Guild Wars 2

i dont play engi… but i dont understand why i keep hearing this…
SB thief can spam blast finishers whenever needed(and a poison field – smoke field possible from utilities/second weapon set)
S/D ele has 4 blast finishers in weapon skills alone (access to more finishers through utilities, evasive arcana gives blast finisher rolls, a fire field and 5 100% projectiles from earth 2 that activate simultaneously with an attack) – a S/D elementalist with arcane blast can grant 15 stacks of AoE might if so inclined – even an instant cast stability to prevent interruption
staff ele has a feast of combo fields and a blast finisher (with a second from utilities)

engi has no weapon combo fields
1 granted from grenades
2 from bomb kit
both of which take up utilities restricting access to other finishers (only having one in a weapon set – both of which have fairly long CDs…/animation time)

even ranger seems to do a better job with traps, healing spring, sword leaps, pet skills (although somewhat unreliable) and quickness (from pet switching) shortbow spamming

is there something im missing?

Toolkit skills add a few more finishers and fields both. Turrets do as well (detonate is a blast).

It’s still very awkward compared to other classes, the combos are spread out between kit sets and hard to both position and time right.

i didnt realise elixer gun/elixer r granted a light field
… but the only notable toolbelt finisher i could find was the thumper turret one… and again takes up a utility preventing access to atleast one combo field

so im not missing anything else?

We can get quite a few combo fields going. Some of them are harder for allies to use. And depending on your build, you probably won’t have access to all of them at once.

On top of what you mentioned, some other good abilities to get combo fields from:

• Healing Turret and its F1 skill are 2 Water combo fields.
• Flamethrower adds a Fire combo field.
• Elixir Gun is another combo field. If you have the Kit Refinement trait and Elixir Gun, now it’s 2 Light combo fields.
• Flame Turret gives a Smoke combo field but Flame Turret is kind of lame. :<

I think it’s more important to master what you do have access to instead of trying to get as many combo fields going as you can. I run a build that uses Healing Turret and a Shield. When I deploy Healing Turret, I will often blow it up (blast finisher) after about half a second to get an extra burst of healing for nearby allies and me. Then I can use Regenerating Mist(F1) and shield #4 to get another burst of healing to my allies and me. These heals make a HUGE difference in fights.

When I’m using Flamethrower, I can use the Fire combo field to get a fire damage shield, stacks of Might for nearby allies and me, AND apply burning to enemies. This is from 1 combo field and 3 different finishers.

Engineers have the following combo fields, and combo finishers

Fire:
Bomb kit #2
FT # 4

Smoke:
Trait
Flame Turret
Bomb Kit #4
Elixir U tool belt

Water
Healing turret
Healing turret tool belt
mortar #3

Ice:
Mortar #4

Light:
Trait
Elixir Gun
Elixir R
Elixir U tool belt

Confusion:
Elixir U tool belt

Poison:
Grenade #5

Blast:
Bomb TB
All turret detonate
supply crate
thumper activate
thumper TB
rocket activate
rocket boots
Shield #4
Mine gadget

Projectile:
Tool kit TB
rifle turret
rifle turret TB
pistol #1
pistol #2
Rifle #1
PBR TB
Elixir Gun #1

Leap:
Rifle #5

((I might be missing 1-2, I am pretty sure I am missing a projectile))

It’s not that we don’t have a lot of combo fields and finishers it’s more that they are a bit funky to use.

Think thumper turret and it’s 3 blast finishers. Theoretically this should be awesome for stacking might with something like bomb kit / FT or even stealth. But the CD on the abilities are so absurdly long it’s not practical to use it like that.

A lot of the go to builds also miss out on these combo skills since a bulk are situated on turrets, and on kits. Turrets are somewhat underused, and for most of the current builds it rare to have more than 1 kit in the utility slots. The 2 most used kits seem to be grenade / FT which both do not have ways to really capitalize on their combo fields unless if you run shield. The leap finishers from rifle is somewhat meh imo as far as what it does with those fields.

