[PvP]What stopped FT/MM/Jugg from being meta?

[PvP]What stopped FT/MM/Jugg from being meta?

in Engineer

Posted by: Akira.5746

Akira.5746

I run this build in WvW and it’s surprisingly similar to the one currently listed as Meta for Scrapper PvP Conquest. With the similarities as heavy as they are and with FT offering quite a lot when paired with the E.Gun, what is it about Inventions and Slick Shoes that trumped this combination for Conquest?

The only changes are:
-Inventions 232 swapped for Firearms 231.
-Slick Shoes swapped for Flamethrower Kit.
-Rapid Regeneration swapped for Mass Momentum.
(for WvW only: add Hoelbrak Runes and Lemongrass Soup)

The advantages are:
-a high damage blast every 6 seconds
-a knockback every 15 seconds
-additional stomp protection (Juggernaut and FT5)
-permanent Swiftness instead of Mecha Legs
-better Stability, Fury and Vulnerability up-time
-passive 15 Might that stacks out of combat, and more Might sources

The trade-offs are:
-no Bunker Down
-no Slick Shoes CC chains
-one less stun break for Juggernaut’s stability
-less passive defense, cleansing and healing from Inventions

While I do recognize that Inventions and Slick Shoes makes for a more consistent build due to the higher defense and CC, isn’t there some merit to FT that’s being ignored here? This seems like a solid kit setup that offers more burst potential due to rolling Might and FT2 to supplement Hammer 2, and a source of 4s Stability that only requires you to use said FT2 and about a second of FT1 for the tick.

Thanks much for any future responses and clarification.

(edited by Akira.5746)

[PvP]What stopped FT/MM/Jugg from being meta?

in Engineer

Posted by: Rozbuska.5263

Rozbuska.5263

Current meta build is great for party support but lack of knockbacks for decaps really bothers me while playing soloQ. Also good alternative is swap alchemy for firearms instead of inventions use Melandru runes instead of Durability.

Tekkit Mojo – Engineer
Tekkit’s Workshop

[PvP]What stopped FT/MM/Jugg from being meta?

in Engineer

Posted by: basz.6129

basz.6129

I hear you. I used to run a set up with eg/ft. The trade off is a stunbreak with a decent last ditch heal, for a few might stacks and stomp support as you mentioned. Unless you run something like a p/p condi scrapper with hgh, the additional cc can disrupt an entire team fight in your favor, elixir b gives you swiftness, and throw gives you stab. The loss of approx 350 consistent power/condi dmg doesn’t seem to make all that much difference when you are looking at combined 40% condition resistance. I have experimented with taking ft over eg, and it’s fun. But against a team with any synergy, the additional stunbreak/heal with cleanse/might/retaliation 5, 4 combo is invaluable. Throw in the heal damper with eg 3 vs. the brief knockdown on ft, the additonal dps offered by burn is not as viable with a hammer scrapper. I am speaking from an spvp point of view, as I run an SD mortar build in wvw that can be glassy, but hits like a truck. 5-7 close range insta casts, all critting 4-6k, will burst down alot of ppl 1v1.

[PvP]What stopped FT/MM/Jugg from being meta?

in Engineer

Posted by: PWNtrooper.8617

PWNtrooper.8617

I think you’re underestimating how much Inventions does to keep you moving, though it is different in WvW. Bunker Down alone does work on small points in sPvP, because half of why the meta build is so efficient is that it’s constantly healing you without you even having to try, and the small bits of damage from the mines helps mitigate your opponent’s incidental healing. Picking up BD med kits gives you around 400 health, Regeneration, and bonus Healing Power, which in turn makes your Superspeed/Swiftness healing/sec. higher, makes every subsequent med kit heal more, and makes more room to breathe. Not to mention heals from your turret, Elixir Gun, Mortar 5 (if you run it), and EG’s tool belt, plus Elixir B and its toolbelt, all do a good job of easing up on conditions when combined with traited elixir and inventions cleanses.

The meta right now is all about outlasting the other player on point, since the elite specs have an insane amount of defense. Burst builds don’t do well because Heralds, Chronomancers, Tempests, and Reapers are super common. The Scrapper meta build is arguably a lot like them, but Engineers don’t have as much silly stuff as Mesmers, Elementalists, and Revenants. All of those specs hit like trucks AND have insanely high survivability. If you can only hit really hard but melt under pressure, you’ll just burn through a couple of their defenses before they knock you out.

Slick Shoes is, in my mind, a meta call; if you catch someone without stability or a stun break, their active defenses are down for a good 4-5 seconds while you wail on them, and it can set up a nice chain with hammer 5. Its toolbelt being a second stun break AND on-demand access to Superspeed (which is ~417-450 hp/sec) is usually why I hesitate to give it up. I’ve tried a few other utilities, but I always reaaaally miss that stun break, since the meta builds have a lot of ways to shut you out. They also have a good defensive application if you’re trying to break, since going through a tight space and activating them pretty much blocks the route for a few seconds. It’s also a fun way to give your team time to catch up to a point by drawing a line in the sand, and you can use it in stealth to be a disruptive ghost.

Trading Inventions for firearms works alright, but it’s just more damage that we don’t need quite as much as we need the bulk. You have to give up a lot of regeneration to really abuse MM/Juggernaut. I tried a similar build and could pretty consistently keep up about 20 stacks of might on myself, but I was having to push way harder to keep myself up. Also, Stability isn’t as crucial considering we can get it from Elixir B’s toolbelt and we have two stun breaks. If we really really wanted it we could grab Perfectly Weighted, but I’m always hesitant to give up any defenses with how things stand right now. It works, it just doesn’t seem to work as well with this meta.