Guild Wars 2

What happened to this idea?
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/8/84/Guardian_06_concept_art_(Judgment).jpg

Personally, I doubt that I’m the only one ( or in the minority ) who would rather play Ritualist like Guardian more than a Ranger Trapper Guardian.
Spirit Weapon skills have been in the game ever since beta, and while, if I’m not mistaken, some minor buffs have been given to them, they’ve never been anywhere remotely viable or good, neither in PvE or PvP.

If you (Arena Ne)t, have no intentions of making these skills useable, which unfortunately seems so, why not remove them and replace with other skills, like a speed Signet? You already did that to Tomes instead of trying to fix them.

All of the recently announced changes have been to elite specs only, as you would expect while the expansion is wrapping up its beta. There will be a class-wide balancing pass shortly after launch. If anything is going to happen to Spirit Weapons (which I doubt), it’ll happen then.

Spirit weapons died long time ago, leave them to rest in peace.

Minions aren’t affected by AOEs in raids so spirit weapons will give DPS guards a huge damage boost.

spirit weapons are so unused that they have longer durations ingame than on the wiki but noones ever fixed it

when i tried them in pvp for a few matches i feel they were pretty useful with a supporty guardian, what really killed them was the downtime. And getting cleaved, of course.

TBH, to be done properly, they probably deserve their own Elite Spec which morphs the Virtues into spirit weapons.

Spirit Weapons need a raw damage buff or bring back the trait that increased their raw damage.

Mallis.4295:

Minions aren’t affected by AOEs in raids so spirit weapons will give DPS guards a huge damage boost.

However given that they don’t stay up indefinitely like other minions you still end up losing quite a bit of potential while their CD’s are ticking.

Not to mention the fact that while they won’t die to AOE they do have a tendency to attract a ton of aggro and can easily be 1 shot by a champ.

Really spirit weapons were better at launch when they were invulnerable but did crap damage unless buffed to extremes.

As they are now guardians would be better off with them being redesigned to be more like banners or ele conjure weapons.

If spirit weapons had reduced cast times similar to traps in BWE3 & started their CDs once summoned do players think this would help smooth out spirit weapons gameplay. My thoughts move along these lines. Fixing this might not solve all their issues as they might need that something extra like traps.. Boons but I believe will be a long way in helping improve them.

Spirit Weapons literally only need the cooldown to start on cast. Weapon uptime is the main problem those skills face. Considering they’re vulnerable to damage and most already can’t achieve 100% uptime, they become closer to minion style play. Making this change would actually open up a lot of synergy with builds. You could make a build similar to cleric MM necro, make good use of Ranger runes, ect. Sword and Hammer deal damage, shield is mostly utility, and bow is pure support. Have the skills keep their current cooldowns, let sword have 100% uptime, none of the other weapons will be up that long. The counter play is killing the minions, which puts the skills on long cooldowns. Currently they have long cooldowns regardless of if they’re killed or not.

Adjusting when the cooldown starts is really the only necessary change.

Ghotistyx.6942:

Adjusting when the cooldown starts is really the only necessary change.

I think this would be a great change & maybe they won’t need any other benefits but I believe we won’t really know if they do or not until cast time & CD game play feels smooth providing worthwhile windows of spirit weapon use.

Spirit Weapons… used to be invulnerable… and used to do about twice their current damage and had a normal auto attack speed that we use on our auto’s.

Then… the hammer dropped… and that was that.

If you want to fix them Spirit Weapons, my suggestion would be to let the CD for the Spirit Weapon start as soon as you summon it. This would give you a permanent sword, and a much easier accessible to the other weapons with only minor CDs between uses…

But hey, I’ve only been saying this for 3 years now…

But Mesmer Phantasms are ok.

Sarif.1827:

Spirit Weapons… used to be invulnerable… and used to do about twice their current damage and had a normal auto attack speed that we use on our auto’s.

Yea but you forget, spirt weapons would could cause burning too with a trait. But it was useless since burning didn’t stack. They probably do more damage than they once did if you have a condi build.

Aza.2105:

Sarif.1827:

Spirit Weapons… used to be invulnerable… and used to do about twice their current damage and had a normal auto attack speed that we use on our auto’s.

