Guild Wars 2

Why can’t the medic, bulwark, purge and sneak gyros be stuck to your character, just like the tiny little function gyro.

If you look at the original HoT trailer at 1:40 you can see a bunch of gyros behaving just like that (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOUk2y0K2m8). Is there any reason to have them wander around like minions instead? Taking that control away from the player removes the tactical aspect of positional play and has resulted in gyros that are often lagging too far behind to actually be useful.

It’s something people have been suggesting since they were revealed to be AI controlled. No response that I’m aware of.

Its really just a bandaid fix tbh. If you stick the sneak gyro to you, you’re definitely not very sneaky you are stealth, sure, but you also have a big beacon hovering over your character that says ‘Shoot Here’.

Sneak Gyro’s field should be increased just a bit so you don’t constantly run out of it OR give the kitten thing swiftness/movement speed buff when I have swiftness/movement speed buff. Tired of running out of the field by just using mecha legs.

I would actually prefer that the Gyro not be attached to my hip since it clearly gives away my position to the enemy team. If the enemy bombs the Gyro that is slightly lagging behind it means that no real pressure is on the Engineer. Consider that if you change it to be attached to you then opponents can simply no skill attack you and cleave out your Gyros as a side effect of simply trying to kill you alone. This would mean that Gyros are in a more negative state than they are at present if the changes recommend by the op were made.

Instead I think that the Stabilization Core minor trait could be modified, lowering the stability duration to around 4s and instead randomly pulsing the following boons for brief durations: Swiftness, Protection, Fury and Regen to all active Gyros. This would allow Gyros such as Blast Gyro to have a chance to critically hit, add more survivability to Gyros in general and possibly allow Engineers to trait in a manner that would allow their Gyros to keep up with them.

Since the changes to player minions I believe that the Protection boon would not be necessary in that rotation. Simply Regen, Swiftness and Fury would be sufficient for this new trait.

If these changes are made I would also like to see Final Salvo be changed as well so that when you detonate a Gyro you also get any boons that were on it pulsed out on a maximum of 3s duration. This would encourage the use of more Gyros and create the possibility of playing a more aggressive Gyro heavy build for Engineers.

As for Purge Gyro, it does not currently perform very well in my opinion. I would like to see that Gyro also remove one boon from nearby enemies whenever it pulses it’s AoE cleanse. This in my opinion would make this Gyro an option to take since it can now actually allow you to mitigate damage to your character properly. Most good condition bombs come in significant spikes higher than 2 conditions and the best condition players know how to hide their most damaging conditions behind the weaker conditions. This skill needs to bring something interesting and unique to the Engineer that would make it more applicable than praying and hoping it removes that 11 stack of burn hidden under 5 or 6 other conditions before its third condition cleanse attempt.

Sneak Gyro is really strong at the moment. In an actual fight you will be changing direction a lot and at the moment it does well enough to keep up with us. Outside of combat simply blast a lightning field on your Gyro to help it keep up with you should you feel that it lags too far behind.

Here boy! whistles Come here Sneak! You’re not stuck boy.

They need to make the active gyro effects work off the engineer similarly to how the toolbelt skills from bulwark and medic gryo do. That way when the gyro pathing gets wonky we don’t lose out.

They should simply replace the AI on the gyros with a cord or chain with a specific length (just to the limit of the AoE for gyros such as sneak and healing) that links the gyro and the scrapper together.

This way you can separate from the gyro AND move it around tactically, without depending on machine “thinking”.

Add a little inertia to the model and voilá, you have a way deeper and funnier gameplay for gyros, where positioning has value, rng is reduced and player’s choices matter.

Perhaps a combination of ideas here.

Make them stuck to your character like function gyro, to give the visual queue that they are in play. Then make the active gyro effects work off the engineer similarly to how the toolbelt skills from bulwark and medic gryo do. That way when the gyro pathing gets wonky we don’t lose out.

The only issue I see with that is with blast gyros functionality in this case. Perhaps they could have the dart itself blast when it hits the player?

Something along these lines would make gyros infinitely more useful.

Yeah, I feel as though the Gyro buffs should come from the Engineer himself that ends when the Gyro is destroyed. That way it is effective, all Gyros still work fine such as Sneak Gyro, and there is still counterplay since the Gyros can be destroyed.

Ardid.7203:

They should simply replace the AI on the gyros with a cord or chain with a specific length (just to the limit of the AoE for gyros such as sneak and healing) that links the gyro and the scrapper together.

This way you can separate from the gyro AND move it around tactically, without depending on machine “thinking”.

