Guild Wars 2

The january patch brought some great things to both the engineer and elementalist. While I was enjoying a fairly decent bombs build, I took some time experimentating with the flamethrower since the new january patch, as I enjoyed the flamethrower while leveling.

Strengths:
Cone based autoattack
Conditions just by autoattacking
Barrage based autoattack
Decent utility, combo fields and AaE blind, projectile reflect if you feel courageous

Cons:
Short range
Hard to target structures

Easily the best part about the flamethrower is the mix of an AoE barrage like attack. This allows you to procc things like sigil of might, omnom berry ghosts and skale venom like crazy.

Flame blast doesn’t seem too special either, but once you find the perfect range to both autoattack and flame blast your target damage will be rather impressive, and all of it is AoE too! And with the right sigils and consumables you get a constant stream of might and healing, while pumping out bleeds, burns, vulnerability.

The problem the flamethrower had were that the numbers were rather poor and the hitmarking was bad, but that seems mostly fixed now with the massive buff to all sorts of bundles now with the january patch.

I made a simple picture for a guide, but I welcome you to experiment with it. I took away 10 points personally and put them in tools for speedy kits.

I’d love to hear everyone else’s thoughts on the flamethrower at 80. I’m having a blast so far.

That’s basically the build I have been running since launch. Lots of fun, super happy with the fixes, definitely feeling more powerful post patch.

Flamethrower was god-awful before because it did miserable damage and missed a lot.

Now it’s just bad because it does low damage. The only thing good about it is the 2 (this is for PvE purposes, it’s a different beast in PvP). I’d recommend you go pick up grenade kit or tool kit (or bomb kit, given it has the hardest hitting raw auto of the kits – but only 1 stack of vuln compared to 3 from grenade kit, only 1 chance to proc shrapnel, etc). If you’re running berserker gear, the only reason to even consider flamethrower is the 2, as it hits pretty hard. But, so does Throw Wrench, Prybar, Elixir F, Acid Bomb, Shrapnel/Freeze/Barrage, blunderbuss, and jump shot (I’m assuming you’re showing 2 sigils because you’re wielding pistol/something – which, while 2 sigils are nice, I don’t feel giving up how much damage those 2 rifle skills deal, along with net shot’s INSANELY good control in boss fights, is worth it unless you’re in a situation where you’re only using a kit).

I run 30/10/0/0/30, I have a 47% crit chance before my sigil of precision starts stacking up, and I have 50% fury uptime since I keep eating my medkit’s 5. I just juggle all those abilities I mentioned and spam grenade 1 on downtime, and the damage output is obscene. I just can’t ever justify taking flamethrower in PvE because of how weak it is by comparison (and I’ll admit how awkward it would be for me to try to line up net shot → napalm blast, and then get back into melee range for my prybar / blunderbuss / etc chain, it’s the same issue as using pistol for DPS, you have to stand at 900/1050 range for double hits).

Oh, and ditch the force sigil. If you’ve 30 points in firearms, and you’re using force over something like sigil of fire / air, you just picked up whatever weapon you had and took a screenshot. The might sigil isnt’ bad but you’ll get more damage from even an accuracy sigil if you’re going full berserker (106%+ crit damage, which would translate to a ~6-7% damage increase, more than force is giving you). Actually, it’d be straight up better if you used a sigil of battle (3 stacks that last 20s on weapon swap) than the might one, as the latter has a 2s internal cooldown – meaning you could, at best, have 5 stacks (this is before duration increases), compared to 6 stacks (again, before duration increases, and the latter would be better since it’s 20s base duration as opposed to 10 – and it’s also skill based, rather than luck).

I tried using flamethrower again, and while it’s nice they fixed the missmissmiss, it’s still our worst kit by a significant margin, even with the 15% damage trait. You’re getting < 400 damage per tick on that? That’s < 4k over 2 seconds (I’m assuming you were showing crits on those numbers). That’s pretty terrible compared to even the grenade auto (which is less than the bomb, given that bomb is slightly faster on the attack, and, again, has higher base). I know you want to bring up burning – don’t. Having one guardian who knows what they’re doing in your group completely obsoletes the condition, as he’ll have it up, at the very worst, 25 out of every 30 seconds, and at the best way over 100% uptime. Only exceptions I can think of are things like Alpha who purges conditions every few seconds, and even then you’re pulling out 1 tick of burning. So 4.7-5k.

Oh, I’m well aware of grenade kit and bomb kit being far better alternatives.
But flamethrower isn’t unplayable any more, which is a start.

