Guild Wars 2

This is not a whine thread, I actualy agree with the nerfs to the elementalist class. Yes we were overpowered and still are at top level in 1vs1 combat. My problem atm is that the most joyful part of my Gaming experience has been taken from me. I love to solo roam, and take or defend a camp solo, fight with thiefs and mesmers who are on the map and even take a 2vs1 fight on. But with the new changes I am not able to run from a zerg. I have just been chased by about 6 people over half the map. from East camp to west, all along with me a freaking ranger bear pet keeping me in combat and a thief crippling me with his teleportation bow.
I do not understand the argumentation that the thief should be the most mobile class when they allready have stealth. they have the 2 best get away cards, while the only one we had has been taken from us.
Is solo roaming reserved for thiefs now?
Honestly nerf my healing, nerf my burning dmg and fire grab, nerf protection and condition removal, but pls do not take away a whole aspect of a game by not letting us choose the fights we want to pick.

My biggest problem was you were able to pick and chose the fights that you wanted so easily.

Slot Lightning Flash. Trait Cantrip Mastery. Trait One with Air.

Your roaming is fine, just don’t get to roam for free any longer.

Is gone? Been gone in t1 with zerg balls the only thing you see.

SilencingMachine.5049:

Is gone? Been gone in t1 with zerg balls the only thing you see.

I’m on Blackgate so you get a +1 for speaking truth. JQ and SoR have so much coverage that solo roaming is always a challenge. That being said so does my home server. You can still roam though just watch out for zergs.

Thyophelis.8035:

This is not a whine thread, I actualy agree with the nerfs to the elementalist class. Yes we were overpowered and still are at top level in 1vs1 combat. My problem atm is that the most joyful part of my Gaming experience has been taken from me. I love to solo roam, and take or defend a camp solo, fight with thiefs and mesmers who are on the map and even take a 2vs1 fight on. But with the new changes I am not able to run from a zerg. I have just been chased by about 6 people over half the map. from East camp to west, all along with me a freaking ranger bear pet keeping me in combat and a thief crippling me with his teleportation bow.
I do not understand the argumentation that the thief should be the most mobile class when they allready have stealth. they have the 2 best get away cards, while the only one we had has been taken from us.
Is solo roaming reserved for thiefs now?
Honestly nerf my healing, nerf my burning dmg and fire grab, nerf protection and condition removal, but pls do not take away a whole aspect of a game by not letting us choose the fights we want to pick.

Idk my ranger vs a good d/d ele was fun and equal. and they are not OP just has well mobility which was helping he/she to keep fighting. But the thief is pretty crazy with its major damage capability. Had one doing 13k damage in 1-3 seconds, talk about ragging.

Thyophelis.8035:

But with the new changes I am not able to run from a zerg. I have just been chased by about 6 people over half the map. from East camp to west, all along with me a freaking ranger bear pet keeping me in combat and a thief crippling me with his teleportation bow.

Thieves and Rangers are among the best chasers in the game. That you managed to last 1v6 for a chase that took over half a map to end tells me the Ele is still pretty good at escaping… and that you needed to have headed for a tower more directly.

Thyophelis.8035:

I do not understand the argumentation that the thief should be the most mobile class when they allready have stealth. they have the 2 best get away cards, while the only one we had has been taken from us.

The only one? Eles have LOTS of escapes. RtL (40 seconds is indeed a lot, possibly excessive, but it’s still there), Cantrips, Burning Speed and Magnetic Grasp (just cast it on a monster), pop Glyph of Elementals in Air/Water/Earth for some extra CC to help you escape, or pop Conjure Fiery Greatsword for a 900-unit dash on a 5 second (!!!) cooldown and a second 900-unit dash on a 10 second cooldown.

Of course, even in Staff or S/F you’re not exactly going to have the hardest time getting away. Staff has low-cast-time AoEs that chill, cripple, and stun, a speed boost that cures movement-impairing CC, instant-cast projectile reflection, and even a backwards dash in there. Scepter’s our least mobile weapon though even then you have a bit of condition removal and a few buffs to make you a bit tankier. Focus has a targeted chill, knockdown, and AoE daze, then more projectile reflection (that cripples in an AoE and cures conditions) and an immunity to damage spell.

And finally, the Elementalist is the only profession in the game that can enter a tower after downing. As long as you don’t get immobilized right as you fall, you can just press F2 and laugh all the way to safety. (Honestly, changing Vapor Form to our F2 has always struck me as hilariously overpowered so I wouldn’t be surprised to see it moved back to F3 at some point after Grasping Earth is made less hilariously pointless. In the meantime, we can enjoy diving into the middle of a besieging zerg and still making it to the tower even if we don’t build for slipperiness.)

So no, Eles are still pretty darn good at getting away. If you were relying on RtL and ONLY RtL, take this as an opportunity to explore everything else the profession has.

Ilthuain.5634:

Slot Lightning Flash. Trait Cantrip Mastery. Trait One with Air.

Your roaming is fine, just don’t get to roam for free any longer.

The fact that you suggeted One With Air, which doesn’t stack with any other movespeed bonuses (such as swiftness) shows that you have a lot to learn about the class before you start pandering advice to others.

Ilthuain.5634:

Slot Lightning Flash. Trait Cantrip Mastery. Trait One with Air.

Your roaming is fine, just don’t get to roam for free any longer.

One with air? haha.

Is necro a good roaming profession when it slots signet of the locust?

Or are you suggesting that the 900 range lightning flash on a 36s cooldown is what sets it over the top? 36s traited at that, 45s base.

Funny stuff.

Ilthuain.5634:

Slot Lightning Flash. Trait Cantrip Mastery. Trait One with Air.

Your roaming is fine, just don’t get to roam for free any longer.