So the issue is not having the abilities, it’s utilizing them in a functional build.

There are builds that do that though. P/S with bomb kit + elixirs. P/S with FT + turrets. Rifle with Tool kit + turrets (flame turret is key) or Elixir gun / bomb kit builds.

It’s just in the current rifle / grenade elixir builds, you do not have as many combo fields to work with, or ways to activate them on your own.

the healing turret looks like it could be useful… but from what i recall of my short playtime as an engi; turrets are squishy and its water field is very short?

ive been playing around with trying to get detonations to trigger flame turrets smoke field/flame throwers fire… field… line and having very little success… more than that stealth doesnt seem to be greatly useful on engi as other classes can catch you easily when you reappear?

thats what i mean though… i keep getting told/seeing engis being praised as a great combo profession… but it seems very limited in that most of its combo potential lies in utilities and all but one of its combo fields require switching in and out of weapon kits whilst its (non projectile – i only mentioned SDeles as it casts independently of an animation, and its a really common finisher) finishers require being close to an enemy (though idk how jump shot works… whether its take off or land) making it more awkward to take advantage of an allies field

Certain engi combo fields are really good because they are long duration. 8s on FT fire combo, you can chain light combos for ~12s on EG. Even smoke bomb as a nice duration + fast cool down.

A lone engi won’t get as much out of it. But if you put 2-3 hammer warriors next to an engi smoke field you can build 15s+ of stealth, which is enough to be somewhat sneaky. Or at least jump off a tower wall and get to a balista to gank it.

Karast.1927:

Certain engi combo fields are really good because they are long duration. 8s on FT fire combo, you can chain light combos for ~12s on EG. Even smoke bomb as a nice duration + fast cool down.

A lone engi won’t get as much out of it. But if you put 2-3 hammer warriors next to an engi smoke field you can build 15s+ of stealth, which is enough to be somewhat sneaky. Or at least jump off a tower wall and get to a balista to gank it.

ty ^^

Agreed, OP.

Just because Engis are versatile, doesn’t necessarily mean that we are amazing at comboing. I would call the Warrior the master of finishers and the Elementalist the master of Fields.

I honestly don’t see the Engineer as a “good comboer”.

We have 14+ combo field generators, 13+ blast finishers, 10+ projectile finishers, and at least one leap finisher. It may not be “amazing”, but it is pretty darn solid and reasonable. Just because we may not be the master of finishers, or the master of field generators, does not mean we are lacking.

In actuality, elementalist can create 10 combo fields to engineers 14. That hardly makes them masters if you ask me. They only have fire,ice, water and lightening fields. Engineers have fire, ice, light, poison, smoke, and water.

This is one of the common mis-conceptions ov various classes.

Warriors on the other hand, have 35 finishers to our 21, that is a solid difference.

14 fields and 21 finishers seems pretty solid to me, you must have some pretty high expectations to suggest that does not rank near a real of “good combo-er”

There was a thread about how engineers are absolute trash unless we start busting out all of our combos. I just really don’t like to think of the class as such. Also, Elementalists may indeed have less fields than we do but I believe most of them to be more accessible to the average build. Whereas engineers have to have a little bit of everything to have access to reliable combos.

Well that can be said for every class in comparison to elementalist. Based on that comparison, it seems a tad illogical for previous posters to claim engineers as particularly weak compared to ele’s, when the same is true on a relatively equal level to all classes, when you compare the to ele’s.

Well even then I wouldn’t say ele’s have a significant advantage over engineers when it comes to access to combo fields.

Most kits give a combo field, some give 2.

And no matter what your weapon gives 1 if not more combo finishers as a default option.

P/S in fact give 4. 3 projectile 1 blast.

Most kits will also give a finisher except FT / Grenade.

