Guild Wars 2

Kalan.9705:

Poe you’re describing things a bit one sided. Many engineer blasts aren’t attached to intrinsically helpful skills, they’re attached to trade off, lose something (like a turret or reposition) in order to gain the blast finisher. This isn’t true of most other classes blast finishers, they are generally gain skills, e.g. lose nothing, do nice damage, with blast finisher as well.

This.

Poe equip a kit in every slot then tell me how amazing your build is.

Engis can’t carry many kits without screwing up the usefulness of a build, excluding the F1/2/3/4 skills kits don’t benefit the user unless you have it equipped.

Aside from the title of this thread being ridiculous, I’d like to weigh in.

Phoenix.3416:

Kalan.9705:

Poe you’re describing things a bit one sided. Many engineer blasts aren’t attached to intrinsically helpful skills, they’re attached to trade off, lose something (like a turret or reposition) in order to gain the blast finisher. This isn’t true of most other classes blast finishers, they are generally gain skills, e.g. lose nothing, do nice damage, with blast finisher as well.

This.

Poe equip a kit in every slot then tell me how amazing your build is.

Engis can’t carry many kits without screwing up the usefulness of a build, excluding the F1/2/3/4 skills kits don’t benefit the user unless you have it equipped.

So you’re telling him to use a specific build, and then critiquing the results? Now it looks like you’re the one being biased. The fact is that Engis have the most prolific set of blast finishers available to them of any profession in the game. It’s not even really that close. Trying to pigeon hole someone into a build that doesn’t use blast finishers, and then criticizing the lack of, is quite misleading.

I also strongly disagree that 3 kit builds (4 if you’re counting Med Kit) cripple the Engineer in any way, made only more true since Elixir Gun got a stun break. If you’re purely talking about blast finishers, which is just silly in a thread that’s about how Anet doesn’t give the Engi any love, why would someone who wants blast finishers use a build that doesn’t have many?

So the conclusions we have come to as a community is, We aren’t disliked by Anet, we are just misunderstood as a class?

We are struggling to find a place in game so we are balanced on the basis that if played really well we can be up there with the easier classes.

We have to suffer the “tax” of being a complex class. so it makes this more difficult as we feel we have to put in the work for average instead of great.

Few bugs to be ironed out the class and we could be pushed up to higher risk reward.

Is that what we want as a class? The higher learning curve, but once mastered we are the top class? Huge risk for the greatest rewards?

Phoenix.3416:

Kalan.9705:

Poe you’re describing things a bit one sided. Many engineer blasts aren’t attached to intrinsically helpful skills, they’re attached to trade off, lose something (like a turret or reposition) in order to gain the blast finisher. This isn’t true of most other classes blast finishers, they are generally gain skills, e.g. lose nothing, do nice damage, with blast finisher as well.

This.

Poe equip a kit in every slot then tell me how amazing your build is.

Engis can’t carry many kits without screwing up the usefulness of a build, excluding the F1/2/3/4 skills kits don’t benefit the user unless you have it equipped.

What is there to tell?

Many Engineers wield the Grenade Kit, Bomb Kit, and Elixir Gun together. This gives them 2 Blast finishers, 1 Light field, 1 Fire field, 1 Poison field, 1 Smoke field, a stun breaker, a targetable AoE condition removal, a conical group condition removal, Cripple, an Immobilization with another Cripple, Chilled, Bleeding, Burning, Poison, Blind, Confusion, Weakness, Knockback, and Vulnerability.

Explain to me how that is bad.

On a utility level, I find it difficult to have one of my characters reach up to my Engineer. Sure, specific characters are very powerful in one specific area of utility (say, my Mesmer for Reflects with a traited Focus).
But – and this fits the class theme with double utility slots – in raw amount and diversity of utility, nearly any build I do with my Engineer has a lot going for it. Combo Fields, Finishers, conditions, removals, movement, knockbacks, it’s on a lot of our skills. And we equip more of them at the same time than any other class except Elementalist (and sometimes even them :P ).

It’s not always powerful, but it’s a very viable niche design-wise. It may need some rebalancing effort in parts, especially in regards to semi-required (Grenade) and overly specialized (Elixir Gun) kits.

Carighan.6758:

On a utility level, I find it difficult to have one of my characters reach up to my Engineer. Sure, specific characters are very powerful in one specific area of utility (say, my Mesmer for Reflects with a traited Focus).
But – and this fits the class theme with double utility slots ofc – in raw amount and diversity of utility, nearly any build I do with my Engineer has a lot of them. Combo Fields, Finishers, conditions, removals, movement, knockbacks, it’s on a lot of our skills. And we equip more of them at the same time than any other class except Elementalist (and sometimes even them :P ).

