Guild Wars 2

So, I know the nerfs to scrapper weren’t as severe as they probably could have been, but the decreased damage on some hammer abilities coupled with not being able to pop Medic-Gyro/Reconstruction Field while channeling has really made me think about trying out the old Rifle/Grenade/Toolkit for a bit this season. (Either way I think it’s definitely back to Healing Turret.)

Mostly just to be able to actually kill somebody… The reduced Electrowhirl really kitten our kill combo, which got me thinking about the old tool kit pull, confuse, rifle rotation..

But I feel like losing regen on swiftness/stability on evade/ranged rezs and stomps might be too much to give up.

Most other engineers I see are still running Power Hammer, but I dunno, thought I would see what the forum crowd thinks. So, sup?

Scrapper really hasn’t changed at all in its SPvP role or its capability to fulfill it. It’s still a good pick for a team, in my opinion at least. Also… Electrowhirl didn’t get nerfed. Shock Shield and Thunderclap received the changes.

the main problem with core engi versus any elite spec is that most of the meta builds have offense coupled with strong defense. any matchup against at least half of the classes will go something like:

• you throw all 5 nades
• they evade/block/invuln/nullify the damage while attacking you, and you have to take the damage

and since you have to take that damage, you lose.

it doesnt really matter how well you set up the fight, if you land your rifle 4 and 2, if you pull, or if you do any of it from invis. the elite specs incorporate stunbreaks, stability, protection, etc, and are prepared to deal with your engagement and counter it with skills you could never have even dreamed of having before HoT, because the devs gave us a bunch of things that simply do 2 or 3 skills’ worth of things at once.

In my opinion engi is really in a good spot .
Scrapper is really strong even after last nerfs and it is the way to go if you want to play high level i think. If you want to play as a casual player ( no tournament and all) but only make seasons vanilla engi can be really fun and strong. Condition engineer can be really really strong in this meta . Rifle in my opinion is not that great now but pistol pistol can be really impressive. It is a different way of play from scrapper but you can win and carry teams even with that. The great difference is that you have to learn it and to learn what you can not win.
In s3 i arrived diamond with this build ( really common , not mine ) , it has a strong burst and it is quite good in 1 vs 1 excpet against full condi classes :
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vdAQJAqalUUhatYJXw+KQ+FLsF1YbMG/oYHNFPB4HWiBAA-TJRHABJVGAgTAQwPAgK2fAA

Now i changed, i found that there are too many conditions and i find this build stronger. You have less burst but you have 2 great thing :
– really strong against condition classes
– great support, the 2 light field with mortar and eg are really strong in teamfights against condi party
http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vdAQJAqalUUh2tYBWw+KQ7FLsFlYHNFPB4HWiBQ4SdRvGA-TJRFABds/AAnAgkfAARVGAA
The strong points of this build are the passive and active defence you have ( field of mortar on points can be really strong ) and the great condi remove. It is not a pure hgh build but when the fight become long your might stack up and your damage becomes quite strong . You have less access to burning but IP is quite strong and also pistol 4 and with 3 blast you can put out a lot of combo. ( i really love when melee pistol 5, pistol 4 , eg 4 for example ) . Even this build is not mine

PierPiero.9142:

You could try playing the scrapper variant which addresses some of the condi and general survability issues with the scrapper traitline.
http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?vdAQJAqanUUB1ah1XBmcBEqiF2iSsjminAMELxAgO4H+kH-TJhMAB0UGg5HAAA7Pw6JAAA

Krag.6210:

PierPiero.9142:

You could try playing the scrapper variant which addresses some of the condi and general survability issues with the scrapper traitline.
http://en.gw2skills.net/editor/?vdAQJAqanUUB1ah1XBmcBEqiF2iSsjminAMELxAgO4H+kH-TJhMAB0UGg5HAAA7Pw6JAAA

