Guild Wars 2

Please please please change Smoke Vent to create a smoke field instead of just an AoE blind.

+1
all the yes

No. It’s already strong. Wish i could downvote. Please stop being “make this really really strong cuz I wannnnnt it.” Think balance, please. Thanks.

it is a very reasonable request to ask that it functions similar to smoke bomb. Any way to bring more value to the flame thrower is welcome. The utter weaknesses of flame jet really call for anything that can help boost the kits over all value.

Voramoz.6790:

No. It’s already strong. Wish i could downvote. Please stop being “make this really really strong cuz I wannnnnt it.” Think balance, please. Thanks.

they are thinkinng balance

how is :
Smoke Vent
takes utility slot and 5 weapon slots
Blind=5s
Cooldown= 20s
180 Radius
acceptable ?

vs

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Flashing_Blade
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Leap_of_Faith
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ray_of_Judgment
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blinding_Flash
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lightning_Surge
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Counterspell<- is a counter skill as well
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magic_Bullet
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Prestige

Flamethrower has fallen out of favor even more than before in all competitive forms of GW2 that I’m aware of. Can’t see how a small buff would hurt.

I’m not sure you’d want it to pulse blind like other smoke fields, though. We’ve already got two skills that do that. Blind fields are kind of cheesy, I don’t think we’d want three large blind fields back to back to back in any kind of build, effective or not.

(Thief pistol field doesn’t count because it’s tiny…)

I personally like the flamethrower, and I agree with that it is pretty bad overall but I still use it as a utility kit, making the 5 skill a smoke field would give it better utility and usefulness which would allow for extra stealth possibilities as well. Add that and burning per hit to flame jet and it just might become widely viable for once.

I am tired of taking flak for using the flamethrower in serious gameplay.

i read somewhere that someone said that they read somewhere that anet said smoke vent is a placeholder until they come up with something better. idk how reliable that is. i remember you could pull and burn with it. combined with permanent stability from old juggernaut it was lols.

since it is dosent have a cast time id suggest they make it a short blind field like 1 second so we can use it for stomps or utilize if for stealth’s but would require a bit of skill to accomplish

I like Smoke Vent a lot, having no cast time and aoe blind makes it a great emergency skill. And while a smoke field would definitely improve the skill, I think FT needs to be improved in other ways first. We’ve got blinds in bomb kit, grenades kit, and pistol mh. And we’re not a stealth class, strictly speaking.

I’d prefer FT be improved with higher autoattack damage and a deshaped Napalm. But that’s just me.

make smoke vent with bigger radius +80

jet flam less dmg and constant burning reaply 1s per hit mohaha

then it would be good.

1s per hit with 10 hits = 10 second burning every 2.25 seconds at 0 condition duration with no cooldown. seems op

ArrDee.2573:

1s per hit with 10 hits = 10 second burning every 2.25 seconds at 0 condition duration with no cooldown. seems op

I’m sure there are ways around that. It can be .25 of a sec or even have its own icd where it only activates once a sec…or something similar. Anet is creative. They can figure it out.

Hvaran.6327:

make smoke vent with bigger radius +80

jet flam less dmg and constant burning reaply 1s per hit mohaha

then it would be good.

No need to lower the FT base damage just to add more burning. It is weak enough.

Only one bad comment, nice. Anyways, the reason for this plea is that I run a very effective Flamethrower, Rocket Boots, Elixir Gun PvE bunker build. Currently my survival is great, and I can blast either Might or AoE heals like it’s nothing, and still do decent damage. However, I can not enter stealth with this build, and when in melee range of enemies Smoke Vent only prevents one attack per enemy in range. Now if Smoke Vent created even the tiniest of Smoke Fields, then the option of blasting Stealth would open up as well as giving me some more breathing room in melee combat. This change would make my build perfect and complete.

I just don’t like the idea of putting stealth on a kit that’s designed to stand face-to-face and burn everything. Juggernaut toughness, aoe blind, aoe conal autoattack, aoe knockback…all things designed for attrition rather than stealth.

Trust me, I do honestly believe FT needs some love. But I’d rather see increased autoattack damage and something else to make FT desirable over ’nades or bombs. I want the high risk-high reward kit that Flamethrower ought to be.

Rezzet.3614:

Blind=5s
Cooldown= 20s
180 Radius
acceptable ?

vs

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Flashing_Blade
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Leap_of_Faith
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Ray_of_Judgment
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Blinding_Flash
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lightning_Surge
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Counterspell<;- is a counter skill as well
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Magic_Bullet
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/The_Prestige

The thing that balances Smoke Vent in favor of other blind skills is that it can be activated while you’re stunned, knocked down, or dazed. It can also be activated while other skills are being channeled, like stomps. If I had to compare Smoke Vent to a guardian’s Leap of Faith or Flashing Blade, I’d take Smoke Vent.

