Guild Wars 2

I love playing my turret engi! My Tpvp team loves me as well for the fact that I really play a turret engineer very well. It’s partly due to the fact that I don’t afk at a point just to bunker it. I’m a mobile turret engineer. Yes that means I pick up my turrets and go where I’m needed, until I need to move again. I’m great support as well. I jus don’t understand this hate towards turret engineers.

I guess many do not like those who afk on a point. That I understand because so much more can be done if you are a mobile turret engineer. Anyway, what do all my fellow engineers think?

Purecura.1795:

I love playing my turret engi! My Tpvp team loves me as well for the fact that I really play a turret engineer very well. It’s partly due to the fact that I don’t afk at a point just to bunker it. I’m a mobile turret engineer. Yes that means I pick up my turrets and go where I’m needed, until I need to move again. I’m great support as well. I jus don’t understand this hate towards turret engineers.

I guess many do not like those who afk on a point. That I understand because so much more can be done if you are a mobile turret engineer. Anyway, what do all my fellow engineers think?

Sure.

You can be mobile all you would like, but only actually be able to be of any use anywhere else once every 40-50s until Thumper/Rocket Turret come back up.

Meanwhile many builds have no such limitations!

Conquest, plain and sample is their only and designed purpose. Most of the counters are not conquest meta and no one wants to adapt anymore.

There was only one guy here that really hated turret engis, and luckly his flamboyant behavior drove him away eventually.

Anyways, it’s not that most people hate them (except those who whisper you and whine), it’s that these builds are nowhere near meta for the engi, and therefore you will never compete on a proficient level in pvp.
the cooldowns are too long, the pressure is too low, which means that you maybe can hold a point fairly long (if you don’t get overloaded by condis), but to effectively defend it, you’ll always need the support from a second team-mate, and you can’t deal with more than 1 attacker without getting cc-locked and killed.

turrets are awesome, and in the right build, provide awesome utility.
net-turret f.e. works wonders together with nades to increase you chance to land your burst.
flame-turret is awesome denial due to its smokefield, and provide nice loads of burn, and in some FT-builds it even finds use as HGH-replacing might-beacon.
and rifle-turret is awesome utility in a exploding turrets / static discharge build, due to its low cd on both the utility and belt-ability.

but running full turrets limits your options in terms of sigils (no doom / battle / energy / hydromancy / geomancy for you), costs you loads of weapon-skills (no room for kits) and therefore limits you to spaming your AA and occasionally one of your other main-weapon abilities. Therefore you don’t have pressure, no survivability, and can’t do anything but hide behind tanky stats and hope that your team-mates will always jump after you in time.

Don’t get me wrong, delaying a point cap is viable, but in the end of the day, your team only has 4 effective members and one point with a healthbar.

As I said, turrets have their use, and can be devastating to your opponent if used in the right build, but a all-turreteer is nowhere near to be even remotely effective.

Still it’s up to you and your team to decide how you enjoy pvp, just don’t expect to be taken as serious pvp players then.

Arantheal.7396:

There was only one guy here that really hated turret engis, and luckly his flamboyant behavior drove him away eventually.

Anyways, it’s not that most people hate them (except those who whisper you and whine), it’s that these builds are nowhere near meta for the engi, and therefore you will never compete on a proficient level in pvp.
the cooldowns are too long, the pressure is too low, which means that you maybe can hold a point fairly long (if you don’t get overloaded by condis), but to effectively defend it, you’ll always need the support from a second team-mate, and you can’t deal with more than 1 attacker without getting cc-locked and killed.

turrets are awesome, and in the right build, provide awesome utility.
net-turret f.e. works wonders together with nades to increase you chance to land your burst.
flame-turret is awesome denial due to its smokefield, and provide nice loads of burn, and in some FT-builds it even finds use as HGH-replacing might-beacon.
and rifle-turret is awesome utility in a exploding turrets / static discharge build, due to its low cd on both the utility and belt-ability.

but running full turrets limits your options in terms of sigils (no doom / battle / energy / hydromancy / geomancy for you), costs you loads of weapon-skills (no room for kits) and therefore limits you to spaming your AA and occasionally one of your other main-weapon abilities. Therefore you don’t have pressure, no survivability, and can’t do anything but hide behind tanky stats and hope that your team-mates will always jump after you in time.

