Guild Wars 2

I read today that power shoes was an out of combat +25% speed increase now? I had thought this was just an in combat buff. When did this get changed? I must have completely missed a patch note. I’ve been racing a thief in La and It seems to be correct? So am I crazy or did I miss this?

Last patch

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-December-10-2013/first#post3370214

Changed in a recent update. It does work out of combat, as it reads, your not mistaken.

Edit: Looks like Penguin posted it as I was typing my post.

I’m really glad they made this change because I play WvW a lot and no longer feel a real need to rely upon Speedy Kits.

yep!!! and i havent put them down since making my new build around it lol, muwahahahahahaahah**cough cough** erm, sorry. lol

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

Partially because your assumption that it is or isn’t bad, is just your opinion. You may feel a line with some very good defensive traits are bad. That doesn’t make it true. Further more, many players may feel they are busy enough on the engie, that they prefer not to have to pay attention to scheduled kit changes on top of it all simply for the speed boost.

I play around others that share the swiftness boon. The 25% is plenty good for those moments when the boon wears off and I’m waiting for another share without burdening the group to have to wait for everyone. And I’ve never much felt the need to be much faster in combat.

Uhm, I feel Automated Medical Response is better than speedy kits by itself.

On top of passive move speed…

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

It’s good for those folk who run elixir infused bomb bunker, or for the odd zany kitless build that gets nothing out of speedy kits.

coglin.1867:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

Partially because your assumption that it is or isn’t bad, is just your opinion. You may feel a line with some very good defensive traits are bad. That doesn’t make it true. Further more, many players may feel they are busy enough on the engie, that they prefer not to have to pay attention to scheduled kit changes on top of it all simply for the speed boost.

…? If you aren’t swapping kits every 10 seconds you aren’t playing engi effectively at all. A good engineer makes at least a few swaps every 10 seconds, if not more when checking for cooldowns.

icewyrm.5038:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

It’s good for those folk who run elixir infused bomb bunker, or for the odd zany kitless build that gets nothing out of speedy kits.

Soooo it’s for bad builds until they buff those traits?

The Gates Assassin.9827:

coglin.1867:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

Partially because your assumption that it is or isn’t bad, is just your opinion. You may feel a line with some very good defensive traits are bad. That doesn’t make it true. Further more, many players may feel they are busy enough on the engie, that they prefer not to have to pay attention to scheduled kit changes on top of it all simply for the speed boost.

…? If you aren’t swapping kits every 10 seconds you aren’t playing engi effectively at all. A good engineer makes at least a few swaps every 10 seconds, if not more when checking for cooldowns.

icewyrm.5038:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

It’s good for those folk who run elixir infused bomb bunker, or for the odd zany kitless build that gets nothing out of speedy kits.

Soooo it’s for bad builds until they buff those traits?

How are the builds he said bad builds?

Also how can you say that you spending 10 in tools just to get swiftness is a better choice then someone else allocating those 10 points elsewhere to fit their needs more?

And since when is the inventions line a “bad line”?

The Gates Assassin.9827:

…? If you aren’t swapping kits every 10 seconds you aren’t playing engi effectively at all. A good engineer makes at least a few swaps every 10 seconds, if not more when checking for cooldowns.

Actually if you are waiting 10s to swap kits, as your exclamations make it appear you are the one playing the engie wrong. Unlike yourself my friend, I prefer not to be tied to a specific chronological schedule to maintain my speed boost. I can never wait ten seconds before I swap. This would cause down time of a lack of speed boost. I personally prefer a 25% speed boost all of the time over a 33% speed boost 75% of the time, and swap my kits according to need of their specific weapons skills as I need them, rather then have that flow interrupted because I focused on doing what you specifically suggested and do it simply at internals that maximize my speed boost. If limiting you capabilities and play in combat is important enough to you to have an 8% speed boost over me, that is your prerogative. All the rest of us are suggesting, is that you stop being so rude to those who disagree.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

It’s good for those folk who run elixir infused bomb bunker, or for the odd zany kitless build that gets nothing out of speedy kits.[/quote]

Soooo it’s for bad builds until they buff those traits?[/quote]

How amusing. A posters is specifically suggesting timing your kit swapping for an 8% increase in speed, and bashing anyone who prefers a passive boost, so that they can change at optimal times in the flow of battle instead, and you attack those builds.

