How to kill thief in pvp?

How to kill thief in pvp?

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Posted by: fallingleaf.1036

fallingleaf.1036

Q:

I mainly use rifle, which I think good for pve and most of pvp situation. But pvp against a thief seems impossible to me.
A thief always comes invisible and then does a lot of damage in short time before going invisible again. What do I need to do?
Any tip is appreciated.
PS: Just made a new build with rifle and trait as 10,30,30,0,0. The idea is to increase some toughness for survival. Would it beany good?

(edited by fallingleaf.1036)

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Posted by: Zil.7642

Zil.7642

A:

Killing a thief is actually quite simple.

Let me start by saying gear is king in pvp. You can be skilled but if you fight someone with full exotic you will lose. I happen to have full exotic so it makes it even easier to kill thieves.

Elixir S is your friend, I always have it on me in PvP. If you see a thief, or warrior, start spinning around about to dish out crazy damage just pop it… immune. As soon as a thief gets to you use overcharged shot, get them away! net them, jump shot to them then blunderbuss. they will probably go stealth again, either use Toss Elixir S and hope it gives you stealth or plant your rocket turret and then trigger it’s explosive rockets. This gives you an additional knockdown so when they pop out of stealth they will fall. Look at your CDs, jump shot, blunderbuss, overcharged, net.. you get the idea.

Basically stay mobile, knockdown/away, use immune when you need to. I also don’t agree with 10-30-30 build. I won’t tell you my build but you should check out Alchemy 10 points skill IV. Instant Elixir S (immunity) at 25% health. This not only prevents you from taking damage but it buys you a few seconds for your cooldowns. Maybe your health pot just came off CD, or overcharged shot, this could save your life.

I also usually carry Elixir B with me for many reasons, one being it has Retaliation for 11 seconds. This just puts more damage back at the thief. If you need to use Suppy crate for another ranged stun which you could follow up with a jump shot/net/anything. Supply crate also gives you a net turret to stop the thief from moving.

I realize this is a long winded post but it’s a brief explanation on how to fight a thief and come out on top. Criticize if you want to but I laugh at thieves all day, hope this helps.

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Posted by: Ferum Flamebender.5910

Ferum Flamebender.5910

I acutally was asking myself the same question. I always get killed by thieves. They always go invisible, spam a enormous amount of damag and go underground again!
I always try to hit them with my flamethrower, but it’s not really a ‘thiev killer’

Aetra Ironbender, Rated E for Engineer- [WoT] Warlocks of Tyria- Far Shiverpeaks

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Posted by: fallingleaf.1036

fallingleaf.1036

That’s actually right. I used to use Elixir S a lot for pvp but I haven’t played pvp for quite a while and forgot this one………
And as to 10,30,30 build, I figured it is kind of weird choice~

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Posted by: Gillysan.1962

Gillysan.1962

LOL at the “trade secrets”, we all have access to the same things and playing with builds is not rocket science.

The note about equipment does indeed help quite a bit. Remember exotics are max stats, don’t get side tracked by Legendary gear, just a different skin but same stats as crafted exotics.

Get superior runes, you can find reasonably priced ones in the TP. Doesn’t have to be the popular expensive ones right away.

Experiment with your builds freely, it’s not that expensive to respec, only 3s at level 80.

At this time (like I said, I change from time to time) I’m using a rifle to get the weapon achievement and have found it fairly effective in wvw.
(change roman numeral as you see fit)
20 Firearms: Rifled Barrels/Kneeshot/? + Go For the Eyes
20 Invention: Protective Shield/Cloaking Device/Energized Armor + Energized Armor/Elite Supplies
30 Alchemy: Self-Regulating Defenses + Cleaning Formula + Automated Response

Utilities:
Elixir B
Utility Goggles/Personal Battering Ram/Net Turret/play around with this
Thumper Turret(love the knockback)

If the battle goes long I’ll rifle net my opponent and Overcharged Shot(#4) them back my Thumper Turret and fling em in the air again. If a thief doesn’t kill me right away, usually with help, I find them running for their lives. Thieves really don’t scare me at all, pretty much nothing scares me 1v1.

