Guild Wars 2

I’m conflicted about whether to run heal stacking or condition stacking sigils on my bunker wvw bomb heals build. Healing turret, bomb kit, elixir gun, tool kit, pistol/shield. Full apothecary armor and trinkets, backpack regenerator. zerg / roam. Already at about 1300 healing no buffs, over 700 condition damage no buffs.

Any thoughts?

EDIT: Going with condi stacking

Small group support it’s awesome. Look up the god, BAMF Joe. Solo or in a zerg, meh…

I am mostly running as an apothecary engi these days. I don’t use toolkit I use rocket boots instead. F skill on Healing turret and rocket boots is <3.

currently have perplexity runes for some damage. Also I take protection injection and vigorous speed in the alchemy tree instead of backpack regen.

Condition stacking sigil.

My build with explanation if interested

I don’t recommend this for zergs. In fact I don’t think Engis are good in zergs because the fun of being an engi is the kit switching and comboing skills. In zergs you just need to know where your “1” button is since you will likely encounter skill lag. Better off as a guard or a warrior there.

I believe you should run, condition because you won’t need more than the healing that was stated in your question after the 1300 mark it should have a huge diminishing return and wouldn’t be as effective to a point. Running condition will give you the ability to enhance the Zerg more then healing because the status of current WV3 is that it’s not about having more heals then the dps but to have more dps then what the enemy can out heal.

@Oblivious Perplexity runes have nothing to do with the question that was asked. Also if you don’t recommend engineers for Zergs than you must not be a good engineer. All classes are valuable WvW.

oblivious.8074:

I am mostly running as an apothecary engi these days. I don’t use toolkit I use rocket boots instead. F skill on Healing turret and rocket boots is <3.

currently have perplexity runes for some damage. Also I take protection injection and vigorous speed in the alchemy tree instead of backpack regen.

Condition stacking sigil.

My build with explanation if interested

I don’t recommend this for zergs. In fact I don’t think Engis are good in zergs because the fun of being an engi is the kit switching and comboing skills. In zergs you just need to know where your “1” button is since you will likely encounter skill lag. Better off as a guard or a warrior there.

I morally decline to use perplexity runes, as they are broken. I still believe they need to be nerfed and I hope that they will be. I run rune of traveler instead, which allows me to avoid a number of wasted trait points simply for perma swiftness, and I can run healing turret for team play. I build tankier and with more support that way. I run 40% condi duration reduce combo’d with transmute minor. This makes you incredibly tanky and keeps conditions off you.

Saying bomb heal builds are not good for zergs is false. I have been incredibly effective with this apothecary bomb heal build I am currently using. Rocket boots is nice but it promotes sloppy play, as you have an easy escape, and don’t need to try as hard. Toolkit offers much more versatility, team play, and sustain if played with properly. Like chain magnet pulls on enemy commanders when they have lost stability. A commander kill at the right moment can disrupt enemy movements severely and give you a window of opportunity to close out a battle. Toolkit auto attack does cleaving vulnerability. Box of nails is also a fantastic way of slowing a large number of enemies, plus it has a short cooldown and does some minor damage. Gear shield is an easy survive/engage, also on a relatively short cooldown. Throw wrench is a combo projectile finisher both directions, so when combo’d with something like smoke bomb it’s devastating to enemy groups.

If you think engi is ineffective for zergs then you are not experienced enough with it. Are you aware that engineer has the highest boon stripping potential of any class? It can be one of the tankiest, with the most disrupts, CC, and movement, healing, and dps debuffs. Engi allows for lots of team support even with just 1 skill like fumigate. Coordinated large combat is amazingly effective. If you think it’s about knowing where your 1 skill is, then obviously you haven’t been doing this for very long. Skill lag is really only present when all 3 map zergs engage in combat together, like stonemist.

All I was asking about was whether to run healing or condi stacking. But I looked over the ratios for the healing skills, evaluated my current tankyness, and decided on condition stacking.