And what is with the obsession over a smoke field? What are you going to use it with? Flame Jet isn’t a projectile finisher, so you’re not going to make much use of its blind mechanic as a smoke field. And smoke fields are relatively poor methods to stacking stealth mid-combat, as any blast finisher that hits a target will reveal you. I just don’t really get why a smoke field would make this skill better.

To be completely honest, Adding a 1 second long Combo Field:Smoke wouldn’t really be that unreasonable when considering most Kits functionality. Aside from the Air Blast the Flamethrower really has no true defensive utility. The Blind is good for securing stomps and for avoiding highly telegraphed melee skills but will not protect you from a volatile situation like a Gear Shield, Acid Bomb, or Smoke Bomb/Glue bomb. Even the Freeze and Flash grenade provide better defensive utility than the FT due to its excessive range, Area of Effect and it’s ability for simultaneously applying a surprising ammount of damage and condition stacking.

For conversations sake I will say I have played a lot of Engineer. And I have 6 different ones, each with a unique build that changes frequently. I have used every utility/Heal/weapon and ultimate, as most Engineers have. As well as the Flamethrower Kit in a variety of builds. Some built towards power, some built for Condition as well as some gimmicky hybrid builds. This being said I will jump right to my point:

It would actually be a decent change providing Flamethrower with a defensive option, opening this Kit up for several Flamethrower Builds builds that were previously to easily focused or lacked any form of disengage. Without any change to the Flamethrowers overall damage This change would solidify Flamethrower Kits position as a utility Kit. Currently it is regarded as a poor hybrid between a Damage/Condition stacking Kit even with the single Blowback it offers no soft CC so you are still quite vulnerable. That’s why after some thought I think adding a 1 second Combo Field:Smoke would actually be a reasonable change to the Flamethrower Kits effectiveness without being over the top.

Without the aid of Condition removal, or soft CC this can be a risky Kit to take in competitive PvP. Not that this Kit doesnt see its use, but this would only help the viability and usefulness of this kit across all builds. This is of course, just my opinion from my experience. So essentially I would say this would be a good implement.

+1

I feel like the utility is fine with FT, the damage is what needs a boost. 1,2, and 4 could all do a lot more dmg. Especially 2. Zerker flame-thrower could be so much fun.

Air blast would also make a nice finisher. Eh?

That reply to my post was weak. Someone said it already. Smoke vent allows porcupine defense. Zero cast timer and all. Zero cast timer smoke field would obsolete smoke bomb. So again… No… Engi is my main btw. Balance > wants.

The bombkit has strengths other than smokebomb.

A class having more than one skill that has a similar effect has precedent as well.

I think it would be neat to have a triangle shaped field in addition to our circles and rectangles :p

Personally I see the Toolkit as a much more effective utility kit and in-your-face kit. The only thing provided by the flamethrower utility speaking is the air blast and a one-hit aoe blind. Making it a smoke field with the same cast implications upgrades it to a multi-hit aoe blind. So, assuming everything about smoke vent remains the same aside from it now creating a smoke field, it would in no way have any negative effect on anyone’s game play. It is a slight increase in relief from melee attackers, something to be expected from a so-called utility kit. Not to mention gives me an out-of-combat smoke field without forcing me to slot bomb kit. Meaning the ability to blast aoe stealth for skipping pve content or sneaking up on enemies in pvp. And arguing that this change should never happen just because you want more damage (from what everyone constantly refers to as a utility kit, not damage kit) is silly. It’s like saying, “Since I can’t have more damage then you can not have a smoke field implemented, due to the fact there is no way these hypothetical changes could ever be accomplished at the same time.”

Point is, this conversation is about adding more utility to a utility kit that would not be op nor negatively effect anyone’s current builds. To stay on topic and be constructive, it would be more interesting to hear if you feel such a change would be op or negatively affect your build.

The point is not as cut and dry as you think Shaogin. It’s obviously not a negative to add a smoke field to one of our skills. It’s whether it’s even worth it, when there are better things to do with FT instead. Personally, I don’t want stealth on a kit that’s designed for attrition. I want more damage. And if Anet gives us that damage boost, they’re probably not going to give us stealth access too. I don’t want to be a thief and I don’t think we need more stealth with all the mobility we already have.

The only reason FT is called a utility kit by some is because its damage isn’t high enough to reliably use in the same way we do with ‘nades and bombs. EG & TK have some seriously awesome utility skills, and I’d personally never take FT in place of one of them for the sake of utility. FT’s damage needs to be boosted to justify Juggernaut and sitting in FT for a while.

Also, I don’t think Anet will ever make a change specifically designed to “skip content.” And if you’re sneaking up on enemies in PvP, you’re definitely not doing it with FT, because then you’re hosed.

I would rather have backdraft back. Along with the old juggernaut, at least for pve/wvsw.

Wolf.5816:

That’s why after some thought I think adding a 1 second Combo Field:Smoke would actually be a reasonable change to the Flamethrower Kits effectiveness without being over the top.

But how? People keep asking for this, but there’s nothing about the flamethrower that does anything with a smoke field. Smoke fields are best used with projectile finishers for blind stacking or blast finishers for stealth stacking. The flamethrower has neither of these.

