Guild Wars 2

As the topic says, I have been rolling the other professions, and I have been throwing what I think of them onto an Excel Sheet. It started out with first impressions, and now that I have gotten all these toons to 80, geared out, and done WvW with them/tried different specs. I rated them on how each class fits into certain rolls. We can argue all day what the “true” roles are, but on this excel document, I listed rolls as Dps, Tank, and Support. These are my opinions of the class as a whole and as the pic of the excel document will tell you, depending on the build each roll can go up or down by one. Edit: Potentially two
Now you’re probably wondering why I put this here, and not elsewhere on the forums. Since I frequent this part of the forums often, I am either seeing one of two things. New builds and ideas, or people saying our class needs to be more like another for X reason. Because of the latter, I am putting this here to show you that Engineers are not in a bad spot, and where the Engineer’s potential lies.

Perhaps I should go more into depth on what I define as support and tank roles:
I classify healing yourself, and/or party members as support.
I classify healing just yourself, also as support. Why? If you can keep yourself alive via heals you are supporting your party in not having to have them rez you. If that makes any sense, it does to me anyway.
Tanking, I define as being able to take big hits. Either due to having a big health pool, and/or having a lot of armor.

Let me save you some time:
This is not a post for you to continue to complain about the faults of the Engineer, or the developers, there’re plenty of forums already doing that. Go there.
Don’t bother raging about the ratings, its my opinion, we all have our own.
Don’t bother trolling, you won’t get a reply.
Do you find this post stupid? Go away then, this isn’t for you.

I would actually have given the warrior a point more in support then you did, did you ever try out a Shout Support / Damage soaker Warrior? Quite the good condition removal in AoE, AoE healing and buffing they do! And would have given the elementalist 2-2-2 (See Dagger/Dagger elementalists, pretty much as tanky as they get)

else I actually kinda agree with you! Engineer depeding on the build can ace up to 2 dps tho, but at the cost of one of the other!

Edit:
actually Engineer can probaly move from 1 to 3 in any of the group in my openion now that I think about it, you just pay the price in lowering one of the others!

Your lack of 3’s on profession/build combos like support ele, tank guardian, dps warrior, etc kinda invalidates your approach in my opinion. While i can see you have erred towards average for every profession in every role a table which says each profession is average at 2 things and weak at one does not explore the true roles of the individual classes enough to rate them against each other.

I would recommend going back over your table with a 1-8 approach and try to rate the classes against each other in each role, ie don’t use the same number twice in each role, or just go for a 1-10 rating to give you a larger spread. This would allow you to see for example the warriors 8 in dps compared to the thieves 10 compared to the engineers 4 or the comparative support abilities of the classes. However i think this is all so build dependant it would be a mammoth undertaking to rebuild, regear and assess each and every “top” build on every class.

It also doesn’t compare the difficulty of the classes or the diversity of builds, which is actually most peoples problem. It would also be nice to see a break for tpvp, 80 pve and wvw as classes perform differently in each area.

Ego.2358:

Your lack of 3’s on profession/build combos like support ele, tank guardian, dps warrior, etc kinda invalidates your approach in my opinion. While i can see you have erred towards average for every profession in every role a table which says each profession is average at 2 things and weak at one does not explore the true roles of the individual classes enough to rate them against each other.

I would recommend going back over your table with a 1-8 approach and try to rate the classes against each other in each role, ie don’t use the same number twice in each role, or just go for a 1-10 rating to give you a larger spread. This would allow you to see for example the warriors 8 in dps compared to the thieves 10 compared to the engineers 4 or the comparative support abilities of the classes. However i think this is all so build dependant it would be a mammoth undertaking to rebuild, regear and assess each and every “top” build on every class.

It also doesn’t compare the difficulty of the classes or the diversity of builds, which is actually most peoples problem. It would also be nice to see a break for tpvp, 80 pve and wvw as classes perform differently in each area.

Amadeus.5687:

I would actually have given the warrior a point more in support then you did, did you ever try out a Shout Support / Damage soaker Warrior? Quite the good condition removal in AoE, AoE healing and buffing they do! And would have given the elementalist 2-2-2 (See Dagger/Dagger elementalists, pretty much as tanky as they get)

else I actually kinda agree with you! Engineer depeding on the build can ace up to 2 dps tho, but at the cost of one of the other!

Edit:
actually Engineer can probaly move from 1 to 3 in any of the group in my openion now that I think about it, you just pay the price in lowering one of the others!