Look bud, have your opinion, that is great. But there are multiple game modes, and some builds may thrive in some and not others, but it really does you no good to insult others and attack them if you disagree or do not like skills they favor, and make false claims that they are bad builds simply because the poster is disagreeing with you on an altogether different topic.

coglin.1867:

Actually if you are waiting 10s to swap kits, as your exclamations make it appear you are the one playing the engie wrong. <snip snip>

Where are you getting 75% from? It’s 100% uptime, and easily maintainable as kit swapping happens constantly. No one is saying you should only swap every ten seconds. I said that you should be swapping much more than that. It takes like 3 seconds to use all the skills you need on any one kit. Besides, going into alchemy is extremely common so most builds will have a little bit of boon duration to cover it.

You’re also forgetting the minor adept traits in these lines. Inventions gives you regen when you are close to death. Tools gives you a bit of endurance whenever you use a toolbelt. The latter is MUCH stronger. The Master Minors are both extremely strong in this case, but that’s no reason to go twenty into inventions. You could simply only go 15 into inventions and 15 into tools to take both traits.

You clearly never use speedy kits. For a little bit, you have to think about switching every 10 seconds. After using it for a bit, it’s mindless and feels natural. I don’t even think about it anymore. It just happens.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

It’s good for those folk who run elixir infused bomb bunker, or for the odd zany kitless build that gets nothing out of speedy kits.

Soooo it’s for bad builds until they buff those traits?

How amusing. A posters is specifically suggesting timing your kit swapping for an 8% increase in speed, and bashing anyone who prefers a passive boost, so that they can change at optimal times in the flow of battle instead, and you attack those builds.

Look bud, have your opinion, that is great. But there are multiple game modes, and some builds may thrive in some and not others, but it really does you no good to insult others and attack them if you disagree or do not like skills they favor, and make false claims that they are bad builds simply because the poster is disagreeing with you on an altogether different topic.

Elixir Infused Bombs is a pretty weak trait. It heals for about 200-250 if you heavily spec into healing power and only if you are in range. Meanwhile, you could be negating damage or using much stronger heals such as Super Elixir or your heal skill. You could also be putting those points into Tools for Power Wrench, Alchemy for Automated Response (or w/e trait, that line is a candy store), Explosives for Forceful Explosives. Hell you could even just take another inventions trait. That said, most 25 point traits are trash while most 15 point traits in engi are amazing. It’s better to try to get as many of those as possible.

Kitless builds are never really strong. There’s not enough skills that are that good (non-kits) and because you don’t really have a second weapon set, you pretty much blow all your cooldowns in 5 seconds and have nothing to do until they come back.

And yes, you could go into inventions and take perma 25% speed, or you can take the defensive traits in that line. My bunker dips into inventions a bit, but the combo of speedy kit and invigorating speed is amazing. 50% vigor and 100% swiftness is vital for a bunker. In inventions, there are at least four other traits that trump taking Power Shoes:

1. Stabilized Armor
2. Protective Shield
3. Reinforced Shield
4. Elite Supplies

In that order, too. Even if you have Elixir X (No need for Elite Supplies) and no shield (No need for Reinforced Shield), you can still take Stabilized Armor and Protective Shield. Don’t need Stabilized armor because you have, Protection Injection? It’s still not worth going 20 into that line for that trait because of Invigorating Speed + Speedy Kits.

All in all, Power Shoes is a weaker option for those who think they can’t handle swapping or think that they don’t have the points for it. I have yet to see a build where you can’t afford going 10 into tools for perma swiftness (And usually 50% vigor from Invigorating Speed) but still can go 20 into inventions for perma 25% speed. It’s like the people who use flamethrower as their main source of damage in a build because they can’t aim with grenades (That said, I’m totally in for flamethrower as the main source of damage for fun).

Wow. You need to relax my friend. You lecture on skills like Elixir infused bombs, yet appear unfamiliar with the skill. Then you make an ridiculously TLDR post that is all over the place.

I am sorry if it offends you to the point that you make so many back handed remarks, that we find value in traits you do not. You can rant and rave all you like, the traits will still have a solid value. Like it or not, Power shoes is a handy trait.