Can you please elaborate more on the One with Air part? I’m curious about how a 25% (max) MS increase that effectively does nothing because it gets overridden by Swiftness (33%) anyways, will enhance my roaming capabilities? How this affects me in any way other than wasting a Trait is beyond my comprehension. Enlighten me please.

I’m not sure OP gets away with 2 rtl’s in 40 secs any more than 1. In my experience without immediate and significant separation when ele first decides to run for it, you’re not getting away. Eles certainly can still roam in wvw, but its not like that ever was safe.

Minion of Vey.4398:

Ilthuain.5634:

Slot Lightning Flash. Trait Cantrip Mastery. Trait One with Air.

Your roaming is fine, just don’t get to roam for free any longer.

One with air? haha.

Is necro a good roaming profession when it slots signet of the locust?

Or are you suggesting that the 900 range lightning flash on a 36s cooldown is what sets it over the top? 36s traited at that, 45s base.

Funny stuff.

Wow you people are spoiled… I roam with my Mesmer with 32 seconds CD traited Blink which also ports 900 range, Mass Invisibility and around 40% Swiftness uptime and I am a happy kitten with that.

And here comes some Ele and says that it is horrible… lol… Just shows how good they had it before…

Get down to earth people!

I solo roam with my necromancer.

Like Gaidax said, you guys were spoiled. You can still escape pretty easily most fight.

And I’m still dying behind with my necromancer.

Kardiamond.6952:

I solo roam with my necromancer.

Like Gaidax said, you guys were spoiled. You can still escape pretty easily most fight.

And I’m still dying behind with my necromancer.

Profession with 8k less base hps than necro gets around faster, news at 11.

…but still gets around slower than warriors, heh.

Gaidax.7835:

Wow you people are spoiled… I roam with my Mesmer with 32 seconds CD traited Blink which also ports 900 range, Mass Invisibility and around 40% Swiftness uptime and I am a happy kitten with that.

And here comes some Ele and says that it is horrible… lol… Just shows how good they had it before…

Get down to earth people!

It’s incredibly easy to roam w/ mesmer — I do it all the time. That’s because you have ready access to stealth which, when combined with blink, let’s you disengage and exit combat for a quick WP back to base. Not to mention that both blink and decoy act as stunbreakers. If that’s not enough, you can pop your 90-second CD elite that gives you even more invis. Of course you don’t have problems roaming with your mesmer — I don’t have problems roaming with mine, either.
ps You can also get 100% uptime on stealth with centaur or air runes (although you’ll need +duration buffs if you’re using air runes).

In contrast, Ele doesn’t have the luxury of stealth (unless you’re in water). Disengaging as an ele is purely a matter of speed.

As to necro, yeah roaming w/ Necro is not easy. I concede they have it harder. Although they do have ready access to fears which cause their chasers to run in the opposite direction at max speed. They also can drop chill + cripple fields behind them the whole time b/c they are AOE-targeted skills. A staff ele can do the same thing, but the staff ele has no access to fear. But again, necro is definitely not an ideal roamer. However, a good necro can put out way more AOE dps in a zerg fight than a zerker staff ele.

Gaidax.7835:

Wow you people are spoiled… I roam with my Mesmer with 32 seconds CD traited Blink which also ports 900 range, Mass Invisibility and around 40% Swiftness uptime and I am a happy kitten with that.

And here comes some Ele and says that it is horrible… lol… Just shows how good they had it before…

Get down to earth people!

Right, because everyone forgot that Eles have inherent survivability from illusions, invisibility, distortion, etc. Oh wait, you’re saying Eles don’t have any of that and relied entirely on speed for survival and to disengage and now we don’t have even that anymore?

Huh. Well that seems totally illogical. I guess the Ele is supposed to camp keeps and just Meteor Shower the occasional Rabbit.

Thank you very much for your advices. I play the ele since release and have some tricks in my bags. Yes we are spoiled and that s why we were in the top three roamers. You can get away even as a guardian if the enemy doesn t persist to chase you, but if he persists you wont get away, that s why you see 0.2% of the solo roaming population beeing necros and guards. This is what saddens me, we have had a whole aspect of the game removed and the left over roaming classes will be the ones with access to stealth. Closest tower would have been spawntower and i chose the water route in hope they would give up, and actualy got quite some distance between me and my attackers. exept well, the bloody bear… but honestly running always to the nearest tower is not what i understand under a roaming class.

Thyophelis.8035:

Thank you very much for your advices. I play the ele since release and have some tricks in my bags. Yes we are spoiled and that s why we were in the top three roamers. You can get away even as a guardian if the enemy doesn t persist to chase you, but if he persists you wont get away, that s why you see 0.2% of the solo roaming population beeing necros and guards. This is what saddens me, we have had a whole aspect of the game removed and the left over roaming classes will be the ones with access to stealth. Closest tower would have been spawntower and i chose the water route in hope they would give up, and actualy got quite some distance between me and my attackers. exept well, the bloody bear… but honestly running always to the nearest tower is not what i understand under a roaming class.

If you hit a rabbit when you use RTL you do not have to wait 40 seconds…
yay! However that will probably get nerfed in the next patch, it’s too overpowered.

Xillllix.3485:

Thyophelis.8035:

Thank you very much for your advices. I play the ele since release and have some tricks in my bags. Yes we are spoiled and that s why we were in the top three roamers. You can get away even as a guardian if the enemy doesn t persist to chase you, but if he persists you wont get away, that s why you see 0.2% of the solo roaming population beeing necros and guards. This is what saddens me, we have had a whole aspect of the game removed and the left over roaming classes will be the ones with access to stealth. Closest tower would have been spawntower and i chose the water route in hope they would give up, and actualy got quite some distance between me and my attackers. exept well, the bloody bear… but honestly running always to the nearest tower is not what i understand under a roaming class.

