Guild Wars 2

Turrets got some buffs, but it still is pretty hard to create a build based on turrets.
You always miss out on something.

- When you skip the metal plating and such, the turrets are still too squishy (they really are).
Autotool installation is pretty crap, it heals for too little too late, but it’s on the way to the Grandmaster trait Rifled Turret barrels anyhow.

- When you skip Deployable turrets, they die of aoe aimed at you…
Deployable turrets is the best defensive trait your turret has: put it on a wall or an edge so they have to go out of their way to range-target it.

- Power Wrench is about the only turret related trait I can argue that you can really skip, even though the extra healing is the strongest healing turrets can get.
It is an awesome trait by itself, but as far as turrets go, it’s maybe the least needed (after the terribly weak Autotool Installation)

So a fully traited turret build needs as base either 20/0/30/0/20 or at least 20/0/30/0/10 to get fully optimal turrets, which seems evident in a ‘turret build’.
This is using 60 or all 70 points you have!

Are you serious about this?
No points left for defenses, player damage, utility?

Several turret builds are popping up, and of course they never use this base point allocation for turrets. Smply because no build can afford to spend this many points on turrets alone.
These builds always miss out on something, their turrets, in a turret build, are always weaker than they could be.
Even though almost every turret trait is a tad too weak, at least they are there to be taken, which is nearly impossible.

Elixir builds can get all needed traits, so can most kit builds if they don’t use too many kits. Seeing how you devs seem to hate multi-kit builds anyhow, I assume kit builds can take all the needed traits.

Solution: I see one very good spot for improvement:
let EVERY turret knockback and explode on destruction!
In other words: make accelerant-packed turrets baseline.

This frees up 20 points, and together with Power Wrench or not, you can have 20 to 30 points for personal flavor of your turret build. Just like all other builds have.

I use a 20/10/30/0/10 build with full rabid gear using dual pistols. The condition damage works out nicely with turrets actually. It would be 10/20/30/0/10 but I felt I had to put the extra 10 into explosives for accelerant packed turrets. So in the end I agree with your suggestion. While I doubt it will happen, I do agree.

i think that one thing everyone needs to consider is that a “full basepoint build” with many engie builds takes 50-60 trait points. That said, they all perform better if you actually mix and match the traits.

Sure, you can have accelerant packed turrets that have extra armor, regen, range, and deployability, but as you say, this comes at a cost to the engie.

so maybe instead of deployability, since the new timer makes it a pain to have to recast them every 5 minutes or so, take metal plating and accelerant packed turrets, and then you have 40 points to spend elsewhere.

Keep in mind that the idea is to keep your turrets alive and functioning through the fight, so you do not necessarily want the foe attacking them, you want to be the one taking damage, so you really cannot afford to ignore your own traits. also, since the majority of your fighting is in range of your turrets, rifled turret barrels is a bit much since you will always be in range.

You could have a nades turret build, an ft turret build, a rifle/toolkit turret build. it all depends on how you want to operate yourself in between your turrets.

I couldn’t agree more. It either needs to be baseline or in the Inventions line.

Thing is: I can’t imagine using turrets when they don’t knockback and damage on exploding, just like I can’t imagine using them if I can’t strategically place them on edges and such.

@Nakoda: it’s impossible to keep the enemies from attacking your turrets. Except in easy mob pve fights… So you need to punish them for hitting them, and you need to place them strategically.
The whole theory of ‘you need to keep your turrets alive and wanting the foe to attack you and not them’: you simply don’t control that.
These traits are designed to make up for that.

And than I haven’t even touched the Inventions trait line at all…
The traits are just to scattered.

I can see many people tossing Thumper Turret out, Overcharging it to knock people back, and then watching as people destroy it only to be knocked back again. It’s actually a hilarious idea when you think about it.

Many people would start using turrets at choke points like the Borderland Southeast Tower underpass. As soon as people would focus on it, they would be knocked back by the explosion.

If this trait were made a basic effect of all turrets, this would give us a good improvement in fights.

I’ve been running turrets since last patch and my build doesn’t include anything but Metal Plating and Deployable Turrets, both of which are 10pt traits. /shrug

I think the update was very well done, almost perfect. I went from never playing with turrets and being overall not happy with my Engies performance, to having a great deal of fun and now playing mainly the Engie.

I’m in a tanky p/s build using 2 turrets and the elixir gun. Fun times! I can highly recommend trying it out.

