Need some pro tips for Scrapper PVP
You are supposed to blast the turret but tbh I dont get it either. I have never been able to get the turret to work well and when I fight engies dropping it its like a big neon sign saying “I’m now gonna be busy rotating through skills for 5s without thinking about you so please go ahead and pump all your CC and damage into me”. Because I run final salvo in PvP I use the gyro for an extra stabbi stomp.
1 if using purge gyro I would use the heal gyro. hopefully with all these gyros you grab final salvo. otherwise use heal turret, ideally when you and your team are low. hit the skill twice, the esplode the turret with the toolbelt skill, then egun 4 for another blast, all around mid- mid high hp allies.
2 don’t rely on any one skill rotation. this isn’t pve. although there are some basic damage rotations that are generally effective, you want to be in the mindset that:
-a your opponent is better than you (will stop you from underestimating your opponent and making dumb mistakes)
-b just as important as landing damage is making sure your emeny doesn’t land theirs on you, and they spend their cooldowns faster then you so when the clock strikes 12 (all you guys have left are auto attacks) you have the advantage.
reacting to what your opponent is doing is a superior tactic for defense, using 1 or 2 skill rotations describes a state of constant offense. you must find a balance in each.
3 go with the build on metabattle.com and modify little by little from there. from what I gather about your utilities they are mostly fine. consider using stealth gyro, elixir x can work fine but stealth always works (mostly).
4 egun aa applies weakness, so when you are forced to play defense and heal, shoot them to nullify their burst (if playing against power builds). if playing against condi then maintain 150% pressure, try to interrupt their heal etc. egun 2 is kinda dumb, I guess you can use it in teamfights cuz the probability of it missing is less the more targets you have. egun 3 is awesome, use it as often as possible when your team has a bunch of condis, egun 4 like I said use it to blast your heal and your toolbelt heal, egun 5 use it when on defense to help a bit in conjunction with egun aa. make sure you don’t use your heal turret as the blasts will apply retaliation instead of heals. egun aa is very effective to use as a burst mitigator against enemies who are attacking a mate. try to see this before hand so your egun weakness destroys their burst.
also learn how and when to rotate points. this is different for all classes and is half the battle.
Team Deathmatch for PvP – Raise the AoE cap for WvW – More unique events for PvE
Healing Turret has 3 portions, the immediate ~2.5k self heal, which will also trigger any ‘on heal’ trait/rune effects, the overcharge, Cleansing Burst, which is a large AoE, heals for the same amount as the initial heal, removes 2 conditions and produces the water field, and finally the detonate for its blast finisher. Keep in mind that you can skip the detonate and simply pick the turret back up, which gives it 3/4ths its normal recharge time, meaning you can get to its heal and more importantly condi remove again sooner. You’ll probably want to pick it up when using it to help allies who aren’t staying close enough to also heal with blasts, or when cleansing the most conditions is your highest priority, or when you don’t have any other leaps/blasts available to use in the water field and aren’t in immediate peril.
In general Healing Turret is your best heal, providing more straight healing than medic gyro when used perfectly thanks to rapid regeneration’s nerfs, and also giving you a ton of free regeneration to keep up invention’s passive +250 healing and a couple extra condi cleanses as well. Medic gyro has almost completely lost its niche due to nerfs, so we’re back to 24/7 healing turret again.
You can also use Healing Turret for some fun things like bodyblocking projectiles that don’t pierce. For example, you can block a thief’s Shadow Shot with it by putting it down and keeping it between yourself and the thief to screw over his engage. There are a lot of other fun things you could do with it as well if you took explosives for the knockback on detonate, but unfortunately outside of that explosives is kitten and you’d be gimping yourself seriously for a little bit of trolling potential.
Elixir gun #4 is hugely important and you need to be using it often for more than just the blast finisher. It puts down an unblockable damage field that deals almost as much damage total as 100 blades someone were to stand in it the whole time (they won’t, but it’ll still hurt). It also has no proper AoE indicator so a lot of people don’t know how to stay out of it and will take more hits than they probably should. Put that acid bomb down as often as possible on smaller points, downed bodies, blocking revs, or even just at your feet when a d/p thief or other melee is bothering you. The extra damage adds up to a huge amount, especially in larger teamfights, and it can trigger sigil procs for more damage/healing and can help keep pressure off of you. The damage this skill puts out really should not be underestimated.