Don’t get me wrong, delaying a point cap is viable, but in the end of the day, your team only has 4 effective members and one point with a healthbar.

As I said, turrets have their use, and can be devastating to your opponent if used in the right build, but a all-turreteer is nowhere near to be even remotely effective.

Still it’s up to you and your team to decide how you enjoy pvp, just don’t expect to be taken as serious pvp players then.

Shrug. I’m steadily climbing into the top 100 with my full turret build (rocket, rifle, thumper).

Dis Wiz Raps.7240:

Arantheal.7396:

There was only one guy here that really hated turret engis, and luckly his flamboyant behavior drove him away eventually.

Anyways, it’s not that most people hate them (except those who whisper you and whine), it’s that these builds are nowhere near meta for the engi, and therefore you will never compete on a proficient level in pvp.
the cooldowns are too long, the pressure is too low, which means that you maybe can hold a point fairly long (if you don’t get overloaded by condis), but to effectively defend it, you’ll always need the support from a second team-mate, and you can’t deal with more than 1 attacker without getting cc-locked and killed.

turrets are awesome, and in the right build, provide awesome utility.
net-turret f.e. works wonders together with nades to increase you chance to land your burst.
flame-turret is awesome denial due to its smokefield, and provide nice loads of burn, and in some FT-builds it even finds use as HGH-replacing might-beacon.
and rifle-turret is awesome utility in a exploding turrets / static discharge build, due to its low cd on both the utility and belt-ability.

but running full turrets limits your options in terms of sigils (no doom / battle / energy / hydromancy / geomancy for you), costs you loads of weapon-skills (no room for kits) and therefore limits you to spaming your AA and occasionally one of your other main-weapon abilities. Therefore you don’t have pressure, no survivability, and can’t do anything but hide behind tanky stats and hope that your team-mates will always jump after you in time.

Don’t get me wrong, delaying a point cap is viable, but in the end of the day, your team only has 4 effective members and one point with a healthbar.

As I said, turrets have their use, and can be devastating to your opponent if used in the right build, but a all-turreteer is nowhere near to be even remotely effective.

Still it’s up to you and your team to decide how you enjoy pvp, just don’t expect to be taken as serious pvp players then.

Shrug. I’m steadily climbing into the top 100 with my full turret build (rocket, rifle, thumper).

It’s no where near effective in a battle between coordinated teams. Im sure you can A.I your way to top 100 in soloq because there are handfuls of people readily willing to throw the game by dying on point to immobile A.I.

People dont hate turret engineer because its weak. People hate turret engineer because they think that its overpowered.

there is a particular problem here:
The most people act like NPCs… and that includes PvP and PvE. If there is something out of the meta, or they have to move unexpectly (to take cover for example) many people seems to reach their brain processing powers.

Example: Ascalon Catacombs p2 ghost waves.
If there is a high number of ranged NPC, the people decide to run directly at them to kill them one by one (sometimes results in group dead). With brain powers you could just take two steps and go out of sight —> so ALL the ranged npc would run to you instead.

And this is the same thing in PvP. Most players adapt their pve build with small changes to pvp. And if they meet a player that is acually armored for PvP they get obliberated.
(example: Turret bunker engineer vs full zerg thief. = dead thief in ~5 sec.)

But if you meet a full “true” PvP player, it will become a hard and long fight.

Thats includes all MMORpg with PvP system. You could have the most Balanced PvP… but as long you are not able to selfreflect and analyse the situation (thinking why you are loosing) you will end up week and everyone is overpowered exept yourself.

THIS is why people hating.
I know this form every MMO with PvP system. Everyone was hating, exept the players that have actually PvP gear, Taids, Tactics.

Few reasons from a regular turret engi hater.