Ah, I see one of you didn’t read what I said, depending on the build, the role number can go up or down by one. I classed each profession as a whole not on one variable. I wanted to keep the total role number at 5, it was rather difficult for me to rate certain professions, since some are not quite average or strong. In my book though each profession leaned more than another so for the most part each profession fit in nicely. If I was to do this again, I would probably up the total role number to 10.

You may be asking yourself, why is there a lack of 3s? The reason is simple, each profession as a whole, does not have an amazing amount of dps. (Minus the Thief) Can a Warrior pick up a bow and punch out as much dps as he can with the Rifle? Not likely. Remember I am grading the entire profession, not one glass cannon build.

Agree with Amadeus.
This is mostly your opinion in non specified builds you have tried..
Warrior : 3 in most no doubts
Eles can’t tank? lol…
Gardians: cant support/tank strongly? bahaha
Engis: dps1 |?|?| don’t even know what to say about this..
Anyway, honestly thinking all classes can be lvl 3 in some roll, despite they sacrifice something else. So the overall this exel is kinda wrong i would say.
For this to be more specific it should be rated from class builds and not just professions in general

Specterryu Quipter.8412:

Now you’re probably wondering why I put this here, and not elsewhere on the forums. Since I frequent this part of the forums often, I am either seeing one of two things. New builds and ideas, or people saying our class needs to be more like another for X reason. Because of the latter, I am putting this here to show you that Engineers are not in a bad spot, and where the Engineer’s potential lies.

If you have given every profession a pool of 5 points to use up of course the results are going to show that each profession is about equal, your methods undercut your point.

I agree the the engi isn’t in such a terrible way however without following a rating system which isn’t bias towards an equal result you show nothing but your ability to create pie charts. The fact remains that the engineer has all this versitility which you have to sacrifice to be effective at any one role and normally there is another profession which does what you can do better due to specialisation, these results in now way reflect that.

Edit: I also agree a build centric result would be more appropriate as no profession can be great at all three roles at once, while exploring the top builds for each class you would also gather data on build diversity at the same time.

Malvado.1460:

Agree with Amadeus.
This is mostly your opinion in non specified builds you have tried..
Warrior : 3 in most no doubts
Eles can’t tank? lol…
Gardians: cant support/tank strongly? bahaha
Engis: dps1 |?|?| don’t even know what to say about this..
Anyway, honestly thinking all classes can be lvl 3 in some roll, despite they sacrifice something else. So the overall this exel is kinda wrong i would say.
For this to be more specific it should be rated from class builds and not just professions in general

Let me quote myself on this one:
In regards to the Ele comment:
I classify healing just yourself, also as support. Why? If you can keep yourself alive via heals you are supporting your party in not having to have them rez you. If that makes any sense, it does to me anyway.
Tanking, I define as being able to take big hits. Either due to having a big health pool, and/or having a lot of armor.
I am grading the entire profession, not one glass cannon build (but let me add) or tank builds.
In regards to the Guardian and Engineer comment:
depending on the build each roll can go up or down by one.

Ego.2358:

Specterryu Quipter.8412:

Now you’re probably wondering why I put this here, and not elsewhere on the forums. Since I frequent this part of the forums often, I am either seeing one of two things. New builds and ideas, or people saying our class needs to be more like another for X reason. Because of the latter, I am putting this here to show you that Engineers are not in a bad spot, and where the Engineer’s potential lies.

If you have given every profession a pool of 5 points to use up of course the results are going to show that each profession is about equal, your methods undercut your point.

I agree the the engi isn’t in such a terrible way however without following a rating system which isn’t bias towards an equal result you show nothing but your ability to create pie charts. The fact remains that the engineer has all this versitility which you have to sacrifice to be effective at any one role and normally there is another profession which does what you can do better due to specialisation, these results in now way reflect that.

Edit: I also agree a build centric result would be more appropriate as no profession can be great at all three roles at once, while exploring the top builds for each class you would also gather data on build diversity at the same time.

Let me start with:
This is not a post for you to continue to complain about the faults of the Engineer, or the developers, there’re plenty of forums already doing that. Go there.
Then
These are my opinions of the class as a whole

Now onto the serious stuff:
The 5 point system. Now I do agree with what you’re saying, I probably needed to go to 10. Since this seems to be the biggest complaint how about I review my excel doc? Give me a bit and I will update it. I will not rush this though, expect something tomorrow. BUT, in the mean time; does the 5 point system only “show my ability to create pie graphs.” I would have to disagree. It gives you a clear cut answer on which professions are weak in what areas, as well as where each profession is average/strong in. But this still leaves room for different builds. As I have said before, depending on a build each roll can go up or down by one. If one profession has 50 different builds, how can you account for each and every one of them on a bigger grading scale? You can’t. That was the issue I was running into.

