Guess the pessimists were right about turrets being excluded from the health buff. ~_~
What? Turrets exist?
They got a 3% damage reduction boost from Metal Plating, though. And that’s borderline broken, who needs more health.
I know, right? It’s insane, now you can just sit your Turrets down and watch them solo champions.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again.
Can we finally and at long last get 85% to 90% immunity to AOE on all pets across the board now pleasE?! Because seriously just did the champion giant in nageling and they were all isntakilled even the 1 ranger that was there his pet kept dying so even if the extra hitpoints were there it wouldn’t make a bit of difference At All!
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again.
Can we finally and at long last get 85% to 90% immunity to AOE on all pets across the board now pleasE?! Because seriously just did the champion giant in nageling and they were all isntakilled even the 1 ranger that was there his pet kept dying so even if the extra hitpoints were there it wouldn’t make a bit of difference At All!
I have already said this before, and I’ll say it again. Giving AoE immunity is a bad idea because because this game isn’t wow, you have target limitation and anything giving almost immunity can break down the damage done by AoE if you focus turrets or minions on a single spot.
And for the ranger part, you were playing with a bad ranger, I could do Nageling Giant well before the health buff and I could just switch whenever I needed to my other pet when he was chaining his 3 shockwaves at it to make its attack completely miss. So the guy you played with was one of the 75% rangers who camp longbow with bears and never heard of F4.
Extra heath is always helpfull, even if it just prolongiates the inevitable and it would also make autotool instalation a bit more effective too, maybe usefull enough to make your turret survive a couple of extra hits.
When we speak of AoE immunity, I assume we are speaking in terms of PvE only right?
Well that confirms it, turets are not minions…
I just tried the Rocket Turret underwater and I’m wondering something… How the hell do you target ennemies with Rocket (toolbelt) when you are underwater?!? O.o
Good question. If you can get them to answer that one, maybe it’ll also get Deployable Turrets working underwater.
Well they could always make it work like our elixirs, you throw it and use it again to deploy the turrets or explode the torpedo.
I know, right? But that would require…doing something.
Iv not played in over a month, Iv been waiting on this patch with the rumored turret buffs to bring me back in. I should have known better.
How could they have left out turrets from the pet health increase is beyond me. Maybe it was just some oversight because they use different code and they’ll fix it. Hopefully.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again.
Can we finally and at long last get 85% to 90% immunity to AOE on all pets across the board now pleasE?! Because seriously just did the champion giant in nageling and they were all isntakilled even the 1 ranger that was there his pet kept dying so even if the extra hitpoints were there it wouldn’t make a bit of difference At All!
I have already said this before, and I’ll say it again. Giving AoE immunity is a bad idea because because this game isn’t wow, you have target limitation and anything giving almost immunity can break down the damage done by AoE if you focus turrets or minions on a single spot.
And for the ranger part, you were playing with a bad ranger, I could do Nageling Giant well before the health buff and I could just switch whenever I needed to my other pet when he was chaining his 3 shockwaves at it to make its attack completely miss. So the guy you played with was one of the 75% rangers who camp longbow with bears and never heard of F4.
Extra heath is always helpfull, even if it just prolongiates the inevitable and it would also make autotool instalation a bit more effective too, maybe usefull enough to make your turret survive a couple of extra hits.
And I’ll say this again, it’s not WoW however combat is combat the same numbers that affect WoW combat also are calculated in this game, if you can’t understand math then don’t make the argument about something you don’t understand.
Every game has had to wrestle with this and they all have the same concepts it doesn’t make any difference if you personally can’t see that.
HoTs, DoTs, Resists, Buffs, Debuffs all exist in this game like they do in any other mmo out there action oriented or not, and ignoring one of the most well tested and easiest fixes to the pet problem because of a sense of superstition about a game is just ignorance.
The games pets need resistance to AOEs, I’d argue that they also need the ability to NOT be allowed to be tab targeted as well because that would make combat so much more smooth as even in PVP and sPVP players aren’t trying to kill pets initially.