WhiteAndMilky.2514:

oblivious.8074:

I am mostly running as an apothecary engi these days. I don’t use toolkit I use rocket boots instead. F skill on Healing turret and rocket boots is <3.

currently have perplexity runes for some damage. Also I take protection injection and vigorous speed in the alchemy tree instead of backpack regen.

Condition stacking sigil.

My build with explanation if interested

I don’t recommend this for zergs. In fact I don’t think Engis are good in zergs because the fun of being an engi is the kit switching and comboing skills. In zergs you just need to know where your “1” button is since you will likely encounter skill lag. Better off as a guard or a warrior there.

I morally decline to use perplexity runes, as they are broken. I still believe they need to be nerfed and I hope that they will be. I run rune of traveler instead, which allows me to avoid a number of wasted trait points simply for perma swiftness, and I can run healing turret for team play. I build tankier and with more support that way. I run 40% condi duration reduce combo’d with transmute minor. This makes you incredibly tanky and keeps conditions off you.

Saying bomb heal builds are not good for zergs is false. I have been incredibly effective with this apothecary bomb heal build I am currently using. Rocket boots is nice but it promotes sloppy play, as you have an easy escape, and don’t need to try as hard. Toolkit offers much more versatility, team play, and sustain if played with properly. Like chain magnet pulls on enemy commanders when they have lost stability. A commander kill at the right moment can disrupt enemy movements severely and give you a window of opportunity to close out a battle. Toolkit auto attack does cleaving vulnerability. Box of nails is also a fantastic way of slowing a large number of enemies, plus it has a short cooldown and does some minor damage. Gear shield is an easy survive/engage, also on a relatively short cooldown. Throw wrench is a combo projectile finisher both directions, so when combo’d with something like smoke bomb it’s devastating to enemy groups.

If you think engi is ineffective for zergs then you are not experienced enough with it. Are you aware that engineer has the highest boon stripping potential of any class? It can be one of the tankiest, with the most disrupts, CC, and movement, healing, and dps debuffs. Engi allows for lots of team support even with just 1 skill like fumigate. Coordinated large combat is amazingly effective. If you think it’s about knowing where your 1 skill is, then obviously you haven’t been doing this for very long. Skill lag is really only present when all 3 map zergs engage in combat together, like stonemist.

All I was asking about was whether to run healing or condi stacking. But I looked over the ratios for the healing skills, evaluated my current tankyness, and decided on condition stacking.

Apothecary bombs hit like a wet noodle. U have no stability to stand in the middle of the zerg. Sure, u’re tanky and can heal but while u’re wading thru the condi’s and dropping bombs that hit for 300dmg, here comes the hammer train that crits for 2k after ur protection injection, stabilizing armor, and melandra runes and whatever food reduces stun dmg. The problem though is that u’re still stunned for a while while others are wailing on u. A lot of 2k dmg adds up when u can’t move. Also, u’re not exactly helping ur zerg. As far as boon stripping, I know of throw mine but what else?

Don’t get me wrong, it is what it is and u prolly live longer than most, I stay by the commander and try to put down water fields and blast in them but it’s not very … satisfying…

Each mine from mine field strips boons and can have its explosion radius increased, this roughly translates to a potential of 30 boons stripped per 19 seconds without any gadget or toolbelt reductions. With expanded radius, and proper placement, this is an easy feat, just be aware of blindness. Typical strategy is shield or gear shield into enemy zerg, drop mines, dodge, and detonate mid-dodge to avoid being blinded. The closer they stack, the more you strip.

If you’re playing apo bomb heals and trying to do damage with your bomb 1 attack, you’re playing it wrong. If you need stability you can run elixir X, which can be very good if used properly. Also if you’re walking straight into the enemies initial stuns and aoe’s, you’re playing it wrong. Sidestep and walk through the side back to your team. If you get focused, elixir gun toolbelt has a stun breaker and then combo it with shield or gear shield. Fumigate alone allows you to give the most possible cleansing to your teammates if you fire it correctly.

