Guild Wars 2

Good morning/evening fellows of GW2! Straight to the point —

I’ve finally come to reaching a level 80 Guardian alt, and my goal for this was having a potential build that’s capable of having survivability and supportive offers such as healing and boon duration.

“Why not l33t z3rk3r, br0?”

Because I have enough berserker or half-berserker toons (mediums and heavies) and I want to switch things up.

I’m mostly aiming toward using this in dungeons.
So what sort of direction should I head toward, in terms of stats, gear, and trinkets?

Any form—way, shape, or size—of advice is appreciated!

Why you wouldn’t want to use zerker and knowingly be worse than others is beyond me… https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/guardian/Guide-DPS-Guardian-for-PVE/first

Gives all the support you need along with great dps, sustain comes from playing ability, and of course full zerker everything, healing power in dungeons just harms your team more than anything and people who use it are bad

IF you don’t want zerkers, then just run knights instead? I’m all for people running whatever builds they like but to run something just because it’s not zerkers doesn’t make alot of sense to me. Unless you have a reason other than “just to be different”, the only recommendation would be to run something that isn’t zerkers.

Perhaps you can provide more context to what other benefits you are after or want to provide that you feel zerkers doesn’t give you?

Guardians provide support through boons, blocks, blinds, reflects, strong defensive abilities. All of these come from picking proper utilities for an encounter and rely in no way, shape or form on your choice of gear. It’s been explained countless times why zerker gear is the “best” for dungeons. Guardians bring more ways for their party to completely avoid damage than almost every other class (aegis, reflects) and since these are independent of any stat it just doesn’t make sense to not go full offensive.

If you really feel the need to contribute beyond pure damage and appropriate utilities then go for a zerker hammer build. It still does pretty good damage and maintains 100% uptime on protection for your party, which can be cool if they don’t mind a constant light field being up. If you have a might stacking ele you will want to avoid this btw.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vUAQFASl0ApXo1BxUI8DRRkVQk2MIICrPEPMFY0jA-zQBBYfAZmFRjt4qIas6aYKXER1AA-e

That’s what I usually use for a dps hammer build, it’s important to get the two +10% damage modifiers in zeal and radiance. If you want even more support without sacrificing much/any damage you can go for 30 in Honor and have your symbols heal. This provides constant protection and aoe healing for your group, which can be kinda cool. Imo the meta full zerker s/f gs build is my favorite though:

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vUAQNAR8dl0ApXo1BxUI8DNhkzQkQQbGA0BVpIeuHA-zABBZmFRjt4qIas6aYKXER1AA-e

Tons of blinds and you get an additional block with focus 5. Have fun with guard.

Oh man, always with the zerker..
Yes, yes, we all know it is the most efficient.

But this is a game and sometimes it isn’t about being super uber efficient (surprise), it is about having fun.
He/She specifically asked for a non-zerker build/armor combination, yet you still suggest zerker. What is so wrong in having different playstyles to keep things interesting?

And no build provides 100% protection. The player does that with skillful use of all abilites, dodging the right times and using the skills the most efficient way possible, with careful timing and the knowledge what to use when.
Newsflash, not all players are experienced like that. Not all players are always on high alert. Not all players like going all out offensive.

Well they should, since it’s pretty much the only way to do it without getting kicked from pug groups. If you’re playing with friends/guildmates who are tolerant of slower runs, ask them what they think you should run or what they would find useful.

Consider that Altruistic healing is the Valor line grandmaster trait, where Honor gives healing power and Virtue gives Boon duration, you can’t have them all. ( If you want the highest possible healing/boon duration)

I would suggest wearing PPT or PTV with the DPS Meta. or maybe zerker gear with Altruistic healing builds plus investments in honor line.

full clerics, mace/shield + staff, 0/0/30/30/10

have fun!

try find a balance between damage and support it pays off good especially in pug runs since a lot times you are called to you save the group.

Candacis.7048:

And no build provides 100% protection. The player does that with skillful use of all abilites, dodging the right times and using the skills the most efficient way possible, with careful timing and the knowledge what to use when.
Newsflash, not all players are experienced like that. Not all players are always on high alert. Not all players like going all out offensive.

Yeah, 100% protection sure does take skill.