If you hit a rabbit when you use RTL you do not have to wait 40 seconds…
yay! However that will probably get nerfed in the next patch, it’s too overpowered.

“When an elementalist kills a rabbit, a champion risen is summoned that agros and has a 2500 range immobilize with 5s duration. 2s cooldown”

Minion of Vey.4398:

Xillllix.3485:

Thyophelis.8035:

Thank you very much for your advices. I play the ele since release and have some tricks in my bags. Yes we are spoiled and that s why we were in the top three roamers. You can get away even as a guardian if the enemy doesn t persist to chase you, but if he persists you wont get away, that s why you see 0.2% of the solo roaming population beeing necros and guards. This is what saddens me, we have had a whole aspect of the game removed and the left over roaming classes will be the ones with access to stealth. Closest tower would have been spawntower and i chose the water route in hope they would give up, and actualy got quite some distance between me and my attackers. exept well, the bloody bear… but honestly running always to the nearest tower is not what i understand under a roaming class.

If you hit a rabbit when you use RTL you do not have to wait 40 seconds…
yay! However that will probably get nerfed in the next patch, it’s too overpowered.

“When an elementalist kills a rabbit, a champion risen is summoned that agros and has a 2500 range immobilize with 5s duration. 2s cooldown”

lol that won’t be enough for the Crying out "OP’ babies.

But guys, all roaming isn’t dead. Just stick to the border-lands and we can roam in the water!! Our best wvw role is dropping static field, water fields, and collecting pearls for quaggans! We do have good water mobility (maybe the best with Water 5, cam flip+water 3, air 3, signet of air+stealth), so if they ever make a water map or something that causes water fights to matter, we can roam for a few months before getting nerfed there too! /sarcasm

Just want to vent via qq, like everyone here. I logged on, hopped on havoc duty on my d/d ele. Usually we roam with 3 thiefs and 2 d/d eles. Never had a problem keeping up with the thieves in the past, and I wanted to see how bad it would be. After 15 minutes, of constantly falling behind and being an overall hindrence, I got off havoc duty and rejoined the main guild group, holding my head in shame and lamenting being relegated back into 30 v whatever fights. I shouldn’t be forced to roll a thief to roam. The early days of getting insta gibbed by backstab/heartseeker spam built up too much hate in my heart. Come on ANET, give some love back the eles direction. I mean even if we could get away from anyone its not like we could drop 13k damage in 3 seconds after coming out of stealth, and still run away.. cough

drtoph.4857:

Just want to vent via qq, like everyone here. I logged on, hopped on havoc duty on my d/d ele. Usually we roam with 3 thiefs and 2 d/d eles. Never had a problem keeping up with the thieves in the past, and I wanted to see how bad it would be. After 15 minutes, of constantly falling behind and being an overall hindrence, I got off havoc duty and rejoined the main guild group, holding my head in shame and lamenting being relegated back into 30 v whatever fights. I shouldn’t be forced to roll a thief to roam. The early days of getting insta gibbed by backstab/heartseeker spam built up too much hate in my heart. Come on ANET, give some love back the eles direction. I mean even if we could get away from anyone its not like we could drop 13k damage in 3 seconds after coming out of stealth, and still run away.. cough

Lol yeah I had a thief doing that to me yesterday on my ranger. Man I was raging so hard. Is was so stupidly funny.

Wait must’ve been you….. :P

Gaidax.7835:

Minion of Vey.4398:

Ilthuain.5634:

Slot Lightning Flash. Trait Cantrip Mastery. Trait One with Air.

Your roaming is fine, just don’t get to roam for free any longer.

One with air? haha.

Is necro a good roaming profession when it slots signet of the locust?

Or are you suggesting that the 900 range lightning flash on a 36s cooldown is what sets it over the top? 36s traited at that, 45s base.

Funny stuff.

Wow you people are spoiled… I roam with my Mesmer with 32 seconds CD traited Blink which also ports 900 range, Mass Invisibility and around 40% Swiftness uptime and I am a happy kitten with that.

And here comes some Ele and says that it is horrible… lol… Just shows how good they had it before…

Get down to earth people!

As another mesmer who tries to keep up with eles, necros with signets, rangers, and thieves, I agree. ;-) I still roam, I still attack camps, and I’m still effective.

I would kill for a 25% passive speed boost, but that’s just not good enough, it seems. You need to have 100% swiftness AND a get out of jail free card on a 20 second cooldown or else you’re COMPLETELY USELESS OMG THE MOST GARBAGEBAG PROFESSION ANET HATES US.

Ilthuain.5634:

Gaidax.7835:

Minion of Vey.4398:

Ilthuain.5634:

Slot Lightning Flash. Trait Cantrip Mastery. Trait One with Air.

Your roaming is fine, just don’t get to roam for free any longer.

One with air? haha.

Is necro a good roaming profession when it slots signet of the locust?

Or are you suggesting that the 900 range lightning flash on a 36s cooldown is what sets it over the top? 36s traited at that, 45s base.

Funny stuff.

Wow you people are spoiled… I roam with my Mesmer with 32 seconds CD traited Blink which also ports 900 range, Mass Invisibility and around 40% Swiftness uptime and I am a happy kitten with that.

And here comes some Ele and says that it is horrible… lol… Just shows how good they had it before…

Get down to earth people!

As another mesmer who tries to keep up with eles, necros with signets, rangers, and thieves, I agree. ;-) I still roam, I still attack camps, and I’m still effective.

