Guild Wars 2

guys hello.

i’m usually using S/F with 0/20/25/25/0.

but almost people in my guild, who have lv80 ele but dont see this forum,

said using s/f is almost trolling. because s/f is not good for dps.

but i dont think so. s/f build is good for might statking. and have some sort of

utility. constraint is fire 4 is difficult to control.

so what do you guys thinking about this topic.

for dps, s/d or s/f?

S/D is better for DPS. Gives you a better fire 4/5, better air 4/5, more blast finishers in earth (in addition to churning earth which is great DPS), and a heal in water.
The problem with focus is that the fire and water spells are plainly awful compared to offhand dagger, as is the knockdown in air, which leaves you with three skills that are really useful in the set. Some people can make it work, but it is agreed upon that focus is defensive for ele.

s/f is better for might-stacking than s/d. That’s a fact; you can find the optimal rotations for both s/d and s/f in my guide (link’s in my sig). I also made a vid of the s/f rotation, found in my guide.

As far as DPS goes, you’re only using s/f and s/d for might-stacking anyway, then you’re summoning the LH and AA’ing with it, so OH dagger and focus are only doing dmg in the initial might-stacking rotation. They do very nearly equal DPS during that rotation, but focus stacks more might, so use that.

S/d obviously does more damage but s/f is not bad at all. For pve if you are a good ele you would use all weapon sets depending on the type of instance and environment you are playing to help your team more.

S/F to stack might in a shorter period of time; also, the invuln, if chained into an Arcane Shield, gives you several seconds in which you can Lightning Hammer anything without fear of taking damage; Fire Aura if procced immediately after Phoenix but before the earth dodge combination attack will allow you to burn enemies and stack even more might while in the Invuln Lightning Hammer state.

When I’m in damage mode I use the Hammer anyway. When I’m not using the Hammer, I’m using the utility skills Water 3, Water 4, Water 5, Air 4, Air 5 and Earth 3. Fire 2,3,4 are reserved for initial mightstacking, Earth 4, 5 are reserved for initial mightstacking. If I had to drop my Lightning Hammer prematurely to save my party with Air 4, interrupt attacks with Water 5/Air 4, save myself with Earth 5 or to heal with Water 3, my backup DPS plan is Air 1 against groups (channel against the furthest target, it’ll pierce and damage all enemies on the way to it) with Air 2, and timing Air 3 for blinding the target before it attacks. If I have to drop the hammer against a single target (happens for CoEp1, after using Hammer 3), I’ll usually spend the remainder of the time cycling Shatterstone to vuln the target so the party members with less sad DPS on their autoattacks will do more damage.

The only situation so far in which I cannot use the Hammer at all is in the Molten Boss Fractal; I’ve attempted Invuln Hammering before, but it turns out it’s better to reserve the Invuln for cases where teammies fall/where you’re about to get killed, and just damage from range instead.

PvP/WvW is a different beast, but I can’t see any way in which a dungeon/fractal/world boss scepter ele can possibly be more efficient with the dagger offhand than with the focus offhand when Lightning Hammers will be your main source of damage anyway.

Now if we’re talking Dagger mainhand instead, I wouldn’t take a focus offhand – dual daggers do better for that type of build.

Anierna.6918:

s/f is better for might-stacking than s/d. That’s a fact; you can find the optimal rotations for both s/d and s/f in my guide (link’s in my sig). I also made a vid of the s/f rotation, found in my guide.

As far as DPS goes, you’re only using s/f and s/d for might-stacking anyway, then you’re summoning the LH and AA’ing with it, so OH dagger and focus are only doing dmg in the initial might-stacking rotation. They do very nearly equal DPS during that rotation, but focus stacks more might, so use that.

Could you perhaps explain shortly why you think s/f is better for might stacking compared to s/d ? Really don’t wanna go through that giant post of yours..

It gets the hammer out faster, though both have more or less equal might potential before the random ish effect of Fire Shield. The focus version also always works, whereas the dagger version is prone to interrupts.

