Guild Wars 2

The “Increase Recharge Rate” portion of the Tools line applies less than what is listed. It appears to be shorter by approximately 9.1% at 30 (Toss Elixir R with a 30 in Tools should have an 84 second cooldown as listed in the tooltip, however it is actually closer to 93 seconds). Meaning that your 30 points in Tools is actually only giving you about 21 points worth of Toolbelt Recharge.

I’ve filed a bug report and they were supposed to focusing on bugs soon, so we’ll see what happens. But for now know that if you are invested in Tools for the toolbelt recharge rate, a good chunk of your trait points aren’t contributing to that at all.

It’s not a bug, it increases rate not decreases time.
Interval = 1/Rate
Divide the cooldown by 1.3 and you will get exactly what you find.

gimmethegepgun.1284:

It’s not a bug, it increases rate not decreases time.
Interval = 1/Rate
Divide the cooldown by 1.3 and you will get exactly what you find.

In all fairness, the in game tooltip actually displays a different value than what your formula produces, giving us a blatant discrepancy. Either tools should be working differently, or the tooltip needs the formula changed.

Edit: What Kamahl said.

gimmethegepgun.1284:

It’s not a bug, it increases rate not decreases time.
Interval = 1/Rate
Divide the cooldown by 1.3 and you will get exactly what you find.

In which case the tooltips are substantially off as they reflect a percentage reduction of the base recharge (i.e. base *.3) and not an increase to recharge rate (base /1.3).

And after checking around, it seems that Thieves, Mesmers and any other class that shares a rate increase to their unique skills share this discrepancy. Either all the applicable tooltips are correct and the formula is incorrect, or vice versa.

I’m inclined to think that the 30% reduction to cooldowns was more the intent as it produces cleaner numbers and more noticeable results for the investment.

Base / 1.3 (i.e. 120 seconds / 1.3 = 92.30769230768231)
vs.
Base * .3 (i.e. 120 seconds *.3 = 84).

Ghostpilot.6237:

Base * .3 (i.e. 120 seconds *.3 = 84).

I believe you meant to write Base * .7 or Base * (1 – 0.3).

This is a good bit of information to know though. It is not at all obvious that the recharge bonus does not work as a linear reduction, and that it actually has diminishing returns.

If the formula is truly Base/(1 + (TRC/100)), where TRC = Toolbelt Recharge Rate, then 100% TRC (achievable by a theoretical 100 points in the Tools line) would mean your toolbelt skills would have half the cooldown. The in game descriptions could be easily interpreted as a linear reduction, and thus 100% TRC would mean 0s CD on all toolbelt skills, but that does not appear to be the case.

This makes 30 points in Tools less attractive than it already is.

^^^ You’re right. I skipped a step there: Base* .3 (i.e. 120 *.3 = 36. 120 – 36 = 84).

If they were to change the formula it would not only make it more intuitive, but bring it in line to how the cooldown reductions are handled globally (e.g. Crack Shot, Fireforged Trigger, etc).

It seems like it would not only be an easy fix, but a substantial one for about half the classes; kinda makes me wonder why it hasn’t happened yet.

Ghostpilot.6237:

^^^ You’re right. I skipped a step there: Base* .3 (i.e. 120 *.3 = 36. 120 – 36 = 84).

If they were to change the formula it would not only make it more intuitive, but bring it in line to how the cooldown reductions are handled globally (e.g. Crack Shot, Fireforged Trigger, etc).

It seems like it would not only be an easy fix, but a substantial one for about half the classes; kinda makes me wonder why it hasn’t happened yet.

My guess is that the formula is currently working the way the intended it to work, but the tooltips and in game descriptions are just highly inaccurate. They’ve mentioned they want to do a lot of work on fixing tooltips in the next patch, so this matter might be something they look to address.

Although it is a bit odd that they use this formula for class mechanic reduction and a different formula for other cooldown reductions. If they were to change the formula, it would just take mathematical manipulation… I don’t see that being too difficult unless their code is structured in a freaky way that exhibits no modularity.

Too many numbers. Lets just a agree to be kitten at arenanet.

according to the numbers ingame…

the last 5 points in the tool belt cd trait line are simply doing nothing that is the issue!

Even though the skill cd shown in the tooltip of the skill gets reduced adequately the real cooldown remains the same as when you have 25 points in tool belt trait line

It’s not really diminishing returns if you look at it as 30% more toolbelt activations/shatters/steals/whatever. If the first 10% was worthwhile, so is the next 10% and so on.

Yamsandjams.3267:

This makes 30 points in Tools less attractive than it already is.

Tools is plenty attractive if it suits your build. Keep in mind it additionally adds 30% Critical Damage.

Whenever I run with the Bomb Kit in PvE, I slot 25 points in Explosives and 25 in Tools. Way more damage than any alternative I’ve tested.