% up time. By adding in an class effect like this you have effectually destroy all balancing in the last 3 years.

It seems right now they are trying to balance arone the +50% out going boon its not going to work with out a lot of out right destroying classes tools. I have a strong feeling that this rev’s effect is going to comply mess up raids/pve, wvw and spvp.

Added note about boon counter play. The thing about this is not every class can do this its will stagier team builds all the more to deal with a very op effect. There also more ways to apply these boons then there are to remove them. Short duration was the only thing holding back the boon vs removing game play mostly even now with longer boon duration you will see boons win out (the counter for the counter of corruption of boons is simply condition removal and dodging there only one counter to boons and you cant make these boons miss the person applying them.)

Its all about costs. The perma quickness build guts the mesmers own dps in favour of group dps. Where as the guardian was giving quickness on a shorter cd than any other quickness skill in the game.

A signet of inspiration is either a utility slot or a trait line grandmaster or both. To add in more uses you add in another trait line or another utility slot.

Warhorn share took the skill and only required a traitline minor and a weapon. It was on a class that had a huge amount of boon generation.

Your argument is that revenant will make every boon perma, including the danger boons.

But that won’t work for stability, it won’t work for resistance. The only it will work for is quickness, and the only class that can give quickness perma is also the one with the lowest dps in pve. Currently to get to the level of ele dps a mesmer has to go full chrono alacrity/quickness sharing. Creating a ele, ele, ele, mesmer, revenant meta. But it isn’t even increasing mesmer dps, its increasing party dps to compensate for taking a mesmer.

As for countering boons it is quite simple. Mesmers can rip four every 2.34 seconds. Thiefs can steal at least one every five seconds. Revenants can rip 2 every nine seconds. And these were the boon rips that were tied to cooldowns. I can give of the list of cooldown boon removals, but they are too many. Suffice to say that necro and mesmer have enough boon hate that a simple dodge wouldn’t matter.

Yet rev the only class who has such a powerful effect its maybe the strongest effect in the game. Most AoE effects like this are on the level of 150 to an effect most of the time only in combat and only to very close by players and they tend to be only one per class. Rev has this effect something that comes to much higher then 150 + to something and they can have other Aoe effects like it.

All mesmer needs to do is run one utility to get boon share they can go all in to get many more but tempest needs to run a new line and an set wepon. Tempest needs to give up much more to have any type of boon sharing abitly.

There more then quickness and stab that a danger boon for this effect there resistances and once you start talking about this type of boon you start to removing playable from build times altogether.

The heat sync nerf is more of a symptom of an broken effect in the game rev +50% boon duration is the real problem.

Resistance cannot be shared to the degree you assume. Its base duration is too low. Builds that give larges amounts of aoe resistance are just as gutted dps wise as perma quickness. And a mesmer could only share perma resistance or perma alacrity. No one would go for the former.

Giving up a utility slot =/= giving up a weapon. Take elementalist for example. There are d/d, s/d, s/f, d/f, st builds. You are already forced to go offhand focus if you want its utility. The utility comes as a flavour of each weapon set, yes some sets are better for some instances than others, but you aren’t giving up something.

Now look any of the meta elementalist builds, they all run icebow, glyph of storms, and either signet of fire or lightning hammer. There was no way in the past that anyone would consider giving up any of those things for a signet of inspiration type utility.
It would be totally okay if they made it a utility for tempest, and you would have to decide which cantrip you didn’t take. People in this game are far more dependent on their utility skills than their weapons.

As for losing a traitline, mesmer has to invest in a traitline to make that utility skill have any worth, ele does not.

I think eng gives out the most resistances of 2 sec but its 3 sec with an rev and its 4.5 sec with a boon share effect the first time. That the thing the +50% duration with boon share keeps stacking up pushing the duration of an effect higher and higher each time. Boon share is strong but its the higher boon duration that becomes many times effective. As in each time boons are reapply the old boon is not removed it simply is added. So +50% boon duration to every one in the pt starts to be on the lines of +100% for 2 classes who have the same boons and or share boons. For a full pt set up it becomes + 250% boon duration.