I prefer bombs over grenades personally to stack everyone with might, slight healing and tons of combo fields.

But I know people love the flamethrower and wish it wasn’t so horrible, so there you have it.

#2, despite its problems with obstructions, is good for an opener. It rolls out just a little farther than the cone and to watch it crit is very satisfying.

Napalm, in my eyes, should be a circle of fire, just like the elementalist. I know that the reason why they made it a line is for recognition. Screw that. Give us the circle!

not everyone wants to be the cookie cutter grenade engineer so stop saying to pick the kitten trait up.

Ugh, I personally can’t stand grenades…they are so boring, just sitting there spamming away with them.

I like gernades…underwater. My flamethrower dosn’t work down there.

I haven’t tried the flamer yet since patch but i was thinking of trying a deadly mixture build. If your stacking might and are using medkit, you should take enhance performance and with a sigil of battle instead of force you could easily keep 15+ stacks of might. Although I never take medkit unless I have points in tools for the reduction to heal self.

I’ve been running grenades/e-gun rifle build for dungeons, and am getting tired of grenades again. But there is something to be said for sitting WAY in the back and still being able to out DPS ppl. With the flamethrower I feel like I need to be kind of Tanky because of the limited range. Maybe the new exotic Cavaliers trinkets at the balthazar temple would be good to pair with it.

Kamahl.3621:

snip

I play nearly the same glass cannon build! A glass cannon shouldn’t use a flamethrower because it’s more defensive way of combat, just like how a defensive engineer shouldn’t be using grenades.

Flamethrower doesn’t have damage. It’s just not there no matter how you look at it. What it do have is some pretty decent support skills like a fire field, an aoe passive blind, and a 15s cooldown cone push.

Retaliation still murders flamethrowers like no tomorrow :c
If you are looking for damage, grenades are where its at.

LieutenantGoogle.7326:

If you are looking for damage, grenades are where its at.

Yeah! And you will have deal with the same retaliation and, additionally, with the reflect projective skills - it’s soooo cool, especially after Grenade Barrage &gt;&lt;

And any good plyer will evade of your grenades... just walking! not even running &gt;&lt;

SilverWF.4789:

And any good plyer will evade of your grenades… just walking! not even running ><

If you’re talking about sPvP, you can always set it up with the lowest cooldown root in the game to land your freeze grenades. After that, you should be landing every grenade. Overcharged shot works as backup. c:

Why you created this post? Nothing useful here - just emotions...

In the berserker you will be the source of the ’good number’ and will be oneshotted in the seconds.

Bynji.1907:

Strengths:
Cone based autoattack
Conditions just by autoattacking
Barrage based autoattack
Decent utility, combo fields and AaE blind, projectile reflect if you feel courageous

Cone AA have most of classes but with bigger AOE targets limit.
Conditions at AA have any class
barrage based - have many classes and it will becomes nightmare after you will meet with some retaliationed enemies.
it have many classes too and much better utility, fields, traits...

Bynji.1907:

constant stream of might

tested it nearly 1 hour in the Mysts. Two pistols with ’30% gain Might...’ sigils in each hand. best result: 14 stacks after 5 minutes(!!!!!) of continous barraging pack of golems. 7 stacks from that stacks - from the Juggernaut trait. So I didnt see any "constant streams"

Warrior have that stream:
it will be enough to use one skill into the zerg to gain 30 sec of Fury - Bladetrail (12 sec CD!!!)
after that use whirlwind attack (8 sec CD!) in the zerg and you will have 25 stacks after that combo.
Add here ’For great justice’ and ’signet of rage’ - will you talk about ’good skills’ anymore?

Kamahl.3621:

SilverWF.4789:

And any good plyer will evade of your grenades... just walking! not even running &gt;&lt;

If you’re talking about sPvP, you can always set it up with the lowest cooldown root in the game to land your freeze grenades. After that, you should be landing every grenade. Overcharged shot works as backup. c:

I’m talking about main part of the game - WvWvW. Because WWW this game have so many servers and big popularity.

Lowest cooldown? Not, Necro have the same CD, but his skill is more usable. Elem have 2 times more CD with staff, but his skill more usable too. With daggers - he have lowest CD on chill.

Forget about grenades:
this thread about FT
after they had mindless nerf grenades - this is nearly useless kit.

Anyway, you can use anything you want - always love if our enemies have a lot of weak classes (Engi, Ranger, etc...)

we get it guys grenade or die amirite .. if you aren’t grenade then you are playing the engineer wrong. so all of us should respec into the 100nade spec or else we suck.

