Guild Wars 2

A lot of people in the community have been wondering what was in store for Engineers’s meta PvP builds after the newly announced specializations come in, and the answer to that is: Who knows yet!

It’s of course guaranteed that the top PvP builds will completely depend on tons of tweaking & brand new traits to come. But it’s still great and constructive to provide feedback and discussion on what’s been revealed. I’ll cover the overviews, what’s gotten buffed, nerfed, and then finally suggestions for all the TBD’s that remain. This will be a hell of a long read.

So, let’s start with the general Engineer changes.

Profession Changes:

• Forceful Explosives baseline.
• Accellerant-Packed Turrets baseline. Turrets will only knock back on detonation, not death.
• Rifled Barrels baseline.
• Coated Bullets baseline.
• Med Kit will see a re-work.
• Elites will get a corresponding f5 Toolbelt ability
• Mortar becomes a kit, and a re-work.
• Supply Crate will become a detonatable Turret, ie, reworked.
• Toss Elixir X, a new f5 ability that will transform any enemies affected briefly into a Moa.
• Grenadier’s ‘throw an extra nade’ functionality is now baseline.
• Grenade kit’s range will be nerfed to 900.
• Pistol 1 and Rifle 5 become explosions, benefitting from all explosion related traits.

The following current functionalities have been deleted, and likely won’t be reworked, moved, or re-introduced. If these really underutilized traits that very few people took were things that you absolutely needed for your build/playstyle to work, and new traits don’t provide it, then you might as well speak up!

• Acidic Elixirs.
• Empowering Adrenaline.
• Exploit Weakness.
• Reserve Mines.
• Enhanced Performance.
• Short Fuse.
• Synaptic Overload.
• Fireforged Trigger.
• Sitting Duck.
• Rifle Mod
• Go For The Eyes.
• Bunker Down.
• (All Inventions Minor Traits, including Automated Medical Response)
• Protective Shield.
• Stabilized Armor.
• Energized Armor.
• Cloaking Device.
• Power Shoes.
• Elite Supplies.
• Auto-Tool Installation.
• Rifled Turret Barrels.
• Energy Conversion Matrix.
• Acidic Coating.
• Blood Injection.
• Potent Elixirs.
• Enduring Damage.
• Deployable Turrets.
• Scope.
• Armor Mods.

So now I’ll talk about each specialization. I’ll explain the new synergies that just might be the new hotness in PvP.

Explosives:

• It’s pretty clear to see that Explosives has definitely seen some love, and some much needed setbacks to slow its roll. First on the list, the current Master trait, Explosive Powder: +10% Explosion damage has now essentially replaced Reserve Mines in the grand scheme of things. That’s really nice because Reserve Mines yanking me out of stealth has happened far too many times for me to shed even a single tear for its passing.

• Recall that Pistol #1 (and Rifle #5) was put in the ‘Explosion’ category, and that it naturally pierces now. Now Shrapnel, the newly moved Explosives Grandmaster will have a chance to apply a bleed & cripple, every time an explosion happens. Pistol #1 will bleed and create an explosion on every target that it pierces, allowing for many rolls for a Shrapnel proc.

• Despite Grenade Kit range being nerfed to 900, traiting for Grenadier as an adept trait will increase the velocity and radius of nades. To me, this is more than justified for reducing the range of Grenades, I expect this to increase Engineer’s overall pressure when used.

• Short Fuse will now reduces the arming time of Bombs. This will have synergy with Evasive Powder Keg, Auto-Defense Bomb Dispenser, Big Ol’ Bomb and so on. Bombs currently need this pick-me-up to compete with Grenades for the main damage Kit, or even Tool Kit for the Utility Kit spot in PvP. With the upcoming increase in blast finishers available to the Engineer, I feel Bomb Kit will surely be in a better spot due to its powerful fields.

• The increased amount of blast finishers I previously mentioned come from the two other Explosives Grandmaster traits. Either take the NEW Grandmaster that makes Evasive Powder Keg perform a blast, and gain far greater ability to blast stealth or water when pressured, or take the other NEW Grandmaster that grants a blast finisher on Mortar #1 to blast combos out of combat as well as in, such as stealth, might, and so on.

• Incendiary Powder is gone from Explosives. This is a high significant and highly justified nerf to explosives. With the uncoupling of Incendiary Powder, and now baseline traits like Forceful Explosives, and Grenadier’s 50% damage increase, Explosives is not required and is noticeably more well balanced than the tyranny it currently holds over Engi builds.

Firearms:

• The Minors in Firearms stayed exactly the same.

• As for the first adept, a TBD Pistol trait that is sure to appeal to condition Engineers, and it’s likely to be more than a simple 20% recharge reduction, and if so, be a small help to condition builds opting in to Firearms.

• The second adept trait is a combination of Precise Sights and Infused Precision, allowing the Engineer to inflict Vulnerability and gain Swiftness every 5 seconds, on crit. If the Engineer can’t afford to invest in Speedy Kits, which may be a reality, this could be the best Adept here.

• The third adept is a critical chance increase to enemies within 600 range. If Speedy Kits can be taken, and you’re not using Pistols, this becomes the best in slot.

• Rifle gets a Master trait that Increases the crit chance, and reduces the recharge by 20%. Lots of crit chance modifiers!

• Another strong Master trait, ROBO LEGS spotted, having the old Leg Mods functionality of reducing the duration of Immob/Chill/Cripple by 33%, and a new functionality, swiftness will have a greater effect. Depending on how much greater an effect swiftness will have, it could be one of those traits that just feels wrong to not have.

• Juggernaut was moved from a Master trait into a Grandmaster, but instead of gaining might every 3 seconds, the Flamethrower wielder will receive one stack of stability. It’s currently unclear how much stability can be obtained, but it’s a significant buff to currently non-meta Flamethrower builds. This would add a ton of utility.

• Incendiary Powder has been combined with Napalm Specialist, as a Firearms grandmaster. Incendiary Powder as well as a 33% increase to burning duration is a monster of a trait. If burning stacks in intensity, it’s unclear what will happen, but likely this trait could end up as a must have for Condition builds especially.

Inventions

• Inventions first Minor now allows for condition removal in a radius when a healing skill is used (swapping to Med Kit will potentially take advantage of a low ICD on this.) It’s certainly a buff when compared with the current trait occupying that space.

• The second Minor synergizes with all condition removal abilities, adding regeneration in a radius when removing conditions.

• The third Minor further adds synergy by providing a healing stat increase while under the effects of regeneration. These minors will really depend on the attached ICDs, but extremely likely will this be on a level higher than than the previous 2 weak minors and Automated Medical Response that currently reside.

• Adept Traits have further increased in power over the current ones: Reinforced Shield has come down from Master to Adept, and will grant protection in a Radius when shield skills are triggered. This will help the Engineer’s support capabilites, how much depends on the duration of this protection.

• Non-shield users can also opt for the second Adept trait, which grants the ability to create a blast finisher when using a heal skill. Depending on the ICD of this ability, Med Kit could gain ground on other heals, due to its ability to proc ‘on heal’ effects with a quick swap.

• Autodefense Bomb Dispenser was brought down from an Explosives Grandmaster down to the third Inventions Adept trait. For those without Shields, or combo fields to blast, this trait is okay as a stand-alone. It will provide an Engineer with a Jump Shot leap or blast finisher to make a stealth combo getaway in combat.

• Experimental Turrets being put into Inventions as a Master, from Alchemy Grandmaster has buffed the accessibility for turret builds to get this.

• HEAL-SPLOSION, a new Master trait was introduced, allowing all blast finishers to heal in a radius. This could potentially provide extremely broken synergy with an Engineer that has grabbed all the Blast Finishers he could get from Explosives and Inventions.

• Fortified Turrets now has Metal Plating functionality combined. The turret trait bloat has been surgically removed, but don’t forget that Auto-Tool Installation was deleted, a trait that was used in cancer inducing Turret builds.

