Guild Wars 2

seriously there has been a bunch of questions as to the engineer class why the nerf why bugs aren’t fixed why our damage is so low. hell i can’t even kill on pretty toy princess with my engineer at lvl 80 in any spec i’ve tried with my current gear set. and i got kitten i was a bunker build that did damage now since exlirer gun is nerfed in so many ways the miss and all that my shield skill not working as traited fix the bugs please.
improve our damage output make us viable again. in all builds not just a buffer remover build.

To be fair those princess dolls tear almost everyone up, especially in groups. I opened a present and five of them popped out and screamed and suddenly I had no less than SIXTEEN stacks of confusion. I shot my rifle and half my HP total was suddenly gone, and I was just like “what?”

But yeah, it’s not just engineers who have trouble with the toys solo, other classes do as well. Ventari hits hard, the princess’s have a really mean confuse, and the soldier… well, the soldiers are ok but they can still be a problem in a group if you let the mortar hit. Haven’t seen the griffons in the field yet.

Not to debunk your complaint, but you probably want a better example than the toy princess.

Actually Princess Dolls unfairly effect grenade engineers because we don’t have an autoattack, thus we are far more likely to activate skills (because we have to constantly spam 1) when we get hit by sudden large stacks of confusion.

Except, engineers still do good damage outside of the grenade kit. People have pointed out a few times that rifle, bomb, and heck even the flamethrower now that we have sigils (though targeting can be buggy) do good damage when built properly. The grenade kit still does solid damage now, just not so much as it used to, and still stacks vulnerability like a champ, improving everyone’s damage.

Numot.3965:

Except, engineers still do good damage outside of the grenade kit. People have pointed out a few times that rifle, bomb, and heck even the flamethrower now that we have sigils (though targeting can be buggy) do good damage when built properly.

I think the thing people have issue with, is ArenaNet brought grenade kit down to the level of everything else, when everything else should of been brought up to the level of grenade kit.

Compared to other classes we might as well be shooting bean bags.

Then everything would have been too strong. The issue is people became fixated on the grenade kit so strongly they can’t even see their other options. This change partially forces you to do so if you hadn’t prior or didn’t use grenades.

Numot.3965:

Except, engineers still do good damage outside of the grenade kit. People have pointed out a few times that rifle, bomb, and heck even the flamethrower now that we have sigils (though targeting can be buggy) do good damage when built properly. The grenade kit still does solid damage now, just not so much as it used to, and still stacks vulnerability like a champ, improving everyone’s damage.

The problem I’m seeing with the engineer right now is that we have to obligatorily spec into something very specific to be able to be good at anything. Before this patch I didn’t need to go 30 into explosives just to have decent damage with grenades, now I do. I might want to use flamethrower now and again but I don’t want to spec all of my traits for a flamethrower might build + sigils. I like pistols but I don’t want to go 30 into firearms.

I used to be able to go around with support builds and still contribute with a little damage from grenades. Now since I can’t do SE heals, I have to go full 30 explosives and stack some condition damage to have a decent grenade build. If I don’t then I have to aim 7+ grenades at something my low level ranger could kill easily with auto attacks.

I like challenging games but going on my engineer now feels like masochism. What engineers have right now isn’t versatility. Its the ability to fulfill a single role at a time at the expense of everything else and still do it worse than another class.

I’m not fixated on the grenade kit and I still agree with the OP, you people forget they nerfed EVERY KIT that means all of them that means every option for an engineer to use can we stop saying people don’t know what they are talking about just because they used grenades before please? and try to unite to get an answer from the devs as to why this class is completely screwed up now? Thank you

And before anyone says anything I’ve tried both methods being demanding AND being nice they aren’t saying anything. Prolly because they never come here they are hanging out on reddit or something I dunno.

Engineer has tons of options!

Almost all of them are bad! Some being less worse than others doesn’t really mean much.

I love playing engineer, but every build of engineer is weaker than builds of other classes.

tigirius.9014:

you people forget they nerfed EVERY KIT

No they didn’t.

Show me in the patch noted where they did:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/first

Mif.3471:

tigirius.9014:

you people forget they nerfed EVERY KIT

No they didn’t.

Show me in the patch noted where they did:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/first

Just looking at his signature tells you everything you need to know about him…

Grenades were definitely overpowered continuous damage compared to other classes. Now that #1 has been nerfed by 30%, but #3-4-5 have all been buffed, you can use grenade kit like it was meant to be used, you get great conditions, AoE blindess and chilled, and can swap to another kit while those abilities are on cooldown or to pistol. You don’t have to trait 30 points into Explosives to get grenadier anymore to use grenades.

