Guild Wars 2

I’d say we tried our best. It is time to say goodbye for good to an amazing trait.

/me cries.

Please. I’m tired of seeing posts about a mediocre trait you can’t use anymore.

Adamantium.3682:

Please. I’m tired of seeing posts about a mediocre trait you can’t use anymore.

It would be more constructive if you refrained pushing your subjective opinion as if it were fact. Your feedback is appreciated, but simply because you do not personally care for a discussion doesn’t mean it shouldn’t exist.

I really enjoyed the trait. It added a little more to bomb kit to raise it’s value against grenades.

Seems odd to me, to have issue with this trait or to remove it, yet supporting AI and the generally disliked aspects of gyros

We might as well go play Elementalists now – they are simplier versions of engineers with doubled healing capabilities – The well specced Ele will possibly outheal the Revenant and druid when it comes to sustain heals.

dancingmonkey.4902:

Adamantium.3682:

Please. I’m tired of seeing posts about a mediocre trait you can’t use anymore.

It would be more constructive if you refrained pushing your subjective opinion as if it were fact.

Seems like the same thing y’all are doing in favor of EIB does it not?

Of course my view of it is subjective, saying otherwise is a red herring. Protip: when someone posts something on the forums you can safely assume it’s how they feel and it’s their opinion even if they didn’t explicitly say so.

What really gets me in this whole EIB obsession is how it was rarely discussed as a good build when it was in game. Most of what I saw was along the lines of “yeah it heals but you have to spam bombs, you don’t do a lot of damage, it’s sort of gimmicky”. That’s certainly how it felt to me when I used it, something I could use when I just wanted to mindlessly carry pugs through dungeons by spamming bombs. Now it’s gone and it has somehow nerfed the Engi gutting one of the best builds we had? I think it’s a little over the top.

It was a trait that some people liked and now it’s gone. That sucks, but it happens. Time to let it go.

RubberDougie.2750:

I’d say we tried our best. It is time to say goodbye for good to an amazing trait.

/me cries.

Amazing trait? Are we now to the point where we are re-writing history?

Look, it is a bummer that the trait is gone, especially since its departure revealed that it had a following.

Still, it is not coming back. Nor should it.

lorddarkflare.9186:

RubberDougie.2750:

I’d say we tried our best. It is time to say goodbye for good to an amazing trait.

/me cries.

Amazing trait? Are we now to the point where we are re-writing history?

Look, it is a bummer that the trait is gone, especially since its departure revealed that it had a following.

Still, it is not coming back. Nor should it.

Agreed. Said more succinctly than I could.

This is a bit of a problem somewhat caused by the new system being locked to only 3 traits each tier.

I used to run elixir infused bombs. It worked great in a few niche builds. Yeah, it was far from ‘meta’ but it wasn’t quite ‘bad’. You did need the right gear set-up for it to get just past medocrity, but it was great for a support bunker in team fights, and my old EiB build hard-countered thieves to a ridiculous degree.

Objectively, new bunker down is an overall more effective trait in terms of both damage and healing output (Unless you’re all stacked up, then the group healing of old EiB pushes ahead a bit) and does essentially the same thing while working in many more builds than EiB did without needing cele or cleric gear to be worthwhile.

The problem however is that because it is crit dependent, it relies on grenades like so many other engie traits. If you liked EiB for the bomb part… or wanted something like the old builds I was using, you’re out of luck because bunker down isn’t very good with bombs, and is completely useless in cleric gear.

Bunker down would be a fine replacement for EiB if it didn’t rely on crits. Perhaps if you auto-droped a mine and medkit every 5 seconds in combat, or it was just a chance on hit with an internal cd instead of guaranteed on crit with internal cd. Then you could run the trait in just about any gear without being locked into crit gear.

Arioso.8519:

The problem however is that because it is crit dependent, it relies on grenades

I use Bunker down. Been using it before it changed into what it is today. It has never needed grenades.

And if you miss EiB so much, why don’t you try my guide to the Burst healer engie

Ok, getting into semantics, none of the “on crit” traits truly “rely” on grenades, but grenades are much better at procing on crit traits than bombs are, and that nearly all of the fireams and explosive traits are balanced such that they’re more effective with grenades than bombs.

And that burst healing isn’t quite the same thing. A scrapper support tank is now the replacement rather than a burst healing build, in terms of combat niche. I don’t have beta access to test out a build with it myself, but it seems to do the same job well as a sustained melee range bunker.

That said though, and I suppose this needs to be said, if we got Elixir Infused Bombs back NOW, it probably would be terrible. The specialization patch in general buffed bursty specs and basically nerfed the effectiveness of toughness, such that EiB wouldn’t be nearly as sustainable as it used to be. There is no going back.

I think what I’d prefer to see at this point, is an explosives line trait that gives bomb kit #1 a 20% chance at procing a blast finisher in a similar manner to most of our projectile #1’s having a chance at a projectile one. Maybe roll that into thermobaric detonation since it’s rather underwhelming. That’d allow bomb kit AAs to occasionally trigger soothing detonation so you’d effectively get the same thing without throwing things off too much.