SilverWF.4789:

Lowest cooldown? Not, Necro have the same CD, but his skill is more usable. Elem have 2 times more CD with staff, but his skill more usable too. With daggers – he have lowest CD on chill.

It’s hard to take you seriously when you don’t know what you’re talking about. Dark Pact has a 25s cooldown, immobilizes for one more second, and does some damage (it also has no travel time, which is very nice). Elementalist root is a 2s root on a 30s cooldown. Engineer has [holy crap there’s so many roots] to choose from, the only one another class has that’s even remotely comparable is Throw Bolas, as it has the same uptime percentage (4s out of 20s, whereas net shot is 2s out of 10s). Engineer also has the longest lasting chill on a 20s cooldown (freeze grenade, 6s base duration, although it will be 7.5 if you have grenadier and 30 points into explosives), and also a very high uptime as a result.

Kamahl.3621:

Oh, and ditch the force sigil. If you’ve 30 points in firearms, and you’re using force over something like sigil of fire / air, you just picked up whatever weapon you had and took a screenshot. The might sigil isnt’ bad but you’ll get more damage from even an accuracy sigil if you’re going full berserker (106%+ crit damage, which would translate to a ~6-7% damage increase, more than force is giving you).

It’s not absolutely true that Accuracy yields more damage than Force. Depending on how much +Crit Damage gear you have, there will be a critical chance % below which the additional 5% from Accuracy will result in a higher expected value, and above which the +5% damage from Force pulls ahead. The more +Crit Damage gear you have, the higher that critical chance % is, but even with +50% crit damage (for 200% crit damage total), that critical value is only 50% chance to crit. Anything above that, 5% damage is worth more than 5% crit.

I haven’t looked at on-crit sigils and how they affect the expected value, yet. The PvP’er in me says they’re worth the burst when they proc, though I’m very curious about what the math would say about it, especially with the internal cooldown.

I love flamethrower. Use it all the time. But I went with a slightly different trait line that I find quite effective. 0/30/0/30/10.

We go 30 into firearms because having a high crit rate is essential to this build. Plus you are applying burns constantly, so the +300 to condition is primary. We grab “Precise Sights”, a great trait that combined with your high crit will have you stacking vulnerability on your targets like crazy. “Napalm Specialist” next because you want your burns to last as long as possible. Then Juggernaut, because this is a flamethrower build. The real strength of Juggernaut is in the might gain. At least 15 seconds before battle try to switch to the FT kit as it takes a bit for the might to build to 6.

I went 30 into Alchemy. The vitality is important as you need health to stay alive in close quarters combat, and concentration is invaluable because this build is all about keeping boons up and on. I go with HGH, Deadly Mixture, and Self-Regulating Defenses. HGH is an AMAZING trait, although not very glamorous seeming at first. HGH will actually give TWO might boons for 20 seconds every time you use an Elixir ability. So that includes Elixir B, the tool belt skills, Elixir U, and Elixir H. Between all three utility skills and their tool belt skills, you can keep your might up around 11-14 which is very strong. Deadly mixture gives you that 15% dam increase for flamethrower, but the hidden gem of the alchemy trait line imo is Energy Conversion Matrix (deal 1% extra dam for each boon on you). So if you have might up to 14, that means a 14% dam increase. Then add in all the other boons Elixir B / U/ H gives and you’re looking at an 18% increase at times.

Lastly, I put 10 points into tools. Tools is a weaker trait line but that 10% to crit dam is VERY effective with our high crit % and Adrenaline Pump helps when we need to leap back to safety. The big pick up here is “Speedy Kits”. This instant speed boost when you switch to Flame Thrower is VERY useful for rushing in fast and chasing down foes. Or you can do kit refinement and use the nades kit with the FT kit, switching to nades when you need a quick blast.

Sporadicus.1028:

Napalm, in my eyes, should be a circle of fire, just like the elementalist. I know that the reason why they made it a line is for recognition. Screw that. Give us the circle!

Napalm should be…

…all over the place!

Well, I recently found out that runes that increase might duration can stack, which means you can have a permanent 10 stacks of might with the flamethrower kit. (since boon duration is capped at 100%) Add elixir B and HGH for a permanent 14-15 stacks of might, and the healing elixir for another might stack (assuming you throw elixirs whenever possible) Just add sigils and be a pyromaniac that surpasses the flame legion.

