Guild Wars 2

Anet y u kill ingi?

Speedy kits dead. Merged it with another trait that used to be great before you killed it 2 years ago or whatever. Now that trait comes back from the grave and pulls speedy kits with it. Funny!

Invigorating speed and protection injection on same tier. Sneaky sneaky. Added garbage grandmasters to that line to put more salt in the wound.

Basically replace grenades with the new mortar stuff. “People don’t use mortar but they use grenades so we nerf the kitten out of grenades and move some of that functionality to mortar!” GJ!

Inventions line is still horrible. Obviously you put the only other mobilty trait there. Naturally. Merge it with leg mods too, which btw we could take instead of power wrench in the past.

It’s pretty hilarious mesmer gets super important traits such as illusionary elasticity, illusionary persona as class mechanics, thief gets executioner and panic strike in the same line etc.
Meanwhile core engi traits like speedy kits, invigorating speed are not.

Oh it’s also quite interesting you give us rng dps via rocket on crit or whatever. And reveal poor thieves while we spam skills in the air?
Nobody asked for any of this.

tl;dr I know casuals who roleplay inventions will bash me, but I know I am right.

Theres already been a discussion about the grenade “nerf”, and most people don’t have a problem with it

Elixir C is still unuseable and we still will have problems removing our conditions. I will wait and see what a new build might look like. But 4 points into tools looks like I do not like it.

Improved radius and travel time. Grenades have been buffed.

Pretty much everything you said is either completely false, over-exaggerated or plain QQ about your favored build being gone.

Do we care?
Nope.

But because you’ll continue ranting about people disregarding you right away without even responding, I gonna debunk / explain your points to you.

1. Speedy kits is still there, with a nerfed uptime of 50%. Is that a nerf to engineers mobility? Nope, we still have heavy armor exploit for frequent perma-swiftness & vulnerability in-combat + mecha legs as 25% movement speed / 33%reduced duration on chill/cripple/immob
Is that a nerf to our vigor uptime?
Nope. currently you just get 50% uptime anyways, and by choosing heavy armor exploit you get 100% uptime.

2. Protection Injection & invigorating speed were always in the same tier, they just compete with each other now, so are exclusive. is that a huge issue? Looking into tools, we get a automated stunbreak and over-shield in inventions (the “garbage-line” that looks better than current alchemy) will give you decent protection uptime anyways. And just in case you didn’t heard the news, elixir R has a even shorter cd now, so you may as well pick that if you need the dodges & immob clear and bring some free rezzing as well. In regards to the “garbage” grandmasters, have you even looked up what stimulant does for you? fury and condi-clear, on a 10sec cd, along with the fury on crit from firearms, also on a 10sec cd. Speak after me: P-E-R-M-A—F-U-R-Y.

3. one does not replace the other, they can be picked together, and appart from the range-nerf, nades got buffed beyond awesomeness since it now delivers its full potential without even the need to trait it anymore. and IF you trait it, you’ll land your nades so easy now that you seriously can’t have a reason to complain.
Even for WvW wall-bombing, only nades #4 was viable since it could reach every siege, regardless how far placed behind. This is now possible with orbital strike, which can hit double-times, and still can be picked on the SAME time as nades. Get your kitten together. Nades were always bad on range, and while you were throwing poison nades on nodes in PvP previously, you’ll now do that with mortar #2. No utility is lost, and both come with gread synergy, be it on condi or power-builds.

4. You live under a rock, or never have played engi if you don’t see the synergy in inventions for us. That section of your post right there is hilarious comedy-material. What the kitten is even the point? you still can pick both leg-mods and power-wrench, if you so desire

5. Because they are not core anymore. Grenadier? core-trait before, now baseline and free’d up its slot for double orbital strickes, blast-finishers on dodge or even more bleed/cripple-spam. Bunker down, far better than backpack-regenerator and elixir infused bombs together. ICP? placed neatly in our condi-line, along with traits that buff pistols, our crits, our bleeds and even give us more crits. And its former place got overtaaken by a seeker-missile, that works exactly like ICP but does power-dmg instead.

6. For months people were complaining about the map-control of thieves in WvW and PvP. At this point I’m certain you’ve lived under a rock, or try to make your points more valid by false claims. Lock on looks awesome. Do I personally have asked for it? Nope. Do I welcome the change? Hell yes.

tl;dr: I know casuals who suck meta-battles balls and can’t come up with reasonable builds themselves. That is fine. No one is expecting you to learn the class you play. I mean, that would be hilarious. I’d recommend you to sit back, shut up and wait for the next meta-battle build to pop up, so you can run around and tell people how awesome the meta is, while face-rolling over your keyboard. Your recent posts in pre-announcement threads made clear that you don’t do much else…

I am suprised that blowtorch and glue shot are untouched.

