Guild Wars 2

Here’s how I’d do it. Would appreciate thoughts.

3 builds.

1 – Skipping: http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-V;4sP-9-u5gTFx0;9;4TT;0916748A;45;05c1;3vhrTvhrTn-kr0;5VOVTWYXcYi3o_-o-G-2i;9;9;9;9;9;9;0VR-6q

The skipping build above has the potential for stealth blasts and up to 20 seconds of continuous non-blast instant-apply stealth with no utility slot cool down, and unlimited swiftness. It also has 2 jump skills: acid bomb, and jump shot.

2 – Might stacking: http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-V;4sP-9-66NTFx0;9;4TT;0916748A;41;05c1;3vhrTvhrTn-kr0;5VOVTWYXcYi3o_-o-G-2i;9;9;9;9;9;9;0VR-6d

Before the fight switch to the skills shown. Lay down a fire bomb or two and each engi should blast a mine and the thumper turret tool belt. 5 × 2 × 3 is 30 stacks of might.

3 – Boss fights: http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-V;4sP-9-66gTFx0;9;4TT;0916748A;41;05c1;3vhrTvhrTn-kr0;5VOVTWYXcYi3o_-o-G-2i;9;9;9;9;9;9;0VR-6E

Switch speedy kits for static discharge. Start the fight with med kit 5 for 10s fury and swiftness. Immediately lay down mine field for a simultaneous 30 chances at vuln x .5 odds x .7 chance of crit is about 10 stacks of vulnerability immediately. Drop BoB, acid bomb, rifle rotation, bomb kit auto for an easy 25 stacks and pretty good burst damage.

Edit: if you’re interested in trying this add your ign to this thread. Must be geared appropriately.

Party NA:
1: Nevets Crimsongear
2: Sins.4782
3: Ropechef.6192
4:
5:

Party EU:
1: Rozbuska
2: oxtred.7658
3: jknrich.1549
4: Lixerious.5763
5: Baumjunge.6351
6: Xyonon.3987

i remember right after release, before players learned the dungeons. The forums were spammed with threads crying how Ascalonian catacombs was too difficult and impossible.

The devs had just released a professions poll, and since engineer was the least played profession, they released a video on their blog, of 5 devs, on 5 engineers completing one of the paths in AC, that the forums were swearing was impossible with any group dynamic.

dancingmonkey.4902:

i remember right after release, before players learned the dungeons. The forums were spammed with threads crying how Ascalonian catacombs was too difficult and impossible.

The devs had just released a professions poll, and since engineer was the least played profession, they released a video on their blog, of 5 devs, on 5 engineers completing one of the paths in AC, that the forums were swearing was impossible with any group dynamic.

Haha that’s hilarious. I think the above would be a decent comp for speed runs, and it’d be interesting to try.

And by speed I mean fast, not record breaking.

I would like to see this happen also. Is this the sign up thread?

I’d be up for a 5 engi run if you’re looking for players. The lack of Fury for long fights is somewhat bothering, but with near perma 25 might/vuln it may be harder to notice.

ShadowPuppet.3746:

I would like to see this happen also. Is this the sign up thread?

Uhm, sure. If you’re interested in trying and have the proper zerker gear and runes, put your ign here. I’ll add names to top post.

Greez

I’d suggest to skip in cloaked versions instead of damage dealing jumping stuff. Ooc speed is superior compared to that. 3 engineers alone are already able to permacloak a party.

A special build for might stacking is useless aswell. Even without thumper and with rifle instead of a shield you can go for an easy 9 stack every few seconds. And you are 5 engineers so … I wouldn’t suggest to waste a dps increasing utility slot for thumper.

For bossfights i still recommend the grenade kit for opening with barrage for immediately 25 stacks of vuln. Sure mines can do that too, but I’d say grenade 2 and 4 are also a dps increase compared to bombs. Also if one gets somehow low on health he would have no ranged option except for rifle aa, wich is like every engineer aa – baaaad :P

I’d like to do a 5 engineer party for sure! I really enjoy this class to the finest and engineers seem allways friendly and not like the other forums “NONO YOU SUCK YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW TO PLAY, LIKE I PLAY IS BEST ME PRO”

What do you want to run? Fotm?

