Guild Wars 2

Engineer

Elixir B: This skill’s toolbelt skill now accurately reflects only one boon being applied to allied targets.

Mine Field: This skill’s recharge has been reduced to 20 seconds.

Throw Mine: This skill is now unblockable when it detonates.
—————-
Nothing major but a relatively decent buff to the Mine Gadget is more than welcome – ty devs!

Obviously many issues still left but let’s try and be positive with the love the devs have been showing to our beloved class so far.

Glad mine field got its cooldown rebalanced in consideration of it’s previous blast finisher removal. Looks like the mine in general was looked at.

Again no weapon stats on Kits it is pathetic

So many bugs, so many borked skills.

And this is all they did. Kinda disapointing…

Engineer is basically the Paladin from Vanilla WoW.

None of the devs play it so they just don’t care how broken it is :P

@Cheyenne

LOL i beg to differ, Guardian is like Paladin, Anet is nerfing the class to the ground so that they can on build on it years later… Every patch has a major nerf bat, Guardians are getting abused and kitten #8230;

At least Engineer seems to be getting improvements albiet small and slowly…

People will always find something to complain about. Even I have been guilty of this.

However, the fact is that every post launch patch has had some sort of bug fix and/or buff for Engineers. We have not received a single nerf so far – the only exception being the debatable change for the Flamethrower Juggernaut Trait, and even that wasn’t really a nerf but more of a change of direction for the Kit from a defensive one to an offensive one.

Considering that I would hardly say that the devs aren’t paying attention to our class – seems more like the exact opposite of that.

Edit: To clarify – yes there are still plenty of issues that fellow Engineers would love to get fixed but they can’t be fixed overnight so let’s stay positive considering the fixes/buffs we have received so far.

Venoma.7052:

People will always find something to complain about. Even I have been guilty of this.

However, the fact is that every post launch patch has had some sort of bug fix and/or buff for Engineers. We have not received a single nerf so far – the only exception being the debatable change for the Flamethrower Juggernaut Trait, and even that wasn’t really a nerf but more of a change of direction for the Kit from a defensive one to an offensive one.

Considering that I would hardly say that the devs aren’t paying attention to our class – seems more like the exact opposite of that.

Edit: To clarify – yes there are still plenty of issues that fellow Engineers would love to get fixed but they can’t be fixed overnight so let’s stay positive considering the fixes/buffs we have received so far.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=-lgOKf-Hqnw#t=83s

that is my response to this post

Well considering Elementalists had their downed state buffed a lot, we now officially have THE worst downed state.

Free spikes on Engis for all!

I would appreciate dev input if we are even going to get sigil / stats on our kits.

I respect all the opinions,u can dislike the game.
I MUST respect Anet work,because it’s their JOB,not only their game,so they have some priority.
I can also agree that first to fix traits to make the class work better,it’s important to recover the aspects that can make an engineer OP or broken in a certain sense.

But i must agree also on the “wtf” aspect.
We have some kind of bugs that disable our MAIN resources and provide disages with turrets,kits both not scaling with our stats ;traits semiworking ; a continue “miss” of certanin skills(watch rifle net,or flamethrower skill’s) , and for sure we have some of the cooldowns and turrets mechanics to be reviewed and reworked.

I can’t cry like a child because we still don’t get some love,but i’m a unhappy.
I apologize for my english.
Regards.

OMG three minor fixes!, the rest of the classes had a big fix, and us 3 minor fixes. I was waiting for this patch 2 weeks since it was announced and now this…GJ anet.

Yes, we’d all like to see stats and sigils applied to kits, but I don’t think they need to stop work on ALL other issues until that one item is resolved.

They didn’t even bother to fix Might from Toss Elixir B only lasting 10s instead of 30 even though they clarified the tooltip.

What a joke.

They also said they put the horn hat thingy back on the gem store… it’s not there.

I like how they’ve fixed tons of bugs with other classes…but for Engineer, they only rebalanced Throw Mine and Mine Field, and fixed an inaccurate tooltip.

At this point, I’m pretty much only logging on to download patches so that, if they ever bother to fix the things I actually use, I won’t have to download patches for days, and then signing off, because this is just absolutely stupid.