Elixir Infused Bombs heals for more than that. I got up to 425 a bomb, with regen throw in can get like 1k h per sec. Of course I’m talking about in WvW and not PvP, though.

Wow. Remember that this is overall an argument about if Power Shoes is worth taking. You pretty much ignored the parts where I gave good reasons as to why you shouldn’t and instead picked apart the parts where my numbers were a bit off. You’re avoiding the argument:

coglin.1867:

Sure, what ever you say. I guess I need to go around and remove all of the videos I have posted here, because they must be forgeries since they display me using this trait before the day your own account was even registered as active. Given that fact, you sure have a weird sense of logic. But hey, whatever.

You are doing a great deal of back peddling my friend.

Not a single mention of any of the points I made in this section. No mention of minor traits, no mention of swapping kits. Instead you boast about videos that you don’t give out and about the fact that you somehow have an account registered before someone who registered theirs during the early start.

Doesn’t focusing your arguement on the fact that you have to spec heavy into the healing power line for a specific level of healing seem a bit pointlessly redundant to mention when refering to a skill that everyone knows is a grand master trait in the healing power line?

First off, that is not even close to what they heal for when “heavily” specced into healing. Seems a bit odd that you will berate and lecture everyone else on how to play the profession, when it is obvious your not even familiar with all of its traits and skills, but hey, to each their own. So what is your argument against doing all 3? Yor not making sense here. I am using the skills and line your speaking out against to do specifically what your suggesting. Your statements are contradictory here.

Nit picky. The point is that it doesn’t heal that much. With 1400 healing power, it hits about 355 (roughly). You have to be spamming bombs and be inside of their range to get this effect. That’s really not that much, especially when you can be dodging or mitigating damage instead. Kind of like what my entire argument was in that paragraph. Or did you forget to comment on that?

The so called bad build line as you called it, offers protection, 20% damage mitigation if stunned, and an AoE heal that can heal for 1250 per under every second (at least with the numbers you provided).

That’s intentionally misleading. It doesn’t heal for 1250 on the person using the skill. It heals for 145 + .15 * healing power, aka 355 if you have 1400 healing power. That’s FAR from 1250. Do you mean it heals for 1250 if it somehow hits 5 people? Because that’s really not likely, even in PvE. If you do that in PvP, you’re entire team is going to flop to AoE damage. If you do that in PvE, -shrug- it’s PvE. It’s not like you need that much support anyways. This is just under what regeneration would do with an equal amount of healing power.

If you say so What does any of that have to do with swiftness?

It’s a big part of the point. No swiftness means you don’t get Invigorating speed.

Interesting, since you very sternly exclaimed that the entire line is garbage and used for bad builds. Are you certain your not a congressman?

Soooo it’s for bad builds until they buff those traits?

So there’s what I actually said. The traits in question are Power Shoes and Elixir Infused Bombs. Overall, Inventions is full of some fairly mediocre traits, no doubt. The turret traits are pretty bad (mostly the turret’s fault), Cloaking Device makes you lose the point, Elixir Infused bombs and Power shoes are pretty worthless and nobody really uses the Toughness -> Power trait. Overall, yeah, the line is pretty poor. Of course there are some that are decent, but overall it’s not that great.

If you aren’t going to argue with my points, I’m not going to argue this. Have fun with Power Shoes. I’ll wait for an inventions overhaul.

EDIT:

coglin.1867:

Wow. You need to relax my friend. You lecture on skills like Elixir infused bombs, yet appear unfamiliar with the skill. Then you make an ridiculously TLDR post that is all over the place.

I am sorry it it offends you to the point that you make so many back handed remarks, that we find value in traits you do not. You can rant and rave all you like, the traits will still have a solid value.

And then you edit the post. Nice.

My god, I use the Toughness → Power trait sometimes!

it’s good for tankier/bunker builds that don’t get any points in tools because they don’t get invigorating speed. protection injection, backpack regen, and automated response coupled with 20-30 points in inventions make you really, really tanky.

that being said, inventions is a meh line and shouldn’t be utilized in any kind of offensive build. alchemy is simply better.