Greez Ziggy (Ziggs Ironeye)

I’d be interested but play with high latency (and probably a diff timezone) so may not be that helpful to you. I’m running a party permafury build atm (reliability depends on situation since it depends on exp turrets) which might be simpler than messing with medkit.

How do you sustain permafury with an engineer without even the medkit? o.O

Just like everything else, stacking 5x the same class is obviously suboptimal. Even if engineers are versatile, having more than 2 is really crippling. You can do a 5 engineer team, but it won’t be close to a speedrun. That said, i don’t think you need a specific running build, etc. 5 meta engis will have 5 smoke fields, 5 toss elixir s, and a ton of blasts. Even more than 1 engi is already too much, at least for now. 2 engis/2 eles/1 war, maybe?

Xyonon.3987:

Greez

I’d suggest to skip in cloaked versions instead of damage dealing jumping stuff. Ooc speed is superior compared to that. 3 engineers alone are already able to permacloak a party.

A special build for might stacking is useless aswell. Even without thumper and with rifle instead of a shield you can go for an easy 9 stack every few seconds. And you are 5 engineers so … I wouldn’t suggest to waste a dps increasing utility slot for thumper.

For bossfights i still recommend the grenade kit for opening with barrage for immediately 25 stacks of vuln. Sure mines can do that too, but I’d say grenade 2 and 4 are also a dps increase compared to bombs. Also if one gets somehow low on health he would have no ranged option except for rifle aa, wich is like every engineer aa – baaaad :P

---

I’d like to do a 5 engineer party for sure! I really enjoy this class to the finest and engineers seem allways friendly and not like the other forums “NONO YOU SUCK YOU HAVE NO IDEA HOW TO PLAY, LIKE I PLAY IS BEST ME PRO”

What do you want to run? Fotm?

Greez Ziggy (Ziggs Ironeye)

Hey, I’ll add you to the list. Was thinking dungeons.

Re, your points:

Elixir S x 5 engis is 25s stealth without smoke, the jumps are just for when there is a clear area to “speed” things up. Obviously risky, but just in case.

Can you show me the math for blasts? I was just going to use thumper toolbelt, not the utility itself. That way you can switch to a higher dps kit while still getting the blast. I see 2 blasts-mine, thumper toolbelt. Where are you getting 3 without thumper? I want to save the BoB for the boss itself, and same goes for acid bomb.

I think the math was done by guang that if the party already had full vuln bombs were a DPS increase. So what i’ve tried to do is maximize DPS while providing for easy skill switches for running and pre-fight might stacking. As far as I can tell that’s really what these speed runners do.

That said, there’s a few things we’d be deficient at. They include fury, and party wide dps buffs.

icewyrm.5038:

I’d be interested but play with high latency (and probably a diff timezone) so may not be that helpful to you. I’m running a party permafury build atm (reliability depends on situation since it depends on exp turrets) which might be simpler than messing with medkit.

What’s the build? What I’ve tried to do here is use the maximum engi DPS build while still providing as much of the necessities for speed running as possible – ie. stealth, speed, vuln, might. I feel like a turret build would lead to a huge drop in DPS that isn’t going to be made up by permafury. The above has ~30% fury uptime. Low, yes, but not terrible.

oxtred.7658:

Just like everything else, stacking 5x the same class is obviously suboptimal. Even if engineers are versatile, having more than 2 is really crippling. You can do a 5 engineer team, but it won’t be close to a speedrun. That said, i don’t think you need a specific running build, etc. 5 meta engis will have 5 smoke fields, 5 toss elixir s, and a ton of blasts. Even more than 1 engi is already too much, at least for now. 2 engis/2 eles/1 war, maybe?

The running build includes the toss elixir s skills and speedy kits for +run speed. The might stacking is for pre-fight might, and for the fights themselves you just switch speedy kits for static discharge to maximize DPS.

I know eles have the ice bows, and wars have banners, and the main thing a 5 engi party would be lacking is permafury, but other than that what are we short on?