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Posted by: Luisedgm.2375

Luisedgm.2375

Against kitten heartseeker thieves:

1. Get bomb, grenade kits and full exotic gear
2. As soon as the thief sees you and pop stealth drop confusion and smoke bombs
3. Drop the big bomb when he pop up behind you
4. The thief will damage himself in the confusion and miss the backstab due to smoke
5. Right before the big bomb explodes do a grenade barrage
6. thats a 10-15k burst damage if you have full zerker exotics, the thief is dead or badly damaged
7. finish him while he is still knocked down due to the big bomb

Against good thieves:

A heavy burst build (static discharge) and good enough reflexes to deal 15k damage before he does that to you

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Posted by: coglin.1496

coglin.1496

I just hit my #4 skill with the shield half the time and let them kill themselves. The ones using the melee attacks I use #4 skill twice to bounce em back then stunn em with my shield. PBR, slick shoes, rocket boots all work well too, But I really like BoB and bobs on them as I stay just out of there range.

I do not find thieves to be any harder then any other class, but if you notice in all of the repetitive threads never seem to originate with those who use a shield.

Poor craftsman blame their tools. Poor players blame their Engineer.

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Posted by: Choops.3710

Choops.3710

Bleed damage. Something as small as a few stacks of bleed have sometimes been enough to bring a thief down to half health, have him use his his stealth heal, wait til he pops out again and re-apply bleeds.

Pikachoops – Engineer, Fort Aspenwood

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Posted by: Zinwrath.2049

Zinwrath.2049

I dont WVW and it seems a lot of tips are for that, in SPVP theifs are “imo” one of the easiest encoutner to deal with on engineer. Your only concern is if you decided to go glass cannon and they go glass cannon with backstab spec. Then its a coin toss but if you survive the initial attack they are even squishier and a few attacks regardless of spec should take em down.

For every other spec, i dont beleive there is even a method…slick shoes does destroy mellee theifs who invis though, they will just keep tripping trying to chase you.

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Posted by: Kat.5982

Kat.5982

Thieves are not easy to kill, and anyone who tells you they are is greatly exaggerating their prowess. However, that doesn’t mean you can’t put up a good fight. There have been a number of strategies posted, but really, build doesn’t matter as much as play. If you can survive their burst and avoid as much of the damage as possible, you have a good shot at winning.

Avoiding the initiation is difficult but possible if you see them coming. Try to always be aware of your surroundings. Pan your camera constantly when roaming, and as much as possible during fights. This will give you a good shot at seeing the thief stealth, and when you do, it’s time to dump your defensive abilities. Lay down cripples, use shield abilities, move around unpredictably, and if the thief does manage to backstab you, blow your elixir S before you take too much damage.

If you manage to counter the thief’s initiation, you have a very good shot in the ensuing fight. That doesn’t mean you’ll kill him since thieves are stupid and have so many escape abilities it’s impossible for them to die unless they mess up, but at least you won’t die either.

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Posted by: fallingleaf.1036

fallingleaf.1036

Thanks for all the above tips.
I think I got a lot better just by switching to Elixir s. Now I can pretty much tease two enemies at the same time or kill one without much difficulty.
Here are two more questions:
1. Net shot is kinda slow and most of experienced players can dodge it. I only use it after the overcharged shot knocks down the enemy. Or it works only when I catch someone off guarded. When do you guys shoot the net?
2. The shield. I like the idea of using shied against melee classes but the CD (25s and 30s) seems too long to me?

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Posted by: Karast.1927

Karast.1927

The key to thieves especially D/D is having a stun break on your bar. I tend to fight them with rifle – healing turret – tool kit – net turret – elixir S.

