Guild Wars 2

Can this be a thing? We have mobile spirits, banners that can be moved (w/o inducing recharge), venoms that can be AoE, Auras that can be shared, spirits that can walk, etc – but my turrets don’t have wheels!?

I was very sad because i’m an engineer and would like that option. Also – why not give us a mace weapon class – I kinda wanna clobber someone with a wrench >.>

i think having mobile turrets will be too much and in any case turret are quite fast to deply so if you move you can deploy that again . For mace i think that traited wrench is really ok for melee and our profession is not a melee one

been asking for this for 2 years now man. They can’t even make the timers when we pick these things up on par with the timers for traps, rune fields, summons or spirits. I really don’t think anyone plays this class on the dev side of things.

Even the removal of conditions isn’t on par in timing with other classes automatic removal system, we have to wait 15 seconds before trying an overload while other classes have not one but 2 sets of 10 second cooldown automatic removal options.

They may have low recharges, but it’s still more annoying to have to pick them up and then wait on a recharge :/

As for the mace idea – I was thinking more along the lines of using “Fixer Upper” though :/ – or other “tools” an engineer would use in real life

Oh gosh no turret enig is ok due to its lack of mobility and even now so many player are raging about. Give turrets mobility and the biggest kitten storm with befall the engi community I am no even kidding QQ like you have never seen.

Naw – we need something for kit-less engi’s and gadgets/elixirs just aren’t enough :/ – we have MM’s, nature spirits, weapon spirits, elemental summons, banners, clones, and venoms – each other class has some kind of mobile AoE benefits and we don’t – it’s sad

THis is a classic balance the different game modes issue.
In Spvp, I can’t even imagine the crying that would (and should) occur if you could easily avoid refresh.
In WvW, I can’t imagine taking turrets EXCEPT when bunkered down taking a “keep” or defending a “keep” and then only sometimes. In that case, you wish that you could move the turrets as many times as you wanted in X seconds and then they went on cooldown. But, imagine that in Spvp!

I think relatively they are ok.

I personally don’t think PvP should be a big deal considering there are still other classes with the exact same mechanic – just because you may see less of them doesn’t mean we can just say they don’t exist. What you’re implying is that you don’t think a minion master was programmed into the game – or a ranger with spirits following them. It’s the same exact concept and thus should be allowed in other classes (like this one too). If people want to complain because this class finally got an ability that was shared by most other classes – then foo on them.

While this sounds good in theory, it’s not.

Look at the grenade kit. Do you run that without grenadier? No. Why would you? If you showed up to a PvP match, dungeon, or WvW zerg, your teammates would be upset with you if you decided to not run that trait with the grenade kit. They’d rather have an engineer who would play things “properly”.

So now you want mobile turrets. Well, guess what? You better include that in every turret build from now on because no one will want you on their team if you decide to be that crazy non-conformist who doesn’t want to use it.

Look at spirit rangers. Do you see them running around with stationary spirits? Maybe if they use them while leveling up, but otherwise no. If you join a solo queue with a spirit ranger who doesn’t take spirits unbound, what are you going to think? I can almost guarantee you it will be something along the lines of “Oh man, why do I have to get all the bad people who don’t know how to play on my team?”.

Oh, but turrets can be good while they’re not mobile? Sure, maybe. But then they might need to rebalance the turrets to make them overall weaker so that they aren’t overpowered while mobile. Now not only do you make the mobility trait a necessity, you make stationary turrets even less viable than they currently are.

There are many, many, MANY things turrets could use, but being mobile is just not on that list. If it is, it’s near the bottom. Making them mobile won’t fix any of the issues with them, it’ll just make new ones.

Not to mention they’d have to completely redo the art assets to make them look anything more than completely asinine, and those are probably resources better spent doing other important things.

Ironically, last time I ran my Engi (coupla nights back, roughly), this exact convo came up.
Why isn’t there a Mobile Turret option? Hell, they could put propellers on the buoys for underwater turrets, and little clockwork legs on the ground version. It’d look pretty cool, and fit the class’ overall aesthetic.