Egun #1 is also stronger than many people think, though not in damage. It allows you to keep pressure on someone at range through sigil procs and the high weakness uptime it provides. Weakness is one of the most powerful debilitating conditions in the game, majorly reducing direct damage the target puts out as well as denying them dodges through significantly reduced endurance regeneration. Whenever you’re too far to pressure someone you need to with melee, you should be using this instead. Egun #5 is also a significant portion of your healing, so make sure you’ve got it up as often as you can, and #3 is your best allied cleanse, very useful keeping conditions off of allies in teamfights, especially on smaller nodes.
Also, I’d really recommend running either sneak gyro or elixir s. Scrapper is probably the best resser in the game right now, and a good portion of that is because you can stealth allies to deny stomps (or allow an ele to reposition safely for a free res) on top of your already ridiculous double res speed. Elxir S has the added benefit of giving you an invuln to deal with incoming pressure when your auto proc is gone or you want to preserve it, but its stealth can be annoying and is more easily countered.
I never got the turret heal either until I learned this trick- if you spam the heal keybind quickly you will simultaneously place and overload it. Then F1 and done, you did all three heals plus condi cleanse. Otherwise if you don’t spam the key then you lose precious seconds as it takes the skill animations time to show your character place the turret and then more seconds while the turret overcharges. Its akin to the stow weapon trick for other classes while autoattacking, I believe.
If you detonate Healing turret, you rocket charge/acid bomb for extra healing. Blast poison field for area weakness. Use super elixir if you expect fight on point (easy 250 hp/sec). Youcan use elixir s + elixir x if you want pushing far, and avoid team fight. You have low dmg, so use your poison as much as you can. You can be beaten only by good necro. In other 1v1 scenarios, you should never die, or loose point. Next hard counter: warrior – be carefull on headbutt. You will never kill alone: tempest, good thief, druid. Just only hold point and wait for your teammate, or , if you are brave, outnumber your enemy.
Few tips from t3 plat. HF
“Doctor suggest me, to stop play with engi because my fingers are broken.
So.. I start play scrapper. "
So.. I start play scrapper. "
I tried many combinations but at the end i found that the best utilities are the ones used by Zan. Bulk gyro is really strong and projectils reflection is really handy, EG is a must, there is no need to explain , elixir S and Elixir X. I find Elixir S better than sneak gyro for 3 reason :
– secure stomp
– I can stealth and disengage much more easily when a fight is lost becouse the gyro is visible and disengaging is really important. If i am able to to disangage and to decap far if mid fight is lost it is much better.. even if then i die on far the team loses less points
– Using toolbet elixir X from stealth is much easier
Elixir X is a must for having burst ..
For healing i use healing turret and the 2 water field used with hammer 3 or eg 4 .. other than blasting the turret are really good . For the rotation i try to spam eg 1 more than i can … then i usually try to melee and wait for elixir X (often i open the fight with elixir X, especially for decap ) . If i am fighing a bunker i try to use eg 3 when i think my opponent will heal himself.
A small but critical piece of advice:
Have a target ally keybind
One of the biggest, most important uses of function gyro is the ability to double-up on ressing allies, getting the up fast enough to avoid a stomp even when under fire, but to do that, you have to target said ally first, and all the click-targeting systems used prioritizes enemies over allies.
Honestly, you should be using keybinds for 99% of your targeting, but since there is no default target ally key, I feel like it’s important to mention the fact that you need one.
Though, I guess if you’re gold, you probably know that by now. More for everyone else who’s reading this thread.
I don’t main ng, but I’d like to as the class is fun. Running with power hammer build – similar to meta but with some differences. Gotten up to gold playing just scrapper this season, but I feel like I’m not utilizing the class to its fullness.
1. What heal do you prefer? I use med-gyro despite the nerfs. I have trouble with healing turret – mostly because i don’t understand how exactly it heals. Gyro gives me an immediate heal – especially in a pinch. Turret seems slower but maybe more heal? But that’s more on me than the skill.
2. Combat. Do you use a particular rotation? I like using skill 5 for stun then 3 and 2 for the combos. But not sure if I should reserve 5 for more appropriate skill interruption/cc. Otherwise i seem to be just auto-attacking for bulk of damage and then using skill 2 as reflect and skill 4 as block.
3. Utilities/Elite. I use elixir gun, purge gyro, bulwark gyro and elixir X. I like purge gyro because it’s quick and easy way to get rid of conditions plus gives me stab. Bulwark gyro i just use at start of team fight. Not sure what most effective use of this is. I like elixir X, because of the f skill (moa) which is great against reapers in shroud or warriors in berserker. Dont know much about the actual elite skill other than it seems to get me killed fast.
4. Elixir gun. I’m clueless on how to use this effectively. I get skill 3 to clear condis and skill 5 to clear/heal. I use 4 for the blast if i need one or after skill 5 for retaliation. How do you use this gun?
Thanks.