I’ve been patient, or tried to; I submitted a bug report about the issues with the things I use probably within the first week of the game being out for public release, but I knew there were more significant issues in need of correction. Now, here we are, getting out first bit of expansion-esque DLC for Halloween, and they still haven’t stopped rebalancing instead of bugfixing.

I guess I should just be glad they fixed that tooltip, but compared to the things that just straight-up do not function properly…I can’t bring myself to care.

I’m not sure you guys understand how running an MMO works. Unfortunately you can’t fix everything all at once, it takes time. The kit issues, garbage traits, garbage skills, and bugs are annoying, but you need to remember that for every profession they have these outstanding issues yet to fix. It’s not going to be done in a day, a week, or even a month.

I’m sure you think it’s just a simple numbers change, but quite frankly it isn’t. Every single change on those patch notes consumes much more time then you realize. Meetings, testing, problem solving, analysis, collaboration, coding, more testing, theory, and even more testing. I’m sure they are aware of many of the bugs you are are all worried about, but bugs in particular are the hardest of things to squash. You have to fix it without breaking anything else, and that requires an incredible amount of testing that I don’t think a non-programmer would understand.

Short and sweet, it’s evident they are working on it. The Engineer isn’t the only profession with problems. Things will get fixed, but every patch won’t fix “everything”. Just have some patience, which needs to be on the order of many multiples of months. Actually, I think the best advice would be to not even wait for patches. Play what is here, if you don’t like it move on.

Generally there are a few undocumented changes. Anyone notice any yet for this patch?

Example, when the game went live:
Explosive shot in pve/wvw scaled at .37. In spvp, it listed a .324 scaling,(though actually was dealing .37 damage) And had a .75s attack speed.

Oct 1 patch.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Update-Notes-1-October-2012/first#post357683
Zero mention of any changes to explosive shot.
However,
Explosive shot was changed to .324 scaling both in spvp and pve/wvw, with the tooltip reflecting this as well.
.75s attack speed

Oct 11, or 16th.
Not sure when exactly this occurred. I wasn’t using pistols anymore after the nerf.
But CURRENT explosive shot is:
.324 scaling, .5s attack speed.

I actually do not think it’s funny we got so little bug fixes. Wepaid for this game, they ask me to be patient but WE are the customers not they.
We demand them to fix things, but they don’t. They do not have any right to ask us to be patient.

Work harder!

At least we have some kitteny Halloween event.

Ayestes.1273:

I’m not sure you guys understand how running an MMO works. Unfortunately you can’t fix everything all at once, it takes time. The kit issues, garbage traits, garbage skills, and bugs are annoying, but you need to remember that for every profession they have these outstanding issues yet to fix. It’s not going to be done in a day, a week, or even a month.

I’m sure you think it’s just a simple numbers change, but quite frankly it isn’t. Every single change on those patch notes consumes much more time then you realize. Meetings, testing, problem solving, analysis, collaboration, coding, more testing, theory, and even more testing. I’m sure they are aware of many of the bugs you are are all worried about, but bugs in particular are the hardest of things to squash. You have to fix it without breaking anything else, and that requires an incredible amount of testing that I don’t think a non-programmer would understand.

Short and sweet, it’s evident they are working on it. The Engineer isn’t the only profession with problems. Things will get fixed, but every patch won’t fix “everything”. Just have some patience, which needs to be on the order of many multiples of months. Actually, I think the best advice would be to not even wait for patches. Play what is here, if you don’t like it move on.

I completely understand it takes time, that a patch does not fixes everything.
If you buy something tou want it to be good, you want it to be finished, I paid 60 euros.

Those 60 euros give me right to complain, it does not give arena net the right to ask us to be patient. We are the customers not they.

its been two months, that’s my only problem. I just want to use the traits that should have been available at lanuch

Rather surprised they didn’t do anything to our terrible downed state, because it’s utterly useless.

but if not for us no one would get their 50 monthly kills

No, Necromancer downstate is worse, one interrupt for 1 second. Engineers still have 2.
Not to mention Necromancers get 2 bug fixes(w nerfs) on top of finding 4-10 more bugs after each patch. Anet is really dropping the ball on these bug fixes. I like necromancer and engi, but since engi has less bugs i play my engi.

Ferum Flamebender.5910:

I completely understand it takes time, that a patch does not fixes everything.
If you buy something tou want it to be good, you want it to be finished, I paid 60 euros.