For my power bunker build I take infused bombs that heal for 329 and that’s with only 1200 healing. That’s also coupled with other traits to have perma protection with stabilized armor and kit regen giving me 507 health every .5-1 second. Now please explain how that’s a bad thing when it’s also coupled with 1900 toughness and 18k vit, then to top it off with over 2k power… How is that a bad thing?(pvp stats, even higher in wvw)

Now you say power shoes is a “bad trait” in a “bad line”… When you talk about taking another trait over it(when stabilized armor is already chosen) the other trait options have too long of an internal CD to be viable at 20 secs+.

You rant and rave about speedy kits and invigorating speed when you could be spending 10 points from tools on any or the other trait lines and getting protection injection and backpack regen instead of having to lose out on a constant passive regen while using kits or perma protection. You sound like an ele who thinks he knows everything and thinks you can’t have a build without EA…

Power shoes has no downtime, is always active, and cannot be stripped/corrupted. It opens up for some different styles of play rather than the age old kit swapping.

Numot.3965:

Power shoes has no downtime, is always active, and cannot be stripped/corrupted. It opens up for some different styles of play rather than the age old kit swapping.

Word. Just leave gates to himself/herself and it’ll go away without any cream or treatment.

No utility slot taken up by it either.

Treborlavok.3504:

For my power bunker build I take infused bombs that heal for 329 and that’s with only 1200 healing. That’s also coupled with other traits to have perma protection with stabilized armor and kit regen giving me 507 health every .5-1 second. Now please explain how that’s a bad thing when it’s also coupled with 1900 toughness and 18k vit, then to top it off with over 2k power… How is that a bad thing?(pvp stats, even higher in wvw)

This isn’t about bad, it’s about not as good. It’s a positive effect and in some way you will get a benefit from this trait. You could take the extra healing, but it’s not integrated into a reasonable spot for someone who should be dodging and CCing. If you only use the bombs that make sense for a bunker to use (Smoke, Glue and Big), that’s only just under 1k healing. If you spend time using Flame, Concussion and Normal, you’re being ineffectual and leaving yourself open to attack for a small heal over time.

This is what I run for bunkers (Usually skyhammer):

Skyhammer Build
Rifle
Healing Turret, Flamethrower, Toolkit, Throw Mine, (Elixir X or Supply Crate)
10/0/20/30/10
(Forceful Explosives OR Accelerant-Packed Turrets)
(Stabilized Armor, Protective Shield)
(Vigorous Speed, Protection Injection, Automated Response)
(Speedy Kits)

OR

Normal Bunker
Pistol Shield
Healing Turret, Flamethrower, Toolkit, (Elixir Gun OR Elixir R), (Elixir X or Supply Crate)
0/0/20/30/20
(Stabilized Armor, Reinforced Shield)
(Vigorous Speed, Protection Injection, Automated Response)
(Speedy Kits, Power Wrench)

I’ve tried bomb bunker, but it just doesn’t stack up for me. Big Ol’ Bomb is a super obvious skill that anyone who is paying attention will dodge. Even when comboed with magnet, good players will simply dodge the magnet pull. Most of the skills in bomb kit (besides the last two) are pretty useless in a non-damage build. On the other hand, Flamethrower’s Air Blast is instant. I’ve saved so many lives by stopping a stomp with that skill. Not to mention flamethrower is great for stomping with Skill 5. Tool Kit grants unbelievable defense with just Gear Block, let alone how amazing the rest of the skills are.

Then for the last utility, I always go for something that offers a lot. Throw mine, when used well, can do SO much for decapping a point. Throw that in back of someone to knock them towards you. Throw it up on a wall where someone is nuking you. Place it at your feet so a thief can’t steal wreck you. Put it where you KNOW someone is going to walk towards on a point to slow them even more. Use Mine field to strip off stability. It’s just…sexy.

Or throw in Elixir Gun. Extra blast finisher. More condi removal and great team support. You even get a stun breaker out of the deal.

Or Elixir R and become the greatest resser in the world. Seriously. Try killing a guy with Elixir R AND Energy sigils AND Inertial Converter AND Toss Elixir R. It takes forever if they do it right.

Even if Elixir Infused Bombs kept you alive longer, the build’s utility is kitten for it. You have less utility and offer less to the team just to stay alive (maybe) a bit longer. Elixir Infused Bombs just seems like an unnecessary cushion. Sure it heals allies, but 355 per second if they are in range AND you are spamming isn’t that strong. In PvP, you can’t only be focused on staying alive. That creates a selfish build. Team Utility is an absolute must and because your team should be there to support you, too much defense is just wasting that.