Af for PierPiero’s comment: Here’s the rub, honestly. It would be well and fine for Engi to lack a proper melee option … in an MMO where range/melee are equivalent in damage potential. GW2 is not that game, as we all know. And realistically, Mace or Hammer would the only current melee weapons arguable for Engi use. Wrench is decent, sure; but the desire for at least one standard, non-Kit melee weapon isn’t -imo- unreasonable.

I’m thinking if it goes in “Inventions” no one will have a problem with it. Why? “Alchemy” has “Experimental Turrets” – Couple those 2 together and you have walking boons. I don’t see a down side? And don’t say that this is OP at all – spirit ranger (as you mentioned) is the same concept.

Dragon Ruler X.8512:

I’m thinking if it goes in “Inventions” no one will have a problem with it. Why? “Alchemy” has “Experimental Turrets” – Couple those 2 together and you have walking boons. I don’t see a down side? And don’t say that this is OP at all – spirit ranger (as you mentioned) is the same concept.

Spirits have a finite active time before they despawn and you wait 25 seconds (3 min for nature) before you can bring them up again. they also don’t have an autoattack, or any way of dealing direct damage at all save 1 ability on 1 spirit.

Foefaller.1082:

Dragon Ruler X.8512:

I’m thinking if it goes in “Inventions” no one will have a problem with it. Why? “Alchemy” has “Experimental Turrets” – Couple those 2 together and you have walking boons. I don’t see a down side? And don’t say that this is OP at all – spirit ranger (as you mentioned) is the same concept.

Spirits have a finite active time before they despawn and you wait 25 seconds (3 min for nature) before you can bring them up again. they also don’t have an autoattack, or any way of dealing direct damage at all save 1 ability on 1 spirit.

Fine – MM’s have no time duration and an autoattack – so the mechanic is still viable :/

Foefaller.1082:

Dragon Ruler X.8512:

I’m thinking if it goes in “Inventions” no one will have a problem with it. Why? “Alchemy” has “Experimental Turrets” – Couple those 2 together and you have walking boons. I don’t see a down side? And don’t say that this is OP at all – spirit ranger (as you mentioned) is the same concept.

Spirits have a finite active time before they despawn and you wait 25 seconds (3 min for nature) before you can bring them up again. they also don’t have an autoattack, or any way of dealing direct damage at all save 1 ability on 1 spirit.

However traps are all low timers and do actually do damage and apply conditions whereas there’s a timer on how slow a turret can fire which can be resisted by toughness and armor. So I don’t see your point here. The timers on engineering turrets are still extremely high. And yes I play both so I’ve experienced this first hand.

Two examples for yeah so you can see what I’m talking about. Thumper. Most engies put that on for the AOE fields and knockbacks, but wouldn’t it be great if it had the proper cooldown when you picked it up or actually did solid damage scaling to your stats? 36 seconds is hardly fair when it comes to this thing especially since enemies have to be right on top of you and these things die so quickly from AOEs that in PVP I’ve seen engies put this down to knockback a foe they get one knockback off before some OP AOE skill comes along and bam 36 second wait time AGAIN, meanwhile that fire trap and the torch AOE field that ranger puts down both applies a condition AND has a tick per second while inside the fire and has a seriously swift cooldown time on both. I play one of those too I know.

There are multiple other examples I can show you to prove that these classes are not on par with one another and that indeed their is either the balance team doesn’t play this class enough to compair or they take into account the actual quantity of players who play this class when “balancing” (it being low of course) not realizing that because it’s not balanced it’s therefor troublesome to play which perpetuates the low population.

Im a HUGE Engy Fan. so Im in Engys court with this, BUT: While mobile turrets (on wheels i assume) might be Seriously OP. How about a skill that grants an Engy a Gun Turret on his shoulder. Like Predator. It could count as a kit, but only grant one wep skill on equip. Like your number 1 skill is “equip shoulder gun” then after that you can choose your 6-9 skills to add condi or whatever to your main attack. you can only choose 1 skill from your 6-9 at a time. but once you choose, you go back to main hand weapon. once your timer for “equip shoulder gun” re-cools you can go back and choose another attack from your 6-9 attacks

imagine having a timer to choose which theif venom skill you want.