I would kill for a 25% passive speed boost, but that’s just not good enough, it seems. You need to have 100% swiftness AND a get out of jail free card on a 20 second cooldown or else you’re COMPLETELY USELESS OMG THE MOST GARBAGEBAG PROFESSION ANET HATES US.

Mesmer has easy access to stealth and blinks. That is a pretty big “get out of jail free” card. They’re also on low cooldowns (~30s w/ just the minor trait). This compensates for the mesmer being slightly slower, although you can still maintain 100% uptime on mesmer so you don’t need a 25% ms signet.

ResJudicator.7916:

This compensates for the mesmer being slightly slower, although you can still maintain 100% uptime on mesmer

How, praytell? Don’t say Runes of the Centaur.

Blaine Tog.8304:

ResJudicator.7916:

This compensates for the mesmer being slightly slower, although you can still maintain 100% uptime on mesmer

How, praytell? Don’t say Runes of the Centaur.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Rune_of_the_Air
runes of air? with focus? but not its 100 percent

Ilthuain.5634:

As another mesmer who tries to keep up with eles, necros with signets, rangers, and thieves, I agree. ;-) I still roam, I still attack camps, and I’m still effective.

I would kill for a 25% passive speed boost, but that’s just not good enough, it seems. You need to have 100% swiftness AND a get out of jail free card on a 20 second cooldown or else you’re COMPLETELY USELESS OMG THE MOST GARBAGEBAG PROFESSION ANET HATES US.

How do people like you NOT understand the concept that nearly every other class but Elementalist has some form of active or passive defense as part of their features? And that the Ele’s sole form of “oh s***” skill was just nerfed into uselessness.

A mesmer has on demand clones, invisibility, distortion, etc. You know what an Ele HAD? ONE skill that was the longest range single movement skill. Usually used to extend and escape from a bad situation.

Are you REALLY going to claim that you’d give up all the benefits the Mesmer has (illusions, shatters, invisibility, distortion, etc.) for a single movement skill? Because that’s what Eles have to deal with by default.

Kaleban.9834:

How do people like you NOT understand the concept that nearly every other class but Elementalist has some form of active or passive defense as part of their features? And that the Ele’s sole form of “oh s***” skill was just nerfed into uselessness.

Ride the Lightning was NOT our only get-out-of-jail-free card, not by a long shot. We have a whole utility line just for that as well (Cantrips), in addition to many more mobility options. I listed them above, so I’d rather not repost.

As for RtL, to be honest, I actually like the range nerf. It makes the skill feel more in control, better for tight maneuvering. You don’t have to worry so much about overshooting. 1200 units is still pretty darn good, too. The cooldown nerf is silly but far more manageable than you’re making it out to be.

Kaleban.9834:

Ilthuain.5634:

As another mesmer who tries to keep up with eles, necros with signets, rangers, and thieves, I agree. ;-) I still roam, I still attack camps, and I’m still effective.

I would kill for a 25% passive speed boost, but that’s just not good enough, it seems. You need to have 100% swiftness AND a get out of jail free card on a 20 second cooldown or else you’re COMPLETELY USELESS OMG THE MOST GARBAGEBAG PROFESSION ANET HATES US.

How do people like you NOT understand the concept that nearly every other class but Elementalist has some form of active or passive defense as part of their features? And that the Ele’s sole form of “oh s***” skill was just nerfed into uselessness.

A mesmer has on demand clones, invisibility, distortion, etc. You know what an Ele HAD? ONE skill that was the longest range single movement skill. Usually used to extend and escape from a bad situation.

Are you REALLY going to claim that you’d give up all the benefits the Mesmer has (illusions, shatters, invisibility, distortion, etc.) for a single movement skill? Because that’s what Eles have to deal with by default.

RTL was your only “OH kitten” card?
confused face I must’ve been playing another class.

Yeah I’m confused, d/d eles have A LOT more than just RTL to escape without even considering other utility slots, such as:
-Frozen burst (get away by slowing your enemies down heavily!)
-Frost Aura (reduce incoming damage AND heavily slow down anyone who still can hit you!)
-Shock Aura (thief catching up to you? Stun his kitten!)
-Updraft (thief still keeping up? blow him him away and stack on more swiftness thieves have little access to!)
-Ring of Earth (thief STILL catching up to you? give him one last cripple!)
-Magnetic Grasp (use it to immobilize that darn infinite initiative thief OR leap to a passive mob!)

On my engi I use EVERYTHING I want to escape. I can’t escape zergs, sure, but I could definitely get away from 3~ chaining cripple fields, gear shield, and swiftness without fast, long distance movement.

ResJudicator.7916:

Ilthuain.5634:

Gaidax.7835:

Minion of Vey.4398:

Ilthuain.5634:

Slot Lightning Flash. Trait Cantrip Mastery. Trait One with Air.

Your roaming is fine, just don’t get to roam for free any longer.

One with air? haha.

Is necro a good roaming profession when it slots signet of the locust?

Or are you suggesting that the 900 range lightning flash on a 36s cooldown is what sets it over the top? 36s traited at that, 45s base.

Funny stuff.

Wow you people are spoiled… I roam with my Mesmer with 32 seconds CD traited Blink which also ports 900 range, Mass Invisibility and around 40% Swiftness uptime and I am a happy kitten with that.

And here comes some Ele and says that it is horrible… lol… Just shows how good they had it before…

Get down to earth people!

As another mesmer who tries to keep up with eles, necros with signets, rangers, and thieves, I agree. ;-) I still roam, I still attack camps, and I’m still effective.

I would kill for a 25% passive speed boost, but that’s just not good enough, it seems. You need to have 100% swiftness AND a get out of jail free card on a 20 second cooldown or else you’re COMPLETELY USELESS OMG THE MOST GARBAGEBAG PROFESSION ANET HATES US.