Equip hammer → Auto attack

Here’s what I’ve been using recently: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vUIQJARWl0ApptFDxfH8DRRkVQk2HAY9h4h9QjwfjA-zgBBoNQYOAZrFRjtOqIasqZER16kYkCwElRA-e

Key features for dungeon use:
Respectable power, excellent healing.
F1 on kill will: vuln, blind, burn, might AoE
With fury about 50% crit chance (more than enough, you will might cap with fire fields and staff)
AoE Might on Crit (1 second cool down)
Passive healing and support built-in
Food / Hallowed Ground for Boon Duration
Mercy Runes because: 4 players hitting a target is slower than 5 players hitting a target. little extra toughness is great. no other stats will boost enough here to be noticed.

Use hammer for tougher, high damage boss fights. i use a zerker scepter/torch for ranged fights. bring mace/focus vs Dredge. Don’t ever use sword.

Stack on fights and have everyone hug you. Dungeons always go faster for me with this than with any other class / build.

Insert snarky response for Zerker/Meta Build rhetoric by someone.

Insert my obligatory play how you want as long as group is ok with it response

…..yeah, I think it’s time for me to retire from this forum.

But seriously, Phantom Tear, go by my second sentence and you’ll have a lot more fun. You can always find a build that’s not meta and do nearly just as good with it if your group insists on max damage. Just have a secondary set of zerker gear with you in cases like these.

hybrid.5027:

full clerics, mace/shield + staff, 0/0/30/30/10

have fun!

Bad traits for a clerics guaridan. AH is useless and not needed. 0/0/10/30//30, 0/0/20/30/20, 0/15/10/20/20, all are much better.
DPS Guard>Rest, but maxheal/support cleric>useless AH Egomanic guard.

BTW: Healingpower ist useless without perma protection, Hammer is a must have.

Candacis.7048:

Oh man, always with the zerker..
Yes, yes, we all know it is the most efficient.

But this is a game and sometimes it isn’t about being super uber efficient (surprise), it is about having fun.
He/She specifically asked for a non-zerker build/armor combination, yet you still suggest zerker. What is so wrong in having different playstyles to keep things interesting?

And no build provides 100% protection. The player does that with skillful use of all abilites, dodging the right times and using the skills the most efficient way possible, with careful timing and the knowledge what to use when.
Newsflash, not all players are experienced like that. Not all players are always on high alert. Not all players like going all out offensive.

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vUAQFACiIwUAAPC + press 1 = 100% protection uptime

Norjena.5172:

hybrid.5027:

full clerics, mace/shield + staff, 0/0/30/30/10

have fun!

Bad traits for a clerics guaridan. AH is useless and not needed. 0/0/10/30//30, 0/0/20/30/20, 0/15/10/20/20, all are much better.
DPS Guard>Rest, but maxheal/support cleric>useless AH Egomanic guard.

BTW: Healingpower ist useless without perma protection, Hammer is a must have.

dont be so elitist against my build please !

You could try knight’s armor with zerker weapon & trinket. The knight is tanky enough without sacrificing the dps too much. Also, it’s great for W vs W roaming with sceptor. I have fun with that. For dungeon and fractals; I would trait it with Obal’s balanced DPS version.

Just for the love of god, do not camp a staff, kk. Been seeing way too many of those lately. I would have to say that playing a zerker guard is a challenge because of the low health pool on addition to the support you bring. I enjoy the extra challenge and it’s not just dps slash slash hack the boss down if that is what is off putting for the whole zerker reasoning. You really do have to think on your feet but the knight’s gear is a good compromise.

I pug 95% of time and spend almost all of it in dungeons and fractals.. the AH/Cleric is terrible. You might be the last person standing but then we have to watch you try to solo the boss for like 15 minutes and painfully watch the health bar not move.. or move a millimeter every five minutes. And if you are suppose to be the healer/tank (hypothetically speaking).. why are we all faceplanted on the floor? That defies the whole logic and theory of your role.

Has anyone used Zealot’s armor? The recipe was cheap to pick up. I wonder if you could make a mace build that works with it. Last time I tried a mace, the damage was pretty awful, but its been a very long time since then. This would be the variation on my usual build (0/10/10/30/20).

http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vUAQJApdl0Apeo1CxVI0ENhkpQkQQsHY0H1RXKooHC

If u don´t need the thoughness, zealot´s is always better then cleric´s.

hybrid.5027:

Norjena.5172:

hybrid.5027:

full clerics, mace/shield + staff, 0/0/30/30/10

have fun!

Bad traits for a clerics guaridan. AH is useless and not needed. 0/0/10/30//30, 0/0/20/30/20, 0/15/10/20/20, all are much better.
DPS Guard>Rest, but maxheal/support cleric>useless AH Egomanic guard.

BTW: Healingpower ist useless without perma protection, Hammer is a must have.

dont be so elitist against my build please !