Lupanic.6502:

I am suprised that blowtorch and glue shot are untouched.

I guess they simply forgot blow-torch on their notes, judging from how rushed everything seemed in the stream.
Or it actually stays as it is, and just delivers 1 – extremely long lasting – stack of burning.

Glue shot on the other hand doesn’t need any changes since there were no changes to cripple and immob in the new condi-system.

I think the changes make engi different but not bad or anything. You probably just need to get used to the changes and try to create a new type of build that fits your style.

About the revealed treat, the whole thief forum is hyped up about it right now haha:P

I like most of the changes, at least most of them. I am waiting to try it out for myself before making claims about what will or won’t work.

(I love when people make the claim “I know I am right”, it always lets me know that they aren’t)

An engi complaining about the changes is perhaps the most hilarious thing I’ve read on here today.

Engies received unneeded buffs, and will dominate the meta for months to come.

robertul.3679:

As a fellow engi, I like how salty you are. Please continue to use the meta-est kitten possible (IP + cele + I am sure you use slick shoes).

Yes speedy kits nerf is a nerf to mobility. By 50% to be exact. Mobility is more relevant out of combat than in combat anyway.

You compare 3s protection every 5s when cc to 4s on using shield skills? Yes they were on the same spot but if you went 6 alchemy you could take both. Why would people ever go 6 in alchemy you might ask. For exactly that, 3 amazing traits, taking them all.

The seeker rocket missile whatever thingy seems like another random proc. All them skillful procs that plague the game.

The reveal trait? That’s just to mess up with thieves. If it’s really your goal to do that, just take utility goggles. It seems like such a pointless thing while not addressing more important issues of the class.

The grenade range nerf doesn’t only matter for poisoning downstate from 1.5k. It also means you had ranged cleave because the class is not made to sustain itself in melee.

And what about FT? I think nades are very well when you compare both.

LMFAO..
This is the hugest buff Engi ever received and you’re calling a nerf.
Larger radius, that causes cripple and more bleeding per throw with super fast traveling speed. I’ll take that 24/7 over the current version.

For the mobility, you can still choose power shoe over speedkit since there’re alot of nice reworked options there.

Toxsa.2701:

LMFAO..
This is the hugest buff Engi ever received and you’re calling a nerf.
Larger radius, that causes cripple and more bleeding per throw with super fast traveling speed. I’ll take that 24/7 over the current version.

For the mobility, you can still choose power shoe over speedkit since there’re alot of nice reworked options there.

Before, you can run with grenades, Incendiary Powder and Invigorating Speed, a typical core build with multiple variants. How you can do it now?

robertul.3679:

The reveal trait? That’s just to mess up with thieves. If it’s really your goal to do that, just take utility goggles. It seems like such a pointless thing while not addressing more important issues of the class.

actually its the next step in adding counterplay to stealth. we started with 0. analyze and sic em got added, but the problem with those utilities is that you have to predict your opponent wanting to stealth. the opponent has the opportunity to pay close attention and not stealth for 6 secs and then your “counter” is wasted. they arent counters to stealth, because their usage patterns are designed to be proactive instead of reactive. countering a thing means reacting to a thing. this new trait serves as a true stealth counter in that the engis response to someone stealthing is “spam aoe where you think your opponent is”.

i personally dont really wanna be the hard counter to a shadow arts thief or a torch wielding mesmer, but the game seriously needs counterplay to stealth, and anets first round of messing around with stealth counterplay was a huge flop. this looks a lot more promising and i wish theyd give it to at least 1 more class, or delete this trait and give equivalent things to 2 other classes.

insanemaniac.2456:

robertul.3679:

The reveal trait? That’s just to mess up with thieves. If it’s really your goal to do that, just take utility goggles. It seems like such a pointless thing while not addressing more important issues of the class.

actually its the next step in adding counterplay to stealth. we started with 0. analyze and sic em got added, but the problem with those utilities is that you have to predict your opponent wanting to stealth. the opponent has the opportunity to pay close attention and not stealth for 6 secs and then your “counter” is wasted. they arent counters to stealth, because their usage patterns are designed to be proactive instead of reactive. countering a thing means reacting to a thing. this new trait serves as a true stealth counter in that the engis response to someone stealthing is “spam aoe where you think your opponent is”.

i personally dont really wanna be the hard counter to a shadow arts thief or a torch wielding mesmer, but the game seriously needs counterplay to stealth, and anets first round of messing around with stealth counterplay was a huge flop. this looks a lot more promising and i wish theyd give it to at least 1 more class, or delete this trait and give equivalent things to 2 other classes.