For a class like ele / tempest a wepon is on the same level as an elite slot it may be more important then the build it self both armor type and line choose. One utility slot is nothing compared to what an wepon means to an ele this is due to each wepon covering at least 8 skills and the lack of abitly to swap though weapons.

Mez gives 3 sec of resistance so the combo is rev gurd mez. With the gurd rev+50% boon duration and mez boon share your looking at perma quickness. Mez resistance becomes 4.5 sec on glamer base line then it becomes 6.75 sec on the first boon share pushing it to 11 sec of resistance total. 11 sec is too long for an effect like resistance and it has nothing to do with ele and heat sync in that combo if any thing your better off running another mez who run the signet just to boon share bonce the effect back to the pt with out needing to give up a full build wepon type and over all play to the full support mez build like tempest needs to do to run a viable WH.

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Daniel Handler.4816:

Jski.6180:

Coldtart.4785:

Jski.6180:

This seems to happen a lot on the ele forms the lack of understanding any thing beyond one step combos.

Or they made a very accurate assessment that using 2 skills to give aoe stability on a 1 min cd is much weaker than using 1 skill to give aoe stability on a 24s cd, and since no one has ever considered stand your ground overpowered there’s no possible way that something much weaker than it could be overpowered, either.

If resistance and quickness are the things that supposedly make boon duplication op, why does it get nerfed on ele and not mesmer? Ele can’t generate either of those boons alone while mesmer has access to both and will be able to duplicate twice in a row with chronomancer, or 4 times in a row if it gives up its resistance access.

The full combo was 3 skills AoE into heat sink into Sand Squall all of this combo was done after getting stab from a gurd so you would end up with nearly 15 stacks of stab on a long duration and a very long protection effect.

Mez are also able to use that signet every time they make a phatomze too and the more boons they have on them self the longer the duration of there out going boons. So on a mez its a lot stronger of a trick.

Added note dose Chronophantasma work with the signet effect too if so then there is a lot of evidences that heat sync is NOTHING compared to what mez / cron can pull off with boon sharing.

Well if the problem isn’t vigor. Then it definitely isn’t quickness or resistance.
The issue then would be the might.
Mesmer, chrono or otherwise, has to invest heavily into ramping up 25 stacks of might to share. As does herald. So now you run into a situation where an ele can already blast 25 stacks of might for the party, but this time they can do it twice as easily, and they can increase the length of the intensity stacking boon.
It allowed you to stack might extremely easily. Adding more effects to it would be too much.

Why is it important for the mesmer to be sharing might? This is about having perma quickness and resistances and mesmer can do that in the right set up. Tempest to a point could but not as well as a mesmer.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vhAQNAseWnsnBtfilpBGoBEgiFij6cD2sPzMASgFquS/0QF-TVRPwAwUCWSJCQ9BAU/hkyLSBE4UL-w

Something like this set up for mez (though i am not great with the numbers for armor but mostly the trail line build for max boon sharing). With a rev elite spec class +50% out going boons effect and about 4 boons on the mez your boon share will be about 90% duration i think you could push it to 100%. But my point is heat sync is nothing compared to what mez can build for when it comes to “braking the games boon duration.” Even with out a rev elite spec class +50% mez can get very close to perma every boon type in the game.

So if we look at your spec we can see you took away the trees that have damage modifiers. The mesmer then has to put everything they can into uptime of these boons. Quality boon generation is something the mesmer has to spec for.

If we look at the food we see it is 29 silver a pop. If we look at the nourishment we see it is time gated.

An ele can be scepter warhorn. Spec fully into damage. And still do tooth + fire field + phoenix + arcane wave + arcane brilliance + heat sync + sand squal. Giving aoe 24 stacks of might for at least 20 seconds. Perma if the trait. You don’t have to waste traits, all you have to do is select a specific heal and a specific utility. And this is with no boon duration.

Now if you want to add in traits this combo now gives 1 minute 30 second of fury. As well as a lot of protection, while your dps does not take the hit the mesmer’s does.