Specterryu Quipter.8412:

Let me quote myself on this one:
In regards to the Ele comment:
I classify healing just yourself, also as support. Why? If you can keep yourself alive via heals you are supporting your party in not having to have them rez you. If that makes any sense, it does to me anyway.
Tanking, I define as being able to take big hits. Either due to having a big health pool, and/or having a lot of armor.
I am grading the entire profession, not one glass cannon build (but let me add) or tank builds.
In regards to the Guardian and Engineer comment:
depending on the build each roll can go up or down by one.

And I agree with what you r saying just not the 1 part… depending on build every class can be 3 … Dont get me wrong I am just thinking that you lacked some experience with different builds on each class… example you would never say engi is 1-2-2 if you run like this you are failing… as DPS/Tank/Support:
Engi could be 3-1-2 a 1-3-2 or even a 1-2-3
What I’am trying to explain here is that you can’t rate classes like that since there are so many variants on the builds

The way you classify “Tanking”, is then wrong in my openion, and I think most other is!
Since in this game you can’t really “soak” damage, tanking turns more into: How much Damage can you avoid, reflect, or how much health can you regain yourself! You tank if you take 3k damage, but heal 4k back!
Tanking is when you some how “soak” the damage that would have been delivered, no matter how you do it, but you do it yourself, not helpt by others

Support is when you help other players, that can be helping them soak damage (By healing them) or making them deal more damage (like giving fury and might ect.)
So support is when you give something to someone else

Amadeus.5687:

The way you classify “Tanking”, is then wrong in my openion, and I think most other is!
Since in this game you can’t really “soak” damage, tanking turns more into: How much Damage can you avoid, reflect, or how much health can you regain yourself! You tank if you take 3k damage, but heal 4k back!
Tanking is when you some how “soak” the damage that would have been delivered, no matter how you do it, but you do it yourself, not helpt by others

Support is when you help other players, that can be helping them soak damage (By healing them) or making them deal more damage (like giving fury and might ect.)
So support is when you give something to someone else

I forgot to copy/paste the first part of what I originally said, so let me just copy the whole thing.
I classify healing yourself, and/or party members as support.
I classify healing just yourself, also as support. Why? If you can keep yourself alive via heals you are supporting your party in not having to have them rez you. If that makes any sense, it does to me anyway.
Tanking, I define as being able to take big hits. Either due to having a big health pool, and/or having a lot of armor.

This whole post is my opinion, each and every one of us have different opinions. You’re entitled to you’re own and I am entitled to mine.

Malvado.1460:

Specterryu Quipter.8412:

Let me quote myself on this one:
In regards to the Ele comment:
I classify healing just yourself, also as support. Why? If you can keep yourself alive via heals you are supporting your party in not having to have them rez you. If that makes any sense, it does to me anyway.
Tanking, I define as being able to take big hits. Either due to having a big health pool, and/or having a lot of armor.
I am grading the entire profession, not one glass cannon build (but let me add) or tank builds.
In regards to the Guardian and Engineer comment:
depending on the build each roll can go up or down by one.

And I agree with what you r saying just not the 1 part… depending on build every class can be 3 … Dont get me wrong I am just thinking that you lacked some experience with different builds on each class… example you would never say engi is 1-2-2 if you run like this you are failing… as DPS/Tank/Support:
Engi could be 3-1-2 a 1-3-2 or even a 1-2-3
What I’am trying to explain here is that you can’t rate classes like that since there are so many variants on the builds

I just responded to Ego,
The 5 point system. Now I do agree with what you’re saying, I probably needed to go to 10. Since this seems to be the biggest complaint how about I review my excel doc? Give me a bit and I will update it. I will not rush this though, expect something tomorrow. BUT, in the mean time; does the 5 point system only “show my ability to create pie graphs.” I would have to disagree. It gives you a clear cut answer on which professions are weak in what areas, as well as where each profession is average/strong in. But this still leaves room for different builds. As I have said before, depending on a build each roll can go up or down by one. If one profession has 50 different builds, how can you account for each and every one of them on a bigger grading scale? You can’t. That was the issue I was running into.