I think they have this whole counter play thing backwards. They screwed up with their stealth design from a PVP perspective. And they should be addressing that, not giving skills to people so they can have an excuse, “see you can do this… it’s not bad”

Jerus.4350:

insanemaniac.2456:

robertul.3679:

The reveal trait? That’s just to mess up with thieves. If it’s really your goal to do that, just take utility goggles. It seems like such a pointless thing while not addressing more important issues of the class.

actually its the next step in adding counterplay to stealth. we started with 0. analyze and sic em got added, but the problem with those utilities is that you have to predict your opponent wanting to stealth. the opponent has the opportunity to pay close attention and not stealth for 6 secs and then your “counter” is wasted. they arent counters to stealth, because their usage patterns are designed to be proactive instead of reactive. countering a thing means reacting to a thing. this new trait serves as a true stealth counter in that the engis response to someone stealthing is “spam aoe where you think your opponent is”.

i personally dont really wanna be the hard counter to a shadow arts thief or a torch wielding mesmer, but the game seriously needs counterplay to stealth, and anets first round of messing around with stealth counterplay was a huge flop. this looks a lot more promising and i wish theyd give it to at least 1 more class, or delete this trait and give equivalent things to 2 other classes.

I think they have this whole counter play thing backwards. They screwed up with their stealth design from a PVP perspective. And they should be addressing that, not giving skills to people so they can have an excuse, “see you can do this… it’s not bad”

maybe they should make the stealth stack cap 2 instead of 5. its the long durations that makes it so much more frustrating than a lot of games with stealth. i think.

insanemaniac.2456:

Jerus.4350:

insanemaniac.2456:

robertul.3679:

The reveal trait? That’s just to mess up with thieves. If it’s really your goal to do that, just take utility goggles. It seems like such a pointless thing while not addressing more important issues of the class.

actually its the next step in adding counterplay to stealth. we started with 0. analyze and sic em got added, but the problem with those utilities is that you have to predict your opponent wanting to stealth. the opponent has the opportunity to pay close attention and not stealth for 6 secs and then your “counter” is wasted. they arent counters to stealth, because their usage patterns are designed to be proactive instead of reactive. countering a thing means reacting to a thing. this new trait serves as a true stealth counter in that the engis response to someone stealthing is “spam aoe where you think your opponent is”.

i personally dont really wanna be the hard counter to a shadow arts thief or a torch wielding mesmer, but the game seriously needs counterplay to stealth, and anets first round of messing around with stealth counterplay was a huge flop. this looks a lot more promising and i wish theyd give it to at least 1 more class, or delete this trait and give equivalent things to 2 other classes.

I think they have this whole counter play thing backwards. They screwed up with their stealth design from a PVP perspective. And they should be addressing that, not giving skills to people so they can have an excuse, “see you can do this… it’s not bad”

maybe they should make the stealth stack cap 2 instead of 5. its the long durations that makes it so much more frustrating than a lot of games with stealth. i think.

I was thinking about what I liked and didn’t like about my old games. One thing I really liked was the “fragile” aspect, in that any hit broke the stealth. So you had to not only stealth but also evade, having a huge advantage, but not overly so that it became incredibly annoying. So I don’t know, I was thinking that, maybe give traits for thief/mes/Engi? that extend it to have a few charges of shielding to prevent instant break. I don’t know, I doubt any change like that would ever happen, but that’s the track my mind went down.

Duration can be annoying, but honestly I think the frequency in which you can stealth is more so than that. Land an attack and poof gone. Like maybe a short reveal upon attacking while stealthed should happen, avoidable of course if you just wait for the stealth to drop naturally.

Again, just ideals/thoughts.

Jerus.4350:

insanemaniac.2456:

Jerus.4350:

insanemaniac.2456:

robertul.3679:

The reveal trait? That’s just to mess up with thieves. If it’s really your goal to do that, just take utility goggles. It seems like such a pointless thing while not addressing more important issues of the class.

actually its the next step in adding counterplay to stealth. we started with 0. analyze and sic em got added, but the problem with those utilities is that you have to predict your opponent wanting to stealth. the opponent has the opportunity to pay close attention and not stealth for 6 secs and then your “counter” is wasted. they arent counters to stealth, because their usage patterns are designed to be proactive instead of reactive. countering a thing means reacting to a thing. this new trait serves as a true stealth counter in that the engis response to someone stealthing is “spam aoe where you think your opponent is”.

i personally dont really wanna be the hard counter to a shadow arts thief or a torch wielding mesmer, but the game seriously needs counterplay to stealth, and anets first round of messing around with stealth counterplay was a huge flop. this looks a lot more promising and i wish theyd give it to at least 1 more class, or delete this trait and give equivalent things to 2 other classes.