Nice tip Ganondwarf! What runes do you recommend for might stacking? And I’m also curious what sigils people are using with flamethrower. For runes I went with Superior Rune of the Flame Legion:

(1): +25 Power
(2): +15% Burning duration
(3): +50 Power
(4): 5% chance to cause burning for 1s when hit. (cooldown: 5s)
(5): +90 Power
(6): +5% damage against burning targets.

And for Sigil on my rifle I went with Superior Sigil of Earth to stack bleed even more cuz my crit % hits 64% with Elixir B added in.

+60% Chance on Critical: Inflict Bleeding (5 Seconds)

But I’m thinking I might mix it up with the runes and sigils to try something different. Maybe Sigil of Smoldering? Or Sigil of Force?

For Might stacking you could go with:
2x Rune of Strength
2x Rune of Hoelbrak
2x Rune of Fire

I prefer Sigil of Fire when rolling with FT, but some like Blood or one of the Might sigils.

FT is always more fun than using grenades. Think that game is not always about having better damage, stats etc. I am mostly grenade user too but I love FT more than any kit.

Is the Sigil of fire AOE flame blast localized on the player or the target?

Entropy.4732:

Is the Sigil of fire AOE flame blast localized on the player or the target?

on the affected by crit enemy

Entropy.4732:

but the hidden gem of the alchemy trait line imo is Energy Conversion Matrix (deal 1% extra dam for each boon on you). So if you have might up to 14, that means a 14% dam increase.

No, might is one boon, no matter how many stacks you have = only +1% extra damage

I just posted in another thread an easy to play FT build:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/engineer/Pistol-or-Rifle-FT-build/first#post1339260

This could be played by a drunk monkey. Faceroll your elixirs and autoattack.
But playing this build a bit has alerted me to the core deficiency of FT, and why in my opinion it will never be seriously powerful. Because its autoattack needs to be channeled and there’s a big packet (burning) attached at the end of it.
Normally I play like this: fire an ability, dodge, fire an ability, switch kit, fire an ability. This pattern gets much more difficult with 2 sec cast abilities. If you dodge in the middle of flamer autoattck you lose a lot of damage, especially because the burning comes at the end. Then there’s also the fact that it only hits 3 enemies, that makes it less useful at clearing adds (like grubs spawned from undead giants).

Entropy.4732:

I love flamethrower. Use it all the time. But I went with a slightly different trait line that I find quite effective. 0/30/0/30/10.

We go 30 into firearms because having a high crit rate is essential to this build. Plus you are applying burns constantly, so the +300 to condition is primary. We grab “Precise Sights”, a great trait that combined with your high crit will have you stacking vulnerability on your targets like crazy. “Napalm Specialist” next because you want your burns to last as long as possible. Then Juggernaut, because this is a flamethrower build. The real strength of Juggernaut is in the might gain. At least 15 seconds before battle try to switch to the FT kit as it takes a bit for the might to build to 6.

I went 30 into Alchemy. The vitality is important as you need health to stay alive in close quarters combat, and concentration is invaluable because this build is all about keeping boons up and on. I go with HGH, Deadly Mixture, and Self-Regulating Defenses. HGH is an AMAZING trait, although not very glamorous seeming at first. HGH will actually give TWO might boons for 20 seconds every time you use an Elixir ability. So that includes Elixir B, the tool belt skills, Elixir U, and Elixir H. Between all three utility skills and their tool belt skills, you can keep your might up around 11-14 which is very strong. Deadly mixture gives you that 15% dam increase for flamethrower, but the hidden gem of the alchemy trait line imo is Energy Conversion Matrix (deal 1% extra dam for each boon on you). So if you have might up to 14, that means a 14% dam increase. Then add in all the other boons Elixir B / U/ H gives and you’re looking at an 18% increase at times.

Lastly, I put 10 points into tools. Tools is a weaker trait line but that 10% to crit dam is VERY effective with our high crit % and Adrenaline Pump helps when we need to leap back to safety. The big pick up here is “Speedy Kits”. This instant speed boost when you switch to Flame Thrower is VERY useful for rushing in fast and chasing down foes. Or you can do kit refinement and use the nades kit with the FT kit, switching to nades when you need a quick blast.

Boon and condition stacks count as 1 boon or 1 condition as far as removal and “gain X per each condition/boon”.

Napalm specialist is pointless if you don’t stack constant burning. Because the FT autoattack burning will last 15% longer, it will last 1.15 sec, which does exactly the same damage as 1 sec burning.

Might stacking is not super useful, as the power going into the HORRIBLE scaling on FT means about nothing.

FT is a defensive kit really. As unintuitive as that sounds.