1- turret is the easiest build in the game and can carry extremely bad players.
2. turret engi players are usually not smart and they will afk and make it 4v5
3. they ruin the experience of other people because its an AI build that is frustrating to fight against

4. They make uneven teams in solo Q. Let’s say we have 1 bad player , exemple a mesmer that is always dead and the opposite team has also a bad player but a turret engi so he can still be useful even if he has the same skill level of the garbage mesmer on our team. Basically bad players should not be hard to kill just because of their build.

That’s pretty much it.

glock.6590:

Few reasons from a regular turret engi hater.

1- turret is the easiest build in the game and can carry extremely bad players.
2. turret engi players are usually not smart and they will afk and make it 4v5
3. they ruin the experience of other people because its an AI build that is frustrating to fight against

4. They make uneven teams in solo Q. Let’s say we have 1 bad player , exemple a mesmer that is always dead and the opposite team has also a bad player but a turret engi so he can still be useful even if he has the same skill level of the garbage mesmer on our team. Basically bad players should not be hard to kill just because of their build.

That’s pretty much it.

Just wanted to say, while the first 3 points do make sense (not that I agree with them) the 4th is the one that I must comment on.

You imply that turret engis are difficult to beat, even if they are a bad player, which would also strongly imply that they are overpowered. Well, my necro, ranger, ele, and warrior say hi. I’ve said before I would consider myself a below average player. However, I can still beat turret engis 1v1 with little difficulty. My warrior does have a bit of a problem from time to time, but I have done it several times. They are not difficult to kill. Rangers, if they are smart, can drop them down from a distance away from their turrets, a necro just stacks condis and watch them bleed, staff ele with AoE? no contest. The problem isn’t that its a simple AI build that makes it easy for a bad player to win, it’s just that other prosfessions need to take a different approach to fighting them. If you try to go heads up against a turret engi inside his turret zone, you are asking to be rekt. If you can draw the engi out of his safe zone…they drop like a zerker ele going afk.

My point is still valid. I need to play well as a glass thief to kill a turret engi. What if the turret engi was a mediocre mesmer or thief instead? I would only need few seconds to drop him instead of few mins.

glock.6590:

My point is still valid. I need to play well as a glass thief to kill a turret engi. What if the turret engi was a mediocre mesmer or thief instead? I would only need few seconds to drop him instead of few mins.

Your point is valid that a noob Engineer on a proper starter build, naturally countering Thieves, is better than a noob Mesmer on a high skill input shatter build, naturally countered by thieves. In other news, water is wet.

You hate turrets for that reason, but do you think that turrets should be nerfed due to that same logic?

They’re called starter builds because they give players the ability to fight back against more mechanically skilled opponents. This is an intended design in every decent game. You know, noob friendly strategies that a monkey can use in order to turn the tables on other bad, or average players who make bad decisions, and can’t exploit the limitations of such starter builds.

The reason how players actually find the desire to get better and try builds often stems from that taste of victory, or those ‘aha’ moments when you come across effective builds in the skill tier you are at.

Turret builds aren’t unanimously bad for the game. They do good, in that it forces people to learn how to exploit their limitations, and punishes them for impaling themselves on immobile A.I on a point they don’t own. Turret Engies are hard countered by the slightest tactical plays. Once the community has collectively learned how to rotate and matchups to avoid, instead of fighting 5+ minute 1v1s on an enemy capped points, Turret builds will have no legs left to stand on.

Chaith.8256:

glock.6590:

My point is still valid. I need to play well as a glass thief to kill a turret engi. What if the turret engi was a mediocre mesmer or thief instead? I would only need few seconds to drop him instead of few mins.

Your point is valid that a noob Engineer on a proper starter build, naturally countering Thieves, is better than a noob Mesmer on a high skill input shatter build, naturally countered by thieves. In other news, water is wet.

You hate turrets for that reason, but do you think that turrets should be nerfed due to that same logic?

They’re called starter builds because they give players the ability to fight back against more mechanically skilled opponents. This is an intended design in every decent game. You know, noob friendly strategies that a monkey can use in order to turn the tables on other bad, or average players who make bad decisions, and can’t exploit the limitations of such starter builds.