Windwalker.7421:

I’ve been running turrets since last patch and my build doesn’t include anything but Metal Plating and Deployable Turrets, both of which are 10pt traits. /shrug

I think the update was very well done, almost perfect. I went from never playing with turrets and being overall not happy with my Engies performance, to having a great deal of fun and now playing mainly the Engie.

I’m in a tanky p/s build using 2 turrets and the elixir gun. Fun times! I can highly recommend trying it out.

Last I heard, Deployable Turrets is bugged AGAIN! Deployable Turrets throws out the old, pre-patch turrets…

At least, that’s what I heard…never actually tested it.

I actually use a Rocket / Thumper & Flame Turret, and Bombs. My Bombs are juiced to hit VERY hard, so the fact that mobs go for my Turrets most of the time actually makes my Bombs alot easier to place.

30 / 0 / 30 / 0 / 10

I run the Metal Plating trait too. But I use SD, as it’s the only decent 10pt trait I can get in Tools. I’d use Deployable Turrets if it wasn’t bugged.

from my brief testing, it seems deployable turrets only uses the old tooltips, but the turret itself is the new one.

easiest test is thumper turret. deploy it, and see if it applies cripple.

Yup turrets indeed have their new effects, like extra dmg, effect, health, etc. But there is only a bug with Flame Turret wich gets its CD back to 40sec instead of 25sec.

Even if they just reduced the knock back range or something of the sort… Knock Back on Detonate would be a great baseline. The combos I could pull…

I’d just rearrange what the O kitten aying slightly. Add Accelerant-packed turrets to the turrets baseline without nerfing it into uselessness.

I recently leveled a (second) engineer to 80 this time using no fewer than 2 turrets in the utility slots. I believe Deployable Turrets ruins most of the “ease-of-use” aspect that’s provided by the healing turret.

I found that the Thumper Turret with Flame Turret and a Flamethrower utility setup to be surprisingly effective. Alternatively using a Rifle, Rifle Turret, Rocket Turret, Toolkit setup worked even better. Particularly in using Caltrops to slow the advance of melee mobs and Magnet to pull them into turret range.

Turrets for standard fare PvE (including dungeons) work just fine as is. However, the exploding after 5 minutes is a serious issue. Some boss fights are considerably longer. If a turret destructs after 5 minutes don’t make us wait another 30-50 seconds on a cooldown all the while gimping our damage output. Make them immediately available for redeployment if the 5 minute timer triggers.

Sorry if this was tl;dr.

I tend to pick Net turret instead of Thumper because too many Engineer’s defenses get countered by Stability/boss CC immunity already. Don’t need another knockback, immobilize is better.

I don’t think we need a change to turret traits other than to change auto-tool installation which is just about completely useless. I don’t see why someone should be able to take all turret traits at once, its more interesting if you have a variety of builds. I suggest taking a few turret traits and some other traits as well. I am using turrets, tool kit and static discarge and doing alright. Haven’t tried high level fractals yet.

I agree it should be default behavior. Though I also think deployable turrets needs a revamp perhaps have it add aoe damage on deployment so it’s not just away to make your turrets difficult to target. Also it would help offset the downside of the trait – multiple actions and slow cast.

From a PvP perspective I’d have to say that Deplayable Turrets is already the perhaps most powerful turret-trait there is, especially for being only 10pts, so it really doesn’t need anything. ;-)

It makes a world of difference in PvP if you place your turret at your feet, or 1000+ units away where you’re forcing your enemy to break off to kill the turret.

I agree that most of the other turret traits could use some further boosts, but DT is fine as it is. Especially the Auto-Tool Installation needs to have it’s frequency doubled, then it might be remotely worthwhile.

Windwalker.7421:

From a PvP perspective I’d have to say that Deplayable Turrets is already the perhaps most powerful turret-trait there is, especially for being only 10pts, so it really doesn’t need anything. ;-)

It makes a world of difference in PvP if you place your turret at your feet, or 1000+ units away where you’re forcing your enemy to break off to kill the turret.

I agree that most of the other turret traits could use some further boosts, but DT is fine as it is. Especially the Auto-Tool Installation needs to have it’s frequency doubled, then it might be remotely worthwhile.

it’ not so much that the trait needs work, it’s that we need to free up room in the turret traits.
That one is the most likely place, that’s all.
And it’s something all turrets could have without being odd or OP