Guild Wars 2

I just started playing around with Flamethrower and did the Alpha Drake event just outside Lion’s Arch in Bloodtide Coast.. it took me approximately 5 minutes to solo this event compared to about a minute on my Thief or Ranger…

I then went to Lion’s Arch and was practicing attacks on the Practice Dummies… and found that I miss SOOOOOOOOO much. After some extensive testing I figured these things out, and it will probably help others who use a Flamethrower and their auto-attack ‘Flame Jet’ ability:

-For the most part, I need to be COMPLETELY stationary.
-Rotating Left or Right is ok – but you auto-face with each Flame Jet so the cone will attack as a cone will.
-Movement AFTER channeled attack begins will result in MISS for the duration of the channel.. even if its just a quick stutter step.
-Stopping just BEFORE a channeled Flame Jet begins will result in MISS for the ENTIRE channel.

The ironic thing? Elixir gun Fumigate attack which is essentially the same as the Flame Jet attack isn’t hindered by any of the restrictions that Flame Jet is. I wonder if this was done on purpose considering it’s the same type of channeled cone attack.

I did a quick search before posting here, but am going to research this a bit more… as for now, just going to stack that toughness and face-tank for Flame Jet success.

-EDIT Tested a little bit more:
Found that Flame Jet’s next cast misses after performing a dodge roll…. yikes.
Misses seem to be intermittent between hitting and missing with moving while fighting actual monsters vs practice targets.

I suppose this is nothing new… but I’m absolutely shocked that it’s like this. Is this working as intended or?

I’m thinking now that maybe they should make movement interrupt our Flame Jet/Auto-Attack. I’d rather reactivate it with a global cooldown instead of having to wait 2.25 seconds full of missed attacks.

You can still hit with the flamethrower while moving, but you need to disable auto targeting and use your mouse to aim it. On one hand? It’s kind of fun, especially while farming in Orr.

On the other the damage is so kitten-poor you might as well put the barrel of the flamethrower in your mouth.

Kamahl.3621:

You can still hit with the flamethrower while moving, but you need to disable auto targeting and use your mouse to aim it. On one hand? It’s kind of fun, especially while farming in Orr.

On the other the damage is so kitten-poor you might as well put the barrel of the flamethrower in your mouth.

Hmmmm…. I didn’t think of trying that! I disable it for my thief typically due to the high scores I’ve been receiving from my guildies for diving off ledges… but keep it on for Ranger. I’ll check it out, thanks!

Kamahl.3621:

You can still hit with the flamethrower while moving, but you need to disable auto targeting and use your mouse to aim it. On one hand? It’s kind of fun, especially while farming in Orr.

On the other the damage is so kitten-poor you might as well put the barrel of the flamethrower in your mouth.

This may explain why I haven’t had the issues the OP has lol…

pracrice dummues behave like destructible objects, which we know to still be bugged.

in open world pve, the flame jet hit box is so wide you hit everything in (approx) a 160 degree arc (that is, almost beside you) There ought to be no issues if you are even remotly facing your target.

ive never used auto target, so i cannot speak to the differences.

To me the FT is very underwhelming as a damage tool, I use it more for the utility and might stacking in PVE and in WvW I switch to it so I can shoot through gates.

I personally would rather FT #1 work more like a channeled skill that you have to remain stationary while its going.
More like a Flamethrower sweep attack, you would plant your feet and sweep from side to side. This would have to come with a large increase to FT damage to make up for the loss of movement but I think it would help separate the FT kit from the other damage kits like Nades and Bombs while also making the FT something to be a little more afraid of when you see a sweeping jet of flames.
Right now its hard to give up the other kits for FT, unless you just want to mess around.

with utility goggles, 10-15 stacks of might, food, and a mixture of rampager and knight gear, my FT auto attack rolls up from 400 to 2000 dmg, an average total of 4500 dmg per auto attack.

throwing napalm into a group of foes hits for 300 with a 2000 explosion... at 5 mobs, thays 11500 dmg in a single attack that is on a 4.5 second cooldown.

the fire wall may not do much for dps, but it’s combo for allies increased their attacks significantly, but hard to give you numbers.

FT is a support weapon, as such its dps isnt top drawer, but it is certainly not insignificant. and, with bleeds on crits, burns on crits, vuln on crits, and cripples for near death foes, the FT offers a great deal of dmg output potential.

play hard. play smart. burninate things.

Dont’ take this the wrong way, but I’m just breaking down why engineer’s “on crit” effects are pretty bad, partly to educate players. Also to make flamethrower look bad, ’cause it is (for PvE, PvP is a different beast).

nakoda.4213:

bleeds on crits, burns on crits, vuln on crits, and cripples for near death foes, the FT offers a great deal of dmg output potential.

Bleeds are 3 seconds with only a 30% chance ( times your critical chance, to boot, so more like 13-16% chance per tick), but the lack of an internal cooldown on it seems to make it alright. Grenade attacks with shrapnel have a 38% chance of applying at least 1 stack of bleeding that lasts 15 seconds.