Imagine having a timer on your pets as a ranger, you put him away or try to switch and you have to wait 36 seconds before you can use him again. Then when you do manage to get him to show again manually and he’s stationary, then you tell him to use his skills and all of them have a 4 second delay before they go off and when he uses a skill the mob moves before it can go off thus missing. Then a mob uses an AOE with a particularly large field and your pet dies instantly.

This is what Engineer turrets are like for those of you who’ve never played one. Now explain to us again how they are balanced and this is perfectly fine?

I enjoy turrets in PvP but that’s because I’ve wanted turrets to be a thing since release and now they’re actually useful. I know some complain that AI does all the work.

Having said that I still think they are weak for most PvE encounters unless its a stationary boss/mob or its a dungeon/area you’re familiar with.

Some form of mobility would make Turrets much more viable in PvE, even if limited mobility.

Another note: Turrets have a 5 minute time out too :/

Actually I got used to stationary turrets. The advantages are: I can place them on hard to reach objects and they’ll keep attacking as long as they are in range. And I can place them at different positions like another entrance or expected mob approaching direction, while I’m somewhere else. Mobile turrets would follow and make these advantages impossible.

Instead of a mobile turret trait I’d suggest a utility skill that grabs all turrets in range and pulls them to the Engineers current position. Magnetic Turret Attractor or something like this.

That – or having an option to plant the turret like a toggle – “walk with me” – “stay there” – “walk with me again”

It could be a charge skill (that can be used when moving) for like 1 second – tap it and the turret stops or follows you – hold it for the whole 1 second and get the overcharge function – idk – spitballing xD

No! No walking turrets. Not now, not ever.

What if instead of making them mobile, we simply added a cast-time to picking up a turret which would then give it no cooldown? You would still be left the instantaneous destruction of the turret from anywhere, which would put it on the full CD, but this way have another option to make them more viable – in all aspects of the game really.

Importantly though, the overcharge effect would and toolbar CD for the turrets would remain as is or that’d be too OP IMO.

The actual cast-time for this would need to be explored but I’d be leaning towards 2 sec? Not long enough that people would just blow them up anyways, but not so short that it can be done too easily while in combat.

Also, it may sound tedious to have to pick up all 3-4 turrets (taking up to 8 sec) but that’s the beauty of it (in my mind :P). Makes you think a little more about how you’d use turrets.

I don’t think this would make it terribly OP (except for maybe in a decap build? I don’t play one so not too sure how that would change) in sPvP but may be a good step towards making them slightly useful in WvW/PvE situations?

Thoughts? Sorry about the weird paragraphing… it’s a direct correlation to my train of thoughts, which tends to jump a bit.

Walking turrets… If I wanted an AI to follow me around I would’ve gone a necro or ranger.
Turrets are good as they are, sure incredibly low maneuverability, but that’s the trade off for having extra DPS and support capabilities from one.
They’re best for bunkering down and hold the line, an that’s how they should stay imo. Simply because once turrets start moving, you’ve got 4 turrets that provide better support than pets. Including supply drop, 7.

using other broken AI as an example is not a good reason to buff another (already broken) AI build, turret engis are already ridiculously strong at holding a point.

Liewec.2896:

using other broken AI as an example is not a good reason to buff another (already broken) AI build, turret engis are already ridiculously strong at holding a point.

Afraid of some real balance choices that might actually bring this class up to par with others I see. This is very typical of the attitude towards this class has been for 2 years now. Maybe one day people will stop stigmatizing it but I fear that day will be long long time from now with far fewer players.

The arguments seem to be based on the premise that turrets will be “too OP” if they can move. This is people not thinking about every single mechanic in the game imo.