Specterryu Quipter.8412:

This whole post is my opinion, each and every one of us have different opinions. You’re entitled to you’re own and I am entitled to mine.

Indeed you are! It’s not to be hostile against you I say it, but if you make a thread in the forums to show us something, you need to design it in a way we will be able to understand what you try to show. When you rate the Suppport/DPS/Tanking, you will have to do it under the terms the rest of us see it, else we won’t understand your work, and think it’s wrong!

So what I try to say, for us to have a discussion about it, or even just to understand what you show, there is some terms, or at least explanition you need to give before we can do that! Most people would laugh at you giving the Elementalist 1 point in tanking the way they work atm, cause not only can they self heal a lot, they can create bunker builds that can shield and prevent a lot of damage aswell

I’m not bashing the engineer or even trying to provoke an argument btw, I think your efforts are admirable and i do enjoy reading about other peoples opinions even if i do not agree with them as they often put things in a different light.

However my point is that what you are trying to infer from your results is that the engineer is about equal to the other classes, which your results are bias towards showing. When you force yourself to give each class a 5 point rating the results will be that every class has 5 points, if you use a variable rating system and produce a bar chart rather than a pie chart you can see where a profession is lacking compared to other professions.

For example i would rate a thief’s dps as 10, i think they have the highest damage in the game due to their class mechanic allowing them to use their highest damage abilities repeatedly while other classes have to wait for cooldowns. Compared to thief dps i would rate warriors as 8, ele’s as 7 and engineers as 6/7, thats just imo.

Now if we look at tanking i would rate a guardian as 10, due to their reflects and general healing abilities, i would rate a generic ele build as around a 7 and an engi bunker build at around an 8.

If every class were given a score out of 10 for the three attributes you have listed what would each classes total be? If the engineer has a total score of 19 (6 tank, 6 dps, 7 support) would a thief/guard/war/ele have more or less? I suspect in my own opinion that Ele would probably rate highest overall while thief and warrior would rate highly in dps but not in support.

(class, dps, tank, support, total)
Ele, 8, 9, 9, 26
Engi, 6, 6, 7, 19
Guard, 7, 10, 8, 25
War, 9, 7, 5, 21
Thief, 10, 6, 4, 20

Now those are just numbers that i made up on the spot, i have played each class but not fully geared at 80 or in several builds. I would be interested to see how you rated the classes based on your experiences using the scoring system i proposed.

With reference to builds by the way in my opinion most other professions can swap and change their utilities to cover another role without totally retraiting, ie a dps guardian can slap on some reflect utilities and a different weapon set for one pve fight if needed and still perform as a “tank”, however a bunker engi cannot just swap to ’nades and dps when he needs to as his traits lock him into the tank role. That it something which is very hard to measure and would result in me knocking 1 off of any score i gave to the engineer or would require a whole new catagory such as “Build Versatility”.

a cursory glance at your chart shows me that you believe engineer to be roughly equal with guardian in terms of tankyness, supportive power and damage output.

honestly a chart based entirely on opinion, with such an inaccurate method of measurements (ie a self admitted margin of error of at least 20%-40%) only serves to show us a very very rough estimate of what what you believe the classes have in terms of balance to one another.

that and that you like to make pie charts. but hey, props on presenting something seemingly meaningless in pie chart form.

Fiorrello.8126:

a chart based entirely on opinion, with such an inaccurate method of measurements (ie a self admitted margin of error of at least 20%-40%) only serves to show us a very very rough estimate of what what you believe the classes have in terms of balance to one another.

I don’t even know what to say to this. If I am understand what you’re saying, you’re that a that opinions can be taken as facts and I need to include a margin of error? It’s all opinion based, a margin of error doesn’t matter. You include a margin of error when introducing facts, I am assuming you’re intelligent enough to know what a fact is. Everyone has different opinions, and as I stated in my original post: Do you find this post stupid? Go away then, this isn’t for you.

I found the chart interesting, I find the defensiveness self-defeating.

I think what Quipter has done is admirable in that he wants to share some knowledge he has acquired from playing the different professions. The way he does so is what I don’t agree with.

Number systems are meant to be used with quantifiable statistical data, not opinion. What would have been more insightful would have been a post describing your ratings and reasoning behind each, where you feel each profession is strong with what kind of builds. You could have separated each professions abilities or class mechanics into categories, counted them up, compared and their effectiveness in each role. What you’ve done is slap meaningless numbers on a sheet of paper based on your unexplained opinion, something few people will agree with and something which gives no information on each profession.