Casia.4281:

Might stacking is not super useful, as the power going into the HORRIBLE scaling on FT means about nothing.

FT is a defensive kit really. As unintuitive as that sounds.

True that. I’ve noticed I get much more effect from might stacks when I switch from FT to rifle or even pistols.
With the exception of rifle, engineer power scaling is pretty bad on most weapons/kits.

Chaba.5410:

Sporadicus.1028:

Napalm, in my eyes, should be a circle of fire, just like the elementalist. I know that the reason why they made it a line is for recognition. Screw that. Give us the circle!

Napalm should be…

…all over the place!

I’d imagine napalm ability to work like elixir gun 4 but with fire field. I don’t know why this isn’t the case (and put something else on elixir gun).

Casia.4281:

Might stacking is not super useful, as the power going into the HORRIBLE scaling on FT means about nothing.

FT is a defensive kit really. As unintuitive as that sounds.

I really beg to differ on this one. Defensive kit??? That’s bookah logic. I’ve noticed a big uptick in numbers when the might is on verses when there is no might (plus I switch back to rifle and grenade kit frequently so whatever scaling happens, it’s offset). And using FT as offensive kit works quite well for me. All it needs is a little kick from time to time and the right play style. If you use Elixir U & B before FT 1 you can peel off 3 FT 1’s in the time of 1 normal one. Does a lot of dam and very effective. Plus, if you strafe left and right while blasting a big group you can flame a ton of people simultaneously and without an annoying red circle to let folks know where not to stand. FT works the best when you are in a group in WVW facing off another group. And it’s amazing for preventing rezzing and finishing off 3-4 downed foes simultaneously.

As per one boon stack = 1 boon for the purposes of Energy Conversion Matrix, I stand corrected. But if you’re a big Elixir drinker, it’s still a good trait, even at 4-5% boost.

Entropy.4732:

Casia.4281:

Might stacking is not super useful, as the power going into the HORRIBLE scaling on FT means about nothing.

FT is a defensive kit really. As unintuitive as that sounds.

I really beg to differ on this one. Defensive kit??? That’s bookah logic.

I agree with Entropy here. You will be hard pressed to logically convince the general population that a might stacking AoE kit is a purely defensive kit.

tested the “new” FT in WvW.
Complete bull, 400 range low dmg, crappy targetting or aoe cone whatever you wanna call it.
Maybe for the ppl that run fractals / pve / farm / anything else than WvW can be good.

Although FT is a terrible kit in terms of viability, it’s my favorite kit in terms of “fun”. Every time we get a patch that changes the kit, I immediately go re-trait for it and set Orr on fire for a couple of hours. I think the last 2 bug-related gripes I have with the kit are thus:

1. The range on skill #1 is shorter than the animation. The flame cone also truncates when you run forward (which I don’t believe that Ele D/ Drake’s Breath or Cone of Cold, or my Guard’s /Torch Cleansing Flame do, can’t check right now). This makes FT #1 a little more unwieldy than it needs to be.

2. The entire kit is still inconsistent as heck for hitting breakable objects if you move forward or backward at all.

Entropy.4732:

Casia.4281:

Might stacking is not super useful, as the power going into the HORRIBLE scaling on FT means about nothing.

FT is a defensive kit really. As unintuitive as that sounds.

I really beg to differ on this one. Defensive kit??? That’s bookah logic. I’ve noticed a big uptick in numbers when the might is on verses when there is no might (plus I switch back to rifle and grenade kit frequently so whatever scaling happens, it’s offset). And using FT as offensive kit works quite well for me. All it needs is a little kick from time to time and the right play style. If you use Elixir U & B before FT 1 you can peel off 3 FT 1’s in the time of 1 normal one. Does a lot of dam and very effective. Plus, if you strafe left and right while blasting a big group you can flame a ton of people simultaneously and without an annoying red circle to let folks know where not to stand. FT works the best when you are in a group in WVW facing off another group. And it’s amazing for preventing rezzing and finishing off 3-4 downed foes simultaneously.

As per one boon stack = 1 boon for the purposes of Energy Conversion Matrix, I stand corrected. But if you’re a big Elixir drinker, it’s still a good trait, even at 4-5% boost.