Just the truth not more, not less. If u don´t like it, play your build, i´ve done my job it is your choice.

Hahaha at op, look I finally got my hunting license for exotic animals…. everyone hunts elephants with rifles, so Im gonna go knife, Im tired of being alive.

Here a build that could work for you Phantomtear.

Hammer build. Its less DPS than S/F – GS, but it still good. Like the meta you support your team with virtues (Blind, Might, Vulnerability, aegis), and utilities (reflect, aegis, etc). But the hammer build also bring constant protection to your team in melee, which is really powerful. This build is especially good in fractal, but you can an awesome job in dungeon too. Of course this build is more support oriented, so you should go full zerker for your gear to keep a good DPS. But you can take a mix of zerker and valkyrie (to get a bit more hp if you need it) or knight (if you need more toughness).

hybrid.5027:

full clerics, mace/shield + staff, 0/0/30/30/10

have fun!

You are trolling surely… I mean in an open world where you solo most of the time.. use whatever you want but you suggested the 3 worst weapons for a guard. That would deserve a kick on any team.

A hammer build is something I have not used before personally.. I prefer to slash and hack.. but would be perfect for more supportive guardian role. I have been in fractals with a hammer guardian and it provided nice synergy.

layzoe.6035:

hybrid.5027:

full clerics, mace/shield + staff, 0/0/30/30/10

have fun!

You are trolling surely…

That was obvious from the very beginning. Cookie did what he had to do on this forum.

CptAurellian.9537:

layzoe.6035:

hybrid.5027:

full clerics, mace/shield + staff, 0/0/30/30/10

have fun!

You are trolling surely…

That was obvious from the very beginning. Cookie did what he had to do on this forum.

That level of sarcasm was apparently too high for some people. O_O

Well you never know on the guard section when most people still think Cleric and AH is the way to go.. but yeah totally went over my head.

What am I missing that makes a support guard so bad? Saving the group from a wipe on many occasions already has made it seem quite nice to me. I’ve tried DPS and with just my Virtue and normal heal power to get me back up I can’t help but feel very limited(although I may be playing it wrong just recently tried it). Where with support setup I keep myself up np and I provide a lot of heals and what not to the group to keep them at top damage. keeping the group above 90% to fully utilize the scholar runes.

I’m new, so I feel like I’m missing something here, why are support guardians a joke? Of course more damage is always good, but if the group is wiping or having a lot of people die and what not… what good is your extra damage if the group as a whole is struggling more?

Personally I’ve been running soldier’s gear with 2 water, 2 monk, 2 traveler runes for max boon duration. Cleric weapons with a renewal in staff and the life one in hammer. I run the 0/0/30/30/10 build. Now I play in mostly a preset group, but the way we have it set up we still plow through dungeons in < 10 mins and with very few stressful parts and most of the time everyone is full health with 20+ might stacks from me and the ele.

Now personally I’m looking to try and do the more DPS focused builds here and try it out, but I just don’t see how anyone can say a support guardian isn’t worthwhile. Maybe if your group is awesome and never gets touched, but I find myself quite busy doing the support role.

I will echo the love for the hammer though, it’s very very nice. I usually run staff/hammer. Might/Runspeed/Line/tons of healing on staff. Hammer… protection! and if that’s not enough it has an inturrupt and a snare as well as a blast finisher for more might stacking or chaos armor, and if none of those fields are around even ae retaliation isn’t bad.

There is nothing wrong with a support guardian.. after all that is what guardians are suppose to do.. support.. but I think the whole, “Hey I am a healer/tank and that’s what I do” is really limiting the guardian role.. there are so many other supports you provide. The thing is that guards have a great dps potential that you are not utilizing by traiting yourself to be a bunker/support only. Also it’s difficult to gauge who the boss is going to target so you can’t really fully play the bunker role every time.

You should be bringing dps along with support because really killing the boss as quickly as possible is the best thing you can do for your team. Why, because the longer the boss is up, the higher chance the group has to wipe.. everyone runs out of heals, utilities.. ect ect. So dps should also be part of your build because even if you are the last person standing because of your uber toughness and vitality.. you won’t be doing any damage to the boss and eventually, you will die too. I have seen this happen a lot firsthand.

And even if you are a dps guardian, you still provide tons of support, condition cleanser, stability, blind spam, reflections and such.. which bring more to the encounters than you could ever imagine.

KK that sounds more reasonable than what I was getting from a lot of the talk.

I’m working on the DPS side, but currently even in knights gear I feel squishy. A little mistake and boom. Where when i’m set up in my support side I laugh at most of the things. So plenty of stuff for me to work on till I can survive it all easy.