Yea but you forget, spirt weapons would could cause burning too with a trait. But it was useless since burning didn’t stack. They probably do more damage than they once did if you have a condi build.

It isn’t enough. I’ve already attempted it.

Needless to say this issue needs to be fixed now while all classes are being looked at, otherwise …it might take much longer

We can all agree spirit weapons are subpar (they suck) xpt for shield which is extremely situational

And sadly they make up one of the most class defining features of the game. So its really sad they are so underused.

I was thinking of a few ways they could be improved:

1) Return invulnerability as they were during launch
2) Have skill cooldown start the moment when the spirit weapon is supposed, not when it is destroyed. They should double the duration. In addition, increase the HP and damage/healing of each weapon.
And my favorite:
3) Add pulsing boon application to each weapon. You could even have this linked to a GM trait somewhere in zeal. My idea is to add spirit weapons some of the utility you would otherwise have while using shouts.
- Sword adds pulsing might
- hammer adds pulsing fury
- Shield adds pulsing protection
- Bow adds pulsing regen

Any of these changes would add SO MUCH utility/power to the spirit weapons to make them compete with shouts and medis.

Come on Anet! Spirit weapons ARE the class defining feature of the guardian after all!

They might be better if there was a better way to command them, like attack a target or have them follow you, or stand in this position..

My favorite suggestions for fixing them in PvP would be immunity to cleave and aoe.
The spirit weapons only take damage when they are the primary target of a skill. This means if a opponent is paying attention then the weapon dies instantly same as before, but if left alone they are effectively immune to damage and can wreck havoc.

The Sword and Shield command skills also needs to be updated like the Bow of Truth. Both of these usually end up striking nothing.

Mr OHat.6514:

Aza.2105:

Sarif.1827:

Spirit Weapons… used to be invulnerable… and used to do about twice their current damage and had a normal auto attack speed that we use on our auto’s.

Yea but you forget, spirt weapons would could cause burning too with a trait. But it was useless since burning didn’t stack. They probably do more damage than they once did if you have a condi build.

It isn’t enough. I’ve already attempted it.

Clearly doing it wrong. You get around 3000 real DPS including downtime out of Sword+Hammer.

1. They need to be invulnerable to damage but not soft cc’s, hard cc’s, blinds, and weakness. This would give them more reliability in combat as well as offer counterplay to them.

2. This might be hard but have them target whatever you are targeting. This means that if you’re playing a support guard, you can have the longbow or shield target a friendly and help/protect them. If you’re playing DPS, you can have them focus whatever enemy you are fighting without having them running around all over the place like headless chickens.

3. Make a trait that enhances what each weapon is good at while also reducing their recharge. Sword gets increased damage and crit chance, hammer gets increased cc time and applies chill or something on auto attack, Shield applies stability in its bubble and now reflects projectiles instead of destroys them, lastly, Bow now cures 2 conditions and applies resistance when using its barrage skill.

4. All active Spirit weapon skills should be ground targeted as these are ALL aoe skills and positioning them should be key to the playstyle.

5. Finally, you should grant yourself and nearby allies a boon every time you use a Spirit Weapon’s active. Shield already gives Aegis. Now have Sword give fury, Hammer give might(this would be awesome with might stacking alongside eles as Hammer active is already a Blast), and have Bow give Regeneration or Protection.

These are some of the things I’d love to see. I think most, if not all, are reasonable suggestions.

Rain.9213:

Make a trait that enhances what each weapon is good at while also reducing their recharge.

Just leave the burning for the DPS weapons.

Mallis.4295:

Rain.9213:

Make a trait that enhances what each weapon is good at while also reducing their recharge.

Just leave the burning for the DPS weapons.

I suppose that could work too xD Just throwing some ideas out. I’d really love to see Spirit Weapons become viable though. It’s a shame such a cool concept of having weapons fighting alongside you was not executed well.

Another good idea would be to have the Spirit Weapons literally follow you everywhere as you move without AI and instead execute their effects in intervals while you are either attacking for the sword and hammer(like once every 2-3 attacks similar to Justice’s Passive) or just in combat for the longbow and Shield. Kind of like Signets but you have to summon them first and you can cast their actives as you see fit in battle. In a way, this would be more akin to facets on Revenant though but different as well as they only last for a set duration and then you have to resummon them.