Here is a VERY condensed version of not even all of each class’s main mechanics

-Warrior-

:Signets::
Boosts stats below by +170
~Tougness
~Precision
~Power
Activation benefits
Can have recharges reduced
Can be used underwater

::Banners::
Boosts stats below by 170 area wide
~Tougness, Vitality
~Precision, Ferocity
~Power, Condition Damage
~Healing Power, Boon Duration (10%)
Instant resing
Perma regen
Can pick up the banner with no cool down and move it to a new location
Provide new AoE shouts or skills
Can’t be destroyed
Can have recharges reduced
Can be used underwater

-Guardian-

::Spirit Weapons::
Follow you around
Can be buffed with +50% dmg, longer duration, and burning on hit
Have active attacks and defense mechanics
Can be commanded and not die when commanded if traited right
Can be killed
Can reduce recharges
Can be used underwater

-Ranger-

::Spirits::
On hit
~Healing
~+10% dmg
~Protection
~Burning
~Swiftness
On activation
~Healing
~Chill
~Revival
~Immob and cripple
~AoE Damage
~Blindness
Healing over time
Can be killed
Can follow you
Can be used underwater

::Pets::
Can follow you
Can have 2 of 45 variations with multiple unique F2 skills (4 if you include aquatic)
Can be buffed for damage and defense
Holds ~40% of a rangers dmg (or more)
Can be swapped out to heal when not in combat
Can be killed
Can be used underwater

::Traps::
Can’t be blocked
Can use ground targeting
Have low recharges
Can have recharges reduced
Can have radius increased
Can increase overall damage
Persist regardless of range (timed)
Can’t be used underwater

-Thief-

::Traps::
Can’t be blocked
Can have recharges reduced
Can provide boons
Persist regardless of range (timed)
Can allow a shadow step of 10,000 range with fury and might
Can instantly be recharged
Can add an additional combat ally
Can’t be used underwater

::Venoms::
Can have recharges reduced
Can affect nearby allies
Can provide boons
Can heal
Can have charges increased
Can be instantly recharged
Can all be activated simultaneously on hit
Can be used underwater

-Necromancer-

::Minions::
Can have dmg increased
Can have increased health and gain toughness per minion active
Can damage on death and apply poison
Can be summoned upon killing a foe
Can have recharges reduced
Can remove boons on hit
Can give you additional toughness per active minion
Can siphon hp to you
Can draw conditions from you
Have secondary effects when summoned
Can be killed
Some can be used underwater

::Wells::
Can use ground targeting
Can have recharges reduced
Can apply protection
Can siphon hp every pulse
Can’t be used underwater

::Fear::
Fear on target
Fear from a line
Fear from a ground target mark
Fear can damage the player
Fear can be extended
Fear can run you off an edge
Can be used underwater

-Elementalist-

::Auras::
Can be shared to allies
Can grant fury, swiftness, and protection
On hit gives
~Might
~Burning
~Reflection
~Stun
~Chill
~Reduce dmg 10%
Can be used underwater

::Glyphs::
Heal and grant a boon based on attunement
Inflict conditions based on attunement
Summon elementals
Revive allies with different effects based on attunement
Summon an elemental storm based on attunement
Can have recharges reduced
Can have boons granted based on attunements when cast
Can be used underwater

::Signets::
Passives
~25% movement speed
~170 toughness
~+170 precision
~Heal per spell cast
~Cure a condition each second
Actives
~Blind target and nearby’s
~Immob target
~Burn target
~Heal self
~Chill target
Can give fire shield on activation
Can reduce recharge
Can maintain passives if activated
Can apply vulnerability when activated
Can restore endurance when used
Can be used underwater

-Mesmer-

::Illusions::
Can spawn them infinitely
Will persist until killed, shattered, or target dies
Can cloak you
When Killed Can
~Cripple
~Confuse
~3 stacks of Bleed for 5 seconds
~3 stacks of Vulnerability for 5 seconds
~Weakness for 3 seconds
Can have boons applied to them
Can have recharges reduced
Can increase damage dealt per active clone
Can decrease damage received per active clone
Can increase movement speed per active clone
Can bleed on critical
Can have +15% dmg
Can be used underwater

::Mantras::
Can increase dmg per mantra readied
Can add an extra charge
Can reduce recharge
Can gain toughness when channeling
Can heal allies when casting
Can be used during daze/stun
Can grant stability
Can daze
Can dmg
Can heal
Can cure conditions
Can be used underwater