What i am talking about how boon sharing is going to be op due to rev +50% out going boon. It is the more op effect that anet is going to add to the game and its starting to brake other classes and builds. Heat sync is the first changes to make another class balanced and the gurd shout for quickness going on a longer cd is another balanced changes for another class.

Rev’s +50% to out going boons destroys the game in spvp and wvw it may even kill pve.

The ele would still give max stacks of fury with or without revenant. The guard quickness was on too high of a duration given its cd.

This was about elementalist’s ability to generate boons without investing into boon duration. By comparison mesmer boon generation is largely RNG, and requires heavy trait involvement.

What the revenant enables is for classes to maintain close to perma of boons they before incidentally gave off.

It won’t destroy the game in pvp, null field, conversions, malyx, steal, rip all exist. It won’t destroy it in wvw because its a 5 person aoe effect, and the effects of pvp apply their as well.

I don’t know if it will destroy pve. That remains to be seen.

Fury is not a hard boon to get it never realy has and now its everywhere . Its boon like quickness stab and resistance that are the danger boons. If these become too long lasting from effects like +50% boon duration to out going heals you will see many effects start to become very lope sided. So take frost bow and why they are drooping its dmg if you have a group of 3 ele you steam roll though most content making it trivial. When you have the powerful effects easy to get and last for a long time you see a lot of skill and “fun” leave the game. Even with the longer cd gurd with an mez / rev with the +50% out going boons can still get perma quickness my point for making the all in boon support build on mez.

Giving out +50% to all out going boons is too much and to make it work you must removing all boon sharing effects and push the base duration of all powerful boons very low. That was the ideal behind nerfing boon duration becuse things like stab where 100% up time. By adding in an class effect like this you have effectually destroy all balancing in the last 3 years.

It seems right now they are trying to balance arone the +50% out going boon its not going to work with out a lot of out right destroying classes tools. I have a strong feeling that this rev’s effect is going to comply mess up raids/pve, wvw and spvp.

Added note about boon counter play. The thing about this is not every class can do this its will stagier team builds all the more to deal with a very op effect. There also more ways to apply these boons then there are to remove them. Short duration was the only thing holding back the boon vs removing game play mostly even now with longer boon duration you will see boons win out (the counter for the counter of corruption of boons is simply condition removal and dodging there only one counter to boons and you cant make these boons miss the person applying them.)

Its all about costs. The perma quickness build guts the mesmers own dps in favour of group dps. Where as the guardian was giving quickness on a shorter cd than any other quickness skill in the game.

A signet of inspiration is either a utility slot or a trait line grandmaster or both. To add in more uses you add in another trait line or another utility slot.

Warhorn share took the skill and only required a traitline minor and a weapon. It was on a class that had a huge amount of boon generation.

Your argument is that revenant will make every boon perma, including the danger boons.

But that won’t work for stability, it won’t work for resistance. The only it will work for is quickness, and the only class that can give quickness perma is also the one with the lowest dps in pve. Currently to get to the level of ele dps a mesmer has to go full chrono alacrity/quickness sharing. Creating a ele, ele, ele, mesmer, revenant meta. But it isn’t even increasing mesmer dps, its increasing party dps to compensate for taking a mesmer.

As for countering boons it is quite simple. Mesmers can rip four every 2.34 seconds. Thiefs can steal at least one every five seconds. Revenants can rip 2 every nine seconds. And these were the boon rips that were tied to cooldowns. I can give of the list of cooldown boon removals, but they are too many. Suffice to say that necro and mesmer have enough boon hate that a simple dodge wouldn’t matter.

Yet rev the only class who has such a powerful effect its maybe the strongest effect in the game. Most AoE effects like this are on the level of 150 to an effect most of the time only in combat and only to very close by players and they tend to be only one per class. Rev has this effect something that comes to much higher then 150 + to something and they can have other Aoe effects like it.

All mesmer needs to do is run one utility to get boon share they can go all in to get many more but tempest needs to run a new line and an set wepon. Tempest needs to give up much more to have any type of boon sharing abitly.