• Bunker Down has been reworked and added to Inventions as a Grandmaster. Procs ‘Drop Bandage’ on crit, with a 2s ICD. Seeing as these bandages heal for 1000 base and scale at 50% of healing power each, that would enable the Engineer to drop enough deuces to heal an army with a Celestial or support build that could crit enough!

• The last Inventions Grandmaster heals in a radius for a percentage of incoming healing. This works best with either lots of selfish sustain, or allies pumping heals into you. It’s appearing to be much more beneficial for large scale fights.

Alchemy:

• There’s nothing new to talk about. So far it’s a copy of live, except a few things are switched around, one most notably is that Cleaning Formula 409 has migrated away from Alchemy and into Tools, to nerf the Inventions/Alchemy synergy. There are 4 TBD traits

Tools:

• Tools is in desperate need to be nuked and remade. It needs it very badly! I’m hoping for a robust focus on 2 things: Gadgets, and useful utilities for power Engineers.

• Enduring Damage, the previous minor where you had 10% damage when endurance was full, that was removed, and now the previous traitline stat of ‘Toolbelt Recharge’ has taken its place. This is a small buff

• Static Discharge, now competes with Power Wrench. This is a nerf specifically to Static Discharge Engineers who take both. That makes little sense, unless the TBD Grandmaster is good enough to make a power Engi forget about Power Wrench.

• Cleansing Formula 409 is now a Tools Grandmaster trait, and the reason would simply be to nerf the synergy between Inventions minor traits and Cleaning Formula 409.

The TO BE DECIDED:

TBD’s

• Explosives Adept: ‘Explosive Rocket Belt Thingy: Projectile on hit. 33% chance, 10s ICD.’
• Explosives Adept: TBD
• Explosives Grandmaster: Improved Mortar abilities, or adding a blast to the 1 ability.
• Firearms Adept: ’New Pistol Trait – Condition Focus
• Inventions Master: TBD
• Alchemy Minor: TBD
• Alchemy Adept: Elixir Gun TBD
• Alchemy Major: Med Kit TBD
• Alchemy Grandmaster: TBD
• Tools Master: TBD
• Tools Grandmaster: Gadgets TBD
• Tools Grandmaster: TBD

My answers to the TO BE DECIDED, and other suggestions!

Explosives Adept: Rocket Belt Thingy.

• Esports Rocket: (Name pending.) Fire an Explosive Rocket after a foe when striking them below the health threshhold and greater than 600 range. Health Threshold: 50%. ((Player, Veteran or stronger.)) 20s ICD. This ability would function similarly to Rocket Turret’s overcharge ability, except dependent on the user’s stats. It’s the Esports Rocket! This trait should provide a well telegraphed stand-alone choice for a non-grenade user.

Explosives Adept: TBD.

• Lethal After-effect: Bombs inflict one second of poison per pulse. Conditions inflicted by Bombs have their duration increased by 33%. This trait will create a way for condition Engineers to recover from the loss of Condition Duration now detached from explosives, and actually replace Grenades as a the main damage kit. Competes with Grenadier.

Firearms Adept: New Pistol Trait, Condition Focus.

• Potent Coagulants: Reduced recharge on Pistol skills by 20%. Foes entering Glue attacks are inflicted with Slow (4s). Foes may only be affected once. This trait will strengthen Pistol offhand’s Glue Shot utility, as well as promote synergy between Glue Bomb, Glue Trail, and Condition builds, especially in larger fights.

Firearms Adept: Crit Chance <600.

• This trait is relatively forgettable. This would be much better served as a Flamethrower trait, which has extremely little backing so far. Fireforged Trigger: Gain might on a critical hit with Flamethrower for 2 seconds. Reduced recharge on Flamethrower skills by 20%. This would further create synergy between Flamethrower and Might stacking builds.

Inventions Master: TBD.

• Cloaking Device: You become invisible when immobilized. 25s ICD. Deliver a Static Shock to nearby foes when exiting stealth, stunning them and dealing damage. 180 Radius. Similar to the A.E.D Toolbelt ability. This would provide a necessary stand-alone, selfish, defensive trait, that has less build requirements to function.

Alchemy Minor: TBD.

• Fortified Catalyst: Take 1% less damage for every boon present. Duration of boons you apply increased by 15%. Reclaim some Boon Duration that was severed from the traitline previously.

Alchemy Adept: Elixir Gun Trait, TBD.

• Powerful Disinfectants: Reduced recharge on Elixir Gun skills by 20%. Removing a condition with Elixir Gun will grant one second of protection and restore 15 Endurance to nearby allies. (240 Radius). Elixir Gun functions extremely well in solo encounters, but is often too vulnerable to properly use the support abilities as intended.

Alchemy Master: Med Kit, TBD.

• Med Kit is in the midst of a rework, and the abilities are still undetermined. I’ll wait until the ability is revealed to suggest a trait improving the Med Kit.

Alchemy Master: Self Regulating Defenses.

• This trait is really underpowered in PvP, it wasn’t a popular Adept, and now it is a Master. Instead, Intravenous Drip: Reduce the casting time of drinking and tossing Elixirs by a 1/2 second. This will greatly increase the finesse in which Elixir builds operate.

Alchemy Grandmaster: Automated Response.

• This trait somehow missed the pruning. It’s a trait that’s either cheese, or useless, just anti-fun for everyone. I suggest that it be totally replaced, but remain as stand-alone grandmaster for non-elixir users. Acidic Coating: When you gain vigor, gain a stack of Acidic Coating, causing the next attack against you to blind nearby foes in a 180 radius. Acidic Coating lasts for 10 seconds, and stacks up to 3 times. Can only activate once per second.

Alchemy Grandmaster: TBD.

• Disintigrating Weaponry: Reduced cast time of the Flamethrower and Elixir Gun cone attacks by 50%. Retaliation damage taken is reduced by 66% while Flamethrower or Elixir Gun is equipped. This has high synergy with the Firearms Adept I proposed that grants 2 seconds of Might per crit.

Tools Master: TBD.

• Gadgeteer. Reduced recharge of Gadgets by 20%. After a gadget is used, gain Utility Goggles for 3 Seconds.

Tools Grandmaster: Gadget Trait.

• Electromagnetic Matrix. A.E.D now lasts 8 seconds. Your attacks cause Static Shock to foes while you are under the effect of a Gadget if they are within 600 range. Each foe may only be affected by Electromagnetic Matrix every two seconds. Static Shock stuns for 1 second and does damage (A.E.D Toolbelt ability.) This turns A.E.D, Slick Shoes, and especially Utility Goggles into windows in which to put out serious pressure. Synergizes with the proposed Master Gadget trait, by allowing all other Gadgets to activate this trait for 3 seconds.

Tools Grandmaster: TBD.

• Fancypants Name. Successfully landing a Toolbelt ability that targets enemies will remove one condition. Competes with Cleaning Formula 409.

I would love to see more gadget synergy. The way I would go is make gadgeteer stay grandmaster and do 20% cooldown reduction, give a few seconds of resistance, and give another boon based on gadget (same as current gadgeteer boons). Then add a master trait that does something like blast finishers reduce the cooldown on your gadgets by 5%.

Another idea would be to make static discharge apply to gadgets and toolbelt skills.

A.E.D. could also use some serious work. Even when used perfectly, assuming you take fatal damage every 40 seconds and have all 4 conditions cleansed, you still get more healing and condi removal by just overcharging healing turret on cooldown. Then the fact that if you mistime the A.E.D. you are screwed. It’s horrible in any sustain situation since it’s a liability to use early and has such a long cooldown. I think the reward for timing it right should be bigger, such as giving stacks of stability, fury, and might if you take fatal damage, or maybe refreshing all toolbelt skills. This way burst builds can use it when they get pinned down and turn a fight, but sustain builds would still want the turret and hopefully support/bunker builds will want the med kit.