(edited by tigirius.9014)
Most abilities in GW2 count as AoE. So having my damage against pets/minions/turrets nerfed by 90% with no real single-target ability, to deal with them.
No thanks, no way to ever kill a pet/minion/turret/spirit unless you happen to be using the correct profession with the correct weapon. Then they still melt. And Engineer is certainly not one of those correct professions, all of our weapons are overwhelmingly aoe focussed.
Dont think anyone here is truely surprised they somehow forgot about turrets.
I have already said this before, and I’ll say it again. Giving AoE immunity is a bad idea because because this game isn’t wow, you have target limitation and anything giving almost immunity can break down the damage done by AoE if you focus turrets or minions on a single spot.
I very much agree. AE immunity was a bad idea in WoW too, but they forced themselves into a corner there. GW2 doesn’t have raids and it’s AEs work entirely different. Every pet hit is a player not hit, so the pets are very much doing the right thing.
And I’ll say this again, it’s not WoW however combat is combat the same numbers that affect WoW combat also are calculated in this game, if you can’t understand math then don’t make the argument about something you don’t understand.
Every game has had to wrestle with this and they all have the same concepts it doesn’t make any difference if you personally can’t see that.
HoTs, DoTs, Resists, Buffs, Debuffs all exist in this game like they do in any other mmo out there action oriented or not, and ignoring one of the most well tested and easiest fixes to the pet problem because of a sense of superstition about a game is just ignorance.
The games pets need resistance to AOEs, I’d argue that they also need the ability to NOT be allowed to be tab targeted as well because that would make combat so much more smooth as even in PVP and sPVP players aren’t trying to kill pets initially.
Don’t call me ignorant when you can’t make the smallest difference between the combat (<- it isn’t the same!) between those two games. I had experience with a game called Champions Online wich had the exactly same target limitation on every AoE skills like in GW2. They later added AoE resistance to pet because they were dieing instantly when facing Legendary or Cosmic ennemies and it totaly broke the game because pets were soaking 75% of the damage and players were left uninjured (this in PvE and PvP!). They had to reduce it to actualy make sure pets wouldn’t survive the blows, making that feature pointless and a total fail.
Champions Online share more similiraties with Guild Wars 2 in its combat system compared to WoW. The idea of adding AoE immunity might have work in some games, but it isn’t always the best solution and certainly not one suited for GW2. But I do agree with your statement, it is the easiest one to implement (when you don’t care about balance)!
Lets take your exemple in a context, lets say pets do have 90% AoE and you fight the Nageling Giant (sinds you took this champion as an exemple). If you have 2 necros using a full minion build you can basicaly reduce every stomp (wich takes away between 50%-100% health depending on your health and toughness) and reduce those damage up to 12 targets in the Area only to 5%-10%, wich means 12 players won’t have to use their dodge because there is a high chance pets will soak the damage instead!
If you can’t see the issue right there you are blind and there is no point to argue with you anymore.
If they would just do a solid decrease in cool downs on turrets so that we can drop them repeatedly, then it wouldn’t be bad that they are paper. The way I see it, at some point Anet is going to have to do one of the two, either beef them up to survive, or lower the cool down so that it doesn’t waste a utility skill if the get destroyed.
The worry is quite justified. If I knew I could have pets soak AEs, I sure as hell would want every Mesmer, every Necromancer, every Engineer and every Ranger to run max-Clones/-Pets/-Spirits setups. So many targets which are invulnerable.
It’s make AEs completely trivial. Compared to a team without pets, PvE balance would completely fall apart around AEs because a party set up around extra targets could just forget about them.
There’s an alternative route in that pets could be least-priority targets. AEs only hit them when there’s no players left to hit. As a Mesmer I’d very much not like this, plus it actually removes a rather interesting use in PvE (the AE soaking).
Blame the people on this forum who keep insisting that our class is fine.
By the way, there are people in the Guardian forum complaining. You can’t get more ridiculous than complaining when you’re the most powerful class in the game.
From an objective point of view, since I main Guardian and Engi, my Engineer is completely outshining my Guard in sPvP and WvW (no contest), and feels more useful than my Guardian even in PvE.
