Guild Wars 2

Anyone know what kind of DPS camping FT Auto with full exotic zerk and 25 might is?

OP, your specific answer is below, but I figured I would post the DPS comparisons I’ve been working on as well. Firstly, a few general assumptions:

• No critical damage calculations
• Weapon Damage: 1095.5
• Kit Damage: 952.5 (exotic level scaling)
• Only used damage calculations of auto-attacks

To begin, I started with calculating the damage of a single attack on a 2600 armor target.

• Grenade: Three grenades on one attack with a scaling of 0.33
• FT AA: Damage scaling of 2.5
• Mortar AA: Damage scaling of 0.8
• Hip Shot: Damage scaling of 0.65

Making a graph with differing power stats, I created the graph below titled “Damage Scaling”. On a single attack, the FT AA is much higher than any of the others. However, since this is about DPS, I made a second graph with DPS calculations with these assumptions:

• Grenade: 1 attack/second, 3 grenades each
• FT AA: Entire channel time is 2.57 seconds, so about 0.389 attacks/second
• Mortar AA: There was no time calculations on the wiki, and since the tooltips don’t include pre/aftercasts, I tried to do a few quick time calculations. I ended up with 13 attacks/10 seconds, so 1.3 attacks/second.
• Hip Shot: 1.19 attacks/second

The second graph below titled “DPS” is this graph.

So OP, so now I get to your question for full zerk and 25 might stacks. Since its a very specific set, I have 3038 power w/Ruby Trinkets & jewels. Assuming a 2600 armor target and using the above attack/second values:

• Grenade DPS: 1102 DMG/s
• Hip Shot DPS: 990 DMG/s
• Mortar Shot DPS: 1157 DMG/s
• FT DPS: 1083 DMG/s

Again, let me know if anyone finds a value off.

13% higher then before the patch? Theres cast and after cast delay, so its more like 3 second cast for the DPS calculations.

you just got graph’d, welcome to engineer town

also does this graph include the base condition damage of the autoattack as that is ALWAYS applied on the last tick (at least the minimum damage of 2 second burn for FT)

Good work Nightmare.

Do we have a graph for actual DPS rotations? That is where I think FT really falls behind unfortunately.

Stalima.5490:

you just got graph’d, welcome to engineer town

also does this graph include the base condition damage of the autoattack as that is ALWAYS applied on the last tick (at least the minimum damage of 2 second burn for FT)

Actually no, you’re right I forgot about that burning. Those graphs are just straight damage from power. Let me do some calculations real quick.

Adamantium.3682:

Good work Nightmare.

Do we have a graph for actual DPS rotations? That is where I think FT really falls behind unfortunately.

Actually the old one fell behind immediately with the AA.

But yeah, not having any of the heavy hitters made it a lot worse.

Thanks Nightmare …

I have no basis to reject or accept your numbers, so I will take them for truth. I will let others argue numbers, though I doubt anyone has really spent the time to make a detailed FT analysis because it has never been meta.

I’m inclined to say that the 1083 DPS from camping FT auto doesn’t sound that bad in comparison. It will lose out to some rotations so I guess my next question is much more complicated:

Considering ‘rotations’ where does FT stand relative to what is the currently accepted meta? I’m not sure where to find any currently relevant DPS numbers for the meta and without adding crits and conditions to the calcuations above, it wouldn’t be all that telling.

Well, here’s the thing Obetna: those graphs are just straight power damage. So assuming that that burn never ticks, then yes it is less.

So I just finished doing new graphs with the burn ticks from the end of FT AA. I could include possible other things, but that gets into the whole “should I include this possible bleed tick” etc. These values are only what come from the attacks themselves.

On the first graph, I basically just added the burn tick damage to the DPS.

With the second graph, the burn ticks don’t start until the 2.5 second mark. Every second interval afterwards, it will tick the 131. In addition, the damage is the +10% while burning. As a warning, this is rough since the total damage increases linearly rather than every “damage tick”. It just gives a general idea I’ve seen.

I respect that you’re looking for something quick and easy Nightmare, but cherry picking when it comes to DPS comparisons never ends well. You have to include bleeds and vuln for both bombs and grenades which is just the beginning of where it starts to get messy.

Obtena, Engi dps is on the scale of 15-20k. This is why the FT doesn’t hold up. The auto attack might look decent when compared to other autos, but when you start building up a skill rotation (like you actually use in a fight) it just doesn’t compare.

I wish it did, this has nothing to do with me disliking the FT or anything like that. It is a flamethrower for goodness sake. It’s awesome. It just doesn’t translate to being awesome in game.

Adamantium.3682:

I respect that you’re looking for something quick and easy Nightmare, but cherry picking when it comes to DPS comparisons never ends well. You have to include bleeds and vuln for both bombs and grenades which is just the beginning of where it starts to get messy.

Yeah, I was thinking that as well. I was just trying to include the full base attack, but I definitely agree it gets messy really fast. Consider it an analysis of base attacks only I suppose.

Adamantium.3682:

I respect that you’re looking for something quick and easy Nightmare, but cherry picking when it comes to DPS comparisons never ends well. You have to include bleeds and vuln for both bombs and grenades which is just the beginning of where it starts to get messy.

Obtena, Engi dps is on the scale of 15-20k. This is why the FT doesn’t hold up. The auto attack might look decent when compared to other autos, but when you start building up a skill rotation (like you actually use in a fight) it just doesn’t compare.

I wish it did, this has nothing to do with me disliking the FT or anything like that. It is a flamethrower for goodness sake. It’s awesome. It just doesn’t translate to being awesome in game.

Trust me, I have no illusion FT compares to 15-20k but I’m really just interested in what it is. Is FT 5K?, 8K? How big CAN it be? Honestly, I don’t think these are answers people actually know because theorycrafters care little for anything but what gives the highest damage.

I think it may be time to just accept that Flamethrower is as good as it will ever get in terms of damage.

The kit has a ton of utility, an awesome toolbelt skill and now a less cruddy auto-attack.

And let us not forget that it is part of several Meta builds.

Having it compete with the other kits probably requires either they get downtuned or Flamethrower loses some utility.

Juggernaut is still a problem though. The trait needs to catch up with the fact that no one will ever camp Flamethrower.

I just wanted to chip in how I use flamethrower. Yes in DPS rotation it will loose. But I changed my trait to Juggernaut instead of the (Conditions on enemy will make you do more damage, forgot the name.).

I camp flamethrower to get some stability during trash runs without thiefs and to prepare for a knockback. I lose about 5-10% damage but I do not get knocked back and have to rely on teammates to much. It saved me so much in Twillight Arbor and Ascalonian Catacombs.

In fights that last less then 20 seconds, I can survive the extra 2 seconds it takes. A knockback will make me lose more anyway, even kill me a lot, especially in fractals.

Can you PLEASE add bomb dps to blow everyones mind? Please please please! >:3