Been thinking further about spirit weapons & the Spirit Weapon Judgment image in the OP.

This was one of my favourite images of guardian at release & was why I unlocked each spirit weapon as soon as available. But although visibly very amazing summons with each “Balance Change” they became worse & worse.

But spirit weapons functional (cast time, cooldown, movement, targeting) need massive changes. For any interested I’ve previously posted Spirit Weapons – A Crazy Idea a redesign of SWs. The only thing I want to take from this redesign relates back to the Judgment image with how the spirit weapons seem to be chained to the guardian.

So Melee Functionality design using my redesign of SW’s, DH traps & old mobile Ranger Spirits:

• Cast Time – Reduced 0.5 sec (for the same casting experience BWE3 DH traps provided).
• Recharge – Commences once summoned. This could provide 99% summoned time for some SWs [minus recasting, eg. Sword, Bow] but also guaranteed downtime for the stronger SWs [eg. Hammer, Shield]. (again like how DH traps functioned in BWE3 allowing for pre-combat use without such a harsh punishment for being caught out near the end duration of a summon/s or ).
• Movement – No longer move about as their now chained to the guardian & travel where & how the guardian travels. So they teleport when the guardian teleports, leaps when they leap, travel at super speed when they travels at super speed. You could say movement wise they become like the old mobile spirits of Rangers (you no longer have to worry about that random SW wandering off).
• Attacking/Targeting – Only attacking foes nearby the guardian (unlike Ranger spirits they don’t directly buff the guardians auto attack but function similar to a mobile symbol).
• Command abilities – Still function the same way they currently do. This could mean Sword & Shield are more reliable positionally.
• Health – Still have health & can be killed. With increased timed summoned because of reduced cast time & recharge starting on summon this becomes a more important element of spirit weapon counter play.

I feel with this would provide a smoother experiences without SWs running all over the place & allow for easier focusing of SW’s damage applications & better control over SW’s support abilities.

What we loss is the ability for SWs to harass foes at range making this a larger negative change for ranged gameplay in this regard but could provide a positive as a large deterrent for closing into melee range helping keep foes at range while also guaranteeing benefit from SW support as their always near you.

Having SWs chained to the guardian is both a benefit & a weakness with regards to AoEs:

Weakness

• AoEs / Cleaves – First any AoE /Cleave hitting the guardian will also most likely be damaging the SWs as well.

Advantages

• Chained to Guardian – As they travel now with the guardian leaving the AoE should also remove SWs from said AoE. Now leaving in the hand of the player to remove them from AoEs not relying on an AI script.
• AoE / Cleaves Max Targets – In team / group fights SWs are going to counter towards AoE /Cleave target limits spreading the overall AoE damage over the affected targets plus SWs (Which with cast time & CD changes shouldn’t be as punishing if their killed).

This redesign is only looking at the function / gameplay & mechanics of SWs as a minion not their skill effects or benefits. As it’s not the skill effects or benefits I have problems with but how SWs function. Currently their gameplay mechanics are very awkward & clunky. They so bad that it’s too hard to tell if their skills effects & benefits need improving or not because of this.

Bezagron.7352:

Been thinking further about spirit weapons & the Spirit Weapon Judgment image in the OP.

This was one of my favourite images of guardian at release & was why I unlocked each spirit weapon as soon as available. But although visibly very amazing summons with each “Balance Change” they became worse & worse.

But spirit weapons functional (cast time, cooldown, movement, targeting) need massive changes. For any interested I’ve previously posted Spirit Weapons – A Crazy Idea a redesign of SWs. The only thing I want to take from this redesign relates back to the Judgment image with how the spirit weapons seem to be chained to the guardian.