Not many limitations to exploit against turret engi. Their weakness is condi and I don’t have condi damage. The only way a thief can kill a turret engi is by LoSing with shortbow. But if the engi is not totally brain dead, he will put rocket/riffle turret off point which won’t allow me to LoS.

In that case I’m just forced to give away the cap for free just because of his build and not skill.

glock.6590:

Chaith.8256:

glock.6590:

My point is still valid. I need to play well as a glass thief to kill a turret engi. What if the turret engi was a mediocre mesmer or thief instead? I would only need few seconds to drop him instead of few mins.

Your point is valid that a noob Engineer on a proper starter build, naturally countering Thieves, is better than a noob Mesmer on a high skill input shatter build, naturally countered by thieves. In other news, water is wet.

You hate turrets for that reason, but do you think that turrets should be nerfed due to that same logic?

They’re called starter builds because they give players the ability to fight back against more mechanically skilled opponents. This is an intended design in every decent game. You know, noob friendly strategies that a monkey can use in order to turn the tables on other bad, or average players who make bad decisions, and can’t exploit the limitations of such starter builds.

Not many limitations to exploit against turret engi. Their weakness is condi and I don’t have condi damage. The only way a thief can kill a turret engi is by LoSing with shortbow. But if the engi is not totally brain dead, he will put rocket/riffle turret off point which won’t allow me to LoS.

In that case I’m just forced to give away the cap for free just because of his build and not skill.

Perhaps you haven’t considered the possibility that instead of fighting an uphill battle, you could use your no-condies, high mobility burst build to create an outnumbered scenario on one or both other points?

You are not the guy who 1v1s the turret Engineer on an enemy capped or neutral node. Giving a cap up for free doesn’t even mean close to giving up the match.

Learn your place!

Edit: The limitation you are missing here is that once you say goodbye to the Turret Engi you let get all excited to cap that point……….. he is useless for a minimum of 60 seconds and I’ve witnessed Turret Engineers be useless for 3-5 minutes until their dang turrets despawn.

So many people in this game are unaware that fighting on a point you do not own is not a good idea unless you are going to win

So many people in this game are unaware that LOS and constant movement renders turrets useless – the turret must first turn to face you and then it fires – gives you a window to dodge the net turret which is what kills most people

I think the actual turrets have a bit too much health but otherwise not much of an issue IMO once you learn how to outsmart the AI

These people having issues with turret engi ai must get destroyed in dungeons. >. <

After reading all the replies ( btw thanks everyone for replying) I am force to say that it breaks my heart that turret engis aren’t looked at in a positive light. Now my opinion stands at, I still don’t mind playing a turret engineer here and there at times for fun. But now I do see why people dont like them.

In WvW I play and Condi build running the 6/2/0/4/2 trait set up I got from wolfineer. I’m currently buying the gear I need to be effective and I will say this, learning to play the Engineer in the manner of kits, provides more challenges, but I believe higher rewards for the engi, versus the turret engineer. After maining a mesmer for 2 years, and now maining a engi, I have that intermediate combat experience. But engineer is a whole world of its own.

I won’t stop playing a turret engi here and there but I do see myself transitioning to other builds for the level of uniqueness and ddifficulty they offer. Specifically Condi builds.

glock.6590:

Their weakness is condi and I don’t have condi damage.

Melandru Rune/Soldier’s Amulet, chance for incoming condi to be converted into boons and healing turret say no, no thanks, keep your condi.

I am not really getting into this discussion or debate but I am pointing out something you stated as being woefully incorrect.

GOSU.9574:

glock.6590:

Their weakness is condi and I don’t have condi damage.

Melandru Rune/Soldier’s Amulet, chance for incoming condi to be converted into boons and healing turret say no, no thanks, keep your condi.

I am not really getting into this discussion or debate but I am pointing out something you stated as being woefully incorrect.

????