If you use all skills when they are off cooldown, yeah, it will be bad. If you use your skills wisely you are capable of doing decent damage, high sustain, lots of team support and lots of debuffs for enemies. It can be very satisfying if you take the time to maximize your effectiveness. A typical non-crit no-power bomb hits for about 500 as well, which isn’t nothing. But with apo build, normal 1 skill bombs are more for when your team stacks for healing or are retreating. For damage you should be using your other bombs, pistol, nails, prybar, and then when not doing your damage skills you are using your debuffs or teamsupport skills.

Apo bomb heal builds are all about adapting to combat situations, since you have more than 1 role to perform.

wow the hostility is rife in this thread.

If you guys would have read on it would have become apparent about my meaning about engis and zergs.

Maybe a phrased it wrong maybe its just my preference of non zerg combat.

The fun of engis IMO is kit swapping and comboing. I can’t do that when I having skill lag or in the rare moments when I am facing a massive blob server I am lagging seconds or a minute behind what is happening on screen.

You can be a zerg apothecary Engi and keep up with the melee train providing support CC and a bit of damage. To me its not so much fun.

Be careful about the AOE condition damage but as an engi you can hop in and out of the “danger zone” if you have the vigor + Speedy kits traits.

misread the OP thought you asked about runes as well as sigil.

glhf I have said my peace and will not be posting again

WhiteAndMilky.2514:

Each mine from mine field strips boons and can have its explosion radius increased, this roughly translates to a potential of 30 boons stripped per 19 seconds without any gadget or toolbelt reductions. With expanded radius, and proper placement, this is an easy feat, just be aware of blindness. Typical strategy is shield or gear shield into enemy zerg, drop mines, dodge, and detonate mid-dodge to avoid being blinded. The closer they stack, the more you strip.

If you’re playing apo bomb heals and trying to do damage with your bomb 1 attack, you’re playing it wrong. If you need stability you can run elixir X, which can be very good if used properly. Also if you’re walking straight into the enemies initial stuns and aoe’s, you’re playing it wrong. Sidestep and walk through the side back to your team. If you get focused, elixir gun toolbelt has a stun breaker and then combo it with shield or gear shield. Fumigate alone allows you to give the most possible cleansing to your teammates if you fire it correctly.

If you use all skills when they are off cooldown, yeah, it will be bad. If you use your skills wisely you are capable of doing decent damage, high sustain, lots of team support and lots of debuffs for enemies. It can be very satisfying if you take the time to maximize your effectiveness. A typical non-crit no-power bomb hits for about 500 as well, which isn’t nothing. But with apo build, normal 1 skill bombs are more for when your team stacks for healing or are retreating. For damage you should be using your other bombs, pistol, nails, prybar, and then when not doing your damage skills you are using your debuffs or teamsupport skills.

Apo bomb heal builds are all about adapting to combat situations, since you have more than 1 role to perform.

Couple of things.

U’re right, bomb 1 does hit (non crit) in the 500-600 range.
I don’t think Bomb 1 is a blast finisher so using it in water fields won’t do squat.
Necros/Mesmers seem to be better boon strippers than engineers.
I have not read anywhere that Mine field also removes boon, it’s not in the skill text.
Yes, we can play a support role but other classes support a crap load better than us.

These are just my opinions, not fact…

I don’t mean to get into the middle of this discussion, but I would like to point out that Mine Field does indeed remove boons:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mine_Field

Having said that, I am interested in making an Apothecary-based bunker build for WvW and was curious about others experiences with the setup. Do you guys favor full Apothecary’s or mix it with Rabid, Carrion, or even Rampagers?

I’m also concerned about the rather lackluster healing power ratios on Elixir-Infused Bombs when it comes to Apothecary’s. It seems questionable as to whether it is worth the price of admission for such modest gains. There again, the heal stacking from the auto attack could add up. Thus my interest in others’ empirical evidence with using Apothecary’s.

I’m abandoning it for Dire…lol, thanks for the confirmation on Mine Field.