Burns on crit are great, I won’t deny that, but from a PvE perspective it’s pretty bad – a single, smart Guardian in your party can keep a target perma-burning by just pushing F1 when it’s off cooldown (and positioning himself appropriately).

Vulnerability on crits is awful. They last 3 seconds with a 50% chance per crit, so more like 22-27% chance with each tick to apply 1 short-lived vuln stack.

Cripple isn’t bad, great for kiting bosses. But not when they’re near dead, or when something like a traited Throw Wrench (which, until they make Scope work, I immensely advocate) or Elixir F can apply a very solid chunk of cripple in two packets.

And they made lifesteal food stop working with kits. Thanks Anet, now D/D elementalists are even more stupid.

Kamahl.3621:

And they made lifesteal food stop working with kits. Thanks Anet, now D/D elementalists are even more stupid.

Whoah. When did that happen? That’s a pretty huge nerf to the only real PvE flamethrower build. Maybe they just gave it an ICD?

Kamahl.3621:

And they made lifesteal food stop working with kits.

What you talking about? Yesterday it have worked perfectly…

Disable Auto targetting and Promote skill targetting Presto your FT wont miss as long you keep focused on the direction your targets are .

Rezzet.3614:

Disable Auto targetting and Promote skill targetting Presto your FT wont miss as long you keep focused on the direction your targets are .

Makes me wonder if ANet was in the middle of converting the game to TERA style controls when the decree came from on high that they needed to launch before the pandas…

ft#1 hits 10 times in 4 seconds, ft#2 hits up to 10 times every 4.5 seconds.

with a crit heavy build, the duration of the bleed on crit trait is meant to be low to compensate for how often the ft strikes the opponent. this is also why the ft (much to the chagrin of our inner levitican) does not set foes on fire for very long. it would be over powered.

you are right, a competent guardian can keep a foe perma burning as well, but not every group has a guardian. plus, outside of dungeons (dungeons being the only place where a guardian makes the ft redundant) the ability to sweep through a zerg with the ft starts the bleed and burn chains for everyone else, and does so marvelously.

the ft is a support weapon that maintains conditions on foes allowing synergetic group dynamics for classes that increase efficacy based on foe conditions. it is not a warrior great sword, or a rangers long bow.

properly used, the flamethrower is a very powerful and effective weapon kit despite the lingering targeting bugs.

as always, of course other classes do things differently and under the right circumstances can do things better, but that same sentiment applies to engies as well. nee players ought not be dissuaded from playin with an ft just because the guardian has an F1 skill.

My Eng doesn’t stop moving yet hits almost all the time with the flamethrower.

Once you’ve got your targeting options set right, try the following:

1. When strafing/kiting to the left, aim a bit to the right of the target, and vica versa (takes a bit to get the hang of moving this way, as strafing/kiting now requires using the back key as well to maintain distance relative to your enemy, but it makes the FT hit almost all the time)
2. spam the 1 key (this keeps the flame going even when the AI loses targeting and drops the auto attack – the aoe does most of the rest)
3. You can take out stationery objects by targeting an adjacent mob and letting the aoe do its work (the only time the targeting AI seems to work for stationery objects)
4. When targeting a stationery object only, double-click the left mouse button (to auto aim at the target) and don’t move.

nakoda.4213:

ft#1 hits 10 times in 4 seconds, ft#2 hits up to 10 times every 4.5 seconds.

with a crit heavy build, the duration of the bleed on crit trait is meant to be low to compensate for how often the ft strikes the opponent. this is also why the ft (much to the chagrin of our inner levitican) does not set foes on fire for very long. it would be over powered.

you are right, a competent guardian can keep a foe perma burning as well, but not every group has a guardian. plus, outside of dungeons (dungeons being the only place where a guardian makes the ft redundant) the ability to sweep through a zerg with the ft starts the bleed and burn chains for everyone else, and does so marvelously.

the ft is a support weapon that maintains conditions on foes allowing synergetic group dynamics for classes that increase efficacy based on foe conditions. it is not a warrior great sword, or a rangers long bow.

properly used, the flamethrower is a very powerful and effective weapon kit despite the lingering targeting bugs.

as always, of course other classes do things differently and under the right circumstances can do things better, but that same sentiment applies to engies as well. nee players ought not be dissuaded from playin with an ft just because the guardian has an F1 skill.

you must have an upgraded flamethrower or something lol.

Life-stealing food buffs based on critical hits no longer affect gadgets.

I was wrong, and apologize for any confusion I caused. I’m not exactly sure what this means – engineer gadget utilities? This seems incredibly specific in that case, I inferred it as any pick-up bundle, but then it would say bundle.

Here’s something the FT advocates will never tell you.

Untraited
FT treated as a melee kit does roughly 1/4 melee dps
FT treated as a ranged kit does roughly 1/2 range dps
how you consider 425 as range is more a half full or half empty kind of soul searching

Traited (50pts)
FT treated as a melee kit does roughly 1/2 traited (20pts) melee dps
FT treated as a ranged kit does roughly = traited (20pts) range dps

This is a self comparison of the engg’s melee and ranged options, not a comparison of engg and other classes.