Add a little inertia to the model and voilá, you have a way deeper and funnier gameplay for gyros, where positioning has value, rng is reduced and player’s choices matter.

Wow! This is the best idea I’ve seen so far and I can see it work. Gameplay will be so fun as well indeed.

There are so many good ideas in this Engineer Forum, but they dont care, they just want to do there own thing.

here is one example

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer/Chaith-s-Idea-for-Robust-Scrapper-Identity/first

So it would be great if the devs would discuss changes with us so they get feedback from people who play the class mainly.

Haralin.1473:

There are so many good ideas in this Engineer Forum, but they dont care, they just want to do there own thing.

Which is frequently nothing.

Daralii.8940:

Haralin.1473:

There are so many good ideas in this Engineer Forum, but they dont care, they just want to do there own thing.

Which is frequently nothing.

Or MORE AIs…

Ardid.7203:

Daralii.8940:

Haralin.1473:

There are so many good ideas in this Engineer Forum, but they dont care, they just want to do there own thing.

Which is frequently nothing.

Or MORE AIs…

Our gen 2 elite spec will be the Garbage Can, which features turrets riding gyros.

I maintain that the better fix would be to simply crap the entire elite, instead just give core Engineer access to the hammer. The class would be immesurably improved. Gyros were just a terrible idea that should have been binned. If anyone at anet had any idea what they were doing with the classes, the moment somone said “hey about flying drones for scrapper?” someone with more sense would have asked “and how exactly would that work within the context of the game, given tht we have this long list of problems with Ai including the pathing and the lack of active defence”?
The next reasonable, rational step would have been to think of something else.

If only….

wolfyrik.2017:

I maintain that the better fix would be to simply crap the entire elite, instead just give core Engineer access to the hammer. The class would be immesurably improved. Gyros were just a terrible idea that should have been binned. If anyone at anet had any idea what they were doing with the classes, the moment somone said “hey about flying drones for scrapper?” someone with more sense would have asked “and how exactly would that work within the context of the game, given tht we have this long list of problems with Ai including the pathing and the lack of active defence”?
The next reasonable, rational step would have been to think of something else.

If only….

The concept of gyros is awesome, is their implementation bad, sure — but the idea is great. There’s quite a few ways in which they could be fixed and i’m sure they’ll get around to it, maybe not anywhere in the near term but i still have hope. There could be some guy locked in a closet working on the perfect solution (like the guy who made the action camera). Only time will tell, i’ll continue to try to work gyros into how i play because i really enjoy them. The bulwark gyro (prenerf/bug?) in pve was so good and the toolbelt skill for it was just fantastic.

Sobin.5947:

The concept of gyros is awesome, is their implementation bad, sure — but the idea is great. There’s quite a few ways in which they could be fixed and i’m sure they’ll get around to it, maybe not anywhere in the near term but i still have hope. There could be some guy locked in a closet working on the perfect solution (like the guy who made the action camera). Only time will tell, i’ll continue to try to work gyros into how i play because i really enjoy them. The bulwark gyro (prenerf/bug?) in pve was so good and the toolbelt skill for it was just fantastic.

I agree that the idea behind them is great, in some other game without GW2’s terrible ai and active defences. In this game, with this games Ai history, they’re a terrible choice. As for fixes coming sometime, I give you turrets, spirit weapons and ranger pets. Three years and no closer to Anet getting around to sorting them. Anet had a perfect opportunity with druid to do something with pets, to really change the game. Instead they chose to duct tape on a completely different function, ignoring the pets almost entirely. If they couldn’t be bothered to fix pet problems for their specified pet-class, why would they bother to change a utility for a hatchet-job like scrapper? They haven’t used the time to fix spirit-weps or turrets, either. Why should gyros be any different?

This is why so many of us pleaded to not get another ai. We knew what would happen. It would be badly designed, badly implemented, then it would be forgotten. Just like all the others.

The problem was not to add Gyros, but to decide they should think. Gyros don’t needed AI to work. They could have been passive boosters, re-locable objects, projectiles, tethered entities, a different way to visualize direct attacks or effects, etc.

I was almost convinced they were going to be the Engie’s version of signets. There were so many possibilities!

But no. They have to make them Turrets 2.0. Bookahs…

just increase radius for 300

These ideas are good, I’m bumping this.

Ardid.7203:

The problem was not to add Gyros, but to decide they should think. Gyros don’t needed AI to work. They could have been passive boosters, re-locable objects, projectiles, tethered entities, a different way to visualize direct attacks or effects, etc.