And yeah, most guardian utility isn’t limited by the traits you pick. Reflection, Stability, etc, all still there, just longer with correct traits/setup. If I drop staff I won’t stack as much might most of the time, but I’d be gaining blinds from GS, a pull, and a good bit of burst damage. If I drop my rune setup my stability doesn’t last as long, but the fight is also going to be shorter.

I played my guy to 80 with a very DPS heavy build, but then I went more support, and my group likes support guardian so /shrug. Swapping staff for healing. Using it for Swiftness etc, it’s nice.

But at least I understand the point, and I do agree, more damage is always good. But at least I know I’m not missing something, and I’ll probably stick to my support guardian build for my preset group as they like the extra safety net I provide (as do I honestly).

I’ve always felt every game goes by a simple principle. You have enough defense eventually, but you’ll never have enough damage, more is always good. So once my group starts surviving well enough then maybe I’ll look at swapping completely, until then I’ll be trying to master the DPS side in PUGs and what not, trying not to die hehe.

Well, if your group likes you to play that role then stick with it. I think Hammer build is best for the supportive guardians more so than the staff if you choose to go that route. I don’t play with the hammer. Would look silly on my tiny human guardian female. (I kid…) The might stacking isn’t that great on a staff tbh. The duration is too short. I used to do the staff/greatsword until I switched to gs/s +f. It’s surprising that I love the dps and dropping the ai like the boss on my guard since I traditionally played healer/support on other mmos.

I personally like the balanced version with extra dps. You will feel squishy if you are used to the clerics and AH at first.. but over time.. you will get used to it. It just takes time and experience, that’s all. Spam F1, 4 and 5 on Focus, Leap of Faith to get over trash mobs, dodging (obviously), wall of reflection I use all the time.. if you use gs 2 with it.. it can be extra condi cleanser.

I think of a guardian as a tactician which is why it’s my favorite professional along with the mesmer.

Staff + Hammer is my setup, I guess I should say Hammer + Staff as Hammer is surely the main thing to it, but staff is just such a good offhand, swap for burst healing, might, and swiftness, and that line isn’t even half bad.

Basically start each fight with a might stack, then swap to 2h in time to catch our ele’s or mesmer’s field for a blast finisher from the hammer(chaos armor or group might, both nice). It’s pretty nice.

I don’t swap to staff for just the might anymore, but I find myself swapping to it to top my group off (if they are above 90% they do more damage too!) so aside from starting a fight with might it’s a nice fringe benefit to the healing staff provides.

And yeah, I’ve always been a support guy, but I do fully understand the benefits of damage, and I always end up kinda hybridizing myself to maximize damage while still carrying out all the other things I’m expected to get done.

But, I figured I’ll learn DPS first, then start tweaking my main support build to customize and maximize it.

I just had to ask because I had seen things said as far as “a support guardian does more harm than good” and I was sitting scratching my head as that just seemed absurd. Glad to hear my thinking was right. It may not be optimal but it’s an option.

And Asura ftw. Guardian Asura, Norn Mesmer… makes sense right? tiny tanky guy, giant squishy, mhm.

Jerus.4350:

I just had to ask because I had seen things said as far as “a support guardian does more harm than good” and I was sitting scratching my head as that just seemed absurd. Glad to hear my thinking was right. It may not be optimal but it’s an option.

Be aware that people will be willing to say whatever is necessary to convince others there is a ‘right’ way to do things in this game so more people adopt this style of gameplay, sometimes in opposition to how they wish to play themselves. Don’t forget why you like to play this game and you won’t be misled by this crusade to convert the ‘baddies’.

Obtena.7952:

Jerus.4350:

I just had to ask because I had seen things said as far as “a support guardian does more harm than good” and I was sitting scratching my head as that just seemed absurd. Glad to hear my thinking was right. It may not be optimal but it’s an option.

Be aware that people will be willing to say whatever is necessary to convince others there is a ‘right’ way to do things in this game so more people adopt this style of gameplay, sometimes in opposition to how they wish to play themselves. Don’t forget why you like to play this game and you won’t be misled by this crusade to convert the ‘baddies’.

Thanks for the advice, and absolutely.

My thought is read and listen, test stuff and see how it works, but go to whatever I feel is best for myself. Fact is i’m not the most talented gamer, but there’s yet to be a game I couldn’t beat (or for MMOs content that I haven’t beat).

So what works for those DNT guys may work best for them, but me, who might not be as spot on with the evades or what not may find something else to be superior.