If you wan’t to compare things that cant be quantified (like the effectiveness of professions in this game) you can’t use numbers. This is because very few people will ever agree on the numbers. If you have to make comparisons go into a detailed description, this approach actually does some good as it conveys information.

Also, What exactly are you looking for in this thread Quipter? You seem to react negatively to every piece of feedback and have been shutting down all discussion. If the purpose of this thread is to show your charts but not incite discussion or feedback, then I propose this thread be closed for all the good a thread does like that in a discussion board.

JohnDied.3476:

Also, What exactly are you looking for in this thread Quipter? You seem to react negatively to every piece of feedback and have been shutting down all discussion. If the purpose of this thread is to show your charts but not incite discussion or feedback, then I propose this thread be closed for all the good a thread does like that in a discussion board.

I would also like to hear the answer to this question. I don’t have a problem with the numbers—everyone’s entitled to express his opinion—but why post a controversial thread if you don’t want discussion?

Engineer as a tanky profession. I don’t find this idea as particularly odd. Look at what Rune of the Engineer gives. Keep in mind we were supposed to be a heavy armor class.

So I had a mate of mine take a look at my excel, he was running into issues you guys were. So per his suggestion, I just rated each class role on a scale of 1-6. 6 being the highest, 1 the lowest. (Since I only reviewed 6 professions) Take a look at the original post for the updated excel.

Chaba.5410:

Engineer as a tanky profession. I don’t find this idea as particularly odd. Look at what Rune of the Engineer gives. Keep in mind we were supposed to be a heavy armor class.

I really wish they would have left us as a heavy armor class. Maybe this is something we will see in future updates.

NevirSayDie.6235:

JohnDied.3476:

Also, What exactly are you looking for in this thread Quipter? You seem to react negatively to every piece of feedback and have been shutting down all discussion. If the purpose of this thread is to show your charts but not incite discussion or feedback, then I propose this thread be closed for all the good a thread does like that in a discussion board.

I would also like to hear the answer to this question. I don’t have a problem with the numbers—everyone’s entitled to express his opinion—but why post a controversial thread if you don’t want discussion?

I react negatively, when the question has already been answered in the original post; or if the person is just trolling up a storm. There are so many people that say TL:DR and just say/give their 2 cents on the chart. Even though what they are talking about is explained in the original post. As a side note though, I actually have not been reacting negatively to hardly any posts (Sorry Fiorrello.8126). It’s easy to misinterpret emotions with text, so you may take it negatively or offensive, when its intent was just to inform. As per everyone’s reaction, I have changed the number system, while it made sense to me, I wanted this to benefit the community as a whole. It isn’t that I do not want discussion, I just want intellectually stimulating discussion.

Ego.2358:

I’m not bashing the engineer or even trying to provoke an argument btw, I think your efforts are admirable and i do enjoy reading about other peoples opinions even if i do not agree with them as they often put things in a different light.

However my point is that what you are trying to infer from your results is that the engineer is about equal to the other classes, which your results are bias towards showing. When you force yourself to give each class a 5 point rating the results will be that every class has 5 points, if you use a variable rating system and produce a bar chart rather than a pie chart you can see where a profession is lacking compared to other professions.

For example i would rate a thief’s dps as 10, i think they have the highest damage in the game due to their class mechanic allowing them to use their highest damage abilities repeatedly while other classes have to wait for cooldowns. Compared to thief dps i would rate warriors as 8, ele’s as 7 and engineers as 6/7, thats just imo.

Now if we look at tanking i would rate a guardian as 10, due to their reflects and general healing abilities, i would rate a generic ele build as around a 7 and an engi bunker build at around an 8.

If every class were given a score out of 10 for the three attributes you have listed what would each classes total be? If the engineer has a total score of 19 (6 tank, 6 dps, 7 support) would a thief/guard/war/ele have more or less? I suspect in my own opinion that Ele would probably rate highest overall while thief and warrior would rate highly in dps but not in support.

(class, dps, tank, support, total)
Ele, 8, 9, 9, 26
Engi, 6, 6, 7, 19
Guard, 7, 10, 8, 25
War, 9, 7, 5, 21
Thief, 10, 6, 4, 20

Now those are just numbers that i made up on the spot, i have played each class but not fully geared at 80 or in several builds. I would be interested to see how you rated the classes based on your experiences using the scoring system i proposed.

