Would permanent Gyros be op?

Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Xyonon.3987

Xyonon.3987

Wahoo everyone!

Before you just say “OFC IT WOULD!”, think about it. Would it really be op in any game mode, to have a permanent Purgy, Shreddy, Bulwarky, Medy or Sneaky? All of them?


In WvW and PvP they still can easily be killed with a few hits. I do not play those game modes much, but form what I’ve heared Gyros there are accidentally killed by cleave anyway and considered rather bad. With this change the enemy may need to aim for them more specifically to weaken you.

For PvE I’d say it’s the best way to give Medy a chance against the HT, while Purgy acts more like a condi cleanse signet and Shreddy may become the go to for condi builds. Bulwarky would die on it’s own after it has absorbed too much damage, so no issue there either.


I would say Sneaky may be op in PvE due to the “let’s skip EVERYTHING” aspect of the skill. But the rest? It sure would help them become viable after the plenty of hits they took in the last few patches.

Opinions?

Greez!
- Ziggy

Ziggs Ironeye – Engineer | Madame Le Blanc – Mesmer | Mentor (PvE) | EU
“Mentoring engineers / mesmers and showing you what you can do with your fantastic class!
Just pm me for my advice! Always eager to help!”

Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Cecilia.5179

Cecilia.5179

The only one that really benefits from being permanent is the sneak gyro, which would be stupid in WvW, because you could hide 5 people under 1 indefinitely.

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Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Ivantreil.3092

Ivantreil.3092

The only one that really benefits from being permanent is the sneak gyro, which would be stupid in WvW, because you could hide 5 people under 1 indefinitely.

Purge gyro can benefit from this too, tag gyro and bulwark gyro would need a cooldown skill that triggers what they do already in order to workout, but its possible, the only one i see that would still be meh, would be shreder gyro

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Posted by: Dawdler.8521

Dawdler.8521

Just keep the passive effect simple and the explosion meaningfull and a constant presence would work fine. For example, I’d change the medic gyro to pulse regeneration (ie it can be boonstripped etc). This would be no difference from a rev having constant regen so it cant be OP (and unlike the rev, the gyro can intentionally be targetted). Sneak gyro would be the trickiest thing but one could change it to not be constant stealth, but rather quickly hide and stealth attack on longer intervals (like, every 15s it stealth you for 3s or something)

For the explosion to be meaningfull I would do something totally off the wall, like give it a daze. Yes I know, you can pick up your jaw now!!!

(edited by Dawdler.8521)

Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365

As a GvGer, other than sneak gyro the only thing that’s valuable with the other gyros is the lightning field when they die and stability.
Besides that, it would be a rather boring and static playstyle to have permanent gyros. Also as they are now they die too fast anyways.

Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Ranael.6423

Ranael.6423

Hmm let’s see.
First I think it would not be a problem to have sneak gyro with a timer, like elite turret have. So no harm for this one.
Then for the on the ones, becoming permanent would be balanced by the loss of all “on activation” effects (stab on activation, regen on heal skill…), meaning no urgent heal for medic or the initial purge from purge.
As you said, the redirection of damages on bulwark wil in any case make it short living.
Blast is in any case not concerned.
Now, for shredder, I am not sure if this is the case for condi damage but gyro have their own stats and I am not sure they have condi damage nor condi duration. This means that in fire field it would add 2 stack of base burning (131 damage….so 262 DPS for fire field :/). On top of this, having a permanent whirl finisher in a battle field means it’s gonna be really hard for your party to control their combo effect or you could become crazy when your Ele do not place his lava font on top of the gyro…. and for moving target you will have to destroy it quite soon anyway.

So my conclusion is that this suggestion would not be necessarily OP in many aspects of the game (granted sneaky has a timer) but I do not think this would add so much to the specialization.

Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Xyonon.3987

Xyonon.3987

Ah yea true – Gyros don’t even inherit condi damage like Turrets. Well never mind then, Shreddy wouldn’t even be viable if it would be permanent … holy that’s a sad statement x.x ANet just let those Gyros inherit stats already

About that initial effect Gyros have – how about to just switch them to the self destruct instead?

My goal with the change is to make the Gyros more unique and useful than what they currently are. Some traits that then seem unfitting, like “stability on cast of a Gyro” could be adapted easily to things like “stability on gyro toolbelts” or “stability every X sec per gyro alive”, etc.

Ziggs Ironeye – Engineer | Madame Le Blanc – Mesmer | Mentor (PvE) | EU
“Mentoring engineers / mesmers and showing you what you can do with your fantastic class!
Just pm me for my advice! Always eager to help!”

(edited by Xyonon.3987)

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Posted by: Rezzet.3614

Rezzet.3614

Gyros like turrets have no armor thus even if they lasted forever they still wouldnt have a lifespan longer than 5 seconds except for bulwark.

even then most of gyro effects have a small radius

they need an overall adjustment

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Posted by: Ranael.6423

Ranael.6423

Gyros like turrets have no armor thus even if they lasted forever they still wouldnt have a lifespan longer than 5 seconds except for bulwark.

even then most of gyro effects have a small radius

they need an overall adjustment

You mean in PvP /WvW environment right?
Because since the 95% damage negation from non targeted attacks in PvE all minions (even phantasms) are much more reliable.