FT has horrible scaling. Among the worst in the game offensively.
Stacking +damage doesn’t do much to fix FT becuase the problem is SCALING. Point for point, each point of power, crit, and cond is worth less with FT then it is for other weapons.
Opportunity costs. Gearing, fooding, etc for +duration in order to get higher stacks of might with juggernaut, comes at the price of some OTHER set bonus, or food bonus.
So, you can either feed into FT’s worst stat, in an effort to make kitten poor become mediocre. or you can feed into FT’s good stat, and make its defensive tools even stronger.

imo FT needs channel time on #1 cut to 1,5-1,75s

1. needs to be fixed so it doesn’t go udnerground or unexplode + range reduction to 450 down from 600
2. is perfect
3. is pretty decent
4. should have bigger radius and pulse ~3 times. Maybe 25s cd to offset

Silentsins.3726:

Although FT is a terrible kit in terms of viability, it’s my favorite kit in terms of “fun”. Every time we get a patch that changes the kit, I immediately go re-trait for it and set Orr on fire for a couple of hours. I think the last 2 bug-related gripes I have with the kit are thus:

1. The range on skill #1 is shorter than the animation. The flame cone also truncates when you run forward (which I don’t believe that Ele D/ Drake’s Breath or Cone of Cold, or my Guard’s /Torch Cleansing Flame do, can’t check right now). This makes FT #1 a little more unwieldy than it needs to be.

2. The entire kit is still inconsistent as heck for hitting breakable objects if you move forward or backward at all.

It’s not shorter than the animation, That depends on the size of character. For my human it is actually preciselly where animation ends.

Killyox.3950:

It’s not shorter than the animation, That depends on the size of character. For my human it is actually preciselly where animation ends.

Quite informative. As you can see, I’m a tall Sylvari, but how did that make my animation bigger than even a short human? I wonder how it works out for the 3 other races (especially asura)?

That being said, my #1 concern is more of a minor quality of life thing. My #2 is more performance-affecting.

Casia.4281:

FT has horrible scaling. Among the worst in the game offensively.
Stacking +damage doesn’t do much to fix FT becuase the problem is SCALING. Point for point, each point of power, crit, and cond is worth less with FT then it is for other weapons.

I think there’s just some minor miscommunication going on here. If you’re saying that FT is a jack-of-all-trades kit, but the offensive aspects of it are underpowered to the point of being below consideration, I could get on board with that.

I’ve begun thinking of FT as less of a full kit and more of an Air-Blast-on-a-stick. 15 seconds is a great cooldown for an AoE knockback.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Knockback
It helps to think of it in terms of another, more different http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Throw_Mine . In those terms, you’re trading a blast finisher for a -3 second on the knockback cooldown, an additional instant blind (Smoke Vent), and positive synergy with kit refinement.

Bynji.1907:

I’d love to hear everyone else’s thoughts on the flamethrower at 80. I’m having a blast so far.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQFAUlIqSYn1yuF17IxIFd+zgeA46eXRKyfjB;T4Ag0ynEOJdS9kyJqhMDJGyOkbI5QjIOZA

Air Blast provides knockback redundancy with Overcharged shot, allowing the latter to be saved as condition removal, and to sometimes send an enemy REALLY far when they’re used together.

The FT kit refinement is arguably the best part about the FT, providing an on-demand aoe burn and a condition removal (likely bugged, but who knows?). Between the kit refinement swaps for FT and elixir gun + Super Elixir for point removal, Overcharged shot for snares, and healing turret for condition bombs, the 3rd U slot is freed up for a stunbreak. Omnom ghost bars and the sigil give you something to exploit all that extra crit with. All this would be decent if FT damage was reasonable!

Despite all those positives, I still consider FT to be third best in role: It’s basically an anti-melee melee kit on a class with only 1 gap closer. This is the same problem that bomb kit and tool kit have, except that bomb kit has BoB, smoke bomb, and glue bomb as excellent standalone reasons to bring the kit, and the last 3 bomb skills scale better than FT for both power and condition damage. Toolkit is perhaps best-in-class of the 3 (except in condition builds. that belongs to bombs) with the same strengths and weaknesses, except Gear Shield, Throw Wrench, and Magnet give you something to do against ranged enemies without leaving the kit.

I feel that while better damage would make the Flamethrower viable, it will need more than just that to make it competitive with the utility of our other kits.

With all the skills the engineer has, you shouldn’t be spending too much of your time autoattacking. Yes, FT #1 is weak as hell, so just use it a bit for proccing some crit effects then switch to something else with higher damage and go back to it when everything else is on cooldown. Use it with an omnomberry pie.

Volstag.6371:

I like gernades…underwater. My flamethrower dosn’t work down there.

This ^

I can’t stand nades on land because i have to manually press 1 for every. single. auto.