Focus
-1s Dragon’s Tooth begins channel, Flamewall begins channel.
0s Flamewall procs, Dragon’s Tooth hits (3 might), Phoenix leaves caster.
1/4s Phoenix hits (3 might) Fire Shield activated (? might depending on enemy), dodge starts, attune to earth (3 might from sigil).
1.25s Dodge ends in Earth attunement (3 might), Magnetic wave hits (3 might), Arcane Wave hits (3 might), Begin channeling Lightning Hammer, Proc Invuln.
2.25s Lightning Hammer fully summoned.
5.25s Final Hit of the first Lightning Hammer combo (3 might).

Might Total: 21-25 might (depending on how many enemies hit you) in just over 5 seconds. 2.5+s grace period, exceeding which the Lightning Hammer’s 3rd hit of might will not proc.

Defensive: You are exposed for the initial one second until earth dodge starts. Thereafter, you’re covered by dodge, invuln, then the Blind from lightning hammer.

Dagger
-1s Dragon’s Tooth begins channel.
-1/4s Ring of Fire begins channel.
0s (Assuming perfect timing on your Ring of Fire) Ring of fire procs at the same time Dragon’s tooth hits (3 might). Phoenix leaves caster, dodge starts, attune to earth (3 might from sigil).
1/4s Phoenix hits (3 might).
1s Earth attune dodge hits (3 might), Arcane wave hits (3 might), begin Earthquake channel.
1.75s Earthquake hits (3 might). Begin Churning earth channel.
5s Churning earth hits (3 might).

Might Total: 21 might in five seconds, you have only one second margin of error or the Churning earth will not hit before the Ring of Fire fades. Also, because Earthquake has a 45 second cooldown, your second combo will only proc 18 might. Given Lightning Hammer is only useable every 60 seconds, you will hammer with 21 might half the time and hammer with 18 might half the time.

Defensive: You are exposed for the initial one second, covered by dodge for one second, then exposed for the next 4 seconds channeling interruptible skills, followed by one more interruptible second channelling your lightning hammer, then another 3 seconds until your first blind hits.

As for controlling Fire Wall, remember that it’s always cast at a 90 degree angle relative to the line between you and the cast point. Nowadays I use instacast, rather than the versions that show you where the AoE field is, because I’m familiar enough with how to position the Wall such that the Dragon Tooth never misses, after doing this for a very long time.

If you are hit 4 times at 1 second intervals after Fire Shield is activated, the Focus version is the only way in the game for one character to activate 25 might within 5.5 seconds. It also requires Arcane wave as a utility, together with Evasive Arcana.

In any case I find it strange your Arcana stat is zero if you’re intending to mightstack. Without sufficient boon duration, might stacks only last for 20 seconds by default, before dropping back to zero. This is in addition to the fact that you’re losing out on 3 stacks from Evasive Arcana, which also Cripples in the way Churning Earth does, without the channeling time.

At present, the build I’m running, at 190% BD, makes it last for 38, so I can comfortably run the might stack rotation every 30 seconds (cooldown limited by Arcane Wave) and be guaranteed permanent 25 might. Do that twice, 60 seconds have elapsed, by which the next set of lightning hammer summons is available to keep this going infinitely.

Not that I was talking to you, but if you were replying to my question, I was kinda hoping for a short answer.. a bunch of numbers combined with skills makes it very complicated and confusing.

Tl;dr: flamewall lasts longer than ring of fire, and the blasts from focus channel faster. This means your LH AA gets more rounds off while the fire field is up, which means more total might.

Bsgapollo.5364:

Not that I was talking to you, but if you were replying to my question, I was kinda hoping for a short answer.. a bunch of numbers combined with skills makes it very complicated and confusing.

While I didn’t read the text wall myself, it’s kind of rude to ask for help and then not read something that someone took time to post.

S/F is beter for might stacking if you want to know why then get your glasses out.