About the stats inheritance, I fail to see any logic in Anet stance because companions among professions behave so differently, and sometimes with wrong tooltip that it is really difficult for players to really understand how such mechanisms work.

Turret : insensitive to power/prec (do not even crit) but copy Condi damage, boon and condi duration and healing power
Gyro: have their own stats, no player influence
Clones: have their own weak stats but copy condi stats from player
Phantasms: sensitive to player stats (but not damage modifiers) outside armor and vitality ofc
Pets: have their own preset stats + trait specific modifiers
minions: turret like
Spirit weapons : turret like
Elementals: turret like? not sure about condi and boon stats as well as healing…I think the tooltip is wrong

So much consistency…..no wonder they are barely used in the end (unless forced by class mechanics) because they are made to not be too powerful but never benefit of class boosts powercreep.

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Posted by: Zaviel.1245

Zaviel.1245

For the explosion to be meaningfull I would do something totally off the wall, like give it a daze. Yes I know, you can pick up your jaw now!!!

Whoa now, that would almost make them not terrible. I feel my purity of purpose being violated.

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Posted by: eduardo.1436

eduardo.1436

Love this idea. I for one would like it if gyros were permanent pets/minions

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Posted by: Twigifire.8379

Twigifire.8379

You’d have to tone down the effects of bulwark, sneak and medic gyro for PvP. They’re already used by meta-scrapper (aside from medic gyro but if it’s around permanently then that’s some serious team healing ).

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Posted by: miriforst.1290

miriforst.1290

The bulwark gyro is already limited by the amount of damage it absorbs (due to it not having any armor and the way it “transfers” (takes) damage from you). In pvp it usually dies within seconds when its actually needed (i used to pop it in wvw for just that one pulse of 4 sec -50%, because it exploded instantly). Sure i could pop it up before hand but i wouldn’t really gain anything from it. You miss out on the initial stab, you lower your rapid regen uptime and the recharge still starts when it dies. So far i havent seen anyone stop attacking me for 15 seconds to wait out my bulwark so it changes little there.

As for the sneaky the counter is already to kill the gyro. Gyros got no armor and are pretty fast to kill for powerbuilds. Slower for condi though. But once again people are usually not going to wait out the full duration of your sneak gyro. I agree its the most problematic though.

As for the medgyro, thats kind of the point. In pvp situations where you want to push out those aoe heals (which usually involve heavy aoe pressure) the gyro is probably not going to last its current duration anyhow. If you land every single heal pulse on your allies (in a considerably smaller area) the difference at 0 hp to placing and picking up your healingturret (including regeneration) still isn’t super great. And its at the cost of rapid regen and stab uptime. And the healing turret cleanses 2 conditions aoe. Where i feel this might have an impact is in wvw when you restack but are still in combat.

Atleast shredder would feel more impactfull and reliable for your teammates (but please make it scale).

With the daze gone arenanet seems to want us not to pop them for the destruction effects so that kind of leaves us waiting for stronger support and a reason to have them alive in the first place and not only place and pop for damage, daze, stab and super speed/regeneration (the bulwark naturally being shortlived anyhow if it does its jobb).

Im not sure how much of an impact this would have outside of sneaky, but it would push them in more of a team support direction instead of selfish buffing.

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Posted by: Lord Aargadon.4135

Lord Aargadon.4135

Lets also not forget if you left out bulwark you could actually be gimping yourself as you may enter combat with less health when you could of put it on CD and resummon it with full HP. Same goes for other gyros. In other words, no time limit gyros might/probably be even worse without extra management.

Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Xyonon.3987

Xyonon.3987

I don’t think any Gyro would be too tanky to not quickly be able to deal with it. Right now it’s just a fact that they need urgent help!

Ziggs Ironeye – Engineer | Madame Le Blanc – Mesmer | Mentor (PvE) | EU
“Mentoring engineers / mesmers and showing you what you can do with your fantastic class!
Just pm me for my advice! Always eager to help!”

Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Joxer.6024

Joxer.6024

Love this idea. I for one would like it if gyros were permanent pets/minions

And then we can name them!!??

Would permanent Gyros be op?

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Posted by: Dawdler.8521

Dawdler.8521

You’d have to tone down the effects of bulwark, sneak and medic gyro for PvP. They’re already used by meta-scrapper (aside from medic gyro but if it’s around permanently then that’s some serious team healing ).

Do you really though?

The point would be that they are still killable. Only the sneak gyro would be OP as is. Medic gyro doing “serious team healing”, lol… The secondary heal is pathetic compared to other classes passive AoE heals. And again, it’ll get destroyed and put on cooldown until you can bring it up.

Purge would be stronger, but no more than other classes passive cleanse really.

Shredder would just be a skill like any other skill on any other class (not like you can move it, you got to destroy it).

Blast… well that’s a no brainer.

Bulwark would act just like it does now because there isnt any point in blowing it up early without having any daze. Eventually it’ll die of natural causes – while protecting you exactly the same as todays implementation, no more no less (because that would literally be impossible with a set amount of health in any kind of normal battle where the enemy actually bonk you in the head)