So Melee Functionality design using my redesign of SW’s, DH traps & old mobile Ranger Spirits:

• Cast Time – Reduced 0.5 sec (for the same casting experience BWE3 DH traps provided).
• Recharge – Commences once summoned. This could provide 99% summoned time for some SWs [minus recasting, eg. Sword, Bow] but also guaranteed downtime for the stronger SWs [eg. Hammer, Shield]. (again like how DH traps functioned in BWE3 allowing for pre-combat use without such a harsh punishment for being caught out near the end duration of a summon/s or ).
• Movement – No longer move about as their now chained to the guardian & travel where & how the guardian travels. So they teleport when the guardian teleports, leaps when they leap, travel at super speed when they travels at super speed. You could say movement wise they become like the old mobile spirits of Rangers (you no longer have to worry about that random SW wandering off).
• Attacking/Targeting – Only attacking foes nearby the guardian (unlike Ranger spirits they don’t directly buff the guardians auto attack but function similar to a mobile symbol).
• Command abilities – Still function the same way they currently do. This could mean Sword & Shield are more reliable positionally.
• Health – Still have health & can be killed. With increased timed summoned because of reduced cast time & recharge starting on summon this becomes a more important element of spirit weapon counter play.

I feel with this would provide a smoother experiences without SWs running all over the place & allow for easier focusing of SW’s damage applications & better control over SW’s support abilities.

What we loss is the ability for SWs to harass foes at range making this a larger negative change for ranged gameplay in this regard but could provide a positive as a large deterrent for closing into melee range helping keep foes at range while also guaranteeing benefit from SW support as their always near you.

Having SWs chained to the guardian is both a benefit & a weakness with regards to AoEs:

Weakness

• AoEs / Cleaves – First any AoE /Cleave hitting the guardian will also most likely be damaging the SWs as well.

Advantages

• Chained to Guardian – As they travel now with the guardian leaving the AoE should also remove SWs from said AoE. Now leaving in the hand of the player to remove them from AoEs not relying on an AI script.
• AoE / Cleaves Max Targets – In team / group fights SWs are going to counter towards AoE /Cleave target limits spreading the overall AoE damage over the affected targets plus SWs (Which with cast time & CD changes shouldn’t be as punishing if their killed).

This redesign is only looking at the function / gameplay & mechanics of SWs as a minion not their skill effects or benefits. As it’s not the skill effects or benefits I have problems with but how SWs function. Currently their gameplay mechanics are very awkward & clunky. They so bad that it’s too hard to tell if their skills effects & benefits need improving or not because of this.

Pretty good ideas. I was thinking of something similar in my last reply. Hopefully some devs see this and find some inspiration for a Spirit Weapon rework!

Bezagron.7352:

Advantages

• Chained to Guardian – As they travel now with the guardian leaving the AoE should also remove SWs from said AoE. Now leaving in the hand of the player to remove them from AoEs not relying on an AI script.
• AoE / Cleaves Max Targets – In team / group fights SWs are going to counter towards AoE /Cleave target limits spreading the overall AoE damage over the affected targets plus SWs (Which with cast time & CD changes shouldn’t be as punishing if their killed).

O forgot to add another benefit is that it helps make these a different & unique minion type when compared to the other profession minions.

I’d have to agree completely on a lot of these points. Not to mention that currently spirit weapons are basically taking up utility slots. They are unused, completely forgotten to most if not ALL guardians. Most players are almost blind to the fact that they exist.

We’re so used to spirit weapons being so bad and unusable that we’ve basically tricked ourselves into thinking they don’t exist. When the fact of the matter is that they do, and they are a part of the “core” utilities of the guardian.

Something needs to be done to drastically change how spirit weapons work in GW2. Or else they will continue to take up utility slots that could have been used for something more practicall

AWACS.6537:

They might be better if there was a better way to command them, like attack a target or have them follow you, or stand in this position..

Shield would be amazing if it were a moving projectile absorbing bubble you could position like Ventari’s Tablet with a flip skill. Probably way too amazing.

Spirit weapons haven’t been touched for quite a while now and even though the traits were merged, the weapons themselves are still crap.

IDEALLY they need to go back and redesign, or update the functionality of some of them, similar to ventari tablet and scrapper gadgets.

I hate passive things like ranger pets, minions, spirit weapons, gadgets etc..

It’s best for everyone in PvP if we don’t encourage them to start buffing crap like that unless it’s pure support and no damage.

