Pistol 1 & rifle 5
Was also wondering about this.
Guess since they released the patch with so many bugs making the engi godlike it slipped their mind.
But as more & more of these issues get solved it would be nice to see a response to this and possibly see those things added.
My understanding is that it was billed as a possibility during the unveiling and they decided not to implement it. It’s cool in theory, but having auto-attacks apply bleed and vulnerability with a chance to proc an additional aoe bleed and cripple would probably be too strong (especially when taken with the first minor in Firearms)
Server — Fort Aspenwood
Mains — Mathias of the Wood [Ranger]; Collaborator Bluatt [Engineer]
Alts — Necromancer, Warrior, Elementalist
Mains — Mathias of the Wood [Ranger]; Collaborator Bluatt [Engineer]
Alts — Necromancer, Warrior, Elementalist
My understanding is that it was billed as a possibility during the unveiling and they decided not to implement it. It’s cool in theory, but having auto-attacks apply bleed and vulnerability with a chance to proc an additional aoe bleed and cripple would probably be too strong (especially when taken with the first minor in Firearms)
I don’t think Pistol 1 could ever be considered too powerful.
My understanding is that it was billed as a possibility during the unveiling and they decided not to implement it. It’s cool in theory, but having auto-attacks apply bleed and vulnerability with a chance to proc an additional aoe bleed and cripple would probably be too strong (especially when taken with the first minor in Firearms)
I don’t think Pistol 1 could ever be considered too powerful.
^^this^^
Mesmer staff AA already applies burning with a way higher probability than shrapnel (yes, I know, don’t compare classes…), and even if we get that change, that’d be 1 bleed & cripple every 5-6sec, due to the low proc-chance.
Ask yourself; why no one is spaming bombs or m-shells with shrapnel? The answer is: Because both don’t attack fast enough to get a decent output from shrapnel. If ever, it’s only viable with nades, and even then I’d rather run siege rounds for the longer-lasting fields.
Since our dodge-bomb got nerfed heavily (10sec icd), Thermobaic reaction is a really bad pick for a grandmaster, since it will only deliver 1 blast every 10sec.
Unless you come up with a nade-build that doesn’t take mortar, there is no reason to pick shrapnel, so making the pistol AA counting as explosion, would by no means be overpowered, nor would it be for rifle #5, or literally every other skill we have, with the exception of -maybe -FT #1, and even that is hitting slightly less often than Nades in the same time.
Applying this buff would have helped pistol #1 to become a somewhat reasonable gap-closer between cd’s, and it still would be weaker than EG #1, in case your build picks that.
Tbh, I personally don’t care that much, since I never really had the incentive to camp pistols, what I find annoying tho are all the other promises that are unfulfilled to this day, along with the huge load of messed-up stuff.
No coating bullets as baseline (or slot-able) trait, locked rifle range to untraited status, without even a choice anymore. Elixir Infused bombs, gone. Automated response – replaced by a completely useless trait, that now pretends to be a grandmaster in alchemy. Glass-cannon, rendered almost useless due to the 90% health restrictions (and weaker as the minor oO), no cd-reduction for EG, Nades & FT anymore. Mortar suffering from the same slow projectiles as nades, rendering it useless as our “long-range-solution” (has some nice close-range support, tho)
We got some nice, new mechanics, but most of the stuff is buggy (looking at you gadgeteer) therefore will receive the nerf/fix bat pretty soon, iffy to use (glass-cannon, streamlined kits) or straight out useless (Medical field disperser, medkit in general, iron blooded, thermobaic reaction, explosive powder-keg, a.s.o.)…
We’ll need a lot more balance fixes, trait-reworks and trait-replacements, to be able to actually call us “versatile” ever again.
As I see it, we are currently locked into 2-3 reasonable, and roughly the same amount of borderline-viable specs.
GG A-net. GG.
And that is coming from someone who detests whining in general…
Engineer is love, Engineer is life.
As weak as explosive shot (or is it still fragmentation shot?) is, I’m not sure that explosive traits should apply to it. Rather, any additional quirks that should apply to pistol should be contained in the pistol trait. Otherwise it’s too much spreading out of traits across two specializations for someone that wants to maximize the effectiveness of pistols but not use any actual explosives in their utilities (i.e. actual elixir builds).
As far as coated bullets goes, I don’t know why they’ve simply just deleted that. It should have been made baseline, or at least packaged into the pistol trait. Explosive shot was already fully inferior to tranquilizer dart, so I don’t know why they had to take away one of the things that gave the former more niche usefulness. Unless they really just want everyone to shut up and run grenades now, I dunno.
Pistol 1 was actually pretty broken at release.
It was actually nerfed to its current level.
My understanding is that it was billed as a possibility during the unveiling and they decided not to implement it. It’s cool in theory, but having auto-attacks apply bleed and vulnerability with a chance to proc an additional aoe bleed and cripple would probably be too strong (especially when taken with the first minor in Firearms)
I don’t think Pistol 1 could ever be considered too powerful.
^^this^^
Mesmer staff AA already applies burning with a way higher probability than shrapnel (yes, I know, don’t compare classes…), and even if we get that change, that’d be 1 bleed & cripple every 5-6sec, due to the low proc-chance.
Ask yourself; why no one is spaming bombs or m-shells with shrapnel? The answer is: Because both don’t attack fast enough to get a decent output from shrapnel. If ever, it’s only viable with nades, and even then I’d rather run siege rounds for the longer-lasting fields.
Since our dodge-bomb got nerfed heavily (10sec icd), Thermobaic reaction is a really bad pick for a grandmaster, since it will only deliver 1 blast every 10sec.