Your reflects are also rng based. But it’s like asking why is 4war1mes suboptimal since you have banners, timewarp, vuln, might, and fury. Engineer on paper dps and burst are cool, but it relies on bunker down, and in a speedrun you just don’t take something with good dps, you take the absolute best possible (=eles for now). That’s for speedruns though, not “casual” daily tours. For tours I still like having a guard for aegis when i don’t feel like dodging, and eles for dem pretty conjures. So, engi has a lot of things, but since they are not the best in it, taking more than 1 or 2 hinder their potential. 2 engis is already 25 vuln, about max. might depending on your utilities, 30-40% reflect uptime, and far enough stealth for any run section. Even 1 engi is already 25 vuln, 9-12 might, 20% reflect uptime, and stealth. So the problem is that 5 engis are only a bit more useful than a single one.

Yeah it’s far from the best individual damage setup, maybe it’s not worth the trade-off. I put it together as an alt-build because I run far too many pug groups where there is no one generating any fury at all (which is irritating) and I don’t feel like swapping character.

If you’re interested anyway, build I’ve been running is 2/0/0/6/6. Running assassins armor and weapons, berserker trinkets, sigils of perception and accuracy, altruism runes. Traits I’ve been running are forceful explosives, then 2 optionals +exp turrets from alchemy (I’ve been running self-reg defenses to protect my stacks, hah), then speedy kits, deployable turrets and adrenal implant from tools.

I’ve been running p/s but rifle might be more useful with so many finishers already at your disposal, might stacks bounce between 9 and 15 with shield, so 9 and 12 without. Take healing turret, bomb kit, flame turret and rifle turret. I tend to replace flame turret before the other utilities but the AoE blind and finisher has it’s uses along with the passive might stacks. Deployable turrets is important, it lets you throw your turrets to locations where they are relatively safe from enemy attacks but still within buff range.

For enemies like subject alpha, you can swap healing turret for medkit and pick up your rifle turret instead of leaving it out and still keep up permafury but it’s a bit more fiddly.

As an added bonus your healing turret grants party wide vigor (though only like 45% uptime) and you’ve got regeneration up most of the time since the turret is usually safe up on the wall or ceiling. It would be possible to get permanent protection uptime if you had a couple of people running exp thumper turrets but again not worth it I imagine.

I guess an alternative to the above might be having 2 people with a full pack rune set? Assuming the fight lasts long enough for the effect to proc.

oxtred.7658:

Your reflects are also rng based. But it’s like asking why is 4war1mes suboptimal since you have banners, timewarp, vuln, might, and fury. Engineer on paper dps and burst are cool, but it relies on bunker down, and in a speedrun you just don’t take something with good dps, you take the absolute best possible (=eles for now). That’s for speedruns though, not “casual” daily tours. For tours I still like having a guard for aegis when i don’t feel like dodging, and eles for dem pretty conjures. So, engi has a lot of things, but since they are not the best in it, taking more than 1 or 2 hinder their potential. 2 engis is already 25 vuln, about max. might depending on your utilities, 30-40% reflect uptime, and far enough stealth for any run section. Even 1 engi is already 25 vuln, 9-12 might, 20% reflect uptime, and stealth. So the problem is that 5 engis are only a bit more useful than a single one.

RNG reflects, but with 5 engis the odds of not getting reflect wall is 3%. So it’s pretty close to being OK. I wouldn’t take bunker down at all because of the massive DPS loss. Ele FGS seems to be getting the nerf bat, so their dps will only be marginally better after the patch. The traditional engi vuln relies on grenades which are lower dps than bombs, so with 5 engis you can still cap vuln but with bombs, so you can utilize the engis “best” dps potential.

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

oxtred.7658:

Your reflects are also rng based. But it’s like asking why is 4war1mes suboptimal since you have banners, timewarp, vuln, might, and fury. Engineer on paper dps and burst are cool, but it relies on bunker down, and in a speedrun you just don’t take something with good dps, you take the absolute best possible (=eles for now). That’s for speedruns though, not “casual” daily tours. For tours I still like having a guard for aegis when i don’t feel like dodging, and eles for dem pretty conjures. So, engi has a lot of things, but since they are not the best in it, taking more than 1 or 2 hinder their potential. 2 engis is already 25 vuln, about max. might depending on your utilities, 30-40% reflect uptime, and far enough stealth for any run section. Even 1 engi is already 25 vuln, 9-12 might, 20% reflect uptime, and stealth. So the problem is that 5 engis are only a bit more useful than a single one.