In the mists I can do +2400 damage per second with condition build using pistols pre-patch, and now including grenade 2-5 into that with their buffs to include direct damage and with them activating sigils now, that damage be even higher.

I’ve been trying to get a flamethrower setup that is comparable, it’s a lot tankier than p/p, and has an awesome knockback, but it’s damage is behind p/p as far as I can tell.

Einherjar.6709:

Grenades were definitely overpowered continuous damage compared to other classes.

Is there a youtube video of this somewhere? I would love to see an overpowered grenadier in action. pre or post patch.

I would like more details on that build, especially skill rotations.

Do you mostly aim to apply conditions, or where do you look to get your power dps from?

In the mists I could do +2900 damage per second with berserker’s grenadier setup. For targets you could lead, it was probably the highest continuous damage from any profession.

To give you an idea, I can do around 2800 damage per second on my warrior using greatsword with a maxdps setup. And I sure couldn’t match 25 stacks of vulnerability for the entire group on my warrior like I could on my nade-spamming engi.

Which setup was more intense, fun, and difficult to use in dungeons? It sure wasn’t nade-spam.

Einherjar.6709:

In the mists I could do +2900 damage per second with berserker’s grenadier setup. For targets you could lead, it was probably the highest continuous damage from any profession.

To give you an idea, I can do around 2800 damage per second on my warrior using greatsword with a maxdps setup. And I sure couldn’t match 25 stacks of vulnerability for the entire group on my warrior like I could on my nade-spamming engi.

Which setup was more intense, fun, and difficult to use in dungeons? It sure wasn’t nade-spam.

Are you using a DPS meter to measure your damage?

For my p/p build I’ve been using Rabid gear (from CM, TA, HotW, Arah). The precision is very important but secondary to condition damage, which is why I choose it over Rampagers gear. From precision you gain:

33% chance to burn for 2 seconds on critical hits.
30% chance to cause bleeding for 3 seconds on critical hits.
50% chance to cause vulnerability on critical hits.

Using a 10/30/0/30/0 build.

These discussions should really be split out into PvE, WvW (solo/group/guild) and sPvP.
Half of what’s posted here is only relevant to one of those.

As for group/guild WvW our only use right now is vuln stacks and that’s it. If you can come up with something better, let me know.

Numot.3965:

Except, engineers still do good damage outside of the grenade kit. People have pointed out a few times that rifle, bomb, and heck even the flamethrower now that we have sigils (though targeting can be buggy) do good damage when built properly. The grenade kit still does solid damage now, just not so much as it used to, and still stacks vulnerability like a champ, improving everyone’s damage.

Are you serious? Is this a serious answer? Our damage is horrible for the amount of trouble it takes to make it work. Our damage was fine; it probably needed a buff; however, that’s what the sigils would have done. That would have been enough. We should not have been toned down at ALL until we scale with weapons because yea, that would have made us too OP. But you know what? That awesome damage doesn’t mean !#$ when you have moving targets with erratic movements. If you claim you can hit every single grenade on a moving target that moves like a madman, then you are full of !#$. Even slight movements can cause us to miss because of the grenade air time.

So no, we were not fine. Flamethrower? Really? It’s buggy as hell. I love seeing misses, yet somehow even though I miss, my sigil procs? Explain that. Grenade was the only VIABLE dps outside BOMB kit; however, not many people like BOMB KIT. We are kitten that not only are we forced to dualwield because Area Net is too stupid to give 2H weapons TWO sigils, but we are forced to use BOMBS. However some of us will stick with the crappy damage of grenades because we enjoy the KIT itself.

I for one am astonished on how stupid Anet has been. Our survival has gone to crap. Elixir (while bugged) made the heal VIABLE. It’s hard to stay alive compared to other classes. Many classes such as Thief, and Ele (fire #1 splash) could, and DO more damage than grenades did and they had sigils to boot. I’ve seen a fire elementalist use #1 fire skill to do almost 3k on crit and it doesn’t miss like grenades and it’s an autoattack.

That’s why so many people are kitten Not only did it take Anet so long to fix something that should have been dealt with in BETA, but they continue to nerf our Grenades to the ground because people complain about its damage. And for the record, the only people who complain are the MORONS who stand still and let it hit them.

Mif.3471:

tigirius.9014:

you people forget they nerfed EVERY KIT

No they didn’t.