Thanks for the review. I look at this and personally, I don’t see anything that makes elixirs or turrets viable within the new meta. It will still be kits all day. So now you will have high range kit, mid range kit, short range kits, and melee kit. Elixirs still have their RNG issues. Turrets now are very glass and without synaptic overload, I’m not seeing a lot of benefit to the CC they bring. I think it continues to lean Engi’s to condition based builds but that’s just me.

Condi cleanse on toolbeltskills? insanely broken imo especially with the meta. Dont try it to make it more superior. I would like to see powershoes on firearms, so i can avoid tools for inventions maybe.

I think meta goes this way like 03033, because there is no way to choose explosions anymore without bombs unless mortar will be viable.

Drath.4750:

I would love to see more gadget synergy. The way I would go is make gadgeteer stay grandmaster and do 20% cooldown reduction, give a few seconds of resistance, and give another boon based on gadget (same as current gadgeteer boons). Then add a master trait that does something like blast finishers reduce the cooldown on your gadgets by 5%.

Another idea would be to make static discharge apply to gadgets and toolbelt skills.

A.E.D. could also use some serious work. Even when used perfectly, assuming you take fatal damage every 40 seconds and have all 4 conditions cleansed, you still get more healing and condi removal by just overcharging healing turret on cooldown. Then the fact that if you mistime the A.E.D. you are screwed. It’s horrible in any sustain situation since it’s a liability to use early and has such a long cooldown. I think the reward for timing it right should be bigger, such as giving stacks of stability, fury, and might if you take fatal damage, or maybe refreshing all toolbelt skills. This way burst builds can use it when they get pinned down and turn a fight, but sustain builds would still want the turret and hopefully support/bunker builds will want the med kit.

Yep! A.E.D, it’s very poor sustain. I think trying to make it compete in the sustain department with Healing Turret is a losing battle.

My hope for Gadgets are that they find a place in bursty, man mode, daring builds. Unfortunately, the Boons from Gadgeteer don’t fit in, or synergize with that at all.

If A.E.D was tweaked so that the effect lasted longer, and would ‘defy death’ until the effect expired, I feel that’d be a unique advantage. That way, the glassy Engineer would have a few invaluable seconds of (virtual) endure pain to get things done, under focus-fire, before retreating. If the Engineer was exceptionally dangerous when A.E.D was active, that’d give it a spot in my casual build.

Adding resistance to Gadgets on use could be a way to achieve that goal as well. Refreshing Toolbelt abilities is a great idea, too, but that already happens around the same time you use A.E.D from Initial Converter. A.E.D would still be laughable, and Thieves/Mesmers would still take you to school.

I hope in the xPac people will give Berserker Engi some respect! Haha.

OLD JUGGERNAUT RETURNS. Welcome back, Engi stability.

I’m expecting, or rather “hoping” for, a rework of “Kit Refinement” again. Abilities on a Global Cooldown and Sustained Swiftness don’t like to work together.

I’m interested in Inventions and how effective it’ll be in terms of passive sustaining while applying streams of blasts. I want to work on a base of:

Rifle – [Med Kit|Heal Turret] – Bomb Kit
Explosives: Short Fuse
Inventions: Heal Skill Blasts/Blasts Heal

Nilix.2170:

OLD JUGGERNAUT RETURNS. Welcome back, Engi stability.

I’m expecting, or rather “hoping” for, a rework of “Kit Refinement” again. Abilities on a Global Cooldown and Sustained Swiftness don’t like to work together.

I’m interested in Inventions and how effective it’ll be in terms of passive sustaining while applying streams of blasts. I want to work on a base of:

Rifle – [Med Kit|Heal Turret] – Bomb Kit
Explosives: Short Fuse
Inventions: Heal Skill Blasts/Blasts Heal

Yes @ Kit Refinement.

The fun was sucked dry, in the remake of it.

Remove the ability to activate out of combat, and individual global CDs per kit, please.

a few things i thought about while thinking about your thinking:

• esports rocket — dont make up another stupid proc like panic strike and chill of death ok. theyre lame, because you cant dodge them, because they only happen upon completion of a hit that does a health threshold, and its lame and boring.

• lethal aftereffects is similar to current poison nades. youre basically saying well bombs can perma poison now and if you try to cleanse it it just pops right back on you. i have the distinct feeling that this is why poison nades are losing field status more than anything, because you cleanse it and there it is again, and turning bombs into poison fields that dont blast aoe weakness is even more problematic than poison fields.

• anti-scope could be interesting with hammer and bombs, dont know enough about that yet to call it bad.

• thats a cray cray buff to cloaking device when its best use is already to drop focus in the middle of a zerg. i like it, i love it, its original and in-theme or something…. but it could be wayyyyy OP.

• SRD. again, youre calling an excellent trait UP cuz you dont play the game mode where its awesome. i couldnt ask for a better trait while zerging, except maybe cloaking device or AMR. outside of zerging, its not so useful. especially in pvp, where people watch things and save a killshot for immediately after you get big. as it is, alchemy lets engi take prot injection and SRD, which is absolutely perfect for what a frontline build would want out of that line. the bigger issue is the lack of AMR anywhere. and losing cloaking device. SRDs power level and placement is fine, if we can get those 2 traits back, because frontline engi probably cant be a thing without all 3.

• auto response – i agree. cheese or useless. should be dealt with. as is, its nice filler and pretty much useless anywhere else. would not take on its own merits, which is what anet wants GMs to be.

• tools gm suggestion. idk man, static shock has a 3/4s cast time for a 1s single target stun. something has to change about that. but the idea is interesting.

insanemaniac.2456:

a few things i thought about while thinking about your thinking:

• esports rocket — dont make up another stupid proc like panic strike and chill of death ok. theyre lame, because you cant dodge them,

It’s the ability from Rocket Turret, slow and arcing, not 0 travel time and completely unavoidable.

insanemaniac.2456:

• tools gm suggestion. idk man, static shock has a 3/4s cast time for a 1s single target stun. something has to change about that. but the idea is interesting.

In my pipe dream, it’s applied directly to the target, on hit, if it’s within 600 range, when you’re poppin’ A.E.D or Utility Goggles. No cast time.

The actual ability Static Shock is trash, I agree. It’s aftercast and cast time equal that of the stun.

Chaith.8256:

insanemaniac.2456:

a few things i thought about while thinking about your thinking:

• esports rocket — dont make up another stupid proc like panic strike and chill of death ok. theyre lame, because you cant dodge them,

It’s the ability from Rocket Turret, slow and arcing, not 0 travel time and completely unavoidable.

as an example, how does a player know when to use a reflect if a jump shot + esports rocket is inc, but slightly offset so 1 dodge isnt enough? how do you decide? do you cast the reflect and take the jump? do you dodge out of the jump and take the rocket?

free damage with no cast time is dumb, even if its delayed. just give us better damage/utility on something with a cast time instead. at least then its always clear what one needs to do to counterplay.

Since having speedy kits will require 6 into tools(because of stupid design reasons) the only real choice for mobility would be the new power shoes in firearms, especially with incendiary/napalm stuff there too.
Except power wrench, static discharge and speedy kits the tools line is pretty horrible.
Why go into tools when the new inventions has fancy sustain stuff that probably benefit more than 50% vigor uptime and slightly higher speed.
Alchemy is probably still a valid choice because it offers backpack regenerator and protection injection.

insanemaniac.2456:

Chaith.8256:

insanemaniac.2456:

a few things i thought about while thinking about your thinking:

• esports rocket — dont make up another stupid proc like panic strike and chill of death ok. theyre lame, because you cant dodge them,

It’s the ability from Rocket Turret, slow and arcing, not 0 travel time and completely unavoidable.

as an example, how does a player know when to use a reflect if a jump shot + esports rocket is inc, but slightly offset so 1 dodge isnt enough? how do you decide? do you cast the reflect and take the jump? do you dodge out of the jump and take the rocket?

free damage with no cast time is dumb, even if its delayed. just give us better damage/utility on something with a cast time instead. at least then its always clear what one needs to do to counterplay.