RNG reflects, but with 5 engis the odds of not getting reflect wall is 3%. So it’s pretty close to being OK. I wouldn’t take bunker down at all because of the massive DPS loss. Ele FGS seems to be getting the nerf bat, so their dps will only be marginally better after the patch. The traditional engi vuln relies on grenades which are lower dps than bombs, so with 5 engis you can still cap vuln but with bombs, so you can utilize the engis “best” dps potential.

How many unique conditions will be applied with a 5x bomb setup to take advantage of modified ammo? In a normal rotation it’s really only going to be some bleed, vuln, and perhaps burning depending on how you decide to rotate the fire fields for blast finishes. Don’t get me wrong a 6% damage boost is nothing to sneeze at, I just think it’s going to take some maths to figure out if it’s worthwhile having at least one engi running nades to boost the amount of unique conditions that are on the target. Their personal dps is lowered some from bombs in this scenario, but it may be worth the party dps increase from having better access to more types of conditions.
Edit: It would probably be most effective to have one or two engis replace mine with gk, they can switch to gk just for applying the extra few conditions then switch right back into bombs and it wouldn’t require them to take grenadier since in this case the nades would only be used for applying the extra conditions.

oxtred.7658:

Your reflects are also rng based. But it’s like asking why is 4war1mes suboptimal since you have banners, timewarp, vuln, might, and fury. Engineer on paper dps and burst are cool, but it relies on bunker down, and in a speedrun you just don’t take something with good dps, you take the absolute best possible (=eles for now). That’s for speedruns though, not “casual” daily tours. For tours I still like having a guard for aegis when i don’t feel like dodging, and eles for dem pretty conjures. So, engi has a lot of things, but since they are not the best in it, taking more than 1 or 2 hinder their potential. 2 engis is already 25 vuln, about max. might depending on your utilities, 30-40% reflect uptime, and far enough stealth for any run section. Even 1 engi is already 25 vuln, 9-12 might, 20% reflect uptime, and stealth. So the problem is that 5 engis are only a bit more useful than a single one.

Pretty sure the OP is not trying to make a claim that this is going to break any speed run records, I get the feeling it’s more for just funzies and experimentation. There is plenty enough variety in engi builds and traits to make this worthwhile just to have something to tinker with.

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

Hey, I’ll add you to the list. Was thinking dungeons.

Re, your points:

Elixir S x 5 engis is 25s stealth without smoke, the jumps are just for when there is a clear area to “speed” things up. Obviously risky, but just in case.

Can you show me the math for blasts? I was just going to use thumper toolbelt, not the utility itself. That way you can switch to a higher dps kit while still getting the blast. I see 2 blasts-mine, thumper toolbelt. Where are you getting 3 without thumper? I want to save the BoB for the boss itself, and same goes for acid bomb.

I think the math was done by guang that if the party already had full vuln bombs were a DPS increase. So what i’ve tried to do is maximize DPS while providing for easy skill switches for running and pre-fight might stacking. As far as I can tell that’s really what these speed runners do.

That said, there’s a few things we’d be deficient at. They include fury, and party wide dps buffs.

As I said – cloak is great for that. Elixier S has no cd to swap if only used toolbelt, so I totally agree with you.

As for the blasts, why should you waste time before a fight to buff? Just charge to the boss and use EG and BoB on a fire field. Those are 30 stacks might with 5 engis, all running strength means 29 sec 25 stacks might. Then with 3x Grenade Barrage and later 2x again provides permanently 25 stacks vuln with bomb 1 as aa. DpS increasing skills like rifle and grenade and mines we’ll just rock everything.

Some here seem to forget that the engineer is 3. (4. if mesmer is phantasm viable) in dps. Best dps is clearly the thief, mesmer if he can sustain 3 phants, then ele is next, right behind it engi. Engi has some of the best burst skills and I’m pretty sure 5 of them can burst down a boss faster than eles post patch.

Xyonon.3987:

Nevets Crimsonwing.5271:

Hey, I’ll add you to the list. Was thinking dungeons.