Show me in the patch noted where they did:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/first

It isn’t every kit, but “some of the kits” could be every kit minus one:

“Engineer Kit Sigils.
The Engineer now benefits from the sigils on their weapons when they swap to a kit. So, this means that you will have the ability to get sigil procs on your Flame Thrower, or Grenade Kit, etc. This means we had to tone down some of the kits accordingly, the biggest of which was the Grenade kit.”

Numbers are only part of the story.

It’s a psychological thing: engineer kits were troubled with anything from lower damage to bugs to weird misleading tooltips.

The 2 kits that were considered pretty good were bombs, and mostly grenades.
Happened to be these were also the 2 most boring kits since ability #1 to #5 all use the exact same mechanic.

Love -hate relation there, but grenades were the highest damage, longest range. Simply put: they were the most used engineer kit.
Grenadier the most praised and used elite trait by far.

Now what did the patch do instead of listing bug fixes for the other kits?
It lists a 30% nerf to grenade #1.

This sounds bad, nothing more to it.
Numbers are only part of the story. And frankly it’s hardly relevant that the 30% nerf is far less in reality…
Of all the kits the best one gets a harsh sounding ‘30% nerf’.

People feel disapointed and betrayed even.

As a WvW engineer, and considering both the snail pace of bug fixes, and awful ‘balance’ decisions I have completely lost faith in the devs ability to make Engineer a fully functional class with equal variety of builds and roles to the other classes.

I don’t think it’s worth playing Engineer any longer when it’s being balanced to be weaker in everything but completely fictional situations, like medium range. Medium range is a fantasy that only exists in the devs minds, either people close or they range, there is no such thing as medium range.

Pannonica.5378:

Mif.3471:

tigirius.9014:

you people forget they nerfed EVERY KIT

No they didn’t.

Show me in the patch noted where they did:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/first

It isn’t every kit, but “some of the kits” could be every kit minus one:

“Engineer Kit Sigils.
The Engineer now benefits from the sigils on their weapons when they swap to a kit. So, this means that you will have the ability to get sigil procs on your Flame Thrower, or Grenade Kit, etc. This means we had to tone down some of the kits accordingly, the biggest of which was the Grenade kit.”

Has anyone actually tested the other stuff?

Casia.4281:

Pannonica.5378:

Mif.3471:

tigirius.9014:

you people forget they nerfed EVERY KIT

No they didn’t.

Show me in the patch noted where they did:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/first

It isn’t every kit, but “some of the kits” could be every kit minus one:

“Engineer Kit Sigils.
The Engineer now benefits from the sigils on their weapons when they swap to a kit. So, this means that you will have the ability to get sigil procs on your Flame Thrower, or Grenade Kit, etc. This means we had to tone down some of the kits accordingly, the biggest of which was the Grenade kit.”

Has anyone actually tested the other stuff?

I think what they mean here by other kits may be Elixir Gun in addition to Grenade Kit, makes sense with the patch notes (even though Elixir Gun wasn’t toned down but bug fixed).

Pannonica.5378:

Mif.3471:

tigirius.9014:

you people forget they nerfed EVERY KIT

No they didn’t.

Show me in the patch noted where they did:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/news/Game-Update-Notes-December-14-2012/first

It isn’t every kit, but “some of the kits” could be every kit minus one:

“Engineer Kit Sigils.
The Engineer now benefits from the sigils on their weapons when they swap to a kit. So, this means that you will have the ability to get sigil procs on your Flame Thrower, or Grenade Kit, etc. This means we had to tone down some of the kits accordingly, the biggest of which was the Grenade kit.”

Thank you.

It’s so ridiculous when these players want to argue because they are playing other classes other then engineer and they want engineers to continue to be easy pickings when they know darn well that every pvp nerf, one per major patch each btw, has nerfed pve. I left WoW for this very reason, every week there was something else because some poor childish baby couldn’t stop whining about pvp and so they nerfed nerfed nerfed my class until it was unplayable in pve and expected me to pay money to respect every single time. Well in this game, respeccing means your gear too. And it gets costly, it’s not as simple as redoing your traits, you have to get a new armorset, new runes, and new weapons if you don’t have one of each type (4 major ones that are starkly different in stats then one another). So yeah I’m ticked off and rightfully so. Not only are they herding us to the store with lower drops they are now herding us to the store so we can be ready to use whatever flavor build of the week they haven’t touched yet or the rebuffed because they took a whole month to realize they screwed that one up the month earlier. See my point? It’s getting old fast. And no I’m not talking about grenades tho throwing 30-39 grenades to kill something is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever seen in any video game title with these types of weapons.

And despite people thinking my signature tells you everything about me, you don’t know a single thing about me how I play or what I’m about in RL thanks. (not directed at Pan or Mif.)