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

I hate passive things like ranger pets, minions, spirit weapons, gadgets etc..

It’s best for everyone in PvP if we don’t encourage them to start buffing crap like that unless it’s pure support and no damage.

I disagree. You want some kind of variation. If spirit weapons only gave buffs, why bother using them over shouts

Besides, they are for people who want more offensive options

Here is how I’d change spirit weapons.

Hammer: causes a pulsing tremor(radius 300) . Used to control a point or assist in rezzing teammates

Long bow: periodically fires a cleansing arrow causing all conditions to be turned to boons on a radius(600)

Shield: samething really

Sword: periodically attacks in a circle causing 10 stacks of vuln on hit (600 radius)

I actually really like Spirit Weapons when solo or in a non-meta team. The damage is actuall fairly solid when traited, though not game breaking, and when you run both the sword and the hammer it’s easy to alternate between them and then spawn both of them when you want to pile on the pressure, especially if you have Feel My Wrath to use.

The bow and shield are both also useful at points, though recent changes to the game that have given literally everyone projectile blocking or reflection skills means the shield isn’t as super helpful as it used to be.

This build has served me well: http://gw2skills.net/editor/?vVAQRArf8dl0AhqgYRQwOIQQEHxDVNA2yBwuBvwjmTxWcGB-TRiAABXr8D6TAQX7HAwTAIa9DCcQAqW9nlWQgNlgBAOA2tu1tvBjP+4jP+4t7u7u7u7WKAIWWB-e

Guardians are already a strong, survivable, and supporty class with a lot of gameplay options. It never bothered me that the utilities often have long recharge times. I don’t really think spirit weapons need to be perma.

I certainly hope the Devs can see that with the not infrequent Spirit Weapon threads popping up on this forum, there is most certainly a serious desire to see this utility rectified.

I am absolutely one of those players who first fell in love with the Guardian because of the image posted by the OP. It’s such an evocative piece of art and really hinted at the Guardian being something significantly different than the typical Paladin class featured in many MMOs. It was for this reason I chose the Guardian all the way back in the original GW2 betas and have kept playing it since, blindly hoping for an update that would one day make Spirit Weapons usable again.

If I’m being honest, this is the reason I was so initially bitter about the Dragonhunter; I didn’t feel like the Guardian deserved another underutilized utility type like Traps. I’ve since gotten more on board with the DH (although it’s certainly not perfect), but if there was one hope (and really one main reason) why I keep clinging to this profession (and maybe even GW2 at all) is that I still have a very small, nearly extinguished flicker of hope that they’ll one day give us the Guardian they promised.

xinkspillx.3914:

I certainly hope the Devs can see that with the not infrequent Spirit Weapon threads popping up on this forum, there is most certainly a serious desire to see this utility rectified.

But Revs are so shiny and new…

xinkspillx.3914:

I certainly hope the Devs can see that with the not infrequent Spirit Weapon threads popping up on this forum, there is most certainly a serious desire to see this utility rectified.

I am absolutely one of those players who first fell in love with the Guardian because of the image posted by the OP. It’s such an evocative piece of art and really hinted at the Guardian being something significantly different than the typical Paladin class featured in many MMOs. It was for this reason I chose the Guardian all the way back in the original GW2 betas and have kept playing it since, blindly hoping for an update that would one day make Spirit Weapons usable again.

If I’m being honest, this is the reason I was so initially bitter about the Dragonhunter; I didn’t feel like the Guardian deserved another underutilized utility type like Traps. I’ve since gotten more on board with the DH (although it’s certainly not perfect), but if there was one hope (and really one main reason) why I keep clinging to this profession (and maybe even GW2 at all) is that I still have a very small, nearly extinguished flicker of hope that they’ll one day give us the Guardian they promised.

I suggest you hop aboard the Rev train while you still can. We have cried our lungs out on spirit weapons virtues and shield for years now. I honestly don’t expect anything else major to change now until a balance patch

Rain.9213:

Bezagron.7352:

Been thinking further about spirit weapons & the Spirit Weapon Judgment image in the OP.