-Engineer-

::Turrets::
4 Effects per turret (Not including supply drop)
~Basic function
~Overload
~Non-deployed tool belt
~Deployed tool belt skill (detonation)
Finite timer (5 minutes)
CAN’T critically hit
ARE permiable
ARE stationary
CAN’T reduce recharge
~Only go on recharge when destroyed or picked up
Can dmg when killed
Can have dmg received reduced by 33%
Can be killed (average hp 8217)
Self-repair 5% per 3 seconds
Can increase dmg 15% and range 50%
Can summon a (delayed) reflective shield
Can apply boons to nearby allies
Can use ground targeting
Can be used underwater

::Others::
Since this page is about turrets I will leave that as the focus of my point
Elixirs and Kits would be the only things worth mentioning anyways

-Resolution-
As all other classes clearly have concepts that either follow them, can be moved, or have extremely low recharges we can see exactly how the engi actually does suffer from inadequacy

Dragon Ruler X.8512:

-Resolution-
As all other classes clearly have concepts that either follow them, can be moved, or have extremely low recharges we can see exactly how the engi actually does suffer from inadequacy

Thank you and I would further point out that it’s not limited to turrets, and the instakill mechanics that Engineer healers have to deal with but we are missing traits that other classes take for granted for everything from automatic interval condition removal to burst DPS options that other scout classes possess and don’t have to think about.

I went over some of the things missing from the list of traits available to even sister classes (scouts) that Engineers don’t have the options for
HERE and even tho I left out things like automatic condition removal it’s sad to say here we’re coming up on the 2 year mark and this class is effectively still in beta, still weaker than the other classes, and still behind. What’s even worse is that they are still using the age old system of adding mechanics only to make them useless against bosses so seriously there’s been 0 learning here in the 2 years this game has been out considering this is what they did to destroy the usefulness of CC, healing, condition builds early on in the game. What am I talking about? Reflects on turrets don’t affect open world boss missiles any longer. I mean I guess it wasn’t enough that it had a delay before the shield goes up (unlike other classes who’s skills are instant) they had to make it useless too in boss fights.

So it makes you wonder really, why create skills and effects that you’ll simply make useless later? Why have them at all? Why have pets at all when they are just going to die instantly from a single hit? Why make the claim that it doesn’t matter which class you bring to the fight because they are all equal when you know they aren’t? those would be my questions if I were to sit down to an interview at this point.

Turrets were intended for area control, just read the engineer description please. Turrets are not pets and the reason our turrets have 1500 and offer the utility they do when traited with experimental turrets, is because they are immobile.

A-net will not do a 180 on the purpose of turrets, they are great as they are, if you want moving pets then reroll.

Fragment.2793:

Turrets were intended for area control, just read the engineer description please. Turrets are not pets and the reason our turrets have 1500 and offer the utility they do when traited with experimental turrets, is because they are immobile.

A-net will not do a 180 on the purpose of turrets, they are great as they are, if you want moving pets then reroll.

If you want to sound snide please do it somewhere else.

If you want the guildwars2.com post here it is…

“Engineers can also deploy turrets, immobile devices that help defend and control an area. For example, engineers can plant thumper turrets to cause damage to all foes in the area, or a healing turret that regenerates the health of nearby allies. Engineers can pack up and move turrets at will, and only one of each type can exist at a time.”

- https://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/professions/engineer/ -

If you want the official wiki description of a turret here it is…

“A turret is an immobile, automated device that can be deployed by engineers using healing or utility skills.

Most turrets will automatically engage the engineer’s current target, the only exception to this being the Healing Turret. After deployment, the turret can be overcharged by using its sequence skill, which will create a special effect such as improved rate of fire or area of effect attack.

All turrets are stationary; to redeploy them, engineers need to detonate them via tool belt skill or pick them up by interacting with them. Picking them up reduces the redeployment recharge by 25% while detonation will cause damage around the turret’s location and create a blast finisher combo effect. While not deployed, the tool belt skills granted by turrets resemble the effect of the turret’s action."

- http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Turret -

No where in there does it indicate that they are strictly for “area control”. And, no where have I seen Anet explicitly state that they gave specific features to engineers for specific reasons based on specific mechanics that they wanted players to specifically use and never question any specific aspect of how the engineer was specifically designed.