I think they have this whole counter play thing backwards. They screwed up with their stealth design from a PVP perspective. And they should be addressing that, not giving skills to people so they can have an excuse, “see you can do this… it’s not bad”

maybe they should make the stealth stack cap 2 instead of 5. its the long durations that makes it so much more frustrating than a lot of games with stealth. i think.

I was thinking about what I liked and didn’t like about my old games. One thing I really liked was the “fragile” aspect, in that any hit broke the stealth. So you had to not only stealth but also evade, having a huge advantage, but not overly so that it became incredibly annoying. So I don’t know, I was thinking that, maybe give traits for thief/mes/Engi? that extend it to have a few charges of shielding to prevent instant break. I don’t know, I doubt any change like that would ever happen, but that’s the track my mind went down.

Duration can be annoying, but honestly I think the frequency in which you can stealth is more so than that. Land an attack and poof gone. Like maybe a short reveal upon attacking while stealthed should happen, avoidable of course if you just wait for the stealth to drop naturally.

Again, just ideals/thoughts.

lock on will pretty much add a “fragile” aspect to stealth, so i guess well get to see how it pans out

I wish i knew why people complained about a trait like this when some of the new traits such as bunker down are very very powerful every 2 sec a mine and a medbag? hell even the new gadget trait with AED?! 20 sec cd for an overcharged version not to mention the actual overcharge ability with it that we have yet too see pretty much a 12k heal on a 20 sec cd if used properly.

Frightlight.3796:

I wish i knew why people complained about a trait like this when some of the new traits such as bunker down are very very powerful every 2 sec a mine and a medbag? hell even the new gadget trait with AED?! 20 sec cd for an overcharged version not to mention the actual overcharge ability with it that we have yet too see pretty much a 12k heal on a 20 sec cd if used properly.

It’s easy to understand. The other traits are just making Engi better (well most). This trait though, is targeting specific people.

Basic psychology, if I say “brunets are the smartest people” some people may comment, but if I say “brunets are smarter than redheads” well, I’m gonna rustle some jimmies.

While you’re right, other changes are certainly more questionable when you step back. But people react to being targeted.

i cant wait to see overcharged slick shoes personally, they said bigger puddle radius somewhere O_O;

insanemaniac.2456:

i cant wait to see overcharged slick shoes personally, they said bigger puddle radius somewhere O_O;

And I can´t wait to see engineer´s being able to use throw elixir r every 20 seconds xD

No, seriously… I´m never ever going to loose 1v1 when this goes live lmao

Cero.5132:

And I can´t wait to see engineer´s being able to use throw elixir r every 20 seconds xD

No, seriously… I´m never ever going to loose 1v1 when this goes live lmao

Well there are counters, for example poison and launch skills like overcharge. But it looks like it will be an incredibly strong combo for bunkers.

Are.1326

Well there are counters, for example poison and launch skills like overcharge. But it looks like it will be an incredibly strong combo for bunkers.

As I remember it from times far in the past when it was still regularly used (lol), it removes conditions with every tick, including poison.
Launch.. true… Luckily not every build has one :P
Still it is rather insane being able to use throw elixir r every 20 seconds. At this rate I don´t see it useful only for bunkers. With vigor nerfed the elixirs 2 additional dodges are definitely worth a lot…

Also… #gadgetmeta I´ll be flying around with rocketboots every 10seconds…
or use the mini skyhammer 4x in quick succession, stack might like an idiot and..
omg I´m so hyped for These changes! xD

Cero.5132:

With vigor nerfed the elixirs 2 additional dodges are definitely worth a lot…

And the extra dodges are just what you need to activate the trait after 20 sec, perfect. You just need to survive the 20 sec after Toss Elixir R res you without wasting the active.

with the new trait system, you can only take one one trait of each tier, instead of combinations of them? that would destroy build variety

Susulemon.3204:

with the new trait system, you can only take one one trait of each tier, instead of combinations of them? that would destroy build variety

it actually takes away a lot of the illusion of variety. taking 3 adepts is a false choice in pretty much every case. even taking 2 adepts/masters is almost always a false choice, there are only like 10-50 builds or build archetypes where thats the true/best option, and there are about 100 gazillion possibilities for taking 2 adepts/masters.

Can’t believe people complain about engi getting a slight nerf on 1-2 traits when they all the others are gonna be most op in the game. Aoe moa as a HALF elite skill to remove liches, plagues, aoe control etc.. the supply crate gets buffed even further you can drop the bandages, 3 turrets, overcharge(heal,condi remove) the healing turret and then blast all 3 turrets into its water field JUST with the elite. they gonna be able to insta heal out a guild lord from 1 hp. their throw elixir R gonna be on a 0s then a 20sec cd. with the trait.

If engis need anything its a nerf.

This is as sad as that one thread on the necro forum saying they won the spec changes