I hit elixir S as soon as the pop, swap to tool hit and then hit pry bar and then channel a block kitten fades. After that its net shot, tool belt net, deploy net turret jumpshot blunder buss overcharged skill on net turret, overcharged shot, net shot ((typically ded by now))

I noticed the net turret will often continue to target them in stealth, which is really handy.

The only issue you might have is if your full on glass cannon with poor vit / toughness a good thief with lucky crits and buffs your 2 shot you before you hit elixir S. Which is the main reason full on berzerkers is a bit risky.

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Posted by: Nepocrates.3642

Nepocrates.3642

I always die when I get CC and thieve are good at that. But if I maintain my mobility I can fight him off or even kill dem thieves.

@ZIL
good tips

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Posted by: Ferum Flamebender.5910

Ferum Flamebender.5910

Well, one of the problems of the engineer is, you can’t switch weapons. Leaving alone if that is unfair, its a complete diffirent discussion, playing with rifle is best for killing thieves. But what if i want to play dual pistol or pistol shield? You won’t have such an effective snare like net shot neither you have a dk (distance-keeper) like overcharged shot.
You’ll always have an advantage playing with a rifle.

Aetra Ironbender, Rated E for Engineer- [WoT] Warlocks of Tyria- Far Shiverpeaks

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Posted by: Nepocrates.3642

Nepocrates.3642

Well, one of the problems of the engineer is, you can’t switch weapons. Leaving alone if that is unfair, its a complete diffirent discussion, playing with rifle is best for killing thieves. But what if i want to play dual pistol or pistol shield? You won’t have such an effective snare like net shot neither you have a dk (distance-keeper) like overcharged shot.
You’ll always have an advantage playing with a rifle.

I play pistol/shield and use gadget to get my CC. Personal battering ram and rocket boots. Shield stuns, hit my ram the launch it. Yes there are issue with it but so far and have been good with it.

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Posted by: Kat.5982

Kat.5982

It isn’t worth going pistol/shield unless your build is meant for it. I run rifle but use the toolkit for one of my utilities. Gives me cripple field on activation, a second cripple field on the bar, and a 2 second block everything shield ability, as well as one of the best tool belt abilities.

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Posted by: Nepocrates.3642

Nepocrates.3642

@kat
I disagree and agree. I was speced at level 80 power precision rifle build but wanted to try pistol and shield. I did WWW with it and had a blast it was effective for my play style. However I do get you point.

Question what do you mean you get a cripple field on activation? Tool kit never has given me a cripple field. The pry bar I love and the tool belt skill is just SO COOL

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Posted by: Kat.5982

Kat.5982

It’s called kit refinement, lvl 10 trait in the tool line. Gives each of your kits an ability when you activate it. I run med kit, tool kit, and grenade kit. Med kit gives you a small pbaoe boom, tool kit is the ‘2’ skill, and grenade kit sends out a ton of grenades around you that do a lot of damage. The med kit ability is mediocre, but the other two are extremely nice.

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Posted by: Nepocrates.3642

Nepocrates.3642

Wow how did I miss that one .. DOH! thanks Kat

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Posted by: coglin.1496

coglin.1496

Thieves are not easy to kill, and anyone who tells you they are is greatly exaggerating their prowess.

Thieves are as easy to kill as any class. They have light armor and are at the bottom rung of the ladder in Hp pools. They are no harder to kill then any other class.

Poor craftsman blame their tools. Poor players blame their Engineer.

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Posted by: Yukishiro.8792

Yukishiro.8792

Turrets will often target through stealth so that’s a cheap but effective way to deal with thieves. Supply drop combines turrets with a ground target stun which is extremely effective too.

If you run constant swiftness + vigor you have enough dodges to really mess with them. Combined with all the blindness abilities an engi has access to you can make a thief have a very hard time ganking you.

