Guild Wars 2

title says it. pistol+shield (with condi damage stats) is my fav (in spvp). with flamethrower and tool kit. but from what I see rifle power build outperforms pistol shield condi build.

i’d love to have pistol shield power build, but as i understand its is not meant to, is it? pistol is for condi? direct damage is higher on rifle. merely #1 rifle significantly outperforms pistol. with blunderbuss and jump shot there is no comparison between the two.

i guess in terms of damage rifle is more fun, it is the shield part that i miss. bouncing projectiles back to hunters and thiefs. and holding melee with static sheild (tool kit #4 is my consolation for this one).

if condi damage would deliver, pistol shield is decent, but somehow rifle direct damage does it better. whats your experience ppl?

Rifle doesn’t out-perform anything. It’s just a different way of playing.

If you’re looking for raw damage then Rifle is the way to go. If you’re looking for condition damage, then Pistol is the way to go.

If you’re looking for “MOAR DMG” then yes, your TK/FT combo won’t cut it but if that’s what you like playing then why change it?

Condi damage is king in sPvP right now, I’m confused by this topic. Even if it weren’t, make a good condi build and play what you like. I like P/S so much that pretty much any build I make uses that combo. If you also like P/S, then use it.

If you’re not playing what you want to be playing in a video game… you’re doing it wrong IMO.

Lol, Adamantium, don´t you even consider power-builds would still exist?

Didn´t you hear that power-builds will receive a great buff – with Blunderbuss max-range going up to 500 (talking about throwing a towel on a drowning man . . . )?

I also would like to use a shield in a power-build, but mainhand-pistol simply makes this a bad idea.

OP, you appear a bit misinformed. The P/S is great. The rifle is great. They are simply different.

@Hydeaut, I saw some buff to blunderbuss mentioned. I cannot for the life of me, see how this relates to a “power-builds will receive a great buff”. Blunderbuss damage is based on proximity. the closer you are the more damage it does, so adding range to this sure seems useless to me.

thx for feedback, but still… as condi pistol i have trouble with

- burst. my condis take time, meanwhile i’m dead;
- i love confusion. but beyond newbies enemy notices when i land significant stack (like tool kit #3) and sits it out;
- bleed and poison is often already stacked on enemy and i’m just waisting my time.
- this only leaves me with burning. i get some burning, including using fire field comb on pistol #1. but burning not quite consistent. for instance flamethrower #1 burning is not easy land;
- i love flamethrower, but is it more for power, or condi?
- i get around 1k condi damage in my build stats, is that enough?

maybe i need to improve my build? use elixir gun? i’m not too fond of bombs in pvp, i dont bunker. i’ll post my build later. thx for helping.

-Well of course you not doing burst damage with conditions. If at any point you thought it would be otherwise, I would be inclined to ask why.

- If they are “sitting it out” with confusion stacks, that means, based on condition duration, that it is 5s-10s that I am damaging them or my other conditions are ticking their health away, that they are not hitting me. I cannot see a downside here.

- bleed and poison work completely different. You can stack 25 bleeds. Poison though, is duration based, and yes, this certainly is a problem.

-How can you complain about poison but not burning in the same boat?

-The Flamethrower. oh it is absolutely a power kit, if you trying to use it under the pretense of condition damage, then that is indeed a problem.

- No that isn’t but 1/2 the condition damage other players will have. So of coarse your conditions will feel inferior in comparison to others around you.

coglin.1867:

- No that isn’t but 1/2 the condition damage other players will have. So of coarse your conditions will feel inferior in comparison to others around you.

2k condi damage in sPvP is a lot without some might stacking.

Didn’t even realize the OP specifically mentioned sPvP till you pointed it out Noss. So I guess you can ignore that aspect of my comment above. Thanks for catching that.

@coglin
I agree on many counts.

You are right about sitting out confusions and me doing damage, but for instance I had a thief yesterday, who went in stealth and quiet once I got 5-6 confusions on him, so that’s wasted. I also had a hunter, who slowed me and went out of my range and quiet. I agree, it’s not supposed to work on all classes guaranteed, but most specs seem to find a way to disengage and sit out confusion. I try not to pull it off in the beginning of combat, may be in the middle, in the heat of fight enemy will notice it less, but still, most players do notice it.

from what you said, I believe flamethrower is my main problem. its not fitting in condi build. also I pick traits for flamethrower, but those don’t have condi stats.

