Guild Wars 2

my dilemma with this trait is that it was designed to be used on crit builds along with firearm traitlines .

Tried with non crit gear and builds and this trait on its own is useless and that was with grenades but even those out of 7 shots i get 1-2 stacks of bleeding tops

it needs at least 30% chance bleeding chance to be effective for it to be viable and diversify builds instead of being pidgeonhole to using in conjunction with firearms.

This trait is absurdly strong with grenades and not very good without them.

Knox.8962:

This trait is absurdly strong with grenades and not very good without them.

i must be the unluckiest guy using it then because with grenades i stack a max of 3 bleedings with 15 attacks

maybe you’re getting the illusion that it is strong because you’re running firearms wich has a trait that bleeds on crit ?

I don’t follow.

Shrapnel is on hit, not on crit. Your crit chance has nothing to do with it.

I think you’re getting shrapnel confused with sharpshooter. Sharpshooter has a 50/50 chance to cause 1 stack of bleed for 3 seconds(base, but that always gets bumped up to 4 seconds thanks to serrated steel; both of those are minors in firearms). Between those two traits, sinister gear, and a rune of the krait, I can easily stack 20-something stacks of bleed on an enemy.

i mean that shrapnel’s 15% chance is too low for the trait to be effective without sharpshooter

its performance is too underwhelming when all i manage to stack with it is about 2-3 bleeding every 10-20 seconds

Assuming that you can throw grenades every 1 second:
The chance of proccing this trait is once every 6.6666 grenades. This means that you can expect indeed 1 stack of bleeding every 2, sometimes 3 throws.
However the bleeding of the trait is 15 seconds. In 15 seconds you can throw 45 grenades. This means you can expect 6 to 7 stacks of bleeding. Take firearms with that and thats 9 stacks.
This is pretty good overal.

However on other explosions such as bombs it is waaay too bad. This is one of the problems in the explosions line. If you are not taking mortar of grenades, you wont have a good grandmaster.

Do note however bombs like fire bomb and smoke bomb do actually have a chance of applying bleeds on their pulses, but still lackluster.

My propesed change is to just make it 15% on nades, 30 % on all other explosions.

The issue isn’t Shrapnel, so much as it is that Bleeding, like many other conditions, is just really far behind burning damage and in comparison is pretty weak.

Dahkeus.8243:

The issue isn’t Shrapnel, so much as it is that Bleeding, like many other conditions, is just really far behind burning damage and in comparison is pretty weak.

There is a core of truth, but keep in mind that condition builds can constantly apply burning. Throwing grenades is a good fill-up attack if all other condi appliers are on cooldown. This is where you can keep up some more sustain with bleeding.

Having a 1.5k damaging bleeding ticks is more worthwhile than you think

The V.8759:

Having a 1.5k damaging bleeding ticks is more worthwhile than you think

+1

Pistol 1 w/Krait Runes (or Elixer Gun 1) can easily keep 8 to 10 stacks of Bleed going. Meaning Pistol 1 Elixer 1 can do 1.2k to 1.5k damage per tick that ignores Toughness, Armor and Defiance Bars.

But, per the OP, Shrapnel really only makes sense with Grenades.

On average, shrapnel adds a base 5.4s bleed to every single grenade toss. In a group situation where you have might and vulnerability, that is 1200 extra damage per toss. if you have 100% condi duration, that number doubles. That is a really really strong damage trait. Plus it cripples people.

Dahkeus.8243:

The issue isn’t Shrapnel, so much as it is that Bleeding, like many other conditions, is just really far behind burning damage and in comparison is pretty weak.

It’s really not, actually.

Burning is very bursty, so while you’ll hit 13K or whatever burns when firing everything off at the same time, it’s not sustained. Bleed stacks ramp up to 6K+, and they pretty much stay that way for the entirety of the fight so long as you keep using Shrapnel Grenade and Grenade Barrage on CD.

I don’t remember where the spreadsheet data is, but I remember that bleed stacking and burn stacking DPS was very close to one another when taken at 30+ second intervals.

no, shrapnel doesnt need a buff. it stayed strong for 2.5 years, and then they buffed it by adding cripple. wtf. buff it more and itll be required in power builds too.

if youre taking explosives and not using mortar or nades… well… just take a different spec.

my problem with the triat is that it has no viability you cannot run grenades on a non crit focused build with out firearms traitline

because the 15% chance will keep at most 4 stacks of bleeding

Rezzet.3614:

i mean that shrapnel’s 15% chance is too low for the trait to be effective without sharpshooter

its performance is too underwhelming when all i manage to stack with it is about 2-3 bleeding every 10-20 seconds

1 stack of bleed for 12second duration. But if you are using that, it’s a condition build ans you should get to 100% condition duration. Meaning that it’s 24 seconds.

In 24 seconds you should launch 72 grenades and if each land that mean around 10 stack of bleed. In reality it should be around 5-6 bleed because nobody always hit the target in all situation with nades. That around 1k of damage just from 1 trait, which is pretty great if you ask me. Maybe your build isn’t good or you are not very good with grenade.

Thaddeus.4891:

Rezzet.3614:

i mean that shrapnel’s 15% chance is too low for the trait to be effective without sharpshooter

its performance is too underwhelming when all i manage to stack with it is about 2-3 bleeding every 10-20 seconds

1 stack of bleed for 12second duration. But if you are using that, it’s a condition build ans you should get to 100% condition duration. Meaning that it’s 24 seconds.

In 24 seconds you should launch 72 grenades and if each land that mean around 10 stack of bleed. In reality it should be around 5-6 bleed because nobody always hit the target in all situation with nades. That around 1k of damage just from 1 trait, which is pretty great if you ask me. Maybe your build isn’t good or you are not very good with grenade.

i guess i just have terrible luck with procs because so far i ve been testing with stationary targets lol

but hey if it works just fine for everyone else then i ll admit the problem is on my side

i decided to stick to burning build after i noticed i was able to stack up to 9k burning per tick