With reference to builds by the way in my opinion most other professions can swap and change their utilities to cover another role without totally retraiting, ie a dps guardian can slap on some reflect utilities and a different weapon set for one pve fight if needed and still perform as a “tank”, however a bunker engi cannot just swap to ’nades and dps when he needs to as his traits lock him into the tank role. That it something which is very hard to measure and would result in me knocking 1 off of any score i gave to the engineer or would require a whole new catagory such as “Build Versatility”.

I believe I may have inadvertently used the system you proposed, (Except for the graph) take a look at the updated chart. Let me know if this is what you were talking about. Looking the chart though, it doesn’t make Engineers look that appealing, although that was not its intent.

This is interesting, but what would be more useful still, would be to include some dps measurements to backup your dps ratings. I have a level 80 warrior, thief, elementalist and engineer, all properly geared in exotics that match good builds. I agree that thieves and warriors are high dps (if built for it), but whats less clear to me is how the range of dps for various engineer builds overlap with (or fall short of) other classes ranges. Actual measurements (or at least well thought out theorycrafting) is far more useful than subjective ratings such as you used. With the number of level 80s that you have, you’re in a unique position to help the community. Can you provide some real dps numbers for common ability rotations for key builds for the various classes?

Thats exactly what i was suggesting, it also looks very similar to my expectations as well. I’m suprised at the ranger being 2 on everything but not that they are low on the chart, the engineer is exactly where i thought it would be and the comparison looks more realistic when you look at other classes abilities to do things better than the engi.

We’re only above average at support and not close to the best at it, i would put some very specific engineer builds at higher scores but then they are very rigid builds comlared to the other classes that are good in their fields.

Soul.9280:

Can you provide some real dps numbers for common ability rotations for key builds for the various classes?

This could take a bit, but I will start doing this.

The reason that I’d be excited to see real numbers for many classes with actual builds/gearsets is that this game makes it very difficult to get to them short of having a real character to measure with.

One thing I’ve been working on understanding is the relationship between how power and condition damage, contribute to dps, and finding the right balance between them depending on build. I’m not talking about their basic mechanics, because I think we all understand that. But more how much adding 100 power boosts dps when you’re at 1800 power than when you’re at 2200 power, and how this also varies per weapon and attack.

Another is measuring the actual “cast times” for various abilities/chains. For instance, this morning I shot at a target dummy for a minute with my pistol (as an engineer) just using auto attack, and observed exactly 69 attacks, which gives us an effective attack rate of .85 seconds per attack, which is much slower than the time listed on the ability (which was .50 seconds). It would be great if there was a good database (I know that there is a wiki that has this for some abilities, but it’s not organized well, nor complete) of “true attack times” coupled with the real damage per attack and how power affects it. I’ve noticed that kit-based abilities are typically more positively impacted by increases in power than weapon abilities (like Rifle auto-attack). Not that I’m asking the OP to provide a spreadsheet that has all this info, but it would be great if the community could put something like this together in a structured way for all classes, weapons and attacks and build off of it. Would make it much easier for us (and maybe for the devs) to see how the classes truly compare, and give us the raw material for putting together new effective builds.

I think you’re basically trying to do the impossible, but it’s an interesting attempt anyway, and interesting to see your opinion on it and peoples’ reactions.

I disagree with the definition of support though; I would say it’s generally understood to be “contributing to group survivability and effectiveness.” A self-heal may indirectly help the group, but if you make that argument you have to say that DPS also indirectly helps the group and the whole idea becomes too wishy-washy to really count for much.

So I’d include AOE heals, revives, AOE condition removal, AOE blocks and reflects, ally boons, fields, CC, boon stripping, weakness/vulnerability, and perhaps condition spreading as support.

Soul.9280:

Not that I’m asking the OP to provide a spreadsheet that has all this info, but it would be great if the community could put something like this together in a structured way for all classes, weapons and attacks and build off of it. Would make it much easier for us (and maybe for the devs) to see how the classes truly compare, and give us the raw material for putting together new effective builds.

What do you think of this, pull 3-4 of the most common builds for every profession, rate each build by how much dps/healing was done within a minute (Not quite sure how you would factor in tanking…maybe the average of how long you can last against a certain boss without healing?) Then average together the builds for an overall score. Perhaps you can go more into depth and count the amount of times you attacked/healed/got hit as well.
What do you think?