I like tool kit and it has big confusions on #3. what else should I use, elixir gun? I’m not much fond of bombs and bunking. I use grenades sometimes in big fights when you can shower from above, but it’s small and 1v1 fights that I’m most eager to win.

below is my build (roughly, i have exact screenshot on home comp). now that I look at it, it’s sort of smudge between power and condi and I get both lackluster.
http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-VRw;0B-Z-Vv0l6cQFx0;9;49JJJ-4;027-47-46;2Kc0;3cV19cV197BR

Yeah, your build is very hybrid in my opinion. You could use this build that is a condition duration sPvP build, good for confusion. It has the EG for utility.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQJAqel0pqb3zSyF17IBoH6Nv1XUh8/5xblbaB-ToAAzCpIKS9l7LTRyvsfNIYWB

or you can use Rocket boots in place of the EG for the burn from rocket kick, and a bit more mobility.

but now looking again at flamethrower, is it a power weapon? it has more damage on condi. #1 and #3 has burning, #4 I use with pistol #1 for burning combo.

true #1 burning is hard to land. and #2 (I love that blast) is only power. but still…

gesho.9468:

but now looking again at flamethrower, is it a power weapon? it has more damage on condi. #1 and #3 has burning, #4 I use with pistol #1 for burning combo.

true #1 burning is hard to land. and #2 (I love that blast) is only power. but still…

Skill #3 on the FT does not apply burning. It increases any burning you have already applied on your target by the indicated amount. I’m surprised they didn’t fix that tooltip with all the work they did on tooltips.

Also if you want to do conditions, go full conditions. In sPvP this means choosing Rabid amulet and Runes of the Undead for starters. You could tweak the runes around a bit, but that combo gives the most condition damage in sPvP. Also make sure you go as deep as your build permits into the Firearms tree.

Adamantium.3682:

Skill #3 on the FT does not apply burning. It increases any burning you have already applied on your target by the indicated amount. I’m surprised they didn’t fix that tooltip with all the work they did on tooltips.

Also if you want to do conditions, go full conditions. In sPvP this means choosing Rabid amulet and Runes of the Undead for starters. You could tweak the runes around a bit, but that combo gives the most condition damage in sPvP. Also make sure you go as deep as your build permits into the Firearms tree.

wow, thx for #3 tip.

are you saying flamethrower is viable for condi spvp?

gesho.9468:

Adamantium.3682:

Skill #3 on the FT does not apply burning. It increases any burning you have already applied on your target by the indicated amount. I’m surprised they didn’t fix that tooltip with all the work they did on tooltips.

Also if you want to do conditions, go full conditions. In sPvP this means choosing Rabid amulet and Runes of the Undead for starters. You could tweak the runes around a bit, but that combo gives the most condition damage in sPvP. Also make sure you go as deep as your build permits into the Firearms tree.

wow, thx for #3 tip.

are you saying flamethrower is viable for condi spvp?

There are two ways to use the flamethrower in my mind. One, as your main weapon. In this case you are using Juggernaut and as much might stacking gear/traits as you can get. Two, as a utility. You only pop into it for the fire field when you need it, AOE blind, or knockback. Sometimes #2 burst damage if the opportunity arises.

As utility it fits in any build IMO. As your main weapon, I would only use it in a power build.

Adamantium.3682:

There are two ways to use the flamethrower in my mind. One, as your main weapon. In this case you are using Juggernaut and as much might stacking gear/traits as you can get. Two, as a utility. You only pop into it for the fire field when you need it, AOE blind, or knockback. Sometimes #2 burst damage if the opportunity arises.

As utility it fits in any build IMO. As your main weapon, I would only use it in a power build.

I guess elixir gun trumps flamethrower then.

I looked at numbers, elixir gun is pretty decent with full condi stat (~1.3k), on par with rifle. but rifle crit still leaves condi behind.

rifle #1 is ~600 in zerker build, with ~50% crit chance and say 30% crit damage this is about 850dmg/0.75sec=1130 dps

elixir gun #1 with 1.3k condi damage makes about 600dmg/0.75sec=800dps

rifle autoattack ends up about +50% above elixir gun. pistol #1 is even further behind.

doesn’t look like other skills would look any better. jump shot and blunderbuss with crit hit 2-3k easily.

this is prob compensated by condi hp having about the same +50% larger hp then zerker rifle. so its kinda on par?