Mesmer has easy access to stealth and blinks. That is a pretty big “get out of jail free” card. They’re also on low cooldowns (~30s w/ just the minor trait). This compensates for the mesmer being slightly slower, although you can still maintain 100% uptime on mesmer so you don’t need a 25% ms signet.

Sure we have IF we bring no utilities to WvW and run with Focus.

But the point I’m trying to get across is very simple – a lot of professions and specs (like my case) roam just fine and do that with not that much escape tools or mobility.

I roam – I have 1 32 sec cd Blink, 1 90 seconds cd 5 seconds duration invisibility and 6 seconds of swiftness on 15 seconds cd (heal).

And I’m fine! Can I run away from one guy? Probably yeah, I can drag this long enough to get to the keep. Can I catch a guy? Probably yeah, but not sure if he won’t drag this on long enough to get to his keep.

Can I run away from a couple of guys? Not really, unless I juke real good and they don’t pay attention.

Do I wear heavy armor and have warrior’s healh? Nope, light armor and about 2-3k more HP than Ele. Do I have invulnerabilities? Yeah, but one roots me and another needs illusions up to function and then is 3 seconds tops for me on 60 sec cd.

I think I do fine roaming and I have less mobility than Eles.

====

You tell me – “you can gear, trait and equip certain utilities to get more escape options!” I agree… But then I ponder, if you, Elementalist, want more escape options, then is it unfair to ask YOU to gear/trait/equip for that?

That’s why we have hard time relating to your “plight”, you are basically telling us to spec and gear for escape options, while you are somehow entitled to get that for free because you are Eles?

You lost me there, can’t sympathize with you, guys.

I’m still solo roaming perfectly fine with my ele, FGS and pots of poison helps a tons, try it.

4 seconds invulnerability….+ another on a 5-7 seconds CD.
DAZE
absurd DPS
and your invulnerability is also the fact that your target has to kill phantasm fast if he doesn t want to die, while evading clones because they crit for 10.000+

Not to mention the ability of changing position fast and lot of mini stealth abilities that makes your opponents lose target.

With mesme ryou can run away as much as you want……
Just blink, decoy and focus 4 gives you miles advantage.

I have a mesmer too is 100% better and now faster than elementalist.

But don t pretend again that D/D was broken in www is OFFICIALLY misinformation spread by some bad thieves players…..
In fact it hit berserker PvE players most than anything….

When they will put mesmer f1 skill on a 40 sec CD and remove blurred from sw1 you will understand what this patch did to ele.

LordByron.8369:

With mesme ryou can run away as much as you want……
Just blink, decoy and focus 4 gives you miles advantage.

I have a mesmer too is 100% better and now faster than elementalist.

My point exactly – IF I bring Focus and bring 2 utility skills just for escaping – then I will be better at it…

So, pray tell… Why your Elementalist can’t bring 2 utility skills for that? For example Lightning Flash comes to mind… It’s pretty much the same as Blink you can trait it for less cd TOO like the Mesmer does.

===

LordByron.8369:

4 seconds invulnerability….+ another on a 5-7 seconds CD.
DAZE
absurd DPS
and your invulnerability is also the fact that your target has to kill phantasm fast if he doesn t want to die, while evading clones because they crit for 10.000+

Dude, exxagerate more? 4 seconds invulnerability = 30 trait points in Illusions + destroy 3 illusions.

Clones critting for 10k+? Are you high? I am running Phantasm Mesmer with full exotic gear and the total best crit I seen in WvW on the glassiest of the glass dude is 6k with iSwordsman (which I do not use) and it is much less with iZerker (around 3k) or iDuelist (4k). And you can’t really have that and 30 points in Illusions too, by the way.

Blurred Frenzy invulnerability is on 8 seconds CD at best… It’s CD is 10 seconds untraited, which is what I have. It also roots, by the way – so much for escape.

Really, I don’t like calling people names, but you are simply a flat out liar, man. You play as mesmer? Riiight…

And heck even then, what you said to me – spec and gear for stuff! So pray tell… Why should not Elementalist do that too?

LordByron.8369:

But don t pretend again that D/D was broken in www

Where did he say D/D Ele was broken?

Gaidax.7835:

And I’m fine! Can I run away from one guy? Probably yeah, I can drag this long enough to get to the keep. Can I catch a guy? Probably yeah, but not sure if he won’t drag this on long enough to get to his keep.

Can I run away from a couple of guys? Not really, unless I juke real good and they don’t pay attention.

Well, I guess there’s different definitions of effective roaming then. Regardless of class, when 10 enemies appear nearby, and – given enough time to react properly – I have no chance of escaping them, I’m not effectively roaming by my standards.

Side note: You’re claiming Mesmers are only decent roamers when speccing for it, while Eles seem to get everything for free. You do realise roaming D/D Eles did HEAVILY spec for exactly that? Running 3 utilities that all can be used to escape, and getting yourself locked into the only weapon set (remember, no weapon swap for Eles) that offers the needed mobility but is exclusively melee range is ‘getting everything for free’? Really? I mean, I don’t like calling people names, but… ah, whatever.

makku.2508:

Side note: You’re claiming Mesmers are only decent roamers when speccing for it, while Eles seem to get everything for free. You do realise roaming D/D Eles did HEAVILY spec for exactly that?

People run D/D because it’s difficult to kill in a fight while still offering decent damage and control. That you become insanely difficult to chase and have an easy time roaming is a side effect.