1. I prefer Heal Turret, but gyro and even Elixier are also good. For Heal Turret just press Heal twice then either detonate (F1) or pick up (F) to lower cooldown.
2. I try to use Hammer #2 and Egun #4 as often as possible, these are your most important damage tools. Save hammer #5 for cleave, hammer 4 is useful for both blocking and removing blinds or aegis stacks. 3 is a nice evade and mobility tool (you can cancel it early by equipping a kit and swapping back to hammer.
3. X either gives you Rampage (War elite) or Tornado (Ele elite). Tornade is good for decapping, Rampage gives you kill pressure and is better for 1v1. You can cancel transform early with weapon swap. However i suppose you try the other elites. Sneak Gyro is amazing for ressing and escaping, Mortar has useful aoe fields which apply chill, blind or poison, and an additional water field. Supply Crate is for cheesy 1v1 condi builds, it creates a flame, net and thumper turret and stuns for 2 seconds.
Also try the following non-elite skills at least once: Elixier B (gives a bunch of boons including fury and retaliation, toolbelt gives aoe stability), Elixier S (shrinks yourself, same as the trait in alchemy, toolbelt gives aoe stealth), Elixier C (converts all condis into boons, useful if enemy has 3 necros+2 condi mesmers), blast gyro (huge knockback, low CD, stunbreak toolbelt).
4. Auto Attack applies weakness and bleed, you can literally kill thief just with egun #1. #2 is hard to hit, but applies cripple and gives swiftness to allies and quite good damage. #3 multi hitting AoE that poisons enemies and clear condis on allies. Also good to remove blinds and aegis. #4 is one of the hardest hitting spells engineer has (pro tip: you can cancel the leap by weapon swapping). This aoe has a long duration and does more damage than big oil bomb or grenade barrage, always use this if you fight on point. #5 is a very strong AoE condi clear which heals you and allies for quite a bit.
Mortar introduction, if you want to use it, i personally love mortar. All mortar skills have 1500 range, more than any other weapon you have.
- basic AoE damage projectile, it is a 100% projectile finisher.
- creates a poison field on impact. poison reduces enemy healing by 33%, always use if an enemy is in downstate to slow down resses from his teammates.
- creates an ice field. Free chills.
- a light field that blinds enemies. Useful in any situation, like 1v1, teamfights and securing a stomp.
- water field, heals over time.
#toolbelt delayed blast finisher, but mediocre damage. still useful to bait dodges since it looks much stronger than it actually is.
1. What heal do you prefer?
1. Healing Turret is ideal in team fights and vs. condi comps.
2. Medic Gyro is god-tier in WvW but not so great in PvP outside of a pure 1v1 build.
3. Elixir H is far too selfish, unpredictable, and only makes you further vulnerable to necromancer boon corruption.
4. AED and Med Kit don’t exist.
If you use Medic Gyro, destroy it immediately to maximize Final Salvo. If you use the Healing Turret, pick it up whenever possible. It’s substantially better HPS to rotate as many activations per minute as possible unless you’re in comms with a partner who will blast the water field.
2. Combat. Do you use a particular rotation? I like using skill 5 for stun then 3 and 2 for the combos. But not sure if I should reserve 5 for more appropriate skill interruption/cc. Otherwise i seem to be just auto-attacking for bulk of damage and then using skill 2 as reflect and skill 4 as block.
1. Try to get as many Equalizing Blows on your target as possible, so try not to interrupt the auto attack chain too much. It gives you 3 stacks of might and them 3 stacks of vulnerability. It’s very, very strong. It helps to use Glob Shot and Sigil of Hydromancy aggressively.
2. I open fights with Thunderclap → Shock Shield → Electro-whirl, but you should not just mash these skills on CD in general. Electro-whirl is a very powerful reflect on a short CD, Shock Shield has a good block, and Thunderclap offers an AoE stun. Knowing when to use these skills offensively and defensively is really a matter of personal judgment and game knowledge, as well as knowing your own personal limitations as a player. It’s very easy to tunnel-vision and go for the kill only to completely whiff your Electro-Whirl and Shock Shield, leaving you entirely defenseless.
3. Utilities/Elite. I use elixir gun, purge gyro, bulwark gyro and elixir X. I like purge gyro because it’s quick and easy way to get rid of conditions plus gives me stab. Bulwark gyro i just use at start of team fight. Not sure what most effective use of this is. I like elixir X, because of the f skill (moa) which is great against reapers in shroud or warriors in berserker. Dont know much about the actual elite skill other than it seems to get me killed fast.