Those 60 euros give me right to complain, it does not give arena net the right to ask us to be patient. We are the customers not they.

It’s a little bit of entitlement here though. 60 dollars does not buy a bug-free and finished MMO. It never has. Traditionally it’s been many hundreds of dollars in accumulated subscription fees that bring about a much more bug-free experience with refined content. This is the most finished and playable MMO I’ve ever played at launch (Aion, WoW, SWTOR, Tabula Rasa, and WAR), and honestly when I login and play I enjoy myself greatly.

In regards to the Engineer, I swapped through every profession recently while picking something for PvP. The Engineer is by far from being in the worst boat. We have multiple competitive builds and plenty of subtle variations that are more then viable. We are on the top end of viability for PvE and sPvP. I’m not entirely sure with WvW, but I’d imagine we are well enough off. Are there broken things? Heck yeah, just like with all professions. Is this out of the ordinary? No, not in regards to other professions nor is it out of the ordinary for MMOs in general. Context matters, especially in a game that is as large as an MMO.

I mean, to me the game is playable right now. More then playable, in fact it’s very enjoyable. I trust that they will eventually fix things that frustrate me as well. I mean don’t get me wrong, I wish they could get it right the first time, but historically and via my own experience as a software engineer, that is impossible. In general, I think there is a lot of exaggeration on these forums combined with a lack of understanding.

In response to Frogjon; I don’t know what I’m talking about? Every single thing I said was true. Thieves, Guardians, Rangers even Eles have had round after round of nerfs. Some pretty significant ones too I should add.

Name one nerf, apart from the unconfirmed hidden change to Pistols someone listed, that we have gotten?

Yes we have buggy traits – you seriously think we’re the only ones?
Yes we have mechanics that we’d like fixed (sigils on kits) – once again, not the only profession with those. You should check out hunter pets sometime.

This was a Halloween PVE content patch. If you expected a massive bug fixing patch than you’re either new to MMOs or a hopeless optimist.

@Venoma,

What about the fact that mines didn’t do blast finishers anymore, even though it noted it on the tooltip?

As for bugginess, I’d have to say that our comprehensive lists placed side by side are much longer than the other classes (Save probably necromancer)

Engineers simply have not received much attention throughout all the patches, results wise.

Venoma.7052:

In response to Frogjon; I don’t know what I’m talking about? Every single thing I said was true. Thieves, Guardians, Rangers even Eles have had round after round of nerfs. Some pretty significant ones too I should add.

Name one nerf, apart from the unconfirmed hidden change to Pistols someone listed, that we have gotten?

Yes we have buggy traits – you seriously think we’re the only ones?
Yes we have mechanics that we’d like fixed (sigils on kits) – once again, not the only profession with those. You should check out hunter pets sometime.

This was a Halloween PVE content patch. If you expected a massive bug fixing patch than you’re either new to MMOs or a hopeless optimist.

Yea, Ele here, and its true that some classes such as the Ele got massive sweeping nerfs that demolished the classes effectiveness on every front. They nerfed the class so bad that they are now going back and buffing the class because they realized now on hindsight that they overnerfed the heck out of it. Hows that for game balancing? That sound like a company that has a clue about how game balancing works to you?

However, using that as justification for Anet releasing an entirely unfinished and buggy as heck class is kind of like someone purposely and intentionally breaking your arm and then telling you its your fault. Not saying you would believe that, but defending a company for releasing a badly bugged game is kind of like Helsinki Syndrome. Insane people do that. Rational people expect better, and Anet can do better. So stop trying to make excuses for them. Instead, demand that they come here on these forums and explain themselves instead of hiding behind people that think they have a clue posting clueless garbage about how things work in MMO development circles. Yeah right. Give us all a break here and get over your kitten ego.

Also, I see several people above posting as if they are Anet devs or GW2 game designers. Let me tell you something. You know NOTHING about these things. Nothing. Stop trying to act as if you do because unless you are one of the GW2 game designers, your just talking out your butt.

With the changes that ANet has been making, i should probably remake my engineer to be a dark skinned scottish man with an eyepatch.
ANet just really wants us to be demomen rather than engineers.