To put it differently, you want Lightning Flash on your bar anyway because it breaks stun and lets you land Churning Earth, you want Mist Form on your bar anyway because it gives you guaranteed stomps (and lets you dodge any big attacks your opponent might throw in a duel), and you want Swiftness gain on attuning to Air because Elemental Attunement is just generally too good a trait to pass up. Even if the off-hand dagger lacked RtL entirely, it would still be a hard weapon to pass on thanks to the CC and damage from Earth 4 and 5, the damage from Fire 5, the Fire field from Fire 4 (good for might stacking), the Frost aura from Water 4, the heal and condition removal from Water 5, and Air 5 for breaking stomps and other channels. It’s a great weapon all-around.

makku.2508:

Gaidax.7835:

And I’m fine! Can I run away from one guy? Probably yeah, I can drag this long enough to get to the keep. Can I catch a guy? Probably yeah, but not sure if he won’t drag this on long enough to get to his keep.

Can I run away from a couple of guys? Not really, unless I juke real good and they don’t pay attention.

Well, I guess there’s different definitions of effective roaming then. Regardless of class, when 10 enemies appear nearby, and – given enough time to react properly – I have no chance of escaping them, I’m not effectively roaming by my standards.

Side note: You’re claiming Mesmers are only decent roamers when speccing for it, while Eles seem to get everything for free. You do realise roaming D/D Eles did HEAVILY spec for exactly that? Running 3 utilities that all can be used to escape, and getting yourself locked into the only weapon set (remember, no weapon swap for Eles) that offers the needed mobility but is exclusively melee range is ‘getting everything for free’? Really? I mean, I don’t like calling people names, but… ah, whatever.

And with all that somehow a change to Ride the Lightning brought you on your knees? Must have been a pretty overpowered ability then if it was all that held your kitten together, eh?

Mist Form and Lightning Flash are suddenly useless? Want more? Take Fiery GS and whirl around ftw…

====

Don’t you think you are overreacting? So, WvW solo roaming is gone just like that? Yu gotta be kittenting me.

You think that being able to run away from 10 people is a “standard for effective roaming”? Dude… really… just stop?

I feel safer roaming on my phantasm mesmer than my D/D ele. Between blink/decoy/veil/mass invis and clones confusing bads i get away np. 40 sec RTL on the other hand…. they catch up eventually and kill me.

Puandro.3245:

I feel safer roaming on my phantasm mesmer than my D/D ele. Between blink/decoy/veil/mass invis and clones confusing bads i get away np. 40 sec RTL on the other hand…. they catch up eventually and kill me.

TBH, i’d drop Veil here and take Null Field or even Arcane Thievery instead (it really got better by the way – always works), just to not get totally hammered by conditions. Removing 1 condition every 15/20 seconds just does not cut it really.

Gaidax.7835:

makku.2508:

Gaidax.7835:

And I’m fine! Can I run away from one guy? Probably yeah, I can drag this long enough to get to the keep. Can I catch a guy? Probably yeah, but not sure if he won’t drag this on long enough to get to his keep.

Can I run away from a couple of guys? Not really, unless I juke real good and they don’t pay attention.

Well, I guess there’s different definitions of effective roaming then. Regardless of class, when 10 enemies appear nearby, and – given enough time to react properly – I have no chance of escaping them, I’m not effectively roaming by my standards.

Side note: You’re claiming Mesmers are only decent roamers when speccing for it, while Eles seem to get everything for free. You do realise roaming D/D Eles did HEAVILY spec for exactly that? Running 3 utilities that all can be used to escape, and getting yourself locked into the only weapon set (remember, no weapon swap for Eles) that offers the needed mobility but is exclusively melee range is ‘getting everything for free’? Really? I mean, I don’t like calling people names, but… ah, whatever.

And with all that somehow a change to Ride the Lightning brought you on your knees? Must have been a pretty overpowered ability then if it was all that held your kitten together, eh?

Mist Form and Lightning Flash are suddenly useless? Want more? Take Fiery GS and whirl around ftw…

====

Don’t you think you are overreacting? So, WvW solo roaming is gone just like that? Yu gotta be kittenting me.

You think that being able to run away from 10 people is a “standard for effective roaming”? Dude… really… just stop?

Are you really that dumb? One of the key aspects of roaming is mobility. That’s what RTL provided. They took it away → they killed roaming. Everything else still works like it did before (except for Mist Form obviously, lol), doesn’t matter tho because they took away one of the KEY ASPECTS. Is it really that hard to understand? Do you have a driver’s licence? Own a car? If I took the motor away from your car, would it still work? No? WHAT KIND OF NOOB CAR IS THAT, I MEAN, IT STILL HAS WHEELS, BRAKES AND FUEL, DOESN’T IT?!

And yeah, getting away from 10 people (even 50, for that matter) while not being in combat yet is one of my standards for effective roaming (Newsflash: there’s even classes that manage to pull such stuff while IN combat). But again, standards vary. A garbage player might be glad to barely get away from a single opponent on his ‘roaming’ build. I have different standards.

Gaidax.7835:

Puandro.3245:

I feel safer roaming on my phantasm mesmer than my D/D ele. Between blink/decoy/veil/mass invis and clones confusing bads i get away np. 40 sec RTL on the other hand…. they catch up eventually and kill me.

TBH, i’d drop Veil here and take Null Field or even Arcane Thievery instead (it really got better by the way – always works), just to not get totally hammered by conditions. Removing 1 condition every 15/20 seconds just does not cut it really.

I use veil to stomp and to avoid damage AND to run from zergs. I really don’t suffer from condis, not even from the condi engis running 100% duration. Fight don’t last long anyways phantasm damage is sooo OP right now, #1 1v1 class atm.

makku.2508:

Gaidax.7835:

makku.2508:

Gaidax.7835:

And I’m fine! Can I run away from one guy? Probably yeah, I can drag this long enough to get to the keep. Can I catch a guy? Probably yeah, but not sure if he won’t drag this on long enough to get to his keep.