If you don’t want this mechanic suggestion – then simply indicate that – don’t try to cover it with false pretenses and make it seem like everything is fine when there is clearly room for improvement.

Even the option to mount the turret as a backpack for all classes – like banners – just so they can move and be set back down in new spots without incurring a recharge would be sufficient.

Turrets (minus healing turret) should be all bundled into one kit, and the toolbelt skill blows up all turrets and reduces the deployment CD per turret destroyed (the concept of picking up multiple individual turrets in a build dedicated to them is pretty dumb).

Turrets are aerial control. period.
You don’t call them minions, nor bots, nor drones. You call them turret. And a turret is – per definition – an locally installed defense platform.

What does this mean for gw2?
Simple. If you decide to play turret then you decide to play defensive. For pvp that means to drop ranged turrets off point so melee enemies are forced to walk out and destroy them there, while you cap / hold the point. Same goes for wvw camp / ruin defense.

You can not effectively chase a target with something that is meant as local installment. On the other hand you can pull them with toolkit towards you and immobilize them with the rifles netshot. There you go, your target is free for turret bursting now.

If you don’t like being stuck to defend an area, run another build.
I personally don’t want to have mobile turrets since I prefer to drop them afar into inconvenient and hard to reach spots, while cc’ing the cat out of my targets. I really do like turrets, especially after the bugfixes, and as someone who were roaming with them for almost a year now, I can tell you that they don’t need to be mobile to wreck people on mayor proportions.

tigirius.9014:

Dragon Ruler X.8512:

-Resolution-
As all other classes clearly have concepts that either follow them, can be moved, or have extremely low recharges we can see exactly how the engi actually does suffer from inadequacy

Thank you and I would further point out that it’s not limited to turrets, and the instakill mechanics that Engineer healers have to deal with but we are missing traits that other classes take for granted for everything from automatic interval condition removal to burst DPS options that other scout classes possess and don’t have to think about.

Well, to be fair, we DO have burst DPS options, albeit not for turrets. Static discharge engis do kitten damage, at least from a PvP’ers perspective. As for the condition removal, we get condi removal as well as a huge healing burst every 15 seconds, one of the best heals in the game IMO. If that’s not enough or if you’re going against a condi-centric build, take sigil of generosity or purity. I don’t think I want engi’s to have mobile turrets because then ANet would have to nerf turrets as a whole so as to not upset too many people, who, let’s face it, would be upset anyway. Just my 2 cents.

Dragon Ruler X.8512:
“If you want to sound snide please do it somewhere else.”

I was not being snide (as you put it) in the slightest, merely pointing out what I believe the turrets intentions to be.
I fail to see how I am covering it with false pretences.

Dragon Ruler X.8512:
“No where in there does it indicate that they are strictly for “area control”. "

You say they did not give any specifics on how they were designed to be used, the following line makes me beg to differ, the following is almost the ‘definition of turrets’.
“immobile devices that help defend and control an area.” – It says pretty clearly that their role is to help defend an area through area control.

If they were not intended for controlling an area, it seems odd that they would make a new trait that buffs all team mates in the ‘area of control’
( I believe this was implemented as an attempt to improve area control without directly buffing the damage of the turrets).

It also seems odd that supply drop would create a mini-base to help you control an area.

As per usual guild wars allows for all skills to be used to suit your play style and so there is no specific way they have to be used, but as I already mentioned, turrets seem to be heavily intended for area control.

Making them mobile would make them an offensive pushing weapon, I don’t believe this was the intention and in order to do so would mean heavily nerfing the main selling point and purpose of the turrets.

Side note:
Dragon Ruler X.8512:"
why not give us a mace weapon class – I kinda wanna clobber someone with a wrench"

Look at your toolkit weapon kit….

Just because the intentions of the turrets do not meet your expectation, does not give you the right to be an kitten to other forum members.

I suppose I would do it a bit differently.

You can pick up any turret but you keep the hps it has (or has lost if you are not fixing it).

You must place the turret in the next 10 seconds or it goes on full cooldown.