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Posted by: Slan.5496

Slan.5496

I’m currently running a pistol/shield build that uses grenades. Today I ended up in a match against a backstab style thief. Not sure if this guy was any good but a strategy that worked really well was hitting the #5 power (2 second stun/block) right as he was coming in to attack. Then he wa stunned for 2 seconds, at which point I immediately switched to grenades and cut loose point blank with as many as I could. That was pretty effective in mowing him down. Then if he ran I stacked bleeds with the pistol.

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Posted by: Yukishiro.8792

Yukishiro.8792

If you can hit a thief with all 3 chill grenades it is pretty much GG if they don’t have a conditional removal skill available. Especially if you have perma swiftness.

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Posted by: Csaj.2750

Csaj.2750

Was a no kit rifleman for a while so I know what your dealing with. The issue is not with most thieves if they don’t invis every 5 seconds you should be able to survive until they are visible and we do well at CC at that point.

The issue lays in the ones exploiting the 100% invis builds (invis every 5-7 sec because attacking while invis [in WvW at least] only brings them out of invis on their screen, the uninvis message is in a queue of lots of other messages waiting its turn to be sent to all the enemies they are attacking while still invis.
The no kit rifleman is very weak against this as we don’t have much AoE. I ran around with an Ele to solve this and eventually gave in and started using the grenadier setup and all of a sudden I don’t have an issue with thieves anymore unless i’m busy killing someone and they sneak in to attack while i’m distracted. (i could probably survive this but I get serious tunnel vision that gets me killed alot)

I suggest power vitality toughness build for max survivability, and turrets for extra AoE’s when you explode them. Be sure to take the tool belt skills cause static discharge skill because both detonating your turrets and firing their tool belt skills send a static discharge. Just pick a target other than the thief and kill it while dropping your turrets and blowing them up for static discharge and the thief will get AoEed or have to stay back. If your 1v1 against an invis thief use the turrets explode mode as extra AoE and move towards your other party/guild members. I could usually last several minutes if they stayed away from the AoE or kill them if they attacked anyway. Net and rifle turrets are lowest recharge times, thumper turret special ability can be used as another AoE and its tool belt is an AoE and a blast finisher used with your med turret tool belt skill for AoE healing.

It is rough without kits. I dislike being just like everyone else but when you have one option that is just so above and beyond other options its hard to stay strong and cripple yourself for long.

Quote: “Thieves are as easy to kill as any class. They have light armor and are at the bottom rung of the ladder in Hp pools. They are no harder to kill then any other class.”
Theives wear medium armor just like us. And have have lots of the greatest armor currently availible (invisibility).

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Posted by: Terrahero.9358

Terrahero.9358

Here is the short and dirty. If he is half-competent you will not kill him. At best he will simply run away.
All these “amazing” tip “yah i drop my smokebomb and he just cant hit with the backstab” ow really? and why on earth would he not wait a few seconds before he opens on you? Thats the Thief being an idiot there.

Your best bet is that the Thief is a buttonsmashing monkey, and that is a safe bet since most of them are. Use something to survive the opening burst, and then turn around and put a ton of presure on him. Using CCs are an absolute must. Letting the Thief slip back into yet another stealth so it can get the initiative again is suicide.

My best bet is, break out of the opening burst and overcharge shot him. Followed by a netshot and then i unload everything. Grenade Barrage, Throw Wrench, Blunderbuss. Often they slip into stealth, just keep shooting. After about 5sec a downed Thief appears on the floor.

But again, he can slip into stealth and with Steal instantly teleport to you without you seeing him comming. The CnD combo is already half your health gone and he hasnt even appeared on your screen yet. Dont think for one second you can reliable fight this.
Its why Bunkerbuilds are popular. If you want a solid anti-glasscannon playstyle look into turning yourself into a bunker.

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Posted by: CC Ivonne.6782

CC Ivonne.6782

Community Coordinator

Hello everybody,
the original question has already been answered, so the thread will be locked.
Thanks for understanding.