Unless if your using a build without kits, and turrets, even with elixirs. It’s hard to have a build without some combo fields you can take advantage of.

I think it’s less of a matter of having them, but more of a matter that many do not think or actively use the options they have.

For example if your in a grenade build and you use the poison field, you may not look to use jump shot on that field. Since you might be playing from range, or kiting.

I see a lot of bomb engi’s completely ignore their fire and smoke fields, even though they can use them to great effect to get some extra might stacks or invisibility, if they time Big ’ol bomb right.

I use P/S + bomb as my bunker build with elixirs. I like to build up additional might stacks or a few seconds of stealth in SPvP.

But ele’s are no different in this regard.

I really think a lot of our combo fields are underused. In the hands of a condition damage engineer with a bit of burning duration the 8s fire field from FT is extremely good for AoE burning.

In PvE, and in WvW you can easily use it to stack AoE burning with the pistol offhand / tool belt. Even on it’s only it’s easy to 7-8k damage from it on boss fights / keep doors.

That’s damage easily on par with with grenade barrage, or jump shot.

Depends on who you compare with. Of the classes I play, guardian is probably the best in terms of combos since both their hammer and greatsword has comb fields and finishers on the same weapons. Engineers have very few combo fields and they aren’t exactly rolling in finishers either. End result is that engineers have to think about combos when setting skills up.

For example, on my Asura I usually carry radiation field because it has a poison combo field if I am running with mines and thus work on mine blast finisher + radiation field poison combo happening. Otherwise, you have to go meta and coordinate with your team about combos. It just requires a bit more thought and combo combinations aren’t just handed to you – that’s all.

Tinni.4351:

Depends on who you compare with. Of the classes I play, guardian is probably the best in terms of combos since both their hammer and greatsword has comb fields and finishers on the same weapons.

Yes, and engineers have kits that have multiple combo fields with their own finishers.

Tinni.4351:

. Engineers have very few combo fields and they aren’t exactly rolling in finishers either.

In order to keep this discussion productive we should try a couple of things (I know it’s the internet, but I have faith in all of us ):

1. Provide evidence of our opinions, assuming your experience is indicative of all experiences is a fallacy.

2. Don’t poison the well.

3. Make an attempt to be unbiased.

Clearly you have not read the thread at all, because your make a direct and blunt statement that contradicts the facts. Numerical evidence of a comparison of the amount of fields and finishers has been posted and contradicts your statement.

I dont view the engi as being a “good combo-er” as many people have said, the combo fields and finishers are kinda funky to use.

To me, to say a class is a good combo-er, that means they can place and use combo fields naturally, as in they dont have to go out and make placing and using combo fields as there main goal. But thats exactly what an engi has to do if he wants to place and use combo fields.

It should be a byproduct of abilities they would regularly use, not something they have to go out of there way to get.

XelNigma.6315:

I dont view the engi as being a “good combo-er” as many people have said, the combo fields and finishers are kinda funky to use.

To me, to say a class is a good combo-er, that means they can place and use combo fields naturally, as in they dont have to go out and make placing and using combo fields as there main goal. But thats exactly what an engi has to do if he wants to place and use combo fields.

It should be a byproduct of abilities they would regularly use, not something they have to go out of there way to get.

What feels natural is a very subjective thing. I very much disagree. I use P/S condition build. I use a bomb kit. It is very natural for me to swap to bombs for the concision bomb for confusion, then fire bomb, then switch back to pistol shield. Unless I got out of my way to make awkward positioning, it is too easy to fire right on through it at my opponent or mob and stack burns in the combo. The same goes for the super elixir combo. When using either of those, I would have to go out of my way not to combo them. So from my point of view, it couldn’t work more naturally.

When you aren’t familiar with the class it seems confusing, but once you play it for a while you will realize a lot of ways to combo things together that is very useful.