The turret retains the HPs it had left and can’t be picked up if the overcharge ability is on cool down.

I’m sure there might be some other restriction you need to prevent abuse like it taking a couple of seconds (to ensure you don’t pick up and put down to get another “firing” cycle). But that could be a timer etc.

Fragment.2793:

1)
I was not being snide (as you put it) in the slightest, merely pointing out what I believe the turrets intentions to be.

2)
I fail to see how I am covering it with false pretences.

3)
“No where in there does it indicate that they are strictly for “area control”. "

The following line makes me beg to differ…
“immobile devices that help defend and control an area.” – It says pretty clearly that their role is to help defend an area through area control.

4)
If they were not intended for controlling an area, it seems odd that they would make a new trait that buffs all team mates in the ‘area of control’
( I believe this was implemented as an attempt to improve area control without directly buffing the damage of the turrets).

5)
It also seems odd that supply drop would create a mini-base to help you control an area.

6)
As per usual guild wars allows for all skills to be used to suit your play style and so there is no specific way they have to be used, but as I already mentioned, turrets seem to be heavily intended for area control.

7)
Making them mobile would make them an offensive pushing weapon, I don’t believe this was the intention and in order to do so would mean heavily nerfing the main selling point and purpose of the turrets.

8)
Side note:
Dragon Ruler X.8512:
“why not give us a mace weapon class – I kinda wanna clobber someone with a wrench”

Look at your toolkit weapon kit….

9)
Just because the intentions of the turrets do not meet your expectation, does not give you the right to be an kitten to other forum members.

1)
Deferring someone to the “official description” as if it is common knowledge is being snide.

Snide: “an unpleasant or underhanded person or remark.”

You were not pointing out what you believe – you were trying to pawn off what Anet supposedly has said.

2)
As the rest of the entire thread has indicated through a rather thorough analysis of each class and their basic constructs and purposes you would understand that I do not believe in the terms of the “Meta” bars being “OP already”, and I believe they are, in fact, not as well balanced as many seem to believe.

Note: The ones who seem to be complaining are the ones who seem fearful of losing to a slightly more effective engi in PvP. We have PvP ONLY skills and traits already – we could further divide them to allow a proper PvE take on turrets.

3)
You completely missed the word “help” in that statement.

Help: “make it easier for (someone) to do something by offering one’s services or resources.”

This is NOT implying that they were purely designed for this single purpose.
(Yes I read your disclaimer further below so don’t freak out yet).

This is, however, implying that turrets were designed to assist other players – not be entirely a single man’s war tool.

4)
First, it’s Area of Effect (AoE), and this has a radius of 600, only gives limited set of buffs each with a duration of less than 10 seconds (mostly), and only recurs on an interval of 10 seconds.

Second, if we use your same logic on ranger spirits which don’t attack (apart from 1 skill), have area wide benefits in a set interval of time, and I can choose to not have them follow me around. Therefore, I fail to see the comparison as this should imply now that they are for controlling an area – which they are not.

5)
It’s not specifically designed for that single purpose, again. This also carries a healing turret and multiple health packs (Bandages) for the purpose of re-establishing yourself in a fight if your current healing skill is on recharge. Nor does it explicitly bind you to that area for your fight. You may think that’s a waste of the Supply Drop skill, but I call it tactical maneuvering.

6)
You kind of defeated your entire argument by stating this.

Whether or not you believe your understanding of how the turrets were designed is not the question here. The fact that turrets have multiple uses, limited health, low armor, and DO NOT scale damage based on the player’s power – all lead me to question why allowing an item that follows you and can only shoot on specific intervals of less than and up to 10 seconds each is such a problem?

7)
As I stated above, they have a fixed amount of health (less than 10k average), armor, firing rate, healing rate, and they don’t scale based on the player’s power. I fail to see how this would even survive a “push”.

8)
I’m fully aware of that kit. However, there are multiple types of wrenches, single-handed hammers, screw drivers, etc that would be interesting and fun to play with as an engineer. But, for that we would require more than a pistol (which honestly makes no sense) for a main-hand. Adding in a “mace” weapon class would provide more options. Also, why would I want to force myself to use a kit and waste a skill slot just to use a wrench when I could have it as a main-hand?