There more then quickness and stab that a danger boon for this effect there resistances and once you start talking about this type of boon you start to removing playable from build times altogether.

The heat sync nerf is more of a symptom of an broken effect in the game rev +50% boon duration is the real problem.

Resistance cannot be shared to the degree you assume. Its base duration is too low. Builds that give larges amounts of aoe resistance are just as gutted dps wise as perma quickness. And a mesmer could only share perma resistance or perma alacrity. No one would go for the former.

Giving up a utility slot =/= giving up a weapon. Take elementalist for example. There are d/d, s/d, s/f, d/f, st builds. You are already forced to go offhand focus if you want its utility. The utility comes as a flavour of each weapon set, yes some sets are better for some instances than others, but you aren’t giving up something.

Now look any of the meta elementalist builds, they all run icebow, glyph of storms, and either signet of fire or lightning hammer. There was no way in the past that anyone would consider giving up any of those things for a signet of inspiration type utility.
It would be totally okay if they made it a utility for tempest, and you would have to decide which cantrip you didn’t take. People in this game are far more dependent on their utility skills than their weapons.

As for losing a traitline, mesmer has to invest in a traitline to make that utility skill have any worth, ele does not.

I think eng gives out the most resistances of 2 sec but its 3 sec with an rev and its 4.5 sec with a boon share effect the first time. That the thing the +50% duration with boon share keeps stacking up pushing the duration of an effect higher and higher each time. Boon share is strong but its the higher boon duration that becomes many times effective. As in each time boons are reapply the old boon is not removed it simply is added. So +50% boon duration to every one in the pt starts to be on the lines of +100% for 2 classes who have the same boons and or share boons. For a full pt set up it becomes + 250% boon duration.

For a class like ele / tempest a wepon is on the same level as an elite slot it may be more important then the build it self both armor type and line choose. One utility slot is nothing compared to what an wepon means to an ele this is due to each wepon covering at least 8 skills and the lack of abitly to swap though weapons.

Mez gives 3 sec of resistance so the combo is rev gurd mez. With the gurd rev+50% boon duration and mez boon share your looking at perma quickness. Mez resistance becomes 4.5 sec on glamer base line then it becomes 6.75 sec on the first boon share pushing it to 11 sec of resistance total. 11 sec is too long for an effect like resistance and it has nothing to do with ele and heat sync in that combo if any thing your better off running another mez who run the signet just to boon share bonce the effect back to the pt with out needing to give up a full build wepon type and over all play to the full support mez build like tempest needs to do to run a viable WH.

I will agree to disagree. The patch notes are based on their data not on mine, so I will hold my tongue until HoT to see how OP what you describe is.

@ Daniel Handler.4816
Its op in the way that they removed a lot of boon duration from runes. Things like runes of water and of mnk use to give a lot more boon duration letting ppl stack it out with part sets. They removed early boon duration on these sets so you would be compeld to use a full 6 but they did not replaces the old boon duration on these sets even when you went a full 6.

Rev’s +50% boon duration for there pt is stronger then most lines rune set and food that ppl give up a lot to get to. In a way rev’s +50% is out right hart braking for any type of boon duration effect in the game. Look at it this way what dose a class need to use to get to at least +50% boon duration for just them self? Ele use to be the end all be all boon duration class but now its +15% from a full line +20 from food and +15 from a rune set. An ele and most other classes need a full rune set food and a build line just to match +50% boon duration for them self where rev just need one line and they give this effect to there full pt. How is that not an extremely op effect?

I’m okay with Warhorn being trash if Tempest is still viable (which it is not, of course). I’m willing to settle for that; that is how low my expectations for Tempest are at this point.

irrumatio.4893:

I’m okay with Warhorn being trash if Tempest is still viable (which it is not, of course). I’m willing to settle for that; that is how low my expectations for Tempest are at this point.

WH gives ele its other water field wepon and the true support off hand wepon that dagger or scepter eles have been lacking.
Heat sync should not share powerful boons like quickness or resistance but it should share every thing else. Though all boon share effect thous not effects these 2 boons in truth even boon duration should not effect them.