Can I run away from a couple of guys? Not really, unless I juke real good and they don’t pay attention.

Well, I guess there’s different definitions of effective roaming then. Regardless of class, when 10 enemies appear nearby, and – given enough time to react properly – I have no chance of escaping them, I’m not effectively roaming by my standards.

Side note: You’re claiming Mesmers are only decent roamers when speccing for it, while Eles seem to get everything for free. You do realise roaming D/D Eles did HEAVILY spec for exactly that? Running 3 utilities that all can be used to escape, and getting yourself locked into the only weapon set (remember, no weapon swap for Eles) that offers the needed mobility but is exclusively melee range is ‘getting everything for free’? Really? I mean, I don’t like calling people names, but… ah, whatever.

And with all that somehow a change to Ride the Lightning brought you on your knees? Must have been a pretty overpowered ability then if it was all that held your kitten together, eh?

Mist Form and Lightning Flash are suddenly useless? Want more? Take Fiery GS and whirl around ftw…

====

Don’t you think you are overreacting? So, WvW solo roaming is gone just like that? Yu gotta be kittenting me.

You think that being able to run away from 10 people is a “standard for effective roaming”? Dude… really… just stop?

Are you really that dumb? One of the key aspects of roaming is mobility. That’s what RTL provided. They took it away -> they killed roaming. Everything else still works like it did before (except for Mist Form obviously, lol), doesn’t matter tho because they took away one of the KEY ASPECTS. Is it really that hard to understand? Do you have a driver’s licence? Own a car? If I took the motor away from your car, would it still work? No? WHAT KIND OF NOOB CAR IS THAT, I MEAN, IT STILL HAS WHEELS, BRAKES AND FUEL, DOESN’T IT?!

And yeah, getting away from 10 people (even 50, for that matter) while not being in combat yet is one of my standards for effective roaming (Newsflash: there’s even classes that manage to pull such stuff while IN combat). But again, standards vary. A garbage player might be glad to barely get away from a single opponent on his ‘roaming’ build. I have different standards.

So basically you want to tell me that having less CD on one ability made all the difference for you in being able to run away from 10 people or not?

What you basically say is your whole build did not matter – only this one weapon ability?

I think you need to lower your “standards” a bit down to earth… you know, just to where all the other 95% of the guys in WvW are. If just that change is what turned your escaping from the “pro” quality to “garbage player” quality, then maybe you are not really that pro, but were instead carried by that ability?

Cry more.

Gaidax.7835:

Dude, exxagerate more? 4 seconds invulnerability = 30 trait points in Illusions + destroy 3 illusions.

So?
everybody uses those.
And spamming illusion with a mesmer is not difficult…i have an almost costant stream of shatters as most players.

Clones critting for 10k+? Are you high? I am running Phantasm Mesmer with full exotic gear and the total best crit I seen in WvW on the glassiest of the glass dude is 6k with iSwordsman (which I do not use) and it is much less with iZerker (around 3k) or iDuelist (4k). And you can’t really have that and 30 points in Illusions too, by the way.

F1 and it hits for way more than 10.000 not to mention that i izerker wasn t bugged it would hit for much more (and still does just its unreliable).

Blurred Frenzy invulnerability is on 8 seconds CD at best… It’s CD is 10 seconds untraited, which is what I have. It also roots, by the way – so much for escape.

8 seconds ok forgive me….i tend to deal with 40 seconds CD….so sometimes i find 3 seconds really few….

Really, I don’t like calling people names, but you are simply a flat out liar, man. You play as mesmer? Riiight…

Yes i play a shatter mesmer (and is my main since months) and seems i know it way more than you….and i consider myself an average mesmer player.

I m really angry because in order to understand professions i focused on 2….
They basically cut off 50% of the game from me.

And heck even then, what you said to me – spec and gear for stuff! So pray tell… Why should not Elementalist do that too?

because elementalist already was traited/geared for that…
30 arcana? mandatory
10 wind? same….
20 water again ……

you are left with 10 points
Then you can play a zerker ONLY if you have mobility because you don t have any other surviving mechanic and your damage is horribly low….
Now you can ONLY BUNKER……and bunkers are bad in www unless you are a commander.

But seems you know mesmers like you know elementalists.

@gaindax

Woohoo! Glorious… I’m totally having a blast farming Eles in WvW now. I met a couple and they are much weaker now really.

The dude I met 1 on 1 20 mins ago had no chance to escape ever with his RTL being on 40s cd.

Now Eles can’t run away from my Mesmer anymore. Awesome

Don’t be sad guys – just reroll Mesmers – we got 900 range instant teleport on 32 sec cd. Sure, we are the next on the chopping block, but hey, you will have fun for 2 months at least

/kiss

you are a troll …..

Gaidax.7835:

makku.2508:

Gaidax.7835:

makku.2508:

Gaidax.7835:

And I’m fine! Can I run away from one guy? Probably yeah, I can drag this long enough to get to the keep. Can I catch a guy? Probably yeah, but not sure if he won’t drag this on long enough to get to his keep.

Can I run away from a couple of guys? Not really, unless I juke real good and they don’t pay attention.

Well, I guess there’s different definitions of effective roaming then. Regardless of class, when 10 enemies appear nearby, and – given enough time to react properly – I have no chance of escaping them, I’m not effectively roaming by my standards.

Side note: You’re claiming Mesmers are only decent roamers when speccing for it, while Eles seem to get everything for free. You do realise roaming D/D Eles did HEAVILY spec for exactly that? Running 3 utilities that all can be used to escape, and getting yourself locked into the only weapon set (remember, no weapon swap for Eles) that offers the needed mobility but is exclusively melee range is ‘getting everything for free’? Really? I mean, I don’t like calling people names, but… ah, whatever.