All this whining must be a generational thing. GW2 is basically still a brand new game as far as MMO’s go. Does anyone actually remember what vanilla WoW was like? How long it took for them to fix major class bugs and exploits.

This game is barely out and yes it has alot of bugs and glitches but it is far from unplayable. The flamethrower is probally one of the glitchy’es weapons(kit) in the game with the flame blast getting blocked by just about everything and the constant miss miss miss miss miss, But its not unplayable I still run around in PvE and WvW with my trusty FT and I can make do just fine.

And not to mention this is a pretty huge holiday event tht they seem to have put alot of time and effort into, adding a good deal of extra content and fun after the game has only been out for a month and some change. Alot of the stuff is gimmicky but its still pretty substantial compared to other holiday releases. Once again a certain other game simply had you run around to vendors to “trick or treat” or the oh so “fun” darkgoon faire.

Just be patient the fixes will come in due time and when they do they will just open up the door for brand new bugs and exploits for everyone to complain about.

Ronin.5038:

With the changes that ANet has been making, i should probably remake my engineer to be a dark skinned scottish man with an eyepatch.
ANet just really wants us to be demomen rather than engineers.

Can we…..can we get this as an option? I would play through all of the story missions and dungeons again If my charr engineer had a deep scottish accent. A kilt would be cool too.

Engineers did not get many fixes because they are doing okay in all areas of the game right now. It’s a simple principle of fix what’s broken the worst. Engis are definitely not OP but they are doing decently well in PvE, WvW, and tPvP. That’s not true of every profession.

Yes, there are still a ton of bugs but they’re not preventing the profession from being viable.

Edit: in response to questions about nerfs: the flamethrower losing stability was a huge nerf as far as tournament PvP goes, I think the biggest nerf any profession has gotten. But it was absolutely necessary. Every tournament team would have three engineers if permanent stability was still available.

CriSPeH.8512:

GW2 is basically still a brand new game as far as MMO’s go. Does anyone actually remember what vanilla WoW was like? How long it took for them to fix major class bugs and exploits.

This game is barely out and yes it has alot of bugs and glitches but it is far from unplayable. The flamethrower is probally one of the glitchy’es weapons(kit) in the game with the flame blast getting blocked by just about everything and the constant miss miss miss miss miss, But its not unplayable I still run around in PvE and WvW with my trusty FT and I can make do just fine.

Mmmk. Why are you making excuses for Anet and apparently Blizzard too? As if you actually agree that you should get a broken, buggy product after paying for it…

You presupposing that all MMO’s must follow in Blizzards footsteps from what?.. 7 years ago?.. As if somehow this behavior is OK?..

Its NOT OK. You keep on with that apology tour of yours though if you think thats actually working for you. Maybe if you try hard enough Blizzard or Anet will shower you with cash from above LOL!

Half the problem is folks have been conned for so long now and by so many gaming companies that push crapware out the door that you actually think that this is some kind of standard. Well I got some news. Its never good to push a crap product out the door and expect to make any kind of profit on it except for this industry which has got its sheeple so brainwashed into believing that this is actually normal.

But back on topic. Engy’s got a bone thrown their way. Be happy with that. There is likely to be many more. PS.. There is nothing wrong with FT. It works great for me both in PvE and PvP. Never seen a miss yet from any of the targets I point it at.

boozer.7815:

CriSPeH.8512:

GW2 is basically still a brand new game as far as MMO’s go. Does anyone actually remember what vanilla WoW was like? How long it took for them to fix major class bugs and exploits.

This game is barely out and yes it has alot of bugs and glitches but it is far from unplayable. The flamethrower is probally one of the glitchy’es weapons(kit) in the game with the flame blast getting blocked by just about everything and the constant miss miss miss miss miss, But its not unplayable I still run around in PvE and WvW with my trusty FT and I can make do just fine.

Mmmk. Why are you making excuses for Anet and apparently Blizzard too? As if you actually agree that you should get a broken, buggy product after paying for it…

You presupposing that all MMO’s must follow in Blizzards footsteps from what?.. 7 years ago?.. As if somehow this behavior is OK?..

Its NOT OK. You keep on with that apology tour of yours though if you think thats actually working for you. Maybe if you try hard enough Blizzard or Anet will shower you with cash from above LOL!