Also, sorry if my previous posts came off kitten-ish. Bad day, didn’t eat much, didn’t mean to be a kitten about this stuff.

No worries, I’m all up for good solid arguments.

The thing is when I play with my usual ppl I run the role of support with my cc, blinds, stealth, fields, etc. You have no clue how many times I’ve saved a teammate with a smoke field/blast-knocback/stealth-Rez. Bomb kit offers too many support options to not use them in a support type build. Like I said I run a power bunker build. So I dish out some massive dmg too with my bombs and rifle with and without might stacks.

So even if I’m speccing mainly for self perseverance, I’m still able to deal dmg and continually keep our targets cc and on the move. Yes BoB is obvious but that’s the point. It makes them move or they get knocked back and hit for over 2k(non crit).

Like I’ve said before you have your build and you make FT work.. I hate FT lol but if you can make it work then good on ya! Everyone has to be able to build a build around their play style. That’s the biggest place I think most ppl go wrong when trying to copy and paste popular builds.

Scaretactic.8765:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Elixir Infused Bombs is a pretty weak trait. It heals for about 200-250 if you heavily spec into healing power and only if you are in range. Meanwhile, you could be negating damage or using much stronger heals such as Super Elixir or your heal skill. You could also be putting those points into Tools for Power Wrench, Alchemy for Automated Response (or w/e trait, that line is a candy store), Explosives for Forceful Explosives. Hell you could even just take another inventions trait. That said, most 25 point traits are trash while most 15 point traits in engi are amazing. It’s better to try to get as many of those as possible.

Sorry but you’re wrong. Infused Bombs heals 392 on my (tanky) Cleric-Build for WvWvW. It’s also a heal for 5 people on a 240 radius if traited ! That’s a whole lot of healing from a bomb that you can put down every second. This trait works on every single bomb of the kit (including the Big Ol belt bomb.)
Negating damage is not always possible no matter how much endurance regen you have. I am glad to have my 30 points in inventions so I can swap between more damage, reduced falling damage, 25% speed at all times, protection on crit, improved elite or lower cooldowns on the shield abilities depending on the situations.
The 25% speed buff really comes in handy if you are on a farming tour, in a jumping puzzle or trying to catch up with a karma train. Not every build has 10 points to spare for speedy kits and even if I did I wouldn’t get it.
I don’t like to jump to conclusions but you seem like one of those ZERKER ONLY (rallybot) kinda guys… not cool.

I’m talking mostly about PvP and I think you missed about 90% of the conversation after that post.

elixir infused bombs is good because it’s like giving everyone on point a healing signet. with a 10/0/30/30/0 bunker build you can sustain yourself and your team for quite a bit while putting out decent condi damage with settlers amulet. saying elixir infused bombs isn’t good is like saying backpack regen isn’t good when in reality backpack regen heals you for over 7000 every minute. the reason why people think warriors are overpowered is because of their massive sustain. this is a bit off topic though because if you bunker up you probably shouldn’t take power shoes.

i take power shoes in my tanky pointfighting build because the extra 10 points into inventions outweighs the 10 into tools. i won’t be roaming as much as my other build so the extra 8% movespeed isn’t as good as a rechargeable heal (even though amr is pretty bad) and extra 100 toughness. plus i don’t take invigorating speed so there’s less reason for me to take swiftness.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQJAqelIqyXn1ynF17IRIF2/+ieofL74PKkLbB-ToAAzCpI0SplTLjWStsaN+YuA

ellesee.8297:

elixir infused bombs is good because it’s like giving everyone on point a healing signet. with a 10/0/30/30/0 bunker build you can sustain yourself and your team for quite a bit while putting out decent condi damage with settlers amulet.

Except if your entire team is within that range, you’re extremely balled up and susceptible to AoE. The range on this is way too small to really consider this a good party heal.

Guys,

Gates plays mostly PvP and more than a few of the things he says won’t apply in WvW or PvE. Please talk the same thing before drawing conclusions. He says a lot of good stuff about PvP. I wouldn’t run Power Shoes in PvP.

Chaba.5410:

Guys,

Gates plays mostly PvP and more than a few of the things he says won’t apply in WvW or PvE. Please talk the same thing before drawing conclusions. He says a lot of good stuff about PvP. I wouldn’t run Power Shoes in PvP.