Trying to calculate the numbers, especially with condition damage, is very tricky. Rifle hits for 1-2000 in Zerker builds, not 6-800. The other numbers are not quite right either, there’s just too much going into it to be able to calculate it so cut and dry.

What’s important is that the Elixir Gun will give you a decent auto attack in a condition build if that’s what you want to go for, the rifle or FT would not. A Grenadier build is probably the best way to quickly burst conditions on your opponent.

ok, with all of that, how does this look like? skillset is down, im also attaching screenshot for traits.

http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQJAqelspqbH5SfF1LJSoCFGoH1HfNiiUgZW2nCsFA-ToAAzCpI+SplTLjWStsaNCYWC

alchemy #9 vs #7 is a touch choice, when elixir gun in main weapon. may be I should get both and drop protective shield in inventions?

Keep in mind damage boosts affect only direct damage. If you want a condition damage build it isn’t going to give you much of a boost. Same goes with Modified Ammo.

Something else to keep in mind is bleed duration. You only get damage from a bleed at every full second. This means a bleed of 2 seconds ticks 2 times. A bleed of 2.9 seconds also ticks 2 times. Extra bleed duration on your sigil is only helpful if it gets you over the threshold for another second on some of your bleeds. I don’t think it does in this build.

I made a couple of changes, trying to keep the spirit of your build (I’m not just going to make it a nade build if you don’t want to use that):
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?fcAQJAqelspqbnuSgF1LJxoCdGki6zXRPy/jn8nCsF-ToAAzCpIaS1krJTTymsNNWYmB

I stuck with the main parts of your build, Coated Bullets and Elixir Gun. I also gave you HGH for some added damage. I feel you can have fun with this in hotjoin sPvP, then improve on it from there. It’s not ideal, but if this is what you enjoy that’s all that matters. I believe you can be effective in hot join with this build.

yes, you are right about elixir gun +15% dmg, regen is better.

and thx for the bleed tip, that wont work then

I’m not crazy about grenades. only in bigger fights. are they viable in small, 1v1 fights? nobody’s staying in those circles.

okay, so elixir C? cause now with egun I got tool belt breaker. well, I guess I can use belt invisibility+tool kit #4 block as my panic buttons, instead of elixir S.

now about hgh. i’m about to try this with dummy golem, but isnt hgh about elixirs that you drink/toss only? that is, elixir gun skills wont count to it?

overall, thx buddy, you’ve been very helpful.

Why do you have the trait “infused precession” (III) in the fire arms line? Its is not going to do much for you in in your build. You would be much better off going for the 20% weapons cool down reduction trait.

coglin.1867:

Why do you have the trait “infused precession” (III) in the fire arms line? Its is not going to do much for you in in your build. You would be much better off going for the 20% weapons cool down reduction trait.

swiftness is always useful, isn’kitten you always try to get away or catch up. with elixir gun (and I’m thinking of adding grenades) you need to keep the some distance. so….

as for weapon cooldown, for elixir gun shorter cooldown wont do much. main damage is from autoattack (exciting). #5 healing is not that important, since I have regen from alchemy#9 anyway.

I tried that build yesterday, not too crazy about it.

I am not suggesting swiftness isn’t useful, I am simply suggesting that it is much less useful a trait benefit then several of the other traits benefits are in its place.

gesho.9468:

I guess elixir gun trumps flamethrower then.

I looked at numbers, elixir gun is pretty decent with full condi stat (~1.3k), on par with rifle. but rifle crit still leaves condi behind.

rifle #1 is ~600 in zerker build, with ~50% crit chance and say 30% crit damage this is about 850dmg/0.75sec=1130 dps

elixir gun #1 with 1.3k condi damage makes about 600dmg/0.75sec=800dps

rifle autoattack ends up about +50% above elixir gun. pistol #1 is even further behind.

doesn’t look like other skills would look any better. jump shot and blunderbuss with crit hit 2-3k easily.

this is prob compensated by condi hp having about the same +50% larger hp then zerker rifle. so its kinda on par?

Nice calculation, but you forgot that while you are a full zerker in order to reach those numbers with rifle, you gave up things what your condition build has. For example toughness, and / or vitality depends on the gear.
In full Dire armor you got tons of vitality and toughness next to your condition damage, Rabid is awesome with Incendiary Powder. I can’t see the problem of surviving as condition engineer, while you playing as a zerker engi.