Maybe you should stop feeling like an entitled little child who expects everything to be perfect. Are you trying say that you did not get your moneys worth from the game?
That your experience is so broken that you have wasted the one time payment you made to play GW2?

If thats the case then welcome to the club of everyone whos ever bought a game that turned out to suck for them. Just be thankful tht Anet might get around to fixing whatever your grief is and unless you buy gems they are doing it for free.

Your problem is you seem to think that before games had patches they were made perfect without any faults. And if you think that GW2 is crap the way it is now then there will be no patch or fix to make it better for you.

CriSPeH.8512:

Maybe you should stop feeling like an entitled little child who expects everything to be perfect. Are you trying say that you did not get your moneys worth from the game?
That your experience is so broken that you have wasted the one time payment you made to play GW2?

Your accusing me of acting childish? When you post a statement like that?..

You are very confused.

For my part I do not “feel entitled” to anything except for what I payed for with the money I earned. I think anyone should feel entitled to get what they payed for. It makes little sense to pay for something that is buggy (your words, not mine – “This game is barely out and yes it has alot of bugs and glitches”) and then defend that company for the privilege of getting something broken and buggy, as you are doing.

Now, unless your an Anet Dev, I see little reason for why you are trying to make excuses for them. Do you think they cant do that for themselves? Do you feel some sense of obligation to come to their rescue whenever someone questions their ethical standards? I doubt they even care, so why do you?

Neka.2403:

OMG three minor fixes!, the rest of the classes had a big fix, and us 3 minor fixes. I was waiting for this patch 2 weeks since it was announced and now this…GJ anet.

bare in mind the ranger wasn’t even mentioned in the patch notes

My point Boozer, is I have yet to play any game that did not have its share of bugs and glitches. I am just happy that at least this game fixes them from time to time. As oppossed to the days when you just got what you paid for.

I wasn’t making excuses because any statement from me holds as much weight as a statement from you, which is none. I was just commenting on the fact that for an MMO GW2 is actually pretty solid for being out for only a month or so and in that time they have made some fixes and released a not to shabby holiday pack. I think this is pretty nice for a game I dont have to have a subscription to play.

Maybe you should start a company so you can release the very first MMO that works perfectly with no bugs, glitches and flaws. Then maybe Anet would care about what YOU have to say.

Or do you just bash everyone who is happy with what they bought just because you are not. little lonely and miserable are we!

Having played the Engineer since early September 2011 during closed Beta, I can honestly say it has received a huge amount of changes, buffs and fixes. Noteably to its kits, turrets and weapon skills. I would consider that the Engineer is in a good place at the moment and in comparison to other professions, needs far less attention.

Sure no weapon stats on kits need less attention, it is a huge disadvantage to other classes! i lose 128 Toughness 128 Vit 180 Strentgh, 5% Crit, 60% chance on bleeding, 90 Def and you will tell me this needs less attention?

Haralin.1473:

Sure no weapon stats on kits need less attention, it is a huge disadvantage to other classes! i lose 128 Toughness 128 Vit 180 Strentgh, 5% Crit, 60% chance on bleeding, 90 Def and you will tell me this needs less attention?

The statistical loss on kits is an annoyance, yes but you also don’t have to use kits. If you do use kits and you honestly cannot compete with that statistical loss, then you are doing something seriously wrong. There isn’t a single profession I cannot demolish as an Engineer.

There are inevitably things I’d like to see with the Engineer, but to state that they can’t compete or aren’t powerful simply isn’t true.

Didnt say they cannot compete you must read closer.

Haralin.1473:

Didnt say they cannot compete you must read closer.

You’re insinuating that through their statistical loss on kits, they’re at a disadvantage.

Yes disadvantage means not they cannot compete, but if we have the stats the fight against other classes is more “fair”, now the engi need to do more than other classes.

I play engi since beta and i seem not so skilled like you cause i can not demolish all classes in 1vs1 if they are played good.

Venoma.7052:

In response to Frogjon; I don’t know what I’m talking about? Every single thing I said was true. Thieves, Guardians, Rangers even Eles have had round after round of nerfs. Some pretty significant ones too I should add.

Name one nerf, apart from the unconfirmed hidden change to Pistols someone listed, that we have gotten?