If the flamethrower were to receive just one change to be more competitive with other kits, it should be to put a blast finisher onto Flame Blast. Asking for a smoke field doesn’t really make much sense to me.

Phineas Poe.3018:

Wolf.5816:

That’s why after some thought I think adding a 1 second Combo Field:Smoke would actually be a reasonable change to the Flamethrower Kits effectiveness without being over the top.

But how? People keep asking for this, but there’s nothing about the flamethrower that does anything with a smoke field. Smoke fields are best used with projectile finishers for blind stacking or blast finishers for stealth stacking. The flamethrower has neither of these.

If the flamethrower were to receive just one change to be more competitive with other kits, it should be to put a blast finisher onto Flame Blast. Asking for a smoke field doesn’t really make much sense to me.

Most of our finishers are used cross-kit. If I’m in trouble in PvP/WvW and need to blast my smoke bomb, you’d better bet I’m using Magnetic Inversion and Healing Turret, not BoB (or Acid Bomb…lol).

NevirSayDie.6235:

Most of our finishers are used cross-kit. If I’m in trouble in PvP/WvW and need to blast my smoke bomb, you’d better bet I’m using Magnetic Inversion and Healing Turret, not BoB (or Acid Bomb…lol).

If they’re going to buff a kit, the last thing I’d want them to do is increase dependency on other utilities. If they’re going to buff the flamethrower, they need to make it work more effectively as a standalone kit just as the bomb kit and grenade kit are. Saying you can have a smoke field on the flamethrower without the blast finisher means no one would still use it over the bomb kit (which already offers both).

Phineas Poe.3018:

NevirSayDie.6235:

Most of our finishers are used cross-kit. If I’m in trouble in PvP/WvW and need to blast my smoke bomb, you’d better bet I’m using Magnetic Inversion and Healing Turret, not BoB (or Acid Bomb…lol).

If they’re going to buff a kit, the last thing I’d want them to do is increase dependency on other utilities. If they’re going to buff the flamethrower, they need to make it work more effectively as a standalone kit just as the bomb kit and grenade kit are. Saying you can have a smoke field on the flamethrower without the blast finisher means no one would still use it over the bomb kit (which already offers both).

I’m not saying it would instantly make flamethrower popular, just that it’s reasonable. Grenades have a field and no finisher, our main weapons have finishers but no fields, toolkit has one projectile finisher…actually our only two kits with a field and a finisher are bomb and EG.

A blast finisher would also probably help the flamethrower out. Both are reasonable suggestions.

But the very nature of Juggernaut makes the flamethrower a kit, when slotted, something you want to wield most of the time. Most other kits don’t have this issue.

Manuhell.2759:

I would rather have backdraft back. Along with the old juggernaut, at least for pve/wvsw.

Backdraft was so nice.

The only thing I think really needs changing with smoke vent is a radius increase. Right now the opponent basically has to be right in your face. The most common thing I use it for is securing stomps, but that’s partly because not using it for that just often ends up being a waste. Only other thing I really use it for is to defend against thieves.

meh just give juggernaut perma stability back

/problem solved

if they were to add to smoke vent, i’d much rather it be a blast finisher than a smoke field. it would be like the thief’s blinding powder (which is a blast finisher) but without the stealth.

ellesee.8297:

if they were to add to smoke vent, i’d much rather it be a blast finisher than a smoke field. it would be like the thief’s blinding powder (which is a blast finisher) but without the stealth.

Likewise.

Another non-damaging blast finisher would be awesome. Often times when it starts getting dicey and I need to combo field Smoke Bomb to get some relief, Healing Turret is currently the only option if I got people stacked on me.

Rezzet.3614:

meh just give juggernaut perma stability back

/problem solved

I sometimes wonder if the old juggernaut was the reason stability is otherwise so inaccessible for engineers.

icewyrm.5038:

Rezzet.3614:

meh just give juggernaut perma stability back

/problem solved

I sometimes wonder if the old juggernaut was the reason stability is otherwise so inaccessible for engineers.

Between the old juggernaut, elixir x and mortar we had a pretty high amount of long stability..man I miss the old juggernaut flamethrower was much more effective with it..

Make it remove stability from enemies in range. LOL

I would like that so much, I would take multiple other nerfs to the face just to make that happen.

I agree to any flamethrower buffs

+1

Well, FT needs either much higher direct damage, or more control/defense. As it is now, it’s mediocre at both. A black powder like skill 5 would offer a greater amount of survivability and would be completely fair (if you’re just standing in melee range of a FT engi, you deserve to be blinded like a kitten). The blast finisher idea would be okay I guess as well. What I really want is a damage increase for skill 1 or a burn duration increase. The main reason I picked to play an Engi was because of the idea of being able to burn kitten with a flamethrower. Instead, I stack 25 stacks of might, 25 stacks of bloodlust, full zerk, and realize I still am not putting out near the damage of my ranged options. It’s quite disheartening.