This was one of my favourite images of guardian at release & was why I unlocked each spirit weapon as soon as available. But although visibly very amazing summons with each “Balance Change” they became worse & worse.

But spirit weapons functional (cast time, cooldown, movement, targeting) need massive changes. For any interested I’ve previously posted Spirit Weapons – A Crazy Idea a redesign of SWs. The only thing I want to take from this redesign relates back to the Judgment image with how the spirit weapons seem to be chained to the guardian.

So Melee Functionality design using my redesign of SW’s, DH traps & old mobile Ranger Spirits:

• Cast Time – Reduced 0.5 sec (for the same casting experience BWE3 DH traps provided).
• Recharge – Commences once summoned. This could provide 99% summoned time for some SWs [minus recasting, eg. Sword, Bow] but also guaranteed downtime for the stronger SWs [eg. Hammer, Shield]. (again like how DH traps functioned in BWE3 allowing for pre-combat use without such a harsh punishment for being caught out near the end duration of a summon/s or ).
• Movement – No longer move about as their now chained to the guardian & travel where & how the guardian travels. So they teleport when the guardian teleports, leaps when they leap, travel at super speed when they travels at super speed. You could say movement wise they become like the old mobile spirits of Rangers (you no longer have to worry about that random SW wandering off).
• Attacking/Targeting – Only attacking foes nearby the guardian (unlike Ranger spirits they don’t directly buff the guardians auto attack but function similar to a mobile symbol).
• Command abilities – Still function the same way they currently do. This could mean Sword & Shield are more reliable positionally.
• Health – Still have health & can be killed. With increased timed summoned because of reduced cast time & recharge starting on summon this becomes a more important element of spirit weapon counter play.

I feel with this would provide a smoother experiences without SWs running all over the place & allow for easier focusing of SW’s damage applications & better control over SW’s support abilities.

What we loss is the ability for SWs to harass foes at range making this a larger negative change for ranged gameplay in this regard but could provide a positive as a large deterrent for closing into melee range helping keep foes at range while also guaranteeing benefit from SW support as their always near you.

Having SWs chained to the guardian is both a benefit & a weakness with regards to AoEs:

Weakness

• AoEs / Cleaves – First any AoE /Cleave hitting the guardian will also most likely be damaging the SWs as well.

Advantages

• Chained to Guardian – As they travel now with the guardian leaving the AoE should also remove SWs from said AoE. Now leaving in the hand of the player to remove them from AoEs not relying on an AI script.
• AoE / Cleaves Max Targets – In team / group fights SWs are going to counter towards AoE /Cleave target limits spreading the overall AoE damage over the affected targets plus SWs (Which with cast time & CD changes shouldn’t be as punishing if their killed).

This redesign is only looking at the function / gameplay & mechanics of SWs as a minion not their skill effects or benefits. As it’s not the skill effects or benefits I have problems with but how SWs function. Currently their gameplay mechanics are very awkward & clunky. They so bad that it’s too hard to tell if their skills effects & benefits need improving or not because of this.

Pretty good ideas. I was thinking of something similar in my last reply. Hopefully some devs see this and find some inspiration for a Spirit Weapon rework!

+1

Had this idea previously but didn’t know how to word it.
The only coding required is the coding that Ranger’s Spirits already utilize – make them immobile and near the Guardian.

Guardian’s basically summon spirits to take over these weapons. Why wouldn’t they act the same?

Hunter.4783:

I suggest you hop aboard the Rev train while you still can. We have cried our lungs out on spirit weapons virtues and shield for years now. I honestly don’t expect anything else major to change now until a balance patch

Hrm, lets see… Guardian forums front page has exactly one red post wherein Karl solicits feedback and then disappears… Rev forums front page has 5 active red posts wherein Roy excitedly discusses ideas and discusses changes to the class. Yep, I guess you are right.

Alent.4780:

Hunter.4783:

I suggest you hop aboard the Rev train while you still can. We have cried our lungs out on spirit weapons virtues and shield for years now. I honestly don’t expect anything else major to change now until a balance patch

Hrm, lets see… Guardian forums front page has exactly one red post wherein Karl solicits feedback and then disappears… Rev forums front page has 5 active red posts wherein Roy excitedly discusses ideas and discusses changes to the class. Yep, I guess you are right.