Elixir X is a very solid elite skill, but it’s incredibly unpredictable and at times can seriously work you over. I’ve pretty much decided to run nothing but Sneak Gyro most of the time. It allows me to escape 1vX situations much easier, it allows me the ability to pull clutch resses, and it just gives me another stack of stability and extra healing through Final Salvo.
Regarding utilities, when running Final Salvo, I no longer take both Purge Gyro and Bulwark Gyro. It’s just overkill. Pick one depending on the enemy comp and slot Blast Gyro with it.
I also happen to like the synergy between Elixir S and Adaptive Armor if you want to try something different.
4. Elixir gun. I’m clueless on how to use this effectively. I get skill 3 to clear condis and skill 5 to clear/heal. I use 4 for the blast if i need one or after skill 5 for retaliation. How do you use this gun?
You should pretty much be using Fumigate, Acid Bomb, and Super Elixir on cooldown when in big team fights. The 200 tick is massive over a long fight, and Fumigate cleanses more conditions than any individual skill per minute in the entire game. Versus condi necro/mesmer/warrior comps it’s literally god-tier.
Tranquilizing Dart is also probably the most underrated auto-attack in the game. Maintaining permanent weakness on a necromancer in shroud or a warrior in berserk saves lives.
Glob Shot is also valuable in that the cripple can help sustain auto-attacks on your enemy. Don’t ignore it.
The Elixir Gun is pretty much the best designed kit we have, and arguably one of the best weapons in the game. It hasn’t left my bar in PvP much over the years.
[EG] Ethereal Guardians
(edited by Phineas Poe.3018)
Thank you all very much for the tips and advice. It’s the finer points like this that I just couldnt learn from playing.
Wow, i’ve never given as much +1 in a row, you guys just wrote all together a pvp engi bible in less than 24h, thank you so much !
I main engineer then scrapper since begining but as casual, and I never though about many tips you just gave.
(edited by NineLives.8725)
My build is different than most, you can check my past posts, but this season I’m running FT, EG, Elix B, Mortar, and Elix H for heal. I run Hoelbrack and paladins. The idea is I keep might running in the 18 – 25 range. Sigils are Air and Blood.
I am squishier than the meta engi, but do more damage and am effective over a variety of ranges.
My tips would be, sometimes you need to concede point to get the kill and take it back.
Don’t face tank a Warrior. Keep pressure on the real mesmer (ie. leave point and assualt do not try to hold point while it runs around you). For a theif, let it come to you and use the AOE this build has along with its CC. You shouldn’t have to give up point for a theif.
For a guard, if you can pre-anticipate its teleport into you lay fields down in preparation. Standing inside the circle of swords is feasible, a great time to apply shock shield and lay down your fire field. A guard you should be able to have enough moving room to stay on point and deal with it just learn when to use your dodge rolls and stay off the really bad stuff.
The shock shield is incredibly incredibly useful not only because of the block but because of the vuln it applies. Let people open up into it and wait till it ends then retaliate.
FT is a very underrated weapon. With it and EG and mortar you have 4 blasts in a fire field. The blast on FT is so frequent you can actually blast the FT fire field twice if you use it before doing your mortar elite.
Learn your fields and blasts, you are your own super combo machine.
The FT group CC and blind are very under rated and can clear point and buy breathing room. Its’ great for clearing a stomper.
By dropping the EG light field you can tripple blast retaliation with this build (Acid Bomb, FT, and Mortar toolbelt). Doing this to point going in when you have tanky alies there, not only keeps a nice heal up, applies might to your allies, but also gives them all retaliation.
With my build as an engineer, when fighting on a small point in a group mele, your AOE can basically cover. Try to break the rhythm of the fight and realize that you should never be on it too long. You want to be in and out and you have great options for sitting just off point (and your enemy fields) and applying great pressure. For instance with FT your AA can apply burn and hit 3 folks, you can drop fire field, you can push them all off point. You can then drop lighitng field. You can mortar for poison to reduce their healing, you have a blind on mortar, and a healing field. With the helaing field you can do your hammer 3 and do area healing, you have 4 blast finishers.
Because I blast finish so much I take the attribute that does healing on blast finishers. Just a nice added bonus. I can pretty much reset with my blasts and a water field without needing to resort to my elix H.
For the inventions trait first tier I like the smoke bomb more than the free heal recharge.
My philosophies differ than most engis though, and my play style is more old school ADD engineer style from pre-HOT. Very in and out. However my boon support, condi clears, might advantage to alies and the impact of my fields are quite useful to a group especially on smaller point. I also do very well in 1 v 1’s with this build and find it more effective to kill things than with the meta.
If I’m pinned down I’m totally DEAD. life is constant movement.
(edited by shion.2084)