If you’re seriously having problems killing a Guardian, you need to learn how to play.
P.S. Warriors are the most overpowered class in the game (maybe tied with Necro)
Blame the people on this forum who keep insisting that our class is fine.
By the way, there are people in the Guardian forum complaining. You can’t get more ridiculous than complaining when you’re the most powerful class in the game.
You are sort-of proving the point why player input on class balance is entirely useless as a developer. Everyone thinks their class is off the worst and the other one over there is overpowered.
Do you really think the Guardian players don’t think they got serious issues? And hey in fact, Guardians have a lot of troubles. Not everything is based of who kills whom how often, if I give a class a 1-shot ability with 40000 range and in turn make the screen flash brightest colours at 40Hz constantly while playing it, that’s not a well-designed class, despite being massively overpowered.
Likewise, if Engineers were that bad off, you wouldn’t be here and have no one to complain to about it.
Most abilities in GW2 count as AoE. So having my damage against pets/minions/turrets nerfed by 90% with no real single-target ability, to deal with them.
No thanks, no way to ever kill a pet/minion/turret/spirit unless you happen to be using the correct profession with the correct weapon. Then they still melt. And Engineer is certainly not one of those correct professions, all of our weapons are overwhelmingly aoe focussed.Dont think anyone here is truely surprised they somehow forgot about turrets.
I don’t think anyone is asking for AoE reduction from normal cleave, hit 5 targets type abilities. It’s the huge red circles and poison circles and fire and massive unavoidable 1 hit ko boss attacks that are the problem. Regular player aoe of course wouldn’t count, but ranger and mesmer literally HAVE to have pets out whether they like it or not and necromancer and engineer have them as a main, heavily promoted and iconic build that caused most people to even want to play the class in the first place. And for anet to leave them totally screwed when facing attacks that must be dodged or evaded with nothing they can do about it no matter how skilled they are in a game based around the dodging and evasion of big attacks and aoe circles is just ridiculous.
The problem is that turrets have a hit box of a DRAGON. Warrior with a greatsword hits turret that is BEHIND that warrior’s back.
Sometimes YOU are shot and turret that is just near you (not between you and attacker) takes damage instead of you.
Uh, people, they could prioritize AoEs to hit players before pets/minions/whatever eventually, you know?
The whole “give them AoE resistance and the game goes bonkers” is a non-issue.
The problem is that turrets have a hit box of a DRAGON. Warrior with a greatsword hits turret that is BEHIND that warrior’s back.
Sometimes YOU are shot and turret that is just near you (not between you and attacker) takes damage instead of you.
Have ANet even acknowledged this issue?
If they can make aoe’s check to see if a target evades/blocks in order to skip them, then I’m sure they would have little trouble making aoe’s do full dmg on pets/turrets if they’re the only target being hit with said AoE.
It’s mainly a PvE change anyway.
Josh Davis acknowledged the list of Turret Bugs at one point, but he didn’t say which were being added to the trackers, etcetera.
I’d say which bugs were on the list when it was acknowledged, but they deleted my list from these boards, which makes reference a bit of a kitten unless I want to decode the cryptic kittening shorthand I had to write the bug reports in and they’ll hopefully be un-deleting the thread anyway.
The Hitbox bug was most assuredly part of the section that was acknowledged, though, being one of the earliest bugs recorded.
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The person that wanted this change is making no destinction between big pve aoes or spvp. Infact he seems very intent on including pvp in this aoe resistance scheme aswell.
But even in pve this would lead to problems of stacking pets to soak aoe damage. I know what the person who said this is saying, and its not what you think he said.
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The person that wanted this change is making no destinction between big pve aoes or spvp. Infact he seems very intent on including pvp in this aoe resistance scheme aswell.
But even in pve this would lead to problems of stacking pets to soak aoe damage. I know what the person who said this is saying, and its not what you think he said.
Don’t AoE’s in PvP have unlimited target capacity? Not player AoE’s obviously, but enemy ones?
So I’m not sure what good stacking a bunch of pets in an AoE would do because every single one of them (and every single player) would still take damage.
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