I’m strictly talking about pvp and my power bomb bunker build. Since I have 30 in inventions for infused bombs the only other viable option along with armor on adept is power shoes to be able to have mobility when I’m holding a point to myself or roaming. Since I’m only 20 in alchemy and protection and kit regen trump the need to take speed and kits. But strictly speaking on that build. On any other build I simply would not take 20 inventions just for power shoes.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

ellesee.8297:

elixir infused bombs is good because it’s like giving everyone on point a healing signet. with a 10/0/30/30/0 bunker build you can sustain yourself and your team for quite a bit while putting out decent condi damage with settlers amulet.

Except if your entire team is within that range, you’re extremely balled up and susceptible to AoE. The range on this is way too small to really consider this a good party heal.

the range covers the entire point. anyone on point receives good sustained healing. healing signet caliber sustain. obviously thieves, fresh air eles, etc shouldn’t be balled on the point you’re right. but with backpack regen, super elixir, regen, and elixir bombs, you’re looking at over 1000 health regenerated per second (164 + 298 + 248 +288/.75s)for yourself and over 850 health per second for your nearby teammates. this is with a build that utilizes over 3200 armor, high protection uptime, and lots of aoe blinds. i didn’t even take into account the blast finishers and 2 water fields. how can you even deny the power of that kind of sustain?

edit: build i’m referring to is this http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQFAUlIqqbH5ynF17IRoHF2+qV0D9bZH/pgcB-TkAg2CrIMSZkzIjRSjsGN+A

Chaba.5410:

Guys,

Gates plays mostly PvP and more than a few of the things he says won’t apply in WvW or PvE. Please talk the same thing before drawing conclusions. He says a lot of good stuff about PvP. I wouldn’t run Power Shoes in PvP.

Is there really much of a point to going into inventions in PvE/WvW anyways? In high end PvE it’s mostly burst or be bursted. Only really things that stop damage are going to be that useful (blind, snare, CC, condition removal, heavy heals). In low end PvE, you don’t really need minor heals. In WvW…meh WvW isn’t balanced anyways. I wouldn’t be surprised if there was some mystical use that makes it OP. I just saw a video of an engineer with 2k+ condition damage. I wanted to throw up.

I dropped speedy kits with the change and really don’t miss it that much. this is from a wvw viewpoint which I do 99% of my time.

I get by fine with the 25% passive and some rocket boot jumps to get around/out of trouble.

That said, I am the odd bird engineer that runs only 1 kit, and not always in it, so losing speedy kits was not a huge deal for me.

Gates,

For PvE, probably not. For WvW, yes, exactly because you can’t expect balance. Stabilized Armor (10 in Inventions) is one of the best mitigation traits against the hammer meta.

Chaba.5410:

Gates,

For PvE, probably not. For WvW, yes, exactly because you can’t expect balance. Stabilized Armor (10 in Inventions) is one of the best mitigation traits against the hammer meta.

Yea without a doubt. That and 10 alchemy for near perma protection in protection injection. But I’ve come to think that should be a base of all our builds :-P for pvp/wvw anyway.

Scaretactic.8765:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Scaretactic.8765:

The Gates Assassin.9827:

Elixir Infused Bombs is a pretty weak trait. It heals for about 200-250 if you heavily spec into healing power and only if you are in range. Meanwhile, you could be negating damage or using much stronger heals such as Super Elixir or your heal skill. You could also be putting those points into Tools for Power Wrench, Alchemy for Automated Response (or w/e trait, that line is a candy store), Explosives for Forceful Explosives. Hell you could even just take another inventions trait. That said, most 25 point traits are trash while most 15 point traits in engi are amazing. It’s better to try to get as many of those as possible.

Sorry but you’re wrong. Infused Bombs heals 392 on my (tanky) Cleric-Build for WvWvW. It’s also a heal for 5 people on a 240 radius if traited ! That’s a whole lot of healing from a bomb that you can put down every second. This trait works on every single bomb of the kit (including the Big Ol belt bomb.)
Negating damage is not always possible no matter how much endurance regen you have. I am glad to have my 30 points in inventions so I can swap between more damage, reduced falling damage, 25% speed at all times, protection on crit, improved elite or lower cooldowns on the shield abilities depending on the situations.
The 25% speed buff really comes in handy if you are on a farming tour, in a jumping puzzle or trying to catch up with a karma train. Not every build has 10 points to spare for speedy kits and even if I did I wouldn’t get it.
I don’t like to jump to conclusions but you seem like one of those ZERKER ONLY (rallybot) kinda guys… not cool.