I tried but it is much weaker imho than tools variant :
– you lose chemical round … so you lose 50% condi duration increase on pistol ( great loss)
– you lose the reduction on toolbet skill recharge (15%) so you lose damage from ft toolbet, and stealth reduction and also toolkit toolbet .
– you lose power wrench so you lose really much ( block , prybar, pull ) … the block every 13.5 secs is really strong
– you lose speed out of combat …. ( for me it is quite a must playing in solo to have at least the 25% speed)
- you lose kinetik battery : when you get used to it you can use stealth twice or ft toolbet skill twice ( a lot of damage )
- you gain 20% condi reduction … it is strong but not enough imho for 1vs 1 a condi warrior or a condi necro
- you gain sneak gyro : i usually don’t take it neither with scrapper becouse good players see you from gyro … i prefer elixir X .
- the survivability you get in my opinion does not not compensate the loss of damage and the loss of skill reductions , u don’t have access to superspeed so 101 heal for sec is better that nothing but not that great with a vitality of only 15k. It is more different with paladin or marauder where you have more than 25% of vitality (21.5k ..or so)
In my opinion the not scrapper variant is stronger but it is a personal choice and perhaps the fact that i am used to it

In your build i’d swap elixir S for elixir B or elixir C if there is a really strong condi party

insanemaniac has it exactly right. You can play vanilla, but you’re putting yourself at a disadvantage.

Meta/HoT builds attack while defending. Vanilla builds don’t.

Eg. Compare Gear Shield to Shield of Courage. One is a 3 second block that does nothing else. The other is a 5 second block (of a ~75% forward cone) for 5 seconds that lets you attack.

Take Zerker invulns like 8 seconds of endure pain and 18(!!!) seconds of resistance + every minute. In that time they get free reign to kill and survive virtually unopposed. The only counter is to moa them, or pop invulns of your own and run very far away. Compare that to Elixir S, which is 3-6 seconds of invuln every minute and you might die to condis while it’s active if you’re not careful. Oh, and you can’t do damage.

Obviously, there are differences between classes, but in general, meta builds deal damage while safely defending or healing. Older non-HoT specs weren’t designed that way, and they deal less damage as well. Other than novelty, there’s no reason to choose them.

coro.3176:

insanemaniac has it exactly right. You can play vanilla, but you’re putting yourself at a disadvantage.

Meta/HoT builds attack while defending. Vanilla builds don’t.

Eg. Compare Gear Shield to Shield of Courage. One is a 3 second block that does nothing else. The other is a 5 second block (of a ~75% forward cone) for 5 seconds that lets you attack.

Take Zerker invulns like 8 seconds of endure pain and 18(!!!) seconds of resistance + every minute. In that time they get free reign to kill and survive virtually unopposed. The only counter is to moa them, or pop invulns of your own and run very far away. Compare that to Elixir S, which is 3-6 seconds of invuln every minute and you might die to condis while it’s active if you’re not careful. Oh, and you can’t do damage.

Obviously, there are differences between classes, but in general, meta builds deal damage while safely defending or healing. Older non-HoT specs weren’t designed that way, and they deal less damage as well. Other than novelty, there’s no reason to choose them.

There is a great reason to play vanilla …. scrapper is boring, at least for me and after some matches i need to change

maybe its fun to change things up and maybe you do well cuz you know how to play it against your opponents and they dont know how to counter you (until they learn after dying once, twice, 3x, after a match…) but if you go with boring then on average boring will be just plain better. and in pvp, making another class isnt a big deal. you have 5 character slots to start and you can make a toon and immediately play it at its strongest so theres really no reason to be bored with the build you are playing when there are 8~15 other meta builds that are just as strong as the thing youre bored with but have different playstyles.

In my experience, condition engineer is a lot better without the Scrapper trait line. If you take Scrapper, you either lose Inventions/Tools, or Alchemy, you lose movement speed as well as other good traits, and you do not get enough value in return. Having to walk around at base speed is just agonizing. You could use speed runes, but then you lose half your damage output since no Balthazar runes.