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We all know that Elixir C is THE most underused elixir in the engineer kitten nal. My idea to get it into the limelight is to split off the function of condition removal overtime from Toss Elixir R and give it to Toss Elixir C. Toss Elixir C will then convert conditions every second for 10 seconds and Elixir R will remain for rezzing.
Right now, there is no better choice for condition removal other than Elixir R for Engineers and it also has the added benefit of rezzing you. Putting the function of Toss Elixir R in Toss Elixir C will give us a choice, do we want to rezz or do we want to cleanse? Elixir C will instantly become the number 1 choice for condition removal whilst Elixir R would be all about revival/survival.
Hello frands! Vee Wee here, #1 Engi NA and world first rank 80!
That’s a thuper thwell idea my frand! They should make Elixir C instant cast too so it removes Fear! Yippee!
Wahoo! Bye frands!
I’d rather look at the cooldown of Toss Elixir C then just nerf Elixir R again. Elixir R already lost it’s stun break, some % on the pulse tick, and received an added cast time (albeit a cooldown adjustment). Remember tossing Elixir R is just a chance to revive, and is still countered by launches/poisons. Getting the rezz off against decent players/teams can be a challenge.
I don’t know if this stems from my post in the thread about condi removal, but the biggest issue for me with Elixir C is the cooldown as it doesn’t break stuns like the similar guardian skill, transfer to the opponent, or anything of that nature. The 5 second convert sounds nice, but when most builds don’t even take elixirs at all anymore it may be best to start looking at why that is (traits, overall synergy with a build, cooldowns, etc.).
I just don’t think running an elixir build is really that great even with choosing all the traits; whether it’s cleansing formula 409 (not terrible), HGH (good stuff), or acidic elixirs (yeah, how about no & /laugh). The hardest part about choosing Elixir C is asking yourself, “how does this fit into my build?”, when you normally are taking at least 1 kit, and 1 stun break to start a build. And as I stated in the other thread, I can’t even justify running Elixir R into my builds without at least 3 traits in Tools for the cooldown reset at 25% hp.
It seems a lot of Engineers dropped Elixir R after the stun break removal last summer. Most builds are running Gnades/Bombs & Toolkit with either Elixir Gun, Slick Shoes, or Elixir S for a stun break with them all adding some team utility if used correctly under the right circumstances. Then I look at Elixir C – it cures all MY conditions every 40 seconds, and I can toss it (skill shot mind you) for removing 1 condition from my team every 30 seconds.
(edited by Kuju.2153)
It seems a lot of Engineers dropped Elixir R after the stun break removal last summer. Most builds are running Gnades/Bombs & Toolkit with either Elixir Gun, Slick Shoes, or Elixir S for a stun break with them all adding some team utility if used correctly under the right circumstances. Then I look at Elixir C – it cures all MY conditions every 40 seconds, and I can toss it (skill shot mind you) for removing 1 condition from my team every 30 seconds.
Seems like you’re afraid that Elixir R would fall even further into the unused pile if they made this change. Fact is, people only used Elixir R for the rez most of the time anyway. Only a few people, like you and me, use it for condi cleanse.
The cooldown of Elixir C is small compared to that of Contemplation of Purity (Guardian full condi clear skill). They need to wait 60s and we just need to wait 40s (with cooldown reduction, that’s only 32s). If they move the function of condi clear from Toss Elixir R to Toss Elixir C, it should also function in a similar way by creating a field that lasts x amount of seconds and cleanses/converts x amount of conditions per second.
Well, both are getting a slight buff according to the ready up, but we’ll see what goes live. Tossing Elixir C will now cure 2 conditions (3 if you take 409 trait). Using the base Elixir R utility skill cast time will be reduced by 1/4 second. When Elixir R lost it’s stun break it lost a lot of value in people’s eyes. Also, not using it for condi clear before or after the change is just silly if the situation calls for it.
If tossing a traited Elixir C will cure 3 conditions after this balancing patch maybe that will make it more valuable in somebody’s eyes. I still think it’s hard to justify any elixir outside of Elixir S in a lot of non-HGH builds, and I don’t know if nerfing Elixir R to buff Elixir C changes that. I almost want to say if they were to remove the condi clear off tossing Elixir R they would have to change it back to a stun break, but I’m not certain of that, and I don’t think Anet wants multiple stun breaks on one utility type after the changes last summer.
Either way it is something to think about even if I don’t agree as neither skill is core to almost any build. Even when I see HGH Engineers about I typically only see them taking Elixirs H, S, and B with the corresponding tosses to stack might, ignoring C, R, and X.
(edited by Kuju.2153)
Fact is, people only used Elixir R for the rez most of the time anyway. Only a few people, like you and me, use it for condi cleanse.
The condi cleanse IS used to rez. If you take away the condi cleanse, it will be worse as a reviving tool, when it’s used to revive. Keeping poison and damaging conditions that slow down the revive directly makes the revive faster and more effective.
You can’t say: ‘Do you want to rez, or do you want to cleanse?’
It’d be more like: ‘Do you want to reduce how well you can rez in order to get a separate, improved cleanse option?’
I’m all for making Elixir C competitive, but not at the expense of Elixir R, when you can really change Elixir C in any other way.
Fact is, people only used Elixir R for the rez most of the time anyway. Only a few people, like you and me, use it for condi cleanse.
The condi cleanse IS used to rez. If you take away the condi cleanse, it will be worse as a reviving tool, when it’s used to revive. Keeping poison and damaging conditions that slow down the revive directly makes the revive faster and more effective.
You can’t say: ‘Do you want to rez, or do you want to cleanse?’
It’d be more like: ‘Do you want to reduce how well you can rez in order to get a separate, improved cleanse option?’
I’m all for making Elixir C competitive, but not at the expense of Elixir R, when you can really change Elixir C in any other way.
I understand that. But it’s very easy for them to compensate the loss of condition cleanse on Elixir R by boosting the healing effectiveness.
But in what other way could they possibly make Elixir C more competitive?
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