9)
I can easily say I’m not being “kitten” to anyone (I understand that’s the filtered replacement). I’m saying that people (like the way I perceived you) come into this thread to say “No!”, “This is stupid”, “You’re a(n) [insert derogatory statement]”, “Anet won’t do this so don’t bother” because they don’t want this.

The purpose of this thread was to identify a reason why turrets aren’t mobile (which based on calculations – make no sense), and to provide alternate methods of achieving this mobility without making it “game breaking” (which, currently, is very hard to make this more game breaking than other mechanics in the game already).

It was not made for people to speak on behalf of Anet and provide reasons as to why Anet would never do such a thing. That is probably the only reason I decided to harp on you. I’m not trying to be mean, but it gets annoying when people either come in and speak for someone else or try to say that the idea is stupid either because they think they’d lose to/have a harder time killing their opponent with the new update or they are just simply ignorant of every mechanic in the game and thus can’t weigh them together properly.

Bombsaway.7198:

I suppose I would do it a bit differently.

You can pick up any turret but you keep the hps it has (or has lost if you are not fixing it).

You must place the turret in the next 10 seconds or it goes on full cooldown.

The turret retains the HPs it had left and can’t be picked up if the overcharge ability is on cool down.

I’m sure there might be some other restriction you need to prevent abuse like it taking a couple of seconds (to ensure you don’t pick up and put down to get another “firing” cycle). But that could be a timer etc.

I think that’s also an acceptable option

Though I think an Engineer would be able to engineer a turret that can roll, mobile turrets stop feeling like turrets and just turn into ranged pets… and we can look at rangers for how well pet ai works. I have a couple different ideas.

We already have reduced cooldown if we pick them up, that’s good. However it doesn’t reduce it enough to allow turret engineers to keep pace in any mobile gameplay, so we need the cooldown reduced more.

Making it instant is ridiculously OP, as you can have a turret damaged to 5%, pick it up and drop a new 100% health turret without losing more than a second or two.

Instead, scale the cooldown based on the amount of health the turret had when picked up. If it was picked up at 100% health, then it has no cooldown. If it was picked up at 50% health, then it has half the cooldown, etc. This means if you did a good job defending your turrets, you don’t really lose a lot of uptime by picking them up and moving them along with your party, but you still suffer if your turret is damaged/nearly killed.

A different idea, since we have ways to repair turrets, is to simply have their health persist when you pick them up. Since this sort of sucks if you decide you don’t want to drop them for 10 minutes and suddenly you need them and drop a turret at 3% health, perhaps it can reset if the turret is stowed for a length of time equal to its cooldown. I don’t think this is a particularly long addition to the internal character stats, since there are already profession/character unique stats in the game.

Both these changes allow turret play to be more mobile without actually allowing turrets to be mobile, meaning a turret engineer is still strongest when fights remain around his turrets, but he can actively keep up with his party and not lose his defining characteristic during battles.

WithoutAssumption.7936:

1)
Though I think an Engineer would be able to engineer a turret that can roll, mobile turrets stop feeling like turrets and just turn into ranged pets… and we can look at rangers for how well pet ai works. I have a couple different ideas.

2)
Making it instant is ridiculously OP, as you can have a turret damaged to 5%, pick it up and drop a new 100% health turret without losing more than a second or two.

I like your proposition, however I picked out 2 things I’d like to touch base on.

1)
I wouldn’t say if we had mobile turrets they’d be like a ranger pet per say. But, I would be willing to say they would be more akin to necromancer minions. The AI wouldn’t be that bad and it’d fall to the player to understand their effective aggro ranges to prevent accidental pulls.

2)
I agree. However, I’d rather suggest the mechanic of the ranger pets here where if you stow the turret – over time – it gets its hp back. This would allow you to assume the engineer is “repairing” it when it’s stowed. This way we could eliminate the cool down entirely. We’d have to watch the turrets to not let them get too damaged and then put them away before they break – otherwise we’d incur a full recharge.

I like your ideas though!

You just noticed the moving spirits twice.