Yes we have buggy traits – you seriously think we’re the only ones?
Yes we have mechanics that we’d like fixed (sigils on kits) – once again, not the only profession with those. You should check out hunter pets sometime.

This was a Halloween PVE content patch. If you expected a massive bug fixing patch than you’re either new to MMOs or a hopeless optimist.

Ok lets start
Nerfs

mines
pistols
bombkit
grenades
elite underwater
flame-thrower
toolkit

My problem is, the traits that are bugged seem to be the bests.

dear diary,

a new patch has been released. I still suck if i dont use grenades.

I actually feel very disappointed for the number of bugs we still have, don’t rly care about the number of builds viable since most guys sayin “oh grenades are god” are just playin pve (c’mon in pvp they are hella hard to use and you’d be so easily countered…).

I’d rather see some freakin fixes, say… flamethrower? we don’t have much on weapon choice simply because we have kits already, the thing is… there’s a weapon almost entirely broken!

Before buffing and nerfing I’d rather see skills AND traits to actually fully work.

So to sum it up:
1st-bugs (especially the flamethrower and turrets)
2nd-nerfs/buffs + descriptions

Even thought I wouldn’t say there’s any nerf coming, just why are people complainin about grenades? to make’em viable we have to use up 30sp which is HUGE not to mention they’d only be truly viable in dungeon bosses and WvW.

boozer.7815:

For my part I do not “feel entitled” to anything except for what I payed for with the money I earned. I think anyone should feel entitled to get what they payed for. It makes little sense to pay for something that is buggy (your words, not mine – “This game is barely out and yes it has alot of bugs and glitches”) and then defend that company for the privilege of getting something broken and buggy, as you are doing.

Now, unless your an Anet Dev, I see little reason for why you are trying to make excuses for them. Do you think they cant do that for themselves? Do you feel some sense of obligation to come to their rescue whenever someone questions their ethical standards? I doubt they even care, so why do you?

While I agree that you are entitled to a product that works it’s naive to expect anything you buy, especially a game like Guild Wars 2, to be in absolute, perfect working condition at the moment of release. What you don’t seem to consider is that the larger the scale of the game the more likely it is to contain bugs and glitches. Even an extensive testing process cannot guarantee that everything is fixed by release. And besides, you can hardly argue that the game is broken or unplayable. By comparative standards Guild Wars 2’s release was significantly smoother than most other MMOs.

You also display a lack of understanding of the nature of game design, particularly MMOs. Coding is a difficult practice, and fixing one thing can often break something else. A larger team might theoretically be able to sweep over every known bug and fix them in a week, but the lack of communication in such a large group would inevitably lead to more problems later on. It’s also in the nature of an MMO to change and evolve as time goes on; adding new features that will, in some cases, be imperfect and contain bugs. This is the price we pay for wanting complex, expansive games with lots of content.

As for why people are defending Anet, I would guess it’s largely because they actually enjoy the product they’ve sold them. Your attitude towards the people that made this game is offensive to them, so it should be no surprise that they are defensive.

I do not feel it is a matter of complaining for the sake of complaining.

It is a matter of a very clear pattern. Every update we see several fixes to other classes, while engineers see generally half as many fixes, and are still being dealt nerfs.

Also, someones post earlier made some comment that engineers get less fixes because we are in better shape then the other classes. Please PM me with the name of the drug you take. Anything that can make anyone that loopy and still type, must be good stuff.

blarginda blarg blargidy blarg

Aw, isn’t that cute? Every time there is a patch people somehow manage to always feel like the ones it has hit the hardest with the nerf-bat or the one left out of bug-fixes.

I mean, have you actually read the patchnotes for the other classes and know what bugs they really have? I assume not. Becuase if that were the case, you would for example notice that the Necromancer minions still have had no change to their AI whatsoever, so they still do what they like when they like, making playing them a huge risk. Not to mention the Flesh Golem still drowning in every pond, leaving the Minion Mancer with no Elite Skill…

There are bugs and problems in every class, not just in yours and mine. There is no class the devs favor for some constructed reason and no class they hate. The thing just is, that a game of this size and beauty naturally has many bugs that can only be found by trial and error and it will take time to get them all out.
So please stop with that non-sensical “the other classes get everything, we get nothing” talk, I am pretty sure you know that it is not based on facts.