You think 2 condition removal per 15/20 seconds and transmute makes you resilient to condition attacks? If someone is solo queuing, and sick of Engineers, rolling in on a condi focused, but survivable War/Necro/Guardian/Ranger/Ele/Mesmer/Thief.. it’s way more than likely to go even, force the Engi off the point, or beat the Engineer with only healing turret, transmute, and hoelbrak/melandru. Assuming equal skill.

Seriously! Engineers are terrible against condition focused builds. I’m not saying that anything other than Engi/Necro/Ranger and maybe War/Ele are viable as condi in high level tPvP, but any condi build has a fair shot at beating an Engineer 1v1.

Chaith.8256:

GOSU.9574:

glock.6590:

Their weakness is condi and I don’t have condi damage.

Melandru Rune/Soldier’s Amulet, chance for incoming condi to be converted into boons and healing turret say no, no thanks, keep your condi.

I am not really getting into this discussion or debate but I am pointing out something you stated as being woefully incorrect.

????

You think 2 condition removal per 15/20 seconds and transmute makes you resilient to condition attacks? If someone is solo queuing, and sick of Engineers, rolling in on a condi focused, but survivable War/Necro/Guardian/Ranger/Ele/Mesmer/Thief.. it’s way more than likely to go even, force the Engi off the point, or beat the Engineer with only healing turret, transmute, and hoelbrak/melandru. Assuming equal skill.

Seriously! Engineers are terrible against condition focused builds. I’m not saying that anything other than Engi/Necro/Ranger and maybe War/Ele are viable as condi in high level tPvP, but any condi build has a fair shot at beating an Engineer 1v1.

Yes, what I mentioned does matter. Does it make them completely immune? Nope. Take what I mentioned, stand in your turrets and get back to me.

Seriously though all the !!!! and ???? makes me wonder if there is some form of over reaction issues going on. Approach the topic with calm.

glock.6590:

My point is still valid. I need to play well as a glass thief to kill a turret engi. What if the turret engi was a mediocre mesmer or thief instead? I would only need few seconds to drop him instead of few mins.

This is where people seem to be confused. Your point is not valid. Because you do not have a point. You have an opinion. Your opinion may be valid, but claiming it is a fact, and further, a fact that makes a point, is to put it politely, you appear to have difficulty distinguishing objective and subjective.

I don’t think most Engineer’s hate them, but we tolerate them just because we know how to counter them. Other classes hate them a lot more than us for sure. I personally dislike turrets for the same reason that I dislike ranger pets and warrior signet and necro minions, it’s passive and doesn’t require much work from the player.

Even if you’re playing incredibly smart with turrets and placing them strategically and timing all your overcharges, most of the work is being relegated to an AI.

Do I want people to stop using turrets? Heck no, play however you want. If nothing else it’s a breath of fresh fighting something that’s isn’t a cut and paste meta build that you’ll see on 9/10 engineers. If I don’t like it then I don’t have to play it, simple as that.

It also depends and your definition of a turret engineer. IMO, if a player is running at least one kit then they’re not really forsaking our class.

GOSU.9574:

Yes, what I mentioned does matter.

Did I say it didn’t? I’m saying you’re wrong for saying someone’s ‘woefully incorrect’ for citing condition builds as a counter to Engineers.

GOSU.9574:

Does it make them completely immune? Nope. Take what I mentioned, stand in your turrets and get back to me.

Just remind you, you were the one who answered that thief from the Turret Engi’s perspective, claiming you use soldiers and Melandru Runes, and that means you ain’t skurred of no condition builds. So.. why don’t you go back to standing in your turrets? Lol.

You are more ‘woefully incorrect’ than he is was, so don’t take offense if I ‘take what you mentioned’ with a grain of salt.

Hello frands! Vee Wee here, retired #1 Engi NA and world first rank 80!

This is thilly! Vee Wee has always said turret Engis are useless against anyone competent and Vee Wee gets flamed for it! Chaith says the same thing but it’s ok! Just another one of those cases of hate the player ignore the argument! Or maybe it’s because Chaith is so goshdarn beautiful!

Anyway turrets are bad! Vee Wee wants Vee Wee’s fellow Engineers to play good builds! But in the end you can play whatever you want! Get good sons!