Specify that it can’t fire inside of 600 range, and I think that would fix the problem if it insta-flattening someone.

robertul.3679:

Since having speedy kits will require 6 into tools(because of stupid design reasons) the only real choice for mobility would be the new power shoes in firearms, especially with incendiary/napalm stuff there too.
Except power wrench, static discharge and speedy kits the tools line is pretty horrible.
Why go into tools when the new inventions has fancy sustain stuff that probably benefit more than 50% vigor uptime and slightly higher speed.
Alchemy is probably still a valid choice because it offers backpack regenerator and protection injection.

Med Kit provides out of combat Swiftness, and the Swiftness and Vuln on Crit trait in Firearms can stack up pretty well, especially with the right runes.

All is not lost, it just might result in a slight meta change.

There are ways, but for WvW and open world PvE I suspect that Tools will pretty much be a must-have. Traveller Runes are always a possibility.

Sure, it’s a shock to Engineers, but there is life without Speedy Kits.

Chaith.8256:

robertul.3679:

Since having speedy kits will require 6 into tools(because of stupid design reasons) the only real choice for mobility would be the new power shoes in firearms, especially with incendiary/napalm stuff there too.
Except power wrench, static discharge and speedy kits the tools line is pretty horrible.
Why go into tools when the new inventions has fancy sustain stuff that probably benefit more than 50% vigor uptime and slightly higher speed.
Alchemy is probably still a valid choice because it offers backpack regenerator and protection injection.

Med Kit provides out of combat Swiftness, and the Swiftness and Vuln on Crit trait in Firearms can stack up pretty well, especially with the right runes.

All is not lost, it just might result in a slight meta change.

There are ways, but for WvW and open world PvE I suspect that Tools will pretty much be a must-have. Traveller Runes are always a possibility.

Sure, it’s a shock to Engineers, but there is life without Speedy Kits.

I’m looking forward to using BOTH honestly. I don’t know how many people remember the old “Superior Runes of Speed”. They were supposed to give you +7% bonus movement speed in swiftness. ie Swiftness at 40% bonus speed rather than 33%. They never worked for some reason or another though and I had a full set of them really early in the game back when 1 gold was about 400 gems each but it was a waste. Here’s to hoping it’ll be functional this time around!

Nilix.2170:

Chaith.8256:

robertul.3679:

Since having speedy kits will require 6 into tools(because of stupid design reasons) the only real choice for mobility would be the new power shoes in firearms, especially with incendiary/napalm stuff there too.
Except power wrench, static discharge and speedy kits the tools line is pretty horrible.
Why go into tools when the new inventions has fancy sustain stuff that probably benefit more than 50% vigor uptime and slightly higher speed.
Alchemy is probably still a valid choice because it offers backpack regenerator and protection injection.

Med Kit provides out of combat Swiftness, and the Swiftness and Vuln on Crit trait in Firearms can stack up pretty well, especially with the right runes.

All is not lost, it just might result in a slight meta change.

There are ways, but for WvW and open world PvE I suspect that Tools will pretty much be a must-have. Traveller Runes are always a possibility.

Sure, it’s a shock to Engineers, but there is life without Speedy Kits.

I’m looking forward to using BOTH honestly. I don’t know how many people remember the old “Superior Runes of Speed”. They were supposed to give you +7% bonus movement speed in swiftness. ie Swiftness at 40% bonus speed rather than 33%. They never worked for some reason or another though and I had a full set of them really early in the game back when 1 gold was about 400 gems each but it was a waste. Here’s to hoping it’ll be functional this time around!

Hah, yes, Robo Legs promises that larger-than-swiftness walking swag, should be interesting to see in action.

Chaith.8256:

robertul.3679:

Since having speedy kits will require 6 into tools(because of stupid design reasons) the only real choice for mobility would be the new power shoes in firearms, especially with incendiary/napalm stuff there too.
Except power wrench, static discharge and speedy kits the tools line is pretty horrible.
Why go into tools when the new inventions has fancy sustain stuff that probably benefit more than 50% vigor uptime and slightly higher speed.
Alchemy is probably still a valid choice because it offers backpack regenerator and protection injection.

Med Kit provides out of combat Swiftness, and the Swiftness and Vuln on Crit trait in Firearms can stack up pretty well, especially with the right runes.

All is not lost, it just might result in a slight meta change.

There are ways, but for WvW and open world PvE I suspect that Tools will pretty much be a must-have. Traveller Runes are always a possibility.

Sure, it’s a shock to Engineers, but there is life without Speedy Kits.

errr life without speedy kits has been legit in wvw since power shoes was changed.

every single inventions adept is utter crap in pvp so the entire trait line is wasted because any build can put 2 in tools instead of 4 in inventions for move speed. that extra 2 points goes such a long way for builds. thats why you feel so tied to speedy kits.

in wvw, stab armor and cloaking device are both excellent adept inventions traits. you can sacrifice your stunbreak for mobility, opting instead to soft counter cc with damage reduction and the superb sustain from AMR (thats been a thing since forever). you can pick up an awesome focus drop for zerging (engi frontlining couldnt be much of a thing before the stab changes, but now slicky is sosostrong).

and ever since dry top was released, power shoes has had a spot in pve… because the fall damage trait suddenly had relevance. and ofc its adept inventions. none of the core maps really use verticality, except wvw, and in wvw taking fall damage traits for the hell of it is kinda troll/wasteful.

…really hoping robo legs absorbs powershoes, not replaces.

Movement speed stacking didn’t work because it’s hard capped at 33%. So you can’t really go over that maximum but certain things like super speed help you a lot especially since they counter cripple and chill. Also not really relevant but superspeed affects movement skills much more than swiftness. It’s pretty crazy actually.
If somehow robo-legs would be like superspeed that would be an extremely huge buff so I doubt it will occur.

robertul.3679:

Movement speed stacking didn’t work because it’s hard capped at 33%. So you can’t really go over that maximum but certain things like super speed help you a lot especially since they counter cripple and chill. Also not really relevant but superspeed affects movement skills much more than swiftness. It’s pretty crazy actually.
If somehow robo-legs would be like superspeed that would be an extremely huge buff so I doubt it will occur.

I firmly believe Robo Legs will provide a real speed increase over the 33% cap. With a name and delivery such as that, it has to be. LOL. It could be a 2% increase though, who knows.

Chaith.8256:

• Incendiary Powder is gone from Explosives. This is a high significant and highly justified nerf to explosives. With the uncoupling of Incendiary Powder, and now baseline traits like Forceful Explosives, and Grenadier’s 50% damage increase, Explosives is not required and is noticeably more well balanced than the tyranny it currently holds over Engi builds.

I’ve gone to watch the stream again, and keep listening it over and over around the 02:08:25 secs where they speak about that “50% damage buff on granades”.
Sorry if i’m going to point this, but the “50% damage boost” they are referring to, is the add in baseline of the third granade if i well understand.

I jumped on my chair when i’ve read here “50% damage increase on granades”.
But from what i understand, you, like the same Anet devs, are referring to the add of the third granades right(that would be a 33% damage more but only referring to the third nade as baseline) ?

Or am I wrong and there will be a 50% damage increase buff?

Sorry for that, it’s that i have problems understanding english, so even if i hear that stream again and again, with 3 devs talking together at the same time, i really have hard time to understand things properly.

So, in the end, is 50% dmg increase to the nades, or are you just talking about baseline third nades?

Anyway, i would invest in invention with that new traits.
You can go both for a tanky condi engi for roaming or pvp making use of all thst healing trats(even bunker down will be awesome for selfish playstile).
I can see the invention line Overpowered atm.