It’s not always powerful, but it’s a very viable niche design-wise. It may need some rebalancing effort in parts, especially in regards to semi-required (Grenade) and overly specialized (Elixir Gun) kits.

Well said. +1

It hurts to see that people are underestimating engineers, even those people who main the class.

All classes have their uses. Engineers are in a very good place in PvP and small group roaming WvW. The same goes for rangers and thieves.

Turrets are broken because they die so fast?
Then maybe they’re not meant to tank AoEs which means you don’t exactly drop them at a place where opponents can hit them easiliy. The last hosted 1v1 tournament I’ve seen was won by an engineer using 2 turrets.

Celestial gear takes 2-3 months of farming
I’m not trying to be sarcastic or rude but every single class takes 2-3 months of farming, not only engineers.

Your downed skills are weak
Yes they are, I agree. But you are not alone. New conditions can still be applied to Elementalist’s even in Vapor form (downed skill #2). Downed skill #3 doesn’t exactly stop people from stomping you (bleed and immobilize, but given how people run condition reduction setup now it’s pretty useless). It’s probably a bug though and Anet said they fixed it but there are still people experiencing getting new conditions while in vapor form.

The lack of consistent stability
Engineer is not the only class to lack access to stability. In fact, engineers are lucky to have traits that reduce damage when CC’ed (Stabilized Armor, Protection Injection. That’s an instant 53% damage reduction). There are other classes not as lucky as engineers to get the freedom to trait anti-CC (necros, elementalists, thieves). It can be fairly justified as well. Engineers have a lot of CCs but don’t have access to stability… but they can trait to counter it. Thieves and mesmers don’t have stability but they can go invisible. Guards and Warriors have long stability duration because they can’t hide nor trait to counter CCs.

The Ranged Weapons
You can always opt to equip Tool kit or bomb kit if you don’t want to be stuck as a ranged player. Elementalists are stuck on choosing between melee or ranged.

Champion weapons skins/Legendary weapons skins and limited backpack skins and being told they’ll fix them now
I completely agree with these two though I don’t think it’s enough of a reason to label Anet as Engineer Haters.

The Nerf hammer
No, just no. Engineers are in a very good place in PvP and small group WvW roaming. Just as I said in my first sentences, all classes have their place but guardians and mesmers are the 2 most balanced classes in PvE and PvP. Engineers are well loved as allies in PvP. They’ve got a couple of buffs this recent patch, even the condition runes are very useful for the engineer more than other classes.

Yeah, I like the last few posts. Good summaries! I agree Engis are in a good place overall. They could use tweaks (turrets mostly, that’s the only thing I disagree about being okay), but that doesn’t mean Anet hates us.

Even the Mortar is consistently underrated. Yes, it’s only 1400 or 1500 range, and it’s quite clumsy with it’s bugged shot queue.

But! Some classes don’t have 1500 range. At all. Drop them a Mortar while defending a tower or castle, and they are happy bunnies shooting into the enemy ranks. Or drop them one during a world boss like Claw, where going closer than 1500 range is a bad thing. Much more damage than shooting the ice wall with the Bazooka.

No one ever said anything about having to use it yourself!
An engineer throwing grenades from 1500 range supported by a Thief firing mortar rounds from 1500 range is a pretty nasty combo in any situation where you cannot freely run them down.

Pretty much this…
You engi’s and us rangers have been getting the short end of the stick for quite some time now. Hope things get better soon.

Razor.9872:

Pretty much this…
You engi’s and us rangers have been getting the short end of the stick for quite some time now. Hope things get better soon.

How so? Rangers are in such a good place right now.

He’s probably playing pure Archer. While not a bad spec, it’s quite high-skill-ceiling, but many many newbies pick it up and get stuck with it.

Regarding combo fields, engineers are actually the only profession that has no combo fields on weapon skills. They are completely reliant on their utilities for their fields.

Not that there’s anything inherently bad about that, just thought it was a mildly interesting thing to note.

I love reading the dungeon forums themselves, the quote on quote “elite” groups have finally figured out that literally every class in the game is more than perfectly viable to be able to effectively get fast clears in dungeons. The keyword is class, not every player is capable of that, the point is yes engineer does have stricter requirements for achieving similar results as other classes, but to me that is precisely why I play it. It means nothing that you can do fantastic damage on a warrior because it is built into a few skills. Math has been done, examples have been shown and pound for pound a well played engineer is every bit as effective as any other class, it is up to the individual player to discover how to best utilize this. The only real shortcomings of a engineer is lack of easy and reliable stability or group reflection, but this is not unique to just engineer. It seems to me that there are many players that just repeat ad nauseum, what they have read or heard without really trying to break the mold for themselves. These players run up against a personal barrier that they have difficulty in circumventing, and then blame the class or the devs for it. That is not to say that this game is perfectly balanced in every way possible or that it doesn’t still have far too many bugs left in from release, but the kind of equality that most people ask for is a pipedream and the only way to achieve it is by making every class a homogeneous and indistinguishable copy.