I was almost convinced they were going to be the Engie’s version of signets. There were so many possibilities!

But no. They have to make them Turrets 2.0. Bookahs…

agreed.

also, as the present iteration of stealth gyro- why can the cloaking machine not also cloak itself from enemies? needs a rework. (ally stealth view to allies with nameplate.)

Dovienya.6597:

Ardid.7203:

The problem was not to add Gyros, but to decide they should think. Gyros don’t needed AI to work. They could have been passive boosters, re-locable objects, projectiles, tethered entities, a different way to visualize direct attacks or effects, etc.

I was almost convinced they were going to be the Engie’s version of signets. There were so many possibilities!

But no. They have to make them Turrets 2.0. Bookahs…

agreed.

also, as the present iteration of stealth gyro- why can the cloaking machine not also cloak itself from enemies? needs a rework. (ally stealth view to allies with nameplate.)

I disagree. I think that would cause a real justification for a nerf on the duration of its uptime and cool down duration.

As it is now, the fact that you can use the gyro to create counter play is the only argument helping beat back some of the out rage post. If they do as you suggest, I can guarantee you that due to PvP, it will be nerfed.

Assuming for the moment that ANET is going to keep gyros, why not treat them a mix of signets (since we are the only class that doesn’t have them) and turrets (well-established functionality).

For example: when I have the…. healing gyro equipped but not active it “sticks” to me like the function gyro does (or like ioun stones if you’re into it) and provide some small passive. Maybe….. healing power +50? While it’s attached to me I also have the toolkit ability (which makes perfect since since it’s centered on me in the first place). When I deploy it, I lose the passive (a la signets), the toolkit converts to the detonate command (a la turrets) and my skill button turns into some secondary command (a la turrets). Maybe secondary for healing turret is to detonate into a water field rather than a daze.

This could solve basically all of the concerns about stealth gyro:
•standby passive is something nice-to-have but not overpowering, maybe a small on-evade perk
•when activated, toolkit switches to detonate
•while active, the gyro follows you closely…
•UNLESS you activate the skill again, which toggles its “stay put” on and off.

So you can have it hug you if you want to make a run for it and don’t want to worry about the turret falling behind with mecha-legs, and you can command it to stay put and then go off your own way if you want to be sneaky (but fall out of stealth a few seconds later). Granted that’s a pretty substantial buff so I imagine you could it with increased cooldowns, but I expect that would be worth the more fine-tuned control.

If they can always stay within say ~300 range around your character, they should be ok as a quick fix. And teleport to you if they get stuck by rocks while you are running away.

whiletruefork.2347:

Assuming for the moment that ANET is going to keep gyros, why not treat them a mix of signets (since we are the only class that doesn’t have them) and turrets (well-established functionality).

For example: when I have the…. healing gyro equipped but not active it “sticks” to me like the function gyro does (or like ioun stones if you’re into it) and provide some small passive. Maybe….. healing power +50? While it’s attached to me I also have the toolkit ability (which makes perfect since since it’s centered on me in the first place). When I deploy it, I lose the passive (a la signets), the toolkit converts to the detonate command (a la turrets) and my skill button turns into some secondary command (a la turrets). Maybe secondary for healing turret is to detonate into a water field rather than a daze.

This could solve basically all of the concerns about stealth gyro:
•standby passive is something nice-to-have but not overpowering, maybe a small on-evade perk
•when activated, toolkit switches to detonate
•while active, the gyro follows you closely…
•UNLESS you activate the skill again, which toggles its “stay put” on and off.

So you can have it hug you if you want to make a run for it and don’t want to worry about the turret falling behind with mecha-legs, and you can command it to stay put and then go off your own way if you want to be sneaky (but fall out of stealth a few seconds later). Granted that’s a pretty substantial buff so I imagine you could it with increased cooldowns, but I expect that would be worth the more fine-tuned control.

This sounds like “problem solved” but what about destroying our gyros. Try to look like other meele class in pvp. Gyros are close to engi so, if you focus on close combat and want destroy his gyro, you must go to him. You are focus gyro and scrapper have some advantages.

Now gyros floating 200-300 range i think (you can destroy them, and doesn’t need to face engis hammer).

I will be very happy if your suggestion come to real, but I am affraid that this make engi in pvp much OP. Meaby some stuck remove (gyro range more 300 will port to you) or radius increase will solved this problem too.

They only need to increase range. Problem solved, like 500 to 600 range. There is still a max target anyway. Following is fine if the range bumps up.

Edite: more AI and button control is bad and not the answer.