Also it will be EXTREMELY usefull for WvW battles… all that AoE healing… ye i can easly see a frontline engi with invention trait, coupled with FT for stsbility, bombs for damage, etc etc.
A 6 0 6 6 0 or a 0 6 6 6 0 or… there are so many mix to do considering all the changes… and we still don’t know many traits, and also some of the traits we saw are sueceptible to changes or work in progress.

I think it will be awesome. I felt reborn as Engi after that streaming.

Just talking about the baseline 3rd nade. Going from 2 to 3 grenades is in fact a 50% change.

Yes, everyone likes Inventions so far. Alchemy and tools have many brand new traits yet to be revealed, so that might be even better than inventions!

A nice overview, thanks for the post.

As far as the deleted functionalities go, I’m very happy reserve mines is just gone. Those things have knocked me out of stealth countless times, so I’ll be really happy to never have to deal with them again.

I imagine things like rifle mod and rifled turret barrels are possibly rolled into baseline and they just haven’t stated so as of yet, or they’re still deciding on whether or not to do that.

However, I did actually make use of empowering adrenaline, exploit weakness, cloaking device, protective shield, automated medical response, sitting duck, stabilized armour, and acidic coating. In particular, cloaking device and protective shield were very useful defensive options (particularly in WvW), sitting duck was part of my SD burst build, and acidic coating was handy in my defensive turret build.

Some of it seems to be somewhat compensated for, like the shield providing protection when traited, and different sources of vulnerability. I’d like to not see these all go as that gets rid of some potentially useful stuff. At the very least, they could at least tack a lesser form of them onto other traits.

I felt there was a lot of this blast finisher synergy stuff being focused on during the AMA. I don’t really want the profession to be converted to a blast finisher machine, especially when ele is just going to be a better zerg healer anyways. I guess a lot of crap is really still up in the air for engineer though since they made some very deep changes.

Also, I don’t understand the deal with cleaning formula 409. Why is it in tools? It doesn’t fit thematically, and now I have to spec in two specializations to get my elixirs back to the level they’re currently at, whereas I would only need to dump points into alchemy to do that currently (ignoring some things rolled into baseline).

There are currently only three alchemy traits that anyone really takes (fast acting, 409, and HGH), and the changes only reduce that to two. That lets me take an extra trait, but now I have to commit to two trait lines instead of one. How does that at all promote build variety and flexibility? IMO, cleaning formula 409 should remain in the alchemy line at the master level.

And so what if cleaning formula 409 would have good synergy with the inventions line if it was kept in alchemy. That’s still two specializations I’d need to go into. As it is with the proposed trait layout, I’d have no option but to go inventions, alchemy, and tools just to create that combo. And what do I get for it? Potentially just a tickle of AoE regen for a few seconds on tool belt skills that potentially have 30s+ cooldowns. That’s a lot of potentially good things in firearms and explosives to get that (i.e. incediary powder, more blast finishers). Whoopdie friggin do.

If you ask me, the healsplosion combo with the explosives line seems like it could potentially be way more broken. So should they move the explosive grandmasters down to tools to compensate? It would make just as much thematic sense as putting cleaning formula 409 there.

Well, we’ll have to see what they do with it. I’m just going to be really frustrated if they’re intent on leaving cleaning formula 409 in the tools. I understand it’s still a very rough WIP though, a lot of stuff in alchemy still hasn’t even been fleshed out yet. 409 is the only trait that makes elixir builds even remotely competitive, and making it split up from HGH is such a fashion is not really going to serve to help elixir builds shine any brighter.

Ty for reply.

Yes, can’t wait to see the job they have done.
Even more, can’t wait for it to go live, i hope for the end of May.

Very nice ideas Chaith – thanks for the post.
I especially like you`re ideas for bombs and glue. Those would highly increase the engineers viability in large scale fights – mabe even give acces to the WvW – Meta.

Chaith.8256:

• Bunker Down has been reworked and added to Inventions as a Grandmaster. Procs ‘Drop Bandage’ on crit, with a 2s ICD. Seeing as these bandages heal for 1000 base and scale at 50% of healing power each, that would enable the Engineer to drop enough deuces to heal an army with a Celestial or support build that could crit enough!

Where did you get these numbers from?

The way the trait was presented in the stream, it’s supposed to retain its original functionality and deploy mines, too, but maybe it wasn’t clear or I misunderstood.

RabbitUp.8294:

Chaith.8256:

• Bunker Down has been reworked and added to Inventions as a Grandmaster. Procs ‘Drop Bandage’ on crit, with a 2s ICD. Seeing as these bandages heal for 1000 base and scale at 50% of healing power each, that would enable the Engineer to drop enough deuces to heal an army with a Celestial or support build that could crit enough!

Where did you get these numbers from?

The way the trait was presented in the stream, it’s supposed to retain its original functionality and deploy mines, too, but maybe it wasn’t clear or I misunderstood.

This is my interpretation based on what they said.

Literally a copy of bunker down, but with the exception of instead, dropping a bandage. We already know what bandages do.

They could modify anything, and this trait looks borderline OP for small engagements, so we’ll see.

I can’t agree with that optimistic view on grenades.
Sure, now the third grenade is baseline. But as far as balancing goes, we were already balanced upon the traited kit – so it isn’t like we’re getting a buff, they just normalized the situation.
Add to that the poison grenade nerf and the range one, and it doesn’t end up that well.
I understand that they needed to find a way to make mortar more important, but still, that’s harsh.
Sure, the new grenadier trait, by making radius bigger and their travel time faster, may improve our accuracy on mid-range (cause that’s all there is, now). And the improved shrapnel can raise damage and keep enemies far. Also, we still have the good old vulnerability.
But on the other hand, we risk being exactly in the same situation as before – either you fully trait it, or it isn’t worth to take at all.
Guess we’ll have to wait for further informations (especially about the mortar).

Manuhell.2759:

I can’t agree with that optimistic view on grenades.
Sure, now the third grenade is baseline. But as far as balancing goes, we were already balanced upon the traited kit – so it isn’t like we’re getting a buff, they just normalized the situation.
Add to that the poison grenade nerf and the range one, and it doesn’t end up that well.
I understand that they needed to find a way to make mortar more important, but still, that’s harsh.
Sure, the new grenadier trait, by making radius bigger and their travel time faster, may improve our accuracy on mid-range (cause that’s all there is, now). And the improved shrapnel can raise damage and keep enemies far. Also, we still have the good old vulnerability.
But on the other hand, we risk being exactly in the same situation as before – either you fully trait it, or it isn’t worth to take at all.
Guess we’ll have to wait for further informations (especially about the mortar).

Trait-less Nades were undeniably buffed. 85% of the grenades that I land are <900. I’ll take that increased radius and velocity. Post patch, I’ll probably still use Nades in PvP on a Cele build, even if the Meta doesn’t include Explosives. At least I’d seriously consider it. Nades with Firearms instead of Explosives would be no joke, assuming there was a reason to not take both Explosives and Firearms.

Chaith.8256:

Inventions

• Inventions first Minor now allows for condition removal in a radius when a healing skill is used (swapping to Med Kit will potentially take advantage of a low ICD on this.) It’s certainly a buff when compared with the current trait occupying that space.

Anyone else wondering if this might mean a nerf to the HT condition removal?

Some of the trait suggestions by Chaith are cool and I hope the developers take a look at them.

I seriously disagree with the grenade kit changes though. I play mostly WvWvW and there maps and meta is completely different from the small clumped spvp maps, which are all about capping and holding nodes.

Increasing the projectile speed + radius just promotes less skillful “spam everything” type of play, making it more difficult for enemies to avoid them.

The range reduction from 1500 to 900 has massive negative implications for WvWvW.
The current meta is the pirate ship, meaning lots of staff elementalist, necromancers and guardians. Ele staff #1 can already hit further away than grenade kit. I know it’s listed range is mere 1200, but I have tested with a guild mate and under some circumstances it can reliably hit further than the fully traited grenades. Ranger LB with eagle eyes trait hits around 1950 range at even ground and even further away from uphill position.