And with all that somehow a change to Ride the Lightning brought you on your knees? Must have been a pretty overpowered ability then if it was all that held your kitten together, eh?

Mist Form and Lightning Flash are suddenly useless? Want more? Take Fiery GS and whirl around ftw…

====

Don’t you think you are overreacting? So, WvW solo roaming is gone just like that? Yu gotta be kittenting me.

You think that being able to run away from 10 people is a “standard for effective roaming”? Dude… really… just stop?

Are you really that dumb? One of the key aspects of roaming is mobility. That’s what RTL provided. They took it away -> they killed roaming. Everything else still works like it did before (except for Mist Form obviously, lol), doesn’t matter tho because they took away one of the KEY ASPECTS. Is it really that hard to understand? Do you have a driver’s licence? Own a car? If I took the motor away from your car, would it still work? No? WHAT KIND OF NOOB CAR IS THAT, I MEAN, IT STILL HAS WHEELS, BRAKES AND FUEL, DOESN’T IT?!

And yeah, getting away from 10 people (even 50, for that matter) while not being in combat yet is one of my standards for effective roaming (Newsflash: there’s even classes that manage to pull such stuff while IN combat). But again, standards vary. A garbage player might be glad to barely get away from a single opponent on his ‘roaming’ build. I have different standards.

So basically you want to tell me that having less CD on one ability made all the difference for you in being able to run away from 10 people or not?

What you basically say is your whole build did not matter – only this weapon one ability?

I think you need to lower your “standards” a bit down to earth… you know, just to where all the other 95% of the guys in WvW are. If just that change is what turned your escaping from the “pro” quality to “garbage player” quality, then maybe you are not really that pro, but were instead carried by that ability?

Cry more.

And here I am, thinking that car example would even make an ape understand it.

I’ll vary it a little: If I took away the wheels from your car but left the motor in, would it work? No? If I gave you back the motor and the wheels, but took the fuel out, would it still work? No? Something’s ringing yet? Of course the other parts of the build do matter. There’s stability, damage reduction, invulnerability, condition removal. All stuff you need to reliably escape tricky situations. All that stuff doesn’t matter tho without mobility (or stealth, but last time I checked Eles didn’t have access to that). RTL was the thing that provided the mobility. Just like wheels on your car get that whole thing rolling. And yes, twice the CD + a 20% range reduction (for some reason people always seem to forget about that one) make all the difference.

And no, I don’t need to lower my standards. When I am better than 95% of the other guys in WvW, then I can afford to have higher standards than 95% of the other guys. Makes sense to me.

People need to stop opening their threads with comments like “This is not a whine thread”…or similar, when the reason for the thread and the contents of the post clearly contradict it.

Reading these ele complaint threads is only making my face hurt more and more. I have an ele, and I barely…if at all, felt any effect of the changes. I direly hope ANet does NOT cater to the BAD players who are still crying over the changes, as it will only put eles back to where they were (completely and utterly unbalanced).

The idea that you expect to run away from a group of 6 players simply because you’re playing an ele is a JOKE. Get real! Do NOT engage if you can’t handle it. If you get zerged, do NOT cry about it. That’s what WvW is. Now you feel what other classes have been feeling for months. Welcome to a somewhat BALANCED ele.

This patch was a step in the right direction from ANet, and I sincerely hope they do NOT cater to BAD players like some of you.

I swear…if I could spam “shut up and learn to play” on every single thread that’s popped up complaining about the changes to ele post update, and get away with it…I would.

@LordByron

No dear, I am not a troll, because before the RtL change, Eles would just lol at me in WvW and not because they killed me or something, but because I had snowball’s chance in hell to catch them with 20 sec CD RtL.

I for one am overjoyed with RtL nerf, because now I can score rightful kills on Eles, that before could have gone away no matter how bad they were. The good ones still can kite me all the way to their keep and that’s fine, IMO. It’s just that now they have to actually try hard to shake me off.

Of course I’m kitten happy – me and frikkin half of the WvW players that don’t get to be trolled by Eles anymore.

And I am not a Shatter Mesmer – I’m Phantasm one.

Kurow.6973:

The idea that you expect to run away from a group of 6 players simply because you’re playing an ele is a JOKE.

So why are Thieves allowed to do it? Why are Warriors allowed to do it? Why are Rangers allowed to do it? Why were Elementalists allowed to do it and now aren’t?

I wanted a character that was able to roam solo in WvW. In the end, there were 2 reasons I decided to roll an Elementalist for that:

1) Was the most fun to play for me
2) Thieves were (are) beyond broken due to stealth and initiative mechanics and I excpected them to get nerfed into Oblivion so I thought I’d be better off sticking with a GW1 core class as they wouldn’t destroy such an iconic class as hard (ye, silly me,kittenck my life)

8 month later, the devs are now tellling me I’m not allowed to roam anymore. How’s that fair? I’m the last to complain about reasonable balance changes, but when they strip an entire aspect of my class, especially the one that made me create that character in the first place, then I’m up in arms.

Gaidax.7835:

@LordByron

No dear, I am not a troll, because before the RtL change, Eles would just lol at me in WvW and not because they killed me or something, but because I had snowball’s chance in hell to catch them with 20 sec CD RtL.

Learn to play and equip a focus…..
Seems good mesmer have not that issue.

Also tell me how easily you can catch a thief……or a tanky ranger or a warrior that wants to escape..

Ele was already the third or ourth profession for speed…now is one of the slowest without anything in Exchange…

And that was not because you couldn t kill an ele but because a selfish pvp balance team don t think of pve/WWW consequences….

if you read pvp forums you’d know that…its not MY opinion.
And that tells a lot of self entitled pros in this thread