Guild Wars 2

So, I’ll admit up front: I’m an engi noob.

But I’m wondering…from a pure DPS perspective is the mortar now better than the grenade kit? The skills look pretty support-y with all the combo fields and the heal, but the auto-attack seems to have bigger damage modifiers than the grenade kit and the toolkit hits pretty hard.

Is grenade kit still the way to go for pure dps and does that change for a power build vs a condi build?

condi definitely nades. from my testing definitely mortar for power (I’m getting 2k+ autos in cele/knights in wvw. zerker must hit much harder, but I didn’t play wvw on my zerk/assassins engineer today so I can’t give a general number. should be high though).

hybrid could go either way, but mortar has poor condi application regardless.

while nades and not bombs with condi ? if you take granadeer you can not have incendiary powder in your build … it is a great loss for a condi build …

Still much testing to do, I’m slowly gaining motivation to do it but still hesitant in hopes someone else does.

But, grenade still has Shrapnel and Freeze Grenade as somewhat big hitters. But, there’s still the Vuln to consider, as well as other “on hit” procs that grenades will do X3. So, it’s not just cut and dry which 1 skill does more. Or, that grenade kit is useless if Mortar 1 is better. Luckily they don’t compete for a spot.

And, to answer the last question, yes condi vs power will certainly change the situation as mortar only has poison while grenade has a slew of condi stuff that is just great. Grenade IMO is a must for condi builds outside of some niche “for fun” stuff.

PierPiero.9142:

while nades and not bombs with condi ? if you take granadeer you can not have incendiary powder in your build … it is a great loss for a condi build …

nades have 3 projectiles per attack so proc bleeding on crit traits much more often, many of which have no icd. you can have IP and grenadier simultaneously, in fact my condi p/p build has both. you just have to take explosives and firearms, and both have great condi traits in them.

mortar auto spam splatters people. it hits much harder than rifle auto.

PierPiero.9142:

while nades and not bombs with condi ? if you take granadeer you can not have incendiary powder in your build … it is a great loss for a condi build …

Grenadier is an adept, incendiary is a GM… and in different trees all together (Explosion for grenade and firearms for incendiary).

Nades have a LOT of bleeds combined with Shrapnel which has 3X the effect basically. Bomb seems nice for some stuff, but I really feel that it’s a bit lacking outside of dropping a firebomb and maybe concussion bomb every so often. More of a secondary condi kit not a primary, it’s 1 skill being just high power damage.

Jerus.4350:

PierPiero.9142:

while nades and not bombs with condi ? if you take granadeer you can not have incendiary powder in your build … it is a great loss for a condi build …

Grenadier is an adept, incendiary is a GM… and in different trees all together (Explosion for grenade and firearms for incendiary).

Nades have a LOT of bleeds combined with Shrapnel which has 3X the effect basically. Bomb seems nice for some stuff, but I really feel that it’s a bit lacking outside of dropping a firebomb and maybe concussion bomb every so often. More of a secondary condi kit not a primary, it’s 1 skill being just high power damage.

firearms has sharpshooter for 33% bleed on crit also, so nades with shrapnel and sharpshooter do serious bleeds if you have some crit chance.

Now that conditions are uncapped they might actually be more usefull to power builds. Because your bleeds actually apply without pushing someone else’s damage off. Even if conditions are a bit weaker for non-condition builds now, they are atleast purely beneficial damage.

It’s also easier to stack vulnerability with Grenades, and Shrapnel has a good power-component to it as well.
Problem i see with Mortarkit as a power weapon is that it only has your nr1 as something that really deals damage.

With Engineers it’s not about spamming autoattacks because they are usually pretty weak, and i don’t think the mortar is an exception. You want to switch kits and use cooldowns as much as possible. Other classes can autoattack much harder, and they still use skills as well.
I dare say that if you just sit there spamming your nr1 ability on any weapon as an engineer, you’re probably doing it wrong.

its easy to stack up to 25 vulnerability with nades, you can barely get to 3 with mortar

i think nades still outdamage mortar, but you can only pull it out when its midrange

also nade’s frozen grenade aoe is nerfed big time, so the value of mortar kit is really the long range, okay dmg, large blind/chill/poison fields

if you just use a mortar in a dungeon vs nades, overall team dps will surely suffer

choovanski.5462:

condi definitely nades. from my testing definitely mortar for power (I’m getting 2k+ autos in cele/knights in wvw. zerker must hit much harder, but I didn’t play wvw on my zerk/assassins engineer today so I can’t give a general number. should be high though).

hybrid could go either way, but mortar has poor condi application regardless.

If they change how the projectile finisher part of mortar works so it wasn’t so wonky, it could be a great hybrid kit with Streamlined Kits. Stacking confusion is always fun, but right now, having to consistently hit your target with the in-flight shell to do so is pretty much impossible for pvp, and a pain in many PvE encounters.

I think the main question is just when you get to where all your big hitters are down, do you default to mortar or grenades and what’s the comparison? is it extra damage on mortar but a loss on vuln? something worth looking into with the new stuff.

- If you are with a big wvw group, you pull out your mortar because it has the range, the aoe and the fields

- if you are in a dungeon, the vulnerability stacks, bleeds has way higher dps than mortar

- if you are pvping, it would depend how you spec, but either way eng’s damage is only optimal when the enemy is within decent range like 300-600, mortar shells also travel really slow so its easy for a ranger or mesmer to do a lot of damage to you before you can even hit them, all they have to do is dodge a magnet pull then an engineer needs quite some time to get close, probably have to pop a shield or dodge a few times

Susulemon.3204:

- If you are with a big wvw group, you pull out your mortar because it has the range, the aoe and the fields

- if you are in a dungeon, the vulnerability stacks, bleeds has way higher dps than mortar

- if you are pvping, it would depend how you spec, but either way eng’s damage is only optimal when the enemy is within decent range like 300-600, mortar shells also travel really slow so its easy for a ranger or mesmer to do a lot of damage to you before you can even hit them, all they have to do is dodge a magnet pull then an engineer needs quite some time to get close, probably have to pop a shield or dodge a few times

I think Mortar could help with approach, even if you aren’t taking Siege Rounds. Blind from from the light field shot could slow down the incoming dps, and having a Ice Field you can Blast or Leap for Frost Aura and a Water field that is much easier to combo off than Healing Turret’s can do a lot for survival.

I run both mortar and nade in wvw large groups. open with mortar, switch to nades when enemy gets close. see my sig if you want a build. for roaming/pvp you will just run condi nades

with new traits of blast on dodge in my opinion bomb and mortar togegher in a condi builds can be really op. You can have a lot of might and really good regen with mortar 5 … field, dodge … and repeat … it is quite fun. It works even well with celestial and power… in my opinion bombs/mortar will be really appreciated.
But … the new “meta” will be rifle with celestial and hgh. I tried it with elixir H elixir B elixir C elixir X and toolkit, strength runes , battle /strength sigil and celestial amulet, taking invention , alchemy and firearms and for me it is really op … you hit like a truck and you are really tanky

thing is the blast on dodge completes with the mortar GM trait, which I can’t run without

DrMatt.9408:

thing is the blast on dodge completes with the mortar GM trait, which I can’t run without

It’s like the same thing: double blast finish with 2x orbital strike or double blast finish with 1x orbital strike and 1x dodge. :/

but you get the 40% longer field duration on mortar with the trait