If engineer needs to get in 900 range to use grenades against enemy pirate ship he is utter toast. Several enemy necros, elementalists and rangers will focus fire him. In small scale it is difficult to hit solo enemy players who are mobile from over 900 range with the grenade kit as the grenades travel so slowly. Yet the engineer needs a long range attack, which works with hybrid builds (celestial, power or condi builds). This has multiple uses from clearing enemy siege (staff eles and necros do this much better though), pressuring enemies who attack your tower/keep, pressuring enemy zerg from far etc.

Retaliation has already been serious risk of using grenade kit against enemy zerg as single use of grenade barrage can lead to over 7k retaliation damage back. Since retaliation is very common in WvWvW (simple guardian hammer #1 auto chain + hammer #2 spam), we have no need to further punish grenade kit users in WvWvW. Engis have never been meta in WvWvW.

I urge the developers to retain the range of the grenade kit, even if means the use of an additional trait. Those who don’t need this extra range, don’t need to take the trait. Problem solved.

Deniara Devious.3948:

Some of the trait suggestions by Chaith are cool and I hope the developers take a look at them.

I seriously disagree with the grenade kit changes though. I play mostly WvWvW and there maps and meta is completely different from the small clumped spvp maps, which are all about capping and holding nodes.

Increasing the projectile speed + radius just promotes less skillful “spam everything” type of play, making it more difficult for enemies to avoid them.

The range reduction from 1500 to 900 has massive negative implications for WvWvW.
The current meta is the pirate ship, meaning lots of staff elementalist, necromancers and guardians. Ele staff #1 can already hit further away than grenade kit. I know it’s listed range is mere 1200, but I have tested with a guild mate and under some circumstances it can reliably hit further than the fully traited grenades. Ranger LB with eagle eyes trait hits around 1950 range at even ground and even further away from uphill position.

If engineer needs to get in 900 range to use grenades against enemy pirate ship he is utter toast. Several enemy necros, elementalists and rangers will focus fire him. In small scale it is difficult to hit solo enemy players who are mobile from over 900 range with the grenade kit as the grenades travel so slowly. Yet the engineer needs a long range attack, which works with hybrid builds (celestial, power or condi builds). This has multiple uses from clearing enemy siege (staff eles and necros do this much better though), pressuring enemies who attack your tower/keep, pressuring enemy zerg from far etc.

Retaliation has already been serious risk of using grenade kit against enemy zerg as single use of grenade barrage can lead to over 7k retaliation damage back. Since retaliation is very common in WvWvW (simple guardian hammer #1 auto chain + hammer #2 spam), we have no need to further punish grenade kit users in WvWvW. Engis have never been meta in WvWvW.

I urge the developers to retain the range of the grenade kit, even if means the use of an additional trait. Those who don’t need this extra range, don’t need to take the trait. Problem solved.

I think that enabling other avenues for Engineers to rise from garbo-tier in competitive WvW is in order! Engineer is not really a backline profession just because of Nades.

It’s my vision that Engineer could front line with either Flamethrower & retaliation defense, as per my suggestion, or bombs. Toss in some un-limited target abilities such as the Glue fields in my suggestions, and that’s a pretty good start. I’m not a WvW expert, but squishy nade builds seem incompatible with the goals of WvW.

Camping Mortar seems like it could be a potentially very strong WvW option, depending on the balance. Maybe it could single-handedly enable back-lining to make sense.

squishy nade builds are great for desieging, but are thought to be outclassed by ele for aoe dps (cuz ele brings more other supporty things too without trying) or mes/teef for burst (better stealth, big spikes). theres a place in a zerg, but not really in a gvg. a zerg likes it when 1-3 people can take out the ACs that meteor has a hard time killing. in a gvg, theres no siege to kill from 1500 without line of sight.

engi can front line excellently right now with bombs and slicky. we dont need specs for it to enter the meta, basically… we need the trashy elitists to step outside of their boxes and realize 2 things: warriors are bannerbots and no longer the invincible cc+dps machines they used to be, and no matter how many guardians you put in your parties, you cant get enough stability to just stupidly charge like you used to. and they kinda already realize it, but i dont think they have any idea what to do about it, so they just whine and moan that GWEN is superior without trying anything else. it sounds really negative writing about it, but tbh i just have a lot of fun on front line engi and dont worry about any of that. my best feat so far is jumping off a short cliff onto a ~50 man stack and slickying them… followed by my zerg mowing them down from nwc to bay getting kills the entire way. was i the cause of their wipe? maybe, maybe not… but i sure feel like i did something in that fight, and i feel like maybe if there were 5 of me instead of 1 then we wouldnt have had to chase them down to get the bags.

The frontline engine builds, like 2/0/4/4/4 with soldier’s gear, using bombs and slick shoes, I feel I could out heal with basic regeneration. Haha. Does that make them Slick Shoe bots instead of banner bots?

I can’t wait for engineers Elite specialization. I don’t blob v blob, but it would seem a lot less silly to me doing that with a hammer.

yep, slicky bots. build like that wont win you a 1v1, for sure. but in a small v small youre still unignorable. and in a blob v blob you have 20 or 70 other people aoeing when you pull off a trap.

and plain ole regen wouldnt be enough, i can pressure a healing signet enough to make a warrior run, just not enough to kill him.

Manuhell.2759:

But on the other hand, we risk being exactly in the same situation as before – either you fully trait it, or it isn’t worth to take at all.

This I’m not so sure about this.

There’s scenarios where extra velocity and larger radius are not actually helpful. PvE is probably the best example of this, but one would theoretically not need the enhanced velocity and radius if they do not have any issue consistently hitting their targets with the current velocity and radius.

The only reason grenadier is so necessary in the current implementation is because it results in a 50% damage/effectiveness boost, which is insanely good. The range bonus is a bit of a fallacy because grenades are often used at a much shorter range, often even at point-blank. It’s not that the range wasn’t useful, but it was the more minor benefit of the trait.

With the new system, traited grenades will be objectively more powerful. However, whether or not that extra power is really useful in the scenarios you’d be using them is a completely different matter.

In addition, since incendiary powder and grenadier won’t be on the same trait line anymore, it’s quite possible some people might elect to not take the grenadier trait if they’d rather use incendiary powder. Though it’ll really depend on what sort of other options are available.

If nothing else, untraited grenades will be much more relevant to general gameplay than they currently are.

Personally I think the alchemy needs a bit more of an impact.

Perhaps a grandmaster trait that gave grenades a second effect based on the grenade after all the grenades may be explosives but chemicals is what makes it do so.
Grenade +5% damage perhaps
Shrapnel Grenade leaves a short fire field or burns
Flash Grenade causes short confusion or stun effect
Frost Grenade causes freeze effect
Poison grenade causes weakness

Another thought is to make the glue effects on the gun and bombs flammable giving it a field effect that when it comes into contact with burning or fire it does a short explosion and causes a short duration fire field.

these are just a few suggestion/thoughts.

I also thought the elixir gun trait “Increased dosage” or something. changing skill number one to inflict slow and lower the targets resistance to conditions. Either allowing conditions to do more damage like Vulnerability or increases duration of conditions applied.

I think they’re going to try and stick to one trait per kit. That way, you don’t have to be restricted to more than one line if you want to specialize in a kit, and the trait selections won’t be flooded with kit traits.

The new alchemy line was probably the least fleshed out. I hope the put cleaning formula 409 back up there though, as it simply makes sense in that line (at least compared to tools).

I hadn’t really given much thought as to what the trait for elixir gun should do as the current traits don’t really do anything special. I suppose we could start by having the trait make elixir F not crap and go up from there.

I did a mock specialization grid that incorporates my suggestions:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1DQV1ohFOqlhOZ4cxM2nTQTU_M1zS41xA86sf5gHSofY/edit?pli=1#gid=0

Yamsandjams.3267:

I think they’re going to try and stick to one trait per kit. That way, you don’t have to be restricted to more than one line if you want to specialize in a kit, and the trait selections won’t be flooded with kit traits.