Unless you come up with a nade-build that doesn’t take mortar, there is no reason to pick shrapnel, so making the pistol AA counting as explosion, would by no means be overpowered, nor would it be for rifle #5, or literally every other skill we have, with the exception of -maybe -FT #1, and even that is hitting slightly less often than Nades in the same time.Applying this buff would have helped pistol #1 to become a somewhat reasonable gap-closer between cd’s, and it still would be weaker than EG #1, in case your build picks that.
Tbh, I personally don’t care that much, since I never really had the incentive to camp pistols, what I find annoying tho are all the other promises that are unfulfilled to this day, along with the huge load of messed-up stuff.
No coating bullets as baseline (or slot-able) trait, locked rifle range to untraited status, without even a choice anymore. Elixir Infused bombs, gone. Automated response – replaced by a completely useless trait, that now pretends to be a grandmaster in alchemy. Glass-cannon, rendered almost useless due to the 90% health restrictions (and weaker as the minor oO), no cd-reduction for EG, Nades & FT anymore. Mortar suffering from the same slow projectiles as nades, rendering it useless as our “long-range-solution” (has some nice close-range support, tho)We got some nice, new mechanics, but most of the stuff is buggy (looking at you gadgeteer) therefore will receive the nerf/fix bat pretty soon, iffy to use (glass-cannon, streamlined kits) or straight out useless (Medical field disperser, medkit in general, iron blooded, thermobaic reaction, explosive powder-keg, a.s.o.)…
We’ll need a lot more balance fixes, trait-reworks and trait-replacements, to be able to actually call us “versatile” ever again.
As I see it, we are currently locked into 2-3 reasonable, and roughly the same amount of borderline-viable specs.GG A-net. GG.
And that is coming from someone who detests whining in general…
This is why the devs seemed a little uncomfortable giving us the preview they did. When you give people such a close view to the design process, it builds expectations they may not be able to meet.
(edited by lorddarkflare.9186)
I think they should give it a try. Anet removed the trait which gives rifle 10% more damage, it would be nice to get 10% for jump shot by explosive trait to get some damage back. And pistol 1 is one of the weakest AAs of the whole game. It does aoe “damage” without giving the bleeding aoe, I just don’t get why they do something like this. The aoe is really weak and the total number of bleedings from the skill for 1 target is really low. Giving it shrapnel and coated bullets could make pistol finally an aoe condition damage weapon.
I think they should give it a try. Anet removed the trait which gives rifle 10% more damage, it would be nice to get 10% for jump shot by explosive trait to get some damage back. And pistol 1 is one of the weakest AAs of the whole game. It does aoe “damage” without giving the bleeding aoe, I just don’t get why they do something like this. The aoe is really weak and the total number of bleedings from the skill for 1 target is really low. Giving it shrapnel and coated bullets could make pistol finally an aoe condition damage weapon.
It was because the p/p all elixir kitless beta builds could wrack up 20-25 stacks of bleeds in an AoE in a few seconds.
Of course, this was back when people didn’t know how to use condition cleanses, dodge, combo skills, &c. Ever since then it’s been that next-to-useless auto-attack that you use when you don’t have anything better to use, or when you’d rather go for a more accurate attack instead of missing with a grenade toss.
There was some concern previously that giving it AoE bleeds in conjunction with coated bullets could potentially be too powerful. But now that the latter isn’t even in the game anymore, I don’t know…
There was some concern previously that giving it AoE bleeds in conjunction with coated bullets could potentially be too powerful. But now that the latter isn’t even in the game anymore, I don’t know…
Well, I don’t want to change the explosion itself to give aoe bleeds, just give it shrapnel and coated bullets. Shrapnel got a proc chance of 15%, that isn’t really risky and ranger short bow can give aoe bleeds (and more of them) with piercing arrows.
^^ I’m just upset because I was really afraid to spread aoe bleeds with pistol and then it just didn’t happen….
There was some concern previously that giving it AoE bleeds in conjunction with coated bullets could potentially be too powerful. But now that the latter isn’t even in the game anymore, I don’t know…
Well, I don’t want to change the explosion itself to give aoe bleeds, just give it shrapnel and coated bullets. Shrapnel got a proc chance of 15%, that isn’t really risky and ranger short bow can give aoe bleeds (and more of them) with piercing arrows.
^^ I’m just upset because I was really afraid to spread aoe bleeds with pistol and then it just didn’t happen….
Though they should just add that functionality to chemical rounds if they really want it. Otherwise, someone wanting to maximize their pistols needs to take both explosives and firearms. For instance they could add an effect to chemical rounds to state “explosive shot now has a 25% [or whatever %] chance to inflict bleeding in its explosion radius”. Hell, even make it a 100% chance on an ICD or something.
For things like the grenade and bomb kit, their traits are also in explosives so it’s not inconvenient to take them in conjunction with shrapnel since they don’t compete with it. But anything that is going to buff pistols directly should at least be in firearms, if not tacked onto the chemical rounds trait.
Now I guess it would be helpful to have pistol benefit from shrapnel if you were a pistol using engineer that didn’t take firearms, but then I’d ask why you’re using pistol and not taking firearms. If it’s just so you can use shield, then you probably don’t need strong pistol attacks in the first place.
Several of the statements made about old traits being baseline have been added to the Official Unofficial Bug List in those forums (see sig). I’m hopeful if they are a bug, it gets fixed and if they are not that we get that clarification so we can have the discussion about that decision separately.
Qwerkk – Asuran Engineer