Re, your points:

Elixir S x 5 engis is 25s stealth without smoke, the jumps are just for when there is a clear area to “speed” things up. Obviously risky, but just in case.

Can you show me the math for blasts? I was just going to use thumper toolbelt, not the utility itself. That way you can switch to a higher dps kit while still getting the blast. I see 2 blasts-mine, thumper toolbelt. Where are you getting 3 without thumper? I want to save the BoB for the boss itself, and same goes for acid bomb.

I think the math was done by guang that if the party already had full vuln bombs were a DPS increase. So what i’ve tried to do is maximize DPS while providing for easy skill switches for running and pre-fight might stacking. As far as I can tell that’s really what these speed runners do.

That said, there’s a few things we’d be deficient at. They include fury, and party wide dps buffs.

As I said – cloak is great for that. Elixier S has no cd to swap if only used toolbelt, so I totally agree with you.

As for the blasts, why should you waste time before a fight to buff? Just charge to the boss and use EG and BoB on a fire field. Those are 30 stacks might with 5 engis, all running strength means 29 sec 25 stacks might. Then with 3x Grenade Barrage and later 2x again provides permanently 25 stacks vuln with bomb 1 as aa. DpS increasing skills like rifle and grenade and mines we’ll just rock everything.

Some here seem to forget that the engineer is 3. (4. if mesmer is phantasm viable) in dps. Best dps is clearly the thief, mesmer if he can sustain 3 phants, then ele is next, right behind it engi. Engi has some of the best burst skills and I’m pretty sure 5 of them can burst down a boss faster than eles post patch.

I was thinking that it might be worth it to stack might BEFORE a fight so that the burst skills get the benefit of might. This may be wrong, that was just my thought process. Also, Guang indicated that bombs are actually lower DPS than grenades due to the effects of bleed. I was wrong above. So perhaps it’d be best to have all engis in grenade kit.

If this is for EU I am in:-)

Rozbuska.5263:

If this is for EU I am in:-)

:( I’m on NA

I really don’t think that the bleed will come up for the 30% less damage grenades deal …

Xyonon.3987:

I really don’t think that the bleed will come up for the 30% less damage grenades deal …

If we get 5 we can try both.

oxtred.7658:

Your reflects are also rng based.

I am hoping that will change. I base those hopes on the comment they said in the skill bar video about changing the way elixirs worked as a whole. But my hopes are based on speculation, because they offered no detail when they said it.

I somehow like the rng of the engineer. It resembles the "well let’s try this gear with that energyzer and look what WHAT THE BOOOOM " part of beeing an engineer :P

Xyonon.3987:

I somehow like the rng of the engineer. It resembles the "well let’s try this gear with that energyzer and look what WHAT THE BOOOOM " part of beeing an engineer :P

I think the RNG should be visual only. Like, the elixir should explode in a green or yellow or red mist with different noises, but the effects should be the same.

Yeah, I’m just giving thought to improve. Also the op stated speedrun in his post, wich could be confusing for any reader. Anyway back on topic: Bunker down is a dps increase, and you want to take it if you’re maximizing your dps, but even if it’s really good on paper, it requires good positioning. Reflects are indeed reliants on rng, since the tossed elixir closer to the boss will be taken into account not accounting the others behind, you can’t spam 5 and hope for a wall. Stacking mights before a fight is most of the time a time loss, especially since some engi blasts ( mainly BOB and eg4, be careful with BOB though) are a dps increase. The rotation should be: 5 grenade barrages, one engi camp nades, 3 camp bomb aa, 1 uses bomb 2, blasts, etc, or something around that. I’d like to participate as well, but I’m EU. For bleed damage, you’ll cap 25 bleeds pretty fast even without nade spamming, so bomb will be a dps gain over grenade aa. You still want to use shrapnel and freeze in between, possibly when restacking might, every 20 seconds or so.

oxtred.7658:

Yeah, I’m just giving thought to improve. Also the op stated speedrun in his post, wich could be confusing for any reader. Anyway back on topic: Bunker down is a dps increase, and you want to take it if you’re maximizing your dps, but even if it’s really good on paper, it requires good positioning. Reflects are indeed reliants on rng, since the tossed elixir closer to the boss will be taken into account not accounting the others behind, you can’t spam 5 and hope for a wall. Stacking mights before a fight is most of the time a time loss, especially since some engi blasts ( mainly BOB and eg4, be careful with BOB though) are a dps increase. The rotation should be: 5 grenade barrages, one engi camp nades, 3 camp bomb aa, 1 uses bomb 2, blasts, etc, or something around that. I’d like to participate as well, but I’m EU. For bleed damage, you’ll cap 25 bleeds pretty fast even without nade spamming, so bomb will be a dps gain over grenade aa. You still want to use shrapnel and freeze in between, possibly when restacking might, every 20 seconds or so.