As for “gadgets” and life stealing food buffs, I believe anet was referring to turrets (was un aware turrets could life steal to begin with).

As for targeting, it doesn’t matter if you have auto target or not. Hold the right mouse button to lock your camera to where you are facing and you will be fine.

Rezzet.3614:

nakoda.4213:

ft#1 hits 10 times in 4 seconds, ft#2 hits up to 10 times every 4.5 seconds.

with a crit heavy build, the duration of the bleed on crit trait is meant to be low to compensate for how often the ft strikes the opponent. this is also why the ft (much to the chagrin of our inner levitican) does not set foes on fire for very long. it would be over powered.

you are right, a competent guardian can keep a foe perma burning as well, but not every group has a guardian. plus, outside of dungeons (dungeons being the only place where a guardian makes the ft redundant) the ability to sweep through a zerg with the ft starts the bleed and burn chains for everyone else, and does so marvelously.

the ft is a support weapon that maintains conditions on foes allowing synergetic group dynamics for classes that increase efficacy based on foe conditions. it is not a warrior great sword, or a rangers long bow.

properly used, the flamethrower is a very powerful and effective weapon kit despite the lingering targeting bugs.

as always, of course other classes do things differently and under the right circumstances can do things better, but that same sentiment applies to engies as well. nee players ought not be dissuaded from playin with an ft just because the guardian has an F1 skill.

you must have an upgraded flamethrower or something lol.

nope, same one everyone uses. like it says above, FT#1 strikes up to 10 times, each capable of critting and thus capable of achieving on-crit procs from traits and sigils etc, and FT#2 hits as many foes as there are between you and the detonation zone, and detonates on up to 5 foes, and as with FT#1 every hit is crit capable.
the FT is a crit based weapon.
high crit is your friend.

Kamahl.3621:

Dont’ take this the wrong way, but I’m just breaking down why engineer’s “on crit” effects are pretty bad, partly to educate players. Also to make flamethrower look bad, ’cause it is (for PvE, PvP is a different beast).

nakoda.4213:

bleeds on crits, burns on crits, vuln on crits, and cripples for near death foes, the FT offers a great deal of dmg output potential.

Bleeds are 3 seconds with only a 30% chance ( times your critical chance, to boot, so more like 13-16% chance per tick), but the lack of an internal cooldown on it seems to make it alright. Grenade attacks with shrapnel have a 38% chance of applying at least 1 stack of bleeding that lasts 15 seconds.

Burns on crit are great, I won’t deny that, but from a PvE perspective it’s pretty bad – a single, smart Guardian in your party can keep a target perma-burning by just pushing F1 when it’s off cooldown (and positioning himself appropriately).

Vulnerability on crits is awful. They last 3 seconds with a 50% chance per crit, so more like 22-27% chance with each tick to apply 1 short-lived vuln stack.

Cripple isn’t bad, great for kiting bosses. But not when they’re near dead, or when something like a traited Throw Wrench (which, until they make Scope work, I immensely advocate) or Elixir F can apply a very solid chunk of cripple in two packets.

And they made lifesteal food stop working with kits. Thanks Anet, now D/D elementalists are even more stupid.

Tested it this evening the life leech potions still trigger off of flame thrower at a very high rate. It gets really crazy high when you use it on multi mobs. with the right build I would not be shocked if you could regen 800-1k a second incombat.

As some one already said the flame throwers auto attack bypasses any solid objects allowing you to corner cut or kite around things while still dealing damage. Because it is not considered a projectile attack it also bypasses all projectile reflect skills that guards love to use.

Any one know if it bypasses the rebound effect of retaliation as well ?

I will have to test later, but no I do not believe it works around the retaliation rebound.

Omnom Ghost Berries are your food of choice, forget the sigil or whatever.

66% chance to heal on crit (with no CD = lots of hps)), 70 pre, 15% exp.

nakoda.4213:

ft#1 hits 10 times in 4 seconds, ft#2 hits up to 10 times every 4.5 seconds.

with a crit heavy build, the duration of the bleed on crit trait is meant to be low to compensate for how often the ft strikes the opponent. this is also why the ft (much to the chagrin of our inner levitican) does not set foes on fire for very long. it would be over powered.

All well and good, if the thing actually worked as it is supposed to. With the added irony that Elixir Gun’s Fumigate (#3) seems to do a much better job with the same mechanic. Between that and the variable behavior of minions, I swear the game is made up of copy and paste spaghetti code.

works fine for me. what exactly are you referring to when you imply that it isn’t working?

Yea….i would like to know why when I am standing still flamethrowing at a catapult and it says miss twice. By twice I mean two full complete blast of flame.

Seetoo.9316:

As for targeting, it doesn’t matter if you have auto target or not. Hold the right mouse button to lock your camera to where you are facing and you will be fine.

What Seetoo said (except for stationery objects which required double left click to target successfully).

because there is a known bug with hitting stationary objects.