The new alchemy line was probably the least fleshed out. I hope the put cleaning formula 409 back up there though, as it simply makes sense in that line (at least compared to tools).

I hadn’t really given much thought as to what the trait for elixir gun should do as the current traits don’t really do anything special. I suppose we could start by having the trait make elixir F not crap and go up from there.

I think Elixir F would be pretty well suited to a tune up, off the specialization books. I think Elixir Gun needs something to reward players to instead use their time to support with it.

Yamsandjams.3267:

This I’m not so sure about this.

There’s scenarios where extra velocity and larger radius are not actually helpful. PvE is probably the best example of this, but one would theoretically not need the enhanced velocity and radius if they do not have any issue consistently hitting their targets with the current velocity and radius.

Well, the increased radius would also give more consistent multiple hits in ranged situations, raising the overall damage and proccings of shrapnel (if taken).
Sure, in melee range there is no difference, and most of the current PvE is like that. But HoT may present us with different gameplay situations.

Yamsandjams.3267:

The only reason grenadier is so necessary in the current implementation is because it results in a 50% damage/effectiveness boost, which is insanely good. The range bonus is a bit of a fallacy because grenades are often used at a much shorter range, often even at point-blank. It’s not that the range wasn’t useful, but it was the more minor benefit of the trait.

A 50% bonus is indeed insanely good…and even too much, since they ended up balancing the whole kit upon it.
Still, while grenades are usually used at a fraction of their full range, they still were the only 1500 range weapon we had. So, if we really wanted that range, it was either that or nothing. I wouldn’t call that a minor benefit.

Yamsandjams.3267:

With the new system, traited grenades will be objectively more powerful. However, whether or not that extra power is really useful in the scenarios you’d be using them is a completely different matter.

In addition, since incendiary powder and grenadier won’t be on the same trait line anymore, it’s quite possible some people might elect to not take the grenadier trait if they’d rather use incendiary powder. Though it’ll really depend on what sort of other options are available.

I can’t see why one should take grenades and not trait them in explosives.
Ok, let alone grenadier. Let’s take the explosive rocket belt. But there is steel-packed powder to do vulnerability, a master trait that raises damage to targets with vulnerability, explosive powders that further raise damage by 10% and shrapnel as grandmaster as another additional source of damage.
Do we have any reason to really take the kit and not trait it?
Especially if it ends up like with the old grenadier – where the kit was actually balanced upon the traits.

Yamsandjams.3267:

If nothing else, untraited grenades will be much more relevant to general gameplay than they currently are.

Eh, dunno. I can’t share the optimism. I see it more as an “either you trait it, or you trait something else (mortar and/or bomb, judging from the explosive traits) and take it”.

The changes to grenades don’t bother me nearly as much as the fact that 409 was moved into tools for whatever reason. If that stays, elixir builds will be forced into taking 2 lines and the GM traits in both in order to get the most out of elixirs, which, excluding S, are pretty lackluster.

Really hoping either they buff 409 to the heavens as compensation, or just leave it alone and move it back to alchemy where it belongs.

Kande.1930:

The changes to grenades don’t bother me nearly as much as the fact that 409 was moved into tools for whatever reason. If that stays, elixir builds will be forced into taking 2 lines and the GM traits in both in order to get the most out of elixirs, which, excluding S, are pretty lackluster.

Really hoping either they buff 409 to the heavens as compensation, or just leave it alone and move it back to alchemy where it belongs.

Cleaning Formula 409 is definitely not a worthy Tools Grandmaster. I think it’s extremely likely it’ll be buffed or modified when ArenaNet actually does a pass through Tools (no new traits yet.)

Chaith.8256:

Cleaning Formula 409 is definitely not a worthy Tools Grandmaster. I think it’s extremely likely it’ll be buffed or modified when ArenaNet actually does a pass through Tools (no new traits yet.)

What bases do you declare it is not worthy?

What cause you to think it will change, test beta feedback?

dancingmonkey.4902:

Chaith.8256:

Cleaning Formula 409 is definitely not a worthy Tools Grandmaster. I think it’s extremely likely it’ll be buffed or modified when ArenaNet actually does a pass through Tools (no new traits yet.)

What bases do you declare it is not worthy?

What cause you to think it will change, test beta feedback?

Based on precedent of many non-meta traits getting a large power boost, and this one is getting nerfed in availability to elixir build, and going to Grandmaster. It’s the nerfs that make me suspect a buff

Here’s my take.

Skill Changes/Visual Changes

For Engineer, I love the visual changes that were done to the Kits. Engineer has needed telegraphs for what Kit it is in for counterplay reasons for the longest time; and the backpacks really didn’t convey that unless you were behind the Engineer. An opportunity was missed for the Med Kit though. I would much prefer a compound syringe gun/bonesaw like the TF2 Medic’s Ubersaw or just a Medigun type thing. The syringe glove just doesn’t have the visual impact.

Med Kit

• I love the Healing Breeze change to Med Kit 1. The selfish 1-2-3 Bandages were great for solo, but Healing Turret was the apex choice for the longest time precisely because of its AOE healing and Condi cleanse.
• Medkit’s Skill 2 doesn’t really make a lot of sense considering the rest of the kit where you want to be close to allies to buff and heal them.
• The pylon is static and will be quickly left behind in mobile combat. To expound on the anchor icon chosen, why not a “grappling hook” that pulls you to an ally? Or just shadowsteps; because the leap code desync is really bad at 200+ ping.
• Antidote is still single target and longer overall cast time than just double tapping Healing Turret. I hope they buff either the conditions cleared, or the AOE.

Bomb Kit

• The changes to the traits are what will finally make this a viable damage kit over Grenade Kit. BK is okay for Conquest where the AOE covers the whole node, but on the offense and in open WvW it’s absolutely terrible.
• One of my greatest wishes for Bomb Kit is for the Bombs to be thrown forward slightly to increase the telegraph and make it better offensively outside of conquest. Dropped at the feet they quickly become obscured behind the Engineer which takes away counterplay.
• I sincerely hope that the differentiating telegraphs between bombs are improved.

Grenade Kit
I like how there’s now role differentiation between Grenade Kit and Mortar Kit.

• Grenade kit’s range will be nerfed to 900, baseline grenades thrown now 3, Grenadier now buffs velocity and radius.

• I think this change is a good one. Grenade Kit has dominated Engineer play for the longest time. I will agree with Deniara Devious that it does change the playing field for WvW Engineers; but I expect that Mortar will fill the gap. Not completely, but enough.

Mortar Kit
Visually, I would rather that the Mortar became a rocket launcher if it were to become mobile; or keep the mortar but remodeled to be more like modern infantry hand mortars . Mortar’s range now has a role.

• Skill wise now that the Barrage/GDI Ion Cannon is on F5, make the 5 skill Barrage the Blast finisher.
• Replace the Caltrops mortar on skill 2 with the Poison field and you’re golden. Bleed is already on Grenade 2 anyway; and Chill supersedes Cripple’s power.

Turret Changes
Making Turrets able to be crit and take damage from conditions is long overdue. Accelerant Packed Turrets being baseline encourages active play as well. Unfortunately Turrets need more work to become active moreso than they are already.

• The most fundamental change I feel is to remove the Turret autoattack and reduce the cooldown of the Overcharge. This gives players full control over who and when the Turrets attack. Powerful overcharges like the Thumper Turret knockback can be moved to the Toolbelt. Same for the Heat Seeking rocket.
• The second most important change is to make Turrets able to be thrown as baseline (remove Deployable Turrets) just as Wells and Consecrations.
• Tweaks to cooldown and health to make them truly disposable but quick to redeploy can further develop an active playstyle; yet still immobile.