One of the easiest ones you can do is combo’ing a skill off the same skill! Which comes from the healing turret. About a second after you drop it, it will have a water field up, so hit detonate, and it will blast an AOE heal. This heals you for more, and can help heal up allies. It’s the only heal I use in WvW since its also a low cool down I can splash a decent amount of healing around without actually going to any special effort. Try it out

coglin.1496:

Tinni.4351:

Depends on who you compare with. Of the classes I play, guardian is probably the best in terms of combos since both their hammer and greatsword has comb fields and finishers on the same weapons.

Yes, and engineers have kits that have multiple combo fields with their own finishers.

Tinni.4351:

. Engineers have very few combo fields and they aren’t exactly rolling in finishers either.

In order to keep this discussion productive we should try a couple of things (I know it’s the internet, but I have faith in all of us ):

1. Provide evidence of our opinions, assuming your experience is indicative of all experiences is a fallacy.

2. Don’t poison the well.

3. Make an attempt to be unbiased.

Clearly you have not read the thread at all, because your make a direct and blunt statement that contradicts the facts. Numerical evidence of a comparison of the amount of fields and finishers has been posted and contradicts your statement.

I have no idea why you have decided to pick a fight with me when I wasn’t being negative and even gave an example of a combo I am fond off. Also, your numbers are wrong. Engineers have 2 x Fire, 1 x ice (from elite morter), 2 x light, 1 x poison, 2 x smoke and 1 x water. That’s only 9 comb fields, not 14+. They have exactly 13 blast finishers and that’s only if you count each type of turret explosion as a different blast finisher. They have 1 leap finisher: jump shot and they have only 7 projectile finisher not 10+.

However, numbers aside, I stand by my opinion that to combo with an engineer require more pre-planning and isn’t a matter of equipping one weapon and being done with it.

Pick a fight? No. But when you make a blunt claim that the profession has very few combo fields when we actually are numerically at the top. Below is a list of combo fields per profession via the wiki. Your making blunt statements that lack fact, and thus spreading mis-information. I correct you, and you get angry at me? I don’t get that.

Test every skill I pointed out on the engineer. Regardless of what the wiki says, everything I state below on engineer is accurate in game.

Thief – 5
necro- 9
mesmer – 6
guardian – 12
Warrior – 1
Ranger – 8
Elementalist – 10
Engineer – 14

Fire:
1) Bomb kit #2
2) FT # 4

Smoke:
3) Trait (Auto defense Bomb Dispenser)
4) Flame Turret
5) Bomb Kit #4
6) Elixir U tool belt (33% chance of thief smoke screen)

Water
7) Healing turret
8) Healing turret tool belt
9) mortar #3

Ice:
10) Mortar #4

Light:
11) Elixir Gun (kit refinement, 10s ICD on swap to elixir gun)
12) Super elixir
13) Toss Elixir R
14) Elixir U tool belt (WoR 33% guardian skill)

Confusion:
15) Elixir U tool belt (veil 33% mesmer skill)

Poison:
16)Grenade #5

Or you can count the 3 offered By toss elixir U and round it down to 1 making it 14 total.

Nothing impressive.
Check this out.

http://mastodonte.fr/outils/tool-combo#en

Combo Fields

WATER: Healing Turret: Tool Belt Skill – Regenerating Mist, Healing Turret Pulse (this is very brief and hard to time finishers with, but powerful nonetheless), Mortar #3
POISON: Poison Grenade
LIGHT: Super Elixir, Toss Elixir U-Veil or Wall of Reflection
FIRE: Fire Bomb, Napalm
SMOKE: Smoke Bomb, Flame Turret’s Smoke Screen, Toss Elixir U-Smoke Screen, Auto Defense Bomb Dispenser (Explosives Trait)
ICE: Mortar #4

The finisher effects are in order of the Combo Fields above

Finishers: Projectile (^20%): Hip Shot^, Explosive Shot^, Tranq Shot^, Throw Shield
Regen (2 seconds)
Poison
Remove Condition
Burning
Blindness
Chilled

Blast: Magnetic Inversion, Big Old Bomb, Throw Mine’s Detonate, Shock Wave, Detonate (any) Turret
Area Healing
Area Weakness
Area Retaliation
Area Might (3 stacks, 20 seconds)
Area Stealth
Area Ice Armor

Leap: Jump Shot
Healing
Weakness
Retaliation (5 seconds)
Fire Armor
Stealth
Ice Armor

Please let me know if I’ve missed anything.

