Guild Wars 2

From june patch, when IP was moved to firearms , it seems to me that in pvp /wvw not many people use nades and bombs. I tried many different condition build on nades and bombs but for being effective you have to take firearms and explosive togegher and it is quite hard. I found , for example ,that a common hgh pistol build with 2 elixir, elixir gun and mortar, at least in pvp , can be much stronger now than a build based on nades becouse i am not obliged to take explosive . On the other hand taking explosive and not taking Incendiary powder .. in a condi setup , cause you a great loss of damage ( burning is the stronger condition ) . Should not anet do something for revitalize the use of nades and boms in PVP/WVW? Personally i miss them but when i try them i find them suboptilmal , expecially in 1 vs 1 . ( i remain a fan of the old P/P nades, toolkit condi build but now i find it too weak )

Nades should have a 180 explosion radius standard imo and the grenadier trait has to be changed to velocity increase and cooldown reduction instead.

I miss the “old” play style too. The rabid Pistol/Shield/Grenade Kit/Tool Kit/stun breaker/Supply Crate build was so much fun to play. I still don’t see how the June patch and later HoT were an improvement over the previous builds. 7 seconds of invulnerability (aka evade), RNG elite and the most boring Burning stack build ever were definitely not a step forward. Before the Scrapper hit I did not believe it could get any worse.

i agree with you. Maradeur hammer is really really strong but …. playing for fun … i try it and it is really effective but after sometime it becomse unplayable for me … too boring . For now the best mix that i have found to play with condi is something like this :

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vdAQJAqalUUhqrY7Ww8KQ+FLsFF4HWiBgYHNFPxYOOGfBA-TJRGwAAeAAZ2foZZA0nAAA

I use runes of aristocracy instead of balthazar but i did not find them in the site.
It is a strong build … in 1vs 1 too .. and it is not boring as hammer … ( perhaps becouse i like pistol pistol game ) . I miss toolkit and nades really much but they are far less viable than this …. I tried flamethrower also but i did not have good results …

Well they nerfed nades for some reason meanwhile revs can hit 17k hammer 2s..
Anet what is the point in nerfing nades when they are a high risk medium reward skill at long ranges but the range is nerfed? wtf CHANGE THEM BACK

i feel like condi engi only feels lacking because most of the elite specs are pretty blatantly op compared to base classes and condi engi isnt a great fit for being a scrapper.

but… i like using ft in my condi builds these days. IA gives as much damage as anything nades can put out, you want firearms anyways, and you dont really need explosives. typically in wvw ill go H / S / rocket boots / ft / mortar. in pvp i go turret / S / eg / ft / mortar. with firearms / alch / (invent or tools). the problem is, dh is hard and reaper and tempest are nearly impossible, and dd and scrapper have too much condi cleanse… thats 5 of the 9 classes already, so its like there are just a bunch of fights i cant bother wasting time on and mesmer/thief have always been better far decappers cuz teleports. its not that its a bad build, because its great at sniping a person in a teamfight and it can hold its own in a 1v1, but it just isnt versatile enough to be as useful as other things (like elite specs). i find myself going back to marauder hammer / cele rifle scrapper after a few games.

insanemaniac.2456:

i feel like condi engi only feels lacking because most of the elite specs are pretty blatantly op compared to base classes and condi engi isnt a great fit for being a scrapper.

but… i like using ft in my condi builds these days. IA gives as much damage as anything nades can put out, you want firearms anyways, and you dont really need explosives. typically in wvw ill go H / S / rocket boots / ft / mortar. in pvp i go turret / S / eg / ft / mortar. with firearms / alch / (invent or tools). the problem is, dh is hard and reaper and tempest are nearly impossible, and dd and scrapper have too much condi cleanse… thats 5 of the 9 classes already, so its like there are just a bunch of fights i cant bother wasting time on and mesmer/thief have always been better far decappers cuz teleports. its not that its a bad build, because its great at sniping a person in a teamfight and it can hold its own in a 1v1, but it just isnt versatile enough to be as useful as other things (like elite specs). i find myself going back to marauder hammer / cele rifle scrapper after a few games.

Give a try with hgh builds , 2 elixirs, elixir gun and mortar or elixir x with aristocracy runes. EG Autoattack hits really hard when you have 15 stack of might or more … you will not win all the 1vs1 but you will win a lot of them . Acid bomb every 12 seconds , stunbreak with short cd and stability give you a great bonus … the only problem is pop your elixir at the right time with the right fight… for example stability can help you a lot with dragon hunter … it is really really easy to play but quite effective

Yes Flamethrower is the way to go since the June patch. For me the issue is not the effectiveness of a build , but rather interesting combat mechanics. Compared to the play style of the old rabid Grenade Kit build, the Flamethrower build does feel boring and uninteresting. Landing grenades at great distances and impossible angles felt rewarding. Watching a good player handle the Grenade Kit was fun. Handling the Incendiary Ammo proc is on the other hand much less engaging. Since the Burning damage is crazy high, even if your stacks get cleansed quickly, you are guaranteed to take out a large portion of your target’s health. Highly rewarding for minimal player input. The current Burning stack Scrapper stands for the dumbing down of combat mechanics.