Trait Changes
Explosives

• Explosives line making Forceful explosives baseline was absolutely needed; and the synergy with Evasive Powder Keg is appreciated with the Minors. Removal of Reserve Mines is awesome.
• The Dodge bomb becoming a Blast Finisher in GM is great. The synergy with the Inventions line could well replace Backpack Regenerator for sustain and erode Alchemy.
• I don’t like the Explosive Rocket Belt Thingy™. It’s absolutely skill-less.
  • It might be better as an execution trait. Attacks against a target at less than 50% HP build an Esports rocket charge; up to 5 charges. ICD 1 second to prevent Grenades from being OP. Triggering the F5 Elite Toolbelt skill fires 1 Esports Rocket per charge. Now you have a dodgeable execute for Power builds.

Overall Explosives is more focused. Moving Incendiary Powder out of Explosives is a bold move, but necessary. I still think it might be the best line for Engineer though. Everything in there is just so synergistic. Explosives/Inventions/X will be a powerful direct damage bruiser.

Firearms
Firearms is still a little janky to me. Rifled Barrels and Coated Bullets being baseline is great; but now, the line is much more about Condi Damage. I don’t like this, because it really punishes Zerker Rifle Burst Engi when it was already the weakest spec.

• Keeping the Minors the same is horrible RNG design carried over. It’s lazy but it’s there.
• Merging Infused Precision/Precise Sights is okay and has synergy with Explosives; but the benefits are minor at best. I don’t see it overtaking Speedy Kits; but it could see use in die Flammenwerfer build in conjunction with ROBO LEGS.
• ROBO LEGS supersedes Power Shoes? In that case it’s a powerful mobility boost to FT; especially with the Juggernaut pulsing Stability change.
• Taking away Sitting Duck whilst keeping Modified Ammunition a Grandmaster is horrible. Taking away 10% flat damage from Rifle Mod for Crit chance just crushes the Rifle Burst even further. I don’t see the justification for it. The 5 Vulnerability + 4-6% from Modified Ammunition in Sitting Duck/ModAmmo Burst builds being taken away pretty much removes Jump Shot/Blunderbuss executions. It’s probably going to be Celestial Rifle for days now.
• Juggernaut Pulsing Stability is long overdue. The Might is gone though. I think an appropriate buff would be to make Critical Hits rip boons to supersede Bunker Down and mitigate Retaliation.
• Condi damage as %Precision is one of those boring passives but I can see the need for it now that stats don’t come with traits.
• Incendiary Powder is known to be powerful and will be a strong condi spec pick. Celestial Rifle, Rabid condi will want to drop Explosives for this; then try to pick up Power from elsewhere now that Traits don’t give stats; or run Explosives/Firearms/Tools especially now that Adrenal Implant is Tools Master.

Inventions
Overall I like the remake of Inventions in theory. The Inventions Minors are fantastic for active condi remove and are a real competitor to transmute/CF409. The synergy with Blast Finisher on Heal is just gravy and erodes Backpack Regenerator.

• Here’s hoping there’s no ICD to Adept II so I can lay a Fire Bomb and spam Med Kit to get 25 Might for daaaays; whilst sustaining up with HEAL-SPLOSION. It’ll be glorious.
• Autodefense Bomb Dispenser is still bad. It’s even worse with Adept II and the Shield 20% CDR + AOE Prot.
• I’m hoping that the TBD in Inventions Master goes towards Gadget support. Perhaps inflict the “Slow” condition for 3 seconds on Gadget activation in 240 radius. Call it… WAAAARRRP ZOOOONE. In this way, Gadget builds get a “tanky” trait in Inventions with counterplay.
• Moving Experimental Turrets down to Master is a questionable decision; especially now that Fortified Turrets + Metal Plating is merged in GM. Turret camping just got buffed a metric butt ton. Yes, they can be crit and die to conditions now; but this buff is just insane. Camping should be discouraged.
• Bunker Down with the Med Kit buff is still questionable; especially now that it is in Inventions. Heck, with just Healing Turret and the buff to Fortified Turrets, one can simply drop and overcharge to block projectiles for 4 seconds. Adept II removes the immediate need to detonate HT; so there’s literally no downside. Ditto for Supply Crate. The mechanic is RNG and weak compared to what’s in the same tier; and should be discarded entirely.
  • I feel that since Engineer is getting Hammer in the expansion, Bunker Down should be replaced with a Hammer trait. For example, timing a Hammer autoattack to swing at the same time a projectile based autoattack would hit, reflects that autoattack. So you could bat people’s autos back at them.

Alchemy
Alchemy looks pretty much the same as before: outstanding Adepts and Majors, situational Grandmasters. Removing Energy Conversion Matrix is a minor but significant nerf to HGH and Celestial builds though.

• Forcing a choice between Prot Injection and Invig Speed is a false one. Invigorating Speed would be taken more; especially now that you can get Protection on Shield 4-5.
• For the undertermined Elixir Gun trait: A good one would be to make Fumigate (EG3) rip boons from foes; and to make Elixir F transfer a condition from allies to foes. Ultimate support.
• For Med Kit, make the Antidote and Stimulant AOE on pickup. Heck, make the F1 Bandage Self AOE. Maximum support.
• The third Grandmaster Alchemy Trait should make Elixirs generate more Fields; not just On-Throw. So Elixir H generates a Water Field, B a Chaos Field, U a Dark Field, S a Smoke Field, C a Light Field, R a Lightning Field. It would be a powerful counterpoint to HGH; and Elixir Builds lack Finishers; which leads to a Pistol/Shield support design with one damage kit.

I think it’s funny how nearly all the counter-condi power has moved to Inventions and Tools. It makes Alchemy a lot less dominating; though Transmute is still there.

Tools
Tools just looks like as it was before. And that’s a bad thing, because a lot of the good stuff was taken out for no reason; primarily Enduring Damage for Zerker builds. Again, I don’t understand while Rifle Zerker Burst is so bad that it has to be nerfed.

• Static Discharge and Power Wrench are in the same Tier is horrible, because Power Wrench will be picked 100% of the time over SD unless building for 1 shots.
• Speedy Kits/Kit Refinement is the new star though. I will pick that 100% of the time. Even if it’s bad. It’s more for the Swiftness, but a free spell every 20 seconds isn’t horrible; especially now that you can time it.
• CF409 as the GM of Tools is a weird one. I guess it does work to keep the old HGH build down, but HGH was already nerfed significantly so I don’t see the point in breaking it into 2 lines to nerf it further.
• For the Master undetermined trait, there really needs to be some kind of boost for Rifle Burst. Perhaps a flat 2 second cooldown reduction for Toolbelts on each Critical Hit. This makes Static Discharge less bursty but more sustainable damage.
• Putting Speedy Kits in with Adrenal Implant means Firearms/Alchemy/Tools now that Grenadier has 3 nades baseline.
• The Gadget Trait in GM needs to do several things:
  • It must include the CDR of Speedy Gadgets
  • Gadgeteer Boons are optional, but quite nice. Utility effects like a bouncing Launched PBR or a Throw Mine that works like the Mesmer’s Into the Void would be nice.
  • The third effect should either be active condition clear or sustain; two things that Gadget builds are in deficit of.

Overall Tools was nerfed in terms of damage output and Static Discharge in particular is now unlikely to be picked. The loss of damage boosts from Firearms and Tools hurts Rifle Burst the most when it was already quite weak.

Right now it’s looking like Explosives/Inventions/Tools is the way to go for general direct damage bruiser; or Firearms/Alchemy/Tools for “old” Celestial Engi or HGH.

Engineer is now significantly less evasive; which is offset by higher sustain in Inventions. It’s an interesting tradeoff, for sure. One thing that is missing is a 25% increased movement speed trait unless ROBO LEGS has that somehow as well; I think there’s room for that to supersede Speedy Kits in Tools Master; or replace Always Prepared. I never liked Always Prepared anyway. Barring that, Traveller’s Runes.