Guild Wars 2

The toolbelt skills of Gadgets are not shall we say remarkable.

What if the gadgets became a “gadget kit”? You get access to all 4 of them plus one “auto gadget”. Very few are overwhelming given the recharge timers. There is some damage but essentially this is a utility kit.

The auto attack could be an electric shock (like a static discharge).

Pick one of the toolbelt skills to be the one you get (analyze seems the most reasonable fit).

Might need to tone down rocket boots to be more akin to the distance of Acid Elixir on the E-Gun.

Thoughts?

Honestly, no.
Sorry that would be a dumb idea if we have all our gadgets in a single kit xD.
Also, if the gadgets were to get combined into a kit what would replace the old gadget
utilities ? Interesting idea but unfortunately it wouldn’t work.
As a solution to the weak gadget utilities (which i dont think are that weak) they should just add more utility to them like stun break to rocket boots or a new trait which could add condi removal to gadgets or something?
In the end balancing is a difficult job and im not a dev so i shouldn’t worry too much about it XD

It can be little bit OP but I had same idea recently:-) Also Turret Kit when we talking about that:-) Ofc those skill will need rebalance.

I remember when people kept suggesting that Gadgets and Turrets get combined into Kits.
Rubbish.
Leads to one Engineer with half the class’s skills on their bar, forcing Kits down players’ throats even more thoroughly than they already are – I’m practically gagging on the things, despite having no interest at all in using them – and thus turning Engineers into overpowered action-spammers. Could they add more skills to fill the class back out? Sure, but I really don’t trust them to be able to make those hypotheticals less terrible, considering their track record and “Hey, what if we made [skillset] into a Kit?”

I think it’s good to have non-kit options, and a gadget kit (essentially) would make this even less possible than it is now.

I do agree that gadgets need some benefits compared to the versatility of kits. I think adding some utility to gadgets could help (as Gooz Nooz suggests) or, alternatively, reducing the cooldowns of gadget abilities and gadget toolbelts, making them effectively function as a sort of second weapon set. Although we could use more condi-removal, I don’t know if it would be appropriate to make gadget use remove conditions – it just doesn’t make sense, and it would be a copy of 409.

I think we should address each gadget separately though, to buff (or nerf?) each one appropriately:

-AED: pretty unused, mainly because our heal slot is an important source of condi-removal right now. Toolbelt is also pretty lackluster. I think a cooldown reduction of both would be useful, but still might not be enough to make AED viable

-Rocket boots – I think both the toolbelt and the base skill are in a good place

-Slick shoes – I think both the toolbelt and the base skill are in a good place. Could make super speed break immobilize, but it’s already good.

-Goggles – underwhelming. I think the toolbelt needs 20sec. cooldown. The main ability is good for burst (and X/Pistol Thieves), but using it aggressively makes its stun break situational. I also think the cooldown should be lower, maybe 30 seconds.

-PBR – Doesn’t really have a role. In SD builds, Rifle turret is better because of it’s instant-cast and lower-cd toolbelt. The main skill is useful…but rifle already has a good knockback. The skill and the toolbelt hit hard, which is not too useful in a condi build. The cooldowns are already pretty low, and I don’t think lowering them would make the skill much better. I think, for this skill to be useful, it would need to be overhauled significantly. Thoughts?

-Throw mine – I think this skill is in an okay place, but could be better. It is our best source of boon removal. The toolbelt has a long cast time and is often used as a PbAoE bomb rather than an actual minefield. Furthermore, the grenade kit toolbelt does more damage, while also providing a really useful kit. I think mines in general (all mines) would benefit from an increased trigger radius (e.g. 90 or 120 instead of 60). Overall, I think this skill is limited, but any buffing might make it OP.

What does everyone think?

@fluidmonolith:

I pretty much agree with all your Gadget assessments, so I’ll only comment on Throw Mine, which I think I might have an idea for.

Throw Mine’s Toolbelt could really use some predictability, for the user’s sake, with some adjustability thrown in to prevent it from being too predictable; I always find it aggravating when I end up with three mines in one clump, and two far distant. Would much rather a pentagonal formation, if only for planning and PBAoE’s sake.
I’d suggest something like making the skill a charge-release cast instead of tap-cast, as well, with a tap putting the mines just outside of each other’s trigger range next to the player, and holding making them go further and further out. Alternately, make it the other way around if there’s concern over ‘Tap button to drop five bombs at your feet’ being OP, where you have to hold for the maximum channel to drop them nearby.

As for the skill itself, – and this is probably a terrible idea – it could be interesting to treat it somewhat like a Turret with charges – reduce the current damage, of course, but give it…let’s go with three ‘charges,’ which regenerate over time, and each Throw Mine used expends one charge. Replace the Toolbelt with Detonate Mine while these Mines are out, to allow detonation anyway. The skill was allegedly once a kit, after all, and it might be cool to reclaim some of that ‘minefield’ concept.

Turret kit is actually a good idea, Keep healing turret as it is but replace all turrets for signet skills and put maybe weakened versions of turrets in a kit. Like miniversions compared to what we get now. Let those minis explode after like 10-20 sec. Removes the turret problem from the game, and we get to mobilize our turrets, thus making them more usefull.

Grenix.1576:

Turret kit is actually a good idea, Keep healing turret as it is but replace all turrets for signet skills and put maybe weakened versions of turrets in a kit. Like miniversions compared to what we get now. Let those minis explode after like 10-20 sec. Removes the turret problem from the game, and we get to mobilize our turrets, thus making them more usefull.

…Turret problem?
What problem, that they’re immobile structures with predictable attack patterns, that people just don’t bother to destroy?
That the only game mode where people think they’re too strong rewards more points for holding a point, a goal obviously suited to Turrets, than killing other players?
That people aren’t used to seeing or playing against Turrets, certainly not properly-functioning ones?

Ranged AoE destroys the Turrets, and Conditions are the bane of the Engineer. Where’s the problem? It’s just something that has people off-guard. They don’t know how to deal with it, so they’re kneejerking and going “That’s overpowered.” After all, Turrets were subject to several crippling bugs for months, if not a full year, and these bugs have only recently been resolved.

Mobility is an issue for Turrets, that said, but there is no real ‘Turret problem.’ There is just people being unfamiliar with the playstyle, or the counters to Turrets. Don’t balance the game around sPvP.

I wish taking all Gadgets would function like having an alternate weapon. Currently the lengthy cool downs make gadgets very punishing to play in competitive games.

You lose too much from not bringing a kit.

Perhaps if there was a trait that reduced gadgets based skillscool downs by a small percentage every time a gadget is activated.

This alone would make a strait up Gadget Engineer have some potential utility while not feeling completely helpless without a kit.