In my opinion it is not the kit itself that lacks, but rather the exploves line that lacks alot.
Imagine, you want to make a build for WvW/PvP purposes. This will mean that you have to spec into explosives in order to make your bombs explode faster. Now you are forced to choose from the adept and grandmaster traits. Shrapnel is basicly just kind of weak on bombs and ofcourse no1 uses Thermobaric Detonation. This forces you into Siege rounds while you might not even be interested in using Mortar Kit.
Then there are adept traits. First one to scrap off the list is Explosive Descent. Just plain useless. Then there is Grenadier. Not using nades in a bomb build, scrap it off. What remains is Glass Cannon. Another completely useless trait since in these game modes you will barely remain above 90% health.

To make a long story short: If you want to build around one or both of these kits you are way too restricted to one trait line, which doesn’t even have good other options for you.

The V.8759:

In my opinion it is not the kit itself that lacks, but rather the exploves line that lacks alot.
Imagine, you want to make a build for WvW/PvP purposes. This will mean that you have to spec into explosives in order to make your bombs explode faster. Now you are forced to choose from the adept and grandmaster traits. Shrapnel is basicly just kind of weak on bombs and ofcourse no1 uses Thermobaric Detonation. This forces you into Siege rounds while you might not even be interested in using Mortar Kit.
Then there are adept traits. First one to scrap off the list is Explosive Descent. Just plain useless. Then there is Grenadier. Not using nades in a bomb build, scrap it off. What remains is Glass Cannon. Another completely useless trait since in these game modes you will barely remain above 90% health.

To make a long story short: If you want to build around one or both of these kits you are way too restricted to one trait line, which doesn’t even have good other options for you.

Problem for nades , for me , is different. I can not take grenadeer and incendiary powder without taking the 2 lines and it is really a big problem for going condi becouse if i take both of them i am really weak only with invention ( for speed) or alchemy

theres just os much projectile destrution/reflection going on in the game right now for engineers to run anything else other than hammer.

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

theres just os much projectile destrution/reflection going on in the game right now for engineers to run anything else other than hammer.

that is definitely not why hammer is a thing.

insanemaniac.2456:

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

theres just os much projectile destrution/reflection going on in the game right now for engineers to run anything else other than hammer.

that is definitely not why hammer is a thing.

Was poorly put from my side.
What I meant was that there is an increadible amount of reflects in pvp/wvw and this makes rifles, pistols, grenades and mortar (atleast in alot wvw content) quite underwhelming compared to the hammer playstyle.
Ofc there are alot of other aspects to consider, both pros and cons, for all the wep sets.

Only problem with going heavy condi now is it’s not just Necros that hard counter you. That and the existence of Resistance without any good boon stripping. I loved my HGH condi burst build, but it’s a little silly now unless you are paired at the hip with a boon stripping class.

It can still be plenty fun, but I had to switch it up due to some frustration.

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

insanemaniac.2456:

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

theres just os much projectile destrution/reflection going on in the game right now for engineers to run anything else other than hammer.

that is definitely not why hammer is a thing.

Was poorly put from my side.
What I meant was that there is an increadible amount of reflects in pvp/wvw and this makes rifles, pistols, grenades and mortar (atleast in alot wvw content) quite underwhelming compared to the hammer playstyle.
Ofc there are alot of other aspects to consider, both pros and cons, for all the wep sets.

all 4 of those can sidestep reflects in some way with attention to detail…

insanemaniac.2456:

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

insanemaniac.2456:

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

theres just os much projectile destrution/reflection going on in the game right now for engineers to run anything else other than hammer.

that is definitely not why hammer is a thing.

Was poorly put from my side.
What I meant was that there is an increadible amount of reflects in pvp/wvw and this makes rifles, pistols, grenades and mortar (atleast in alot wvw content) quite underwhelming compared to the hammer playstyle.
Ofc there are alot of other aspects to consider, both pros and cons, for all the wep sets.

all 4 of those can sidestep reflects in some way with attention to detail…

I fully agree, but then it’s much more efficient to run hammer in the current meta, isnt it?

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

insanemaniac.2456:

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

insanemaniac.2456:

Ovalkvadratcylinder.9365:

theres just os much projectile destrution/reflection going on in the game right now for engineers to run anything else other than hammer.

that is definitely not why hammer is a thing.

Was poorly put from my side.
What I meant was that there is an increadible amount of reflects in pvp/wvw and this makes rifles, pistols, grenades and mortar (atleast in alot wvw content) quite underwhelming compared to the hammer playstyle.
Ofc there are alot of other aspects to consider, both pros and cons, for all the wep sets.

all 4 of those can sidestep reflects in some way with attention to detail…

I fully agree, but then it’s much more efficient to run hammer in the current meta, isnt it?

Nobody is negating that … the problem is that hammer gameplay , with the new meta, is terribly boring …. nobody said that it was not the most efficient thing … but , at least for me, i have much less fun that with pistol pistol , or rifle 2/3 kit gameplay. I don’t play for money so fun is a really important side of the coin