I don’t think engineer was meant to not have access to stability. The stun/immob mitigation traits are recent. Juggernaut gave reliable stability to engineer once upon a time. I bet it was removed bc of kits… Same with why rune of tormenting was nerfed with icd bc of medkit. An engineer with Juggernaut could just spam equipping the kit to regain stability if it were boon-stripped. That is op. Unfortunately Anet wasn’t sure how to fix that other than remove it and we see they still have problems with remembering our kit-spamming abilities.

It would be nice to get some better access to stability while avoiding the kit-spamming. There really is no reason why engineer couldn’t have better access to stability. I think even necro can get it with death shroud and a trait; notice that ds can’t be spammed like a kit.

P.s. Warrior does have counter-cc traits:dogged march, mobile strike or whatever it is called…

Adding a melee weapon or two (hammer that grants stability?), totally removing that atrocity of an elite skill “Mortar” (gimme a minigun with the old juggernaut trait mechanics built into it), completely redoing the downed state skills (#2 magnetic push, #3 identical to the old rocket boots skill), redoing Kit Refinement trait, and finally making turrets other than Healing Turret worth slotting (passives that mirror signets when they’re not active or on CD).

Don’t hold your breath folks, ANet has no idea what to do with our class, which was kind of the point of the class to begin with, so in essence they’re doing something right, while also doing that same thing wrong…I’m so confused…

Elite Skill:

1.) Orbital Mass Driver a.k.a. Prometheus Cannon

- Has a maximum of 3 succeeding shots with 15 sec. interval of firing.
– Each shot made actives an auto-reload func. of 300 sec.
– It has a base damage ranging 1200-1500 with aoe size equal to healing turret and
a 15 sec. of 300 aoe damage same effect as residual hyper-charged atmosphere.
– Each firing sequence last 5 sec. upon firing.

*trait: next-gen schematics- inc. shot by 1, shorten reload time by 280 sec., reduce
firing interval by 10 sec. and firing sequence or animation
by 3 sec.

2.) Analog Power Suit a.ka. Jeager

- 5th skill mode switch: (melee mode short aoe damage, inc. mobility with base high
defense rate) or (Range mode high crit. rate and chance, range but lacks defense
and mobility)
– Upon destruction releases 600 aoe range of 1500 base damage and knock-back
but player is downed with less than half downed-life.
– has a cool-down rate of 600 if destroyed if expired it has 320 sec. cool-down
– has a duration of 3 min. upon use

*Trait: Improved power compensation- reduce cool-down rate of 300 sec . and skill.

3.) Mechanical battle-purpose Humanoid a.k.a Doppelganger

– has an indefinite time of use which means its unlimited but has less 50% base
damage but has base defense rating of 150% and attracts agro. from user to it\
– self-destructs with knock-back range of 600 and base damage of 300
has a cool-down rate of 150 sec.
– delivers single random boon to user or surrounding party and simultaneous
condition to enemy or group of enemy.

Weapon request: sub-machine gun or long-range sniper rifle

Regular Skills:

from turrets to drones.

I just want turrets to be awesome. They were the main reason I chose Engie and I have been disappointed since I started.

Bomb kit is boring. Grenade kit hurts the fingers. FT kit is actually good. EG is kind of weird but ok.

I wish that SD always targeted your target no matter if your ability was targeted or aoe.

But most of all, MAKE TURRETS AWESOME! Get rid of the dumb wrench throw turret repair. You can’t repair bits and pieces when your turret gets one-shotted. Turrets are stationary thus they should be a LOT harder to kill than other summonables. Although I wouldn’t mind a clockwork knight or doggy to follow me around… HINT HINT ANET!

Also, dump the mortar and give us an elite turret.

But, hypothetically, what’s stopping me from just setting up my now-really-durable turrets and then walk away? I could effectively fight at two points at a time.

Further, any extra DPS needed to kill the turrets is DPS not applied to me, and I’m already fairly durable.

I think what we instead need is a way for Turrets to not be killed as fast by incidental damage. The same applies for all other pets btw, especially Hunters though since they are so dependent on them.