Adamantium.3682:

dancingmonkey.4902:

Adamantium.3682:

Please. I’m tired of seeing posts about a mediocre trait you can’t use anymore.

It would be more constructive if you refrained pushing your subjective opinion as if it were fact.

Seems like the same thing y’all are doing in favor of EIB does it not?

Of course my view of it is subjective, saying otherwise is a red herring. Protip: when someone posts something on the forums you can safely assume it’s how they feel and it’s their opinion even if they didn’t explicitly say so.

What really gets me in this whole EIB obsession is how it was rarely discussed as a good build when it was in game. Most of what I saw was along the lines of “yeah it heals but you have to spam bombs, you don’t do a lot of damage, it’s sort of gimmicky”. That’s certainly how it felt to me when I used it, something I could use when I just wanted to mindlessly carry pugs through dungeons by spamming bombs. Now it’s gone and it has somehow nerfed the Engi gutting one of the best builds we had? I think it’s a little over the top.

It was a trait that some people liked and now it’s gone. That sucks, but it happens. Time to let it go.

I do not know what “y’all” are saying. I speak for myself. You disingenuously make declarative statements, I specify my words as my opinion, with such clarifiers as “seems to me” and “to me it feels like” and so on.

Your pro tip falls on its face in my opinion. One of the worst mistakes a person can make is to assume anything about what anyone means or intends, on the internet.

I do not know what your going on about as to EIB discussions. I made several discussions about it and how I used it in WvW, and many others joined me in the discussion. I suspect what you do not remember seeing others discuss, could just about be crammed into the grand canyon. Similarly, how you describe recalling others referring to the trait strikes me as more likely how you posted about it, not so much how everyone else referred to it. Perhaps it would be beneficial if you stick to speaking for yourself, instead of trying to recall for use what you claim others felt about it in the past.

Fact of the matter is, it was, as I said, a good support additive in my opinion, for adding more benefit and value to utilizing the bomb kit, when compared to other kits in WvW and other scenarios. Enough so that multiple threads have popped up on this recently, with many posters in favor of it. You do not have to like it. No one is even asking you to use it.

dancingmonkey.4902:

Adamantium.3682:

dancingmonkey.4902:

Adamantium.3682:

Please. I’m tired of seeing posts about a mediocre trait you can’t use anymore.

It would be more constructive if you refrained pushing your subjective opinion as if it were fact.

Seems like the same thing y’all are doing in favor of EIB does it not?

Of course my view of it is subjective, saying otherwise is a red herring. Protip: when someone posts something on the forums you can safely assume it’s how they feel and it’s their opinion even if they didn’t explicitly say so.

What really gets me in this whole EIB obsession is how it was rarely discussed as a good build when it was in game. Most of what I saw was along the lines of “yeah it heals but you have to spam bombs, you don’t do a lot of damage, it’s sort of gimmicky”. That’s certainly how it felt to me when I used it, something I could use when I just wanted to mindlessly carry pugs through dungeons by spamming bombs. Now it’s gone and it has somehow nerfed the Engi gutting one of the best builds we had? I think it’s a little over the top.

It was a trait that some people liked and now it’s gone. That sucks, but it happens. Time to let it go.

I do not know what “y’all” are saying. I speak for myself. You disingenuously make declarative statements, I specify my words as my opinion, with such clarifiers as “seems to me” and “to me it feels like” and so on.

Your pro tip falls on its face in my opinion. One of the worst mistakes a person can make is to assume anything about what anyone means or intends, on the internet.

I do not know what your going on about as to EIB discussions. I made several discussions about it and how I used it in WvW, and many others joined me in the discussion. I suspect what you do not remember seeing others discuss, could just about be crammed into the grand canyon. Similarly, how you describe recalling others referring to the trait strikes me as more likely how you posted about it, not so much how everyone else referred to it. Perhaps it would be beneficial if you stick to speaking for yourself, instead of trying to recall for use what you claim others felt about it in the past.

Fact of the matter is, it was, as I said, a good support additive in my opinion, for adding more benefit and value to utilizing the bomb kit, when compared to other kits in WvW and other scenarios. Enough so that multiple threads have popped up on this recently, with many posters in favor of it. You do not have to like it. No one is even asking you to use it.

Opportunity cost.

Wasn’t healing bombs almost never used when it existed because the heals were tiny and the rest of the trait line wasn’t terribly good as it was?

I mean, when it existed it was often outright mocked right here on these forums as a bad trait.

Am I the only person who remembers this?

So why do people desperately want it back suddenly?

Mercurias.1826:

Wasn’t healing bombs almost never used when it existed because the heals were tiny and the rest of the trait line wasn’t terribly good as it was?

I mean, when it existed it was often outright mocked right here on these forums as a bad trait.

Am I the only person who remembers this?

So why do people desperately want it back suddenly?

You are correct on all fronts.

Mercurias.1826:

Wasn’t healing bombs almost never used when it existed because the heals were tiny and the rest of the trait line wasn’t terribly good as it was?

I mean, when it existed it was often outright mocked right here on these forums as a bad trait.