I’m talking mostly about PvP and I think you missed about 90% of the conversation after that post.

Even if we are talking about PvP only speedy kits is not always the best choice and even if you think the bomb healing is not good enough to be a proper team heal it is still a good heal for yourself if you’re running a bunker build. 10 points into explosives increases the radius to 240 that means you will only be out of range and not get any healing from the bombs if you are out of combat AND under the effect of swiftness. The 25% speed trait is in no way worse than “perma” swiftness of speedykits. Swiftness is a boon which some clases convert into conditions or simply remove from you. The trait can not be removed. And lots of the other trait choices for the master ability in inventions I have mentioned could shine in pvp if used at the right time. If you’re running a bunker build 10 points to get speedy kits is a waste. I would pick 100 toughness and healing power over 10 % crit damage and 10% belt recharge any day. You do what lots of people do – you stay in your comfort zone and never experiment with anything new.. think outside of the box, outside of the meta. You’ll become a much better player that way

No necromancer worth their salt is going to waste corrupt boon or any boon corrupting skills on swiftness. Stability, perma vigor, protection…those are things to blow it on. Not a 10-12 second swiftness. Anything like a boon steal thief or a shatter mesmer is going to be fighting you on point and you’re not going to outrun them with a 25% speed boost anyways. However, vigor is going to help out a lot in a fight like that.

You’re making assumptions about what I run. I run what I find fun and effective. I’ve tried all kinds of crazy builds. I once did a build where you use full berserker, net turret, Elixir Gun’s Acid bomb and Elixir X to push the damage to the extreme. It was stupid as hell but funny when it worked. I’ve tried all kinds of crazy builds. I’ve done turret builds that spec into inventions. I’ve done turret builds that DON’T at all. You name it, I’ve at least given it a shot.

The ability to use a lot of dodges is incredibly powerful and the Speedy Kits + Invigorating Speed combo allows for that. It’s part of the reason why I love having Elixir R (SO MUCH DODGING). Whenever I make a build for engineer, I almost always start with 0/0/0/20/10 (At least in PvP). That alone gives me great defense, dodging, condition prevention (Transmute) and mobility.

Also, the stats you get from speccing in something aren’t really that important. Most of your stats come from your gear, not what line you go into. I use to run an engineer that was 30/10/0/20/10. With a change of my amulet and utilities, that build could be a P/P condi build or a Rifle power build…Or a P/S far point assaulter.

The Gates Assassin.9827:

You’re making assumptions about what I run. I run what I find fun and effective.

This is what everyone else does too. Yet you tell them how bad it is or in your words “bad build” …..I can quote you on this if you like. This conversation has come full circle, and you are now making the same arguments that others were making before, that you were arguing against. You have severely derailed this thread to be honest. This thread is simply a discussion of whether a skill was changed and what it was changed too. Whether or not you feel it is the best speed boost we have access to or how it rates compared to other speed effects we have, is in all essence, completely irrelevant and totally of topic.

Such as

Sooo how is perma 33% faster for 10 points in a good line worse than perma 25% for 20 points in a bad line?

and here

Soooo it’s for bad builds

You have even made 55 lines of post discussing Elixir infused bombs and berated other for taking traits in the invention line. Which is irrelevant to the topic.

As well, even in post specifically mentioning WvW you bashed choices or thoughts of traits in reference to PvP. So you are okay berating others for their choices, but we are supposed to accept yours when you take traits for fun or their effectiveness in what other want.

Like it or not, it is a good trait for those wanting a speed boost and looking to boost toughness or healing power. As well it is not a bad choice for those looking for a speed boost who are grabbing elixir infused bombs for PvE or WvW. Power shoes was changed in the last update, and it was absolutely a change for the better, and is in a very useful trait line to many players with builds that are certainly quit useful in many many situations.

I’ve already made my points. If you want to continue to use it, I’ll see you on the battle field.