Grackleflint.4956:

Please let me know if I’ve missed anything.

Grackleflint there are some tricky/hidden combo fields you have not listed. coglin has listed them in a post above. For example a less obvious one is the water field deployed by Healing Turret.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Healing_Turret

As noted here deploying the turret itself (not the toolbelt skill Regenerating Mist) sets up a brief water field for half a second that if timed right can be comboed with the Detonate Healing Turret toolbelt skill.

I am pretty new and have not tried this yet. But it seems like a pretty handy trick to get a decent burst of healing i.e. the heal of the healing turret + the tricky combo with detonate healing. All these combos should be noted for completeness.

coglin.1496:

We have 14+ combo field generators, 13+ blast finishers, 10+ projectile finishers, and at least one leap finisher. It may not be “amazing”, but it is pretty darn solid and reasonable. Just because we may not be the master of finishers, or the master of field generators, does not mean we are lacking.

In actuality, elementalist can create 10 combo fields to engineers 14. That hardly makes them masters if you ask me. They only have fire,ice, water and lightening fields. Engineers have fire, ice, light, poison, smoke, and water.

This is one of the common mis-conceptions ov various classes.

Warriors on the other hand, have 35 finishers to our 21, that is a solid difference.

14 fields and 21 finishers seems pretty solid to me, you must have some pretty high expectations to suggest that does not rank near a real of “good combo-er”

only two of those (non projectile) finishers are in weapon sets; both on long CD, and its more about how awkward it is to use those combos compared to other classes (especially as theres only three utility slots and non of them -afaik- give a finisher/field in both its toolbelt and actual skill

idk… the only two things that indicate useful combo potential to me is the healing turret (but rangers healing spring lasts a long time… and staff ele has two water fields) and the bomb kit smoke field (for the previously mentioned stealth trick – which sounds very fun – and for sneakily placing a bomb near people – which i somehow didnt consider… as i kinda thought engi was at a loss once stealthed)

- i just want to point out that i disregard most projectile finishers as combo potential… cause its so widely used… ranger shortbow can spam 20% projectiles (with pet swap/zephyr quickness its even better), ranger axe/theif shortbow bounces combo projectiles around multiple enemies, theif can throw a couple of unloads (which ive heard engi has access to a similar skill… but cant seem to find), rifle warr has the barrage skill on 3, mesmer has phantasms that periodically unload… more examples… more examples…

… it looks like engi is a ‘jack of all trades’ combo-er imo… anything it can do (maybe with the exception of that stealth trick… though im too tired to check the duration on it vs thief fields) and it cant do everything because its severely hampered by utility slots

is that a suitable conclusion?

@Linguistically Inept

Not quite sure why you are measuring whether an Engi is good at combos by how much combo access they have through weapon sets.

The engineer relies pretty heavily on kits – hence not having a weapon swap available. If you compare it to any other class with swapping available but rule out kits it is not a valid comparison.

I think you should be asking are there valid, decent Engineer builds which have good combo access and the answer to that is yes. A bomb/EG build or bomb/nade build have several field, and healing turret adds another. You can have 4-5 blast finishers on such a build without making any compromises away from desirable skill choices.

My own usual WvW build has the follow fields:

Smoke
Fire
Water
Poison

With 4 blast finishers and a leap finisher.

How is that not a decent access to combos? Only one finisher on the weapon, but why is that important?