Am I the only person who remembers this?

So why do people desperately want it back suddenly?

No, not really. It was a fairly popular dungeon trait, well revered in the frontline builds for WvW. I think it was unpopular in PvP. It was a good suplimentory trait in group WvW play.

One thing I will say: If people want the trait back they should lobby to have the old functionality merged into soothing detonations and apply to all explosions.

Now it is useful to everyone.

Mercurias.1826:

Wasn’t healing bombs almost never used when it existed because the heals were tiny and the rest of the trait line wasn’t terribly good as it was?

I mean, when it existed it was often outright mocked right here on these forums as a bad trait.

Am I the only person who remembers this?

So why do people desperately want it back suddenly?

There were always people that enjoyed using sub-optimal builds, as shocking as it may be to believe. I bet there are even 2 or maybe even three players that use the battering ram once in a while. (Wierdos)

It was useful trait regardless, but a woefully underwhelming grandmaster in a very weak trait-line. If it DID still exist in the current inventions, alchemy or explosives line, I think it would actually see a lot more play than it used to, at least compared to some of the new traits that nobody uses, like thermobaric detonation… or pretty much anything else in the whole explosives line if you’re not running grenades. It was mostly having to go full into the terrible inventions line that killed it. Now inventions is good. so maybe it would have still worked.

Arioso.8519:

Mercurias.1826:

Wasn’t healing bombs almost never used when it existed because the heals were tiny and the rest of the trait line wasn’t terribly good as it was?

I mean, when it existed it was often outright mocked right here on these forums as a bad trait.

Am I the only person who remembers this?

So why do people desperately want it back suddenly?

There were always people that enjoyed using sub-optimal builds, as shocking as it may be to believe. I bet there are even 2 or maybe even three players that use the battering ram once in a while. (Wierdos)

It was useful trait regardless, but a woefully underwhelming grandmaster in a very weak trait-line. If it DID still exist in the current inventions, alchemy or explosives line, I think it would actually see a lot more play than it used to, at least compared to some of the new traits that nobody uses, like thermobaric detonation… or pretty much anything else in the whole explosives line if you’re not running grenades. It was mostly having to go full into the terrible inventions line that killed it. Now inventions is good. so maybe it would have still worked.

It would still need a significant buff for the post-Hot meta.

On a sidenote: I have started using personal battering ram on my scrapper. It is awesome.

Least of our problems. How about an increase to our access to super speed to help synergy with the rapid regeneration trait…

Helcor.9527:

Least of our problems. How about an increase to our access to super speed to help synergy with the rapid regeneration trait…

Our access to super speed seems pretty solid. Good enough from what they are trying to do with it.

The problem is superspeed itself. Not only does it not stack, but its inherent effect is pretty lackluster.

Also, Rapid Regeneration does not seem to scale with Healing Power. At all.

lorddarkflare.9186:

Helcor.9527:

Least of our problems. How about an increase to our access to super speed to help synergy with the rapid regeneration trait…

Our access to super speed seems pretty solid. Good enough from what they are trying to do with it.

The problem is superspeed itself. Not only does it not stack, but its inherent effect is pretty lackluster.

Also, Rapid Regeneration does not seem to scale with Healing Power. At all.

Youre right. I agree with you super speed is lack luster. Even if it scaled with rapid regeneration it would be lack luster at the expense of everything else….

This again? Seriously…

It would synergize great with the healing on super speed and swiftness as well as some other traits in group fighting in WvW, such as backpack regeneration. Those traits with celestial gear and the increased condition damage reduction+toughness increase on hit are great groping benefits and survival combos to work with EG as team support.

Phineas Poe.3018:

This again? Seriously…

We are doomed to have (the same) people kitten about it forever.

lorddarkflare.9186:

Mercurias.1826:

Wasn’t healing bombs almost never used when it existed because the heals were tiny and the rest of the trait line wasn’t terribly good as it was?

I mean, when it existed it was often outright mocked right here on these forums as a bad trait.

Am I the only person who remembers this?

So why do people desperately want it back suddenly?

You are correct on all fronts.

There was nothing wrong with the trait itself. It healed for quite a good amount and the scaling wasn’t terrible. The reason it was bad was because the rest of Inventions line was useless and diving down that traitline made your damage a lot less powerful. The change of removing Attribute Points from traitlines gave people hope and excitement to be able to access Elixir-Infused Bombs without the need to funnel 600 potential Attribute Points into Toughness and Healing Power. It was one of the primary examples that some referenced to when discussing why the change to traitlines was going to be a positive thing.

I really don’t miss them ….

RubberDougie.2750:

I’d say we tried our best. It is time to say goodbye for good to an amazing trait.

/me cries.

Ya I’m sad to see it go too. I was on par with pvt armor with a full cleric’s set. Fortunately I didn’t make the full ascended cleric’s set or I would have been very angry. Not sure what ascended to make now since engineer healing sucks now. EIB was a way to do what engis do and heal your allies. It was dps and heals all in one and it made actual sense. The game right now does not in any way shape or form support a full cleric’s build anymore which sucks for engi.