Will bunker down be a larger DPS increase than the +6-10% you’ll get from modified ammo? I’ll make a separate sign up for EU players on top since we have 2 from EU already interested. You’re right about walls, never thought about that.

I believe it is. Never ran the maths personally, since I’m not a pro for engi coefficients and such, but most talented theorycrafters out there said it was. What dungeons in particular would you run?

oxtred.7658:

I believe it is. Never ran the maths personally, since I’m not a pro for engi coefficients and such, but most talented theorycrafters out there said it was. What dungeons in particular would you run?

Who said it was? I thought guang said it wasn’t. And I’m not sure about dungeons… I think it’d be best to wait for the feature patch to hit so that the GWSC records can be updated.

Last I tried it bunker down was kinda useless for stacking since the mines don’t activate when summoned next to an enemy but only when an enemy enters from outside proximity range. Only works if you are kiting something.

Hello frands! Vee Wee here, #1 Engi NA and world first rank 80!

Vee Wee would run 1 grenade Engineer and 4 melee wrench Engineers! The wrench Engineers must all be Asura!

But in the end it does not matter! You could run 5 condi Engis and still beat PvE! It’s sad really!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

According to DnT forums, it is a dps increase. Then again I can’t provide you maths for that, so it’s worth testing. I believe engis are valuable in fractals, arah, se, cm, anything that requires stealth and proj reflection anyway. THey wouldn’t bring much in ac, ta, and coe. Maybe CoF. Still, you shouldn’t bother with GWSC imo. 5 engis will work, but it won’t be the absolute best time, wich is the points of gwsc. Have fun.

It would be a dps increase if it would work properly. The mines only explode if something walks over it, not if it stays on it when they are created. So – they are only good for kiting, not for stacking. And with 5 ppl you will only be the target a part of the time wich makes it less viable.

MA is by far superior compared to Bunkerdown. Bunkerdown is for solo, MA is for teamplay. It also stacks better with other % modifiers.

I would be more that happy to help

EU Server SFR
Add me in game

jknrich.1549:

I would be more that happy to help

EU Server SFR
Add me in game

Added your name to top post.

That would be something fun to do.

Add me for eu, I’m at Baruch bay
I use thumper turret + FT for might.

I have last one for EU good friend and great engi add Baumjunge.6351 :-)

Rozbuska.5263:

I have last one for EU good friend and great engi add Baumjunge.6351 :-)

EU team assembled. Go go go go go!

Can’t wait to see the videos

GL guys, make it fun.

Need to work out builds and the sort.
So the EU Team needs to get together and chat

NA here; I’ll run with you, but I have scholar’s in my ascended set and no strength runes, so…

Sins.4782:

NA here; I’ll run with you, but I have scholar’s in my ascended set and no strength runes, so…

That’s fine, sounds great. Added.

btw I’m EU too, not NA – and my name is not “Greez Ziggy” XD It’s Ziggs Ironeye :P (Xyonon.3987)

Xyonon.3987:

btw I’m EU too, not NA – and my name is not “Greez Ziggy” XD It’s Ziggs Ironeye :P (Xyonon.3987)

Sorry! Fixed

So we did very first run CoE 1,2,3 and it was great:-) For example destroyer in P3 was zerged on first try long before shield:-P We hope some videos will come soon:-)

yeah, we had so much time left on destroyer, must have been like 30 seconds
(no)

We must be even faster tomorrow:-D

Was a nice CoE Run today Tomorrow we are going faster (EU)

Stalker strelok.9304:

Was a nice CoE Run today Tomorrow we are going faster (EU)

Can’t wait to see

Any other NA engis wanna go?