Wahoo! Bye frands!

Chaith words it in an explanation, you through it out there in the form of an insulting accusation. that is the difference in how it is received.

Turrets will never put out the dmg pressure, and also lack the survivability to negate pvp builds that are meant to sit on point and do AoE dmg, while being able to take a hit i.e. most bunker builds. 2 points in explosives for forceful explosives and 6 in inventions for elixir infused bombs will give you a build with 6 extra points that can dominate turret engis. Ill round down on all these since I don’t know the actual math off hand. With 8 trait points and celestial neck you can average almost 550 healing a sec and again that’s ignoring BP regen. and assuming you sit on a cap point spamming bomb 1 and maximizing your regen uptime i.e. HT toolbelt and EG TB Bunker turrets are basically handicapping themselves by 6 trait points. 3 turrets don’t do the DPS/HPS a sec of auto bomb, ergo your better off putting 2 in explosives taking the radius expand, putting 6 in inventions elixir infused bombs, and equipping only bomb kit, and then just standing on point spamming HT and bomb1. And you have 6 trait points to move around.

coglin.1867:

Chaith words it in an explanation, you through it out there in the form of an insulting accusation. that is the difference in how it is received.

just ignore the troll.
it will go away eventually.

I hate it for many reasons, its to powerful for being so passive, doesn’t require most no skill, you just sit place turrets and use rifle 1-5. It needs a nerf in pvp, decrease the time turrets last for from 5 minutes to 60-90 seconds, this will give people a real choice on if they’ll place turrets and just afk or play more actively atleast. Increase the skill needed for the build would be better, its just to easy and effective atm…

EDIT: Maybe I am making it seem abit to strong, it doesn’t have mobility, not alot of condi removal, still CC destroys engi, and AoE works really well vs it, but I dislike how passive it is.

In my humble opinion there is another aspect to consider. When i play celestial rifle eng or condi rabid eng ( i prefer pistol pistol but it is the same for pistol shield ) i enjoy myself …. instead when i play turrets …. even if i win … i am boared after a while … so i prefer to play condi specs … much more interactive and various I play for fun first…

turret engi currently highest skill floor build
..well maybe except for pew pew rangers

but its a low skill ceiling, and so gets trashed in high level play where people arent floored by thumper turret (dis pun omg)

Arantheal.7396:

coglin.1867:

Chaith words it in an explanation, you through it out there in the form of an insulting accusation. that is the difference in how it is received.

just ignore the troll.
it will go away eventually.

No she won’t. lol. Vee Wee can’t stay away for too long at a time. ;P

The hate mostly spawns from supplycrate, someone spends most of their skills trying to aoe down the engi and the turrets only to have them return immediately and flipping the table on a one on one match, which is why people who can’t fight knowing this just move on to another point to cap instead of fighting the engi or bring others to zerg him.

The turrets are not difficult to destroy if you’re not running complete condi or bunker. You have three options.

• Leave the Engi and outnumber the rest of his team.
• Stay off-point and kill the Engi from range.
• Destroy the turrets then burn the Engi.

Supply crate has a nicely animated cast. If you insist in fighting the Engi on point, take out his turrets. More specifically the rocket turret and flame turret. Or if you are running a condi build, just burst him with condi damage.

I don’t really see a issue in general with certain classes that have abilities or spells that will render the player passive. Like Summoners from other MMOs for example. Your summons are your main dmg source.

Hmmm…. I don’t think my logic will apply here but I hope someone sees what I’m trying to convey

1) Turret engi in your team afks a node whole match. Gets outrotated, 4vs5 etc.
2)Turret engi in enemy team. Your team is dumb and dies 2vs1 against turret repeatedly. Reasons include “but close/mid is important to cap!”, “it is too op i can’t fight it!” etc. (i.e. your team is horrible and despite your team chat spam with “just ignore it can’t move” is ineffective!)
3)They supply crate if you engage 1vs1. Not a real reason but it’s like super lame, right? I got supply crated by 2 turret engis at the same time. I was alone. They have no shame!