Of course they are. Rev is the front line of HoT, they want the Rev to be absolutely awesome and so far it looks and plays just as good.

I’m absolutely estatic with the changes we’ve gotten. It’s only a matter of whether or not Guard will survive the Power creep.

Saiyan.1704:

Alent.4780:

Hunter.4783:

I suggest you hop aboard the Rev train while you still can. We have cried our lungs out on spirit weapons virtues and shield for years now. I honestly don’t expect anything else major to change now until a balance patch

Hrm, lets see… Guardian forums front page has exactly one red post wherein Karl solicits feedback and then disappears… Rev forums front page has 5 active red posts wherein Roy excitedly discusses ideas and discusses changes to the class. Yep, I guess you are right.

Of course they are. Rev is the front line of HoT, they want the Rev to be absolutely awesome and so far it looks and plays just as good.

I’m absolutely estatic with the changes we’ve gotten. It’s only a matter of whether or not Guard will survive the Power creep.

Its about selling the expansion content. Same reason why they are now reducing Gold rewards from dungeons.

They want you to feel the NEED to get the expansion. There is no reason to make base guardian abilities better, when you can focus on expansion classes/elites in terms of making money.

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

Saiyan.1704:

Alent.4780:

Hunter.4783:

I suggest you hop aboard the Rev train while you still can. We have cried our lungs out on spirit weapons virtues and shield for years now. I honestly don’t expect anything else major to change now until a balance patch

Hrm, lets see… Guardian forums front page has exactly one red post wherein Karl solicits feedback and then disappears… Rev forums front page has 5 active red posts wherein Roy excitedly discusses ideas and discusses changes to the class. Yep, I guess you are right.

Of course they are. Rev is the front line of HoT, they want the Rev to be absolutely awesome and so far it looks and plays just as good.

I’m absolutely estatic with the changes we’ve gotten. It’s only a matter of whether or not Guard will survive the Power creep.

Its about selling the expansion content. Same reason why they are now reducing Gold rewards from dungeons.

They want you to feel the NEED to get the expansion. There is no reason to make base guardian abilities better, when you can focus on expansion classes/elites in terms of making money.

Hence why im contemplating quitting a class with over 4k hours under my belt.

You are absolutely right, base guardian abilities will NEVER see an improvement for a year or so. A best Anet will try to improve the dragonhunter, which is bound to remain the worst elite spec in the game.

Guardians already are behind the power creep, and even more so now that our elite is complete crap. The stronger other elite specs get, the farther behind we fall.

Hunter.4783:

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

Saiyan.1704:

Alent.4780:

Hunter.4783:

I suggest you hop aboard the Rev train while you still can. We have cried our lungs out on spirit weapons virtues and shield for years now. I honestly don’t expect anything else major to change now until a balance patch

Hrm, lets see… Guardian forums front page has exactly one red post wherein Karl solicits feedback and then disappears… Rev forums front page has 5 active red posts wherein Roy excitedly discusses ideas and discusses changes to the class. Yep, I guess you are right.

Of course they are. Rev is the front line of HoT, they want the Rev to be absolutely awesome and so far it looks and plays just as good.

I’m absolutely estatic with the changes we’ve gotten. It’s only a matter of whether or not Guard will survive the Power creep.

Its about selling the expansion content. Same reason why they are now reducing Gold rewards from dungeons.

They want you to feel the NEED to get the expansion. There is no reason to make base guardian abilities better, when you can focus on expansion classes/elites in terms of making money.

Hence why im contemplating quitting a class with over 4k hours under my belt.

You are absolutely right, base guardian abilities will NEVER see an improvement for a year or so. A best Anet will try to improve the dragonhunter, which is bound to remain the worst elite spec in the game.

Guardians already are behind the power creep, and even more so now that our elite is complete crap. The stronger other elite specs get, the farther behind we fall.

But we are in a good spot remember

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

But we are in a good spot remember

Guardians ARE in a good spot. Whiners.

I find Spirit Weaps in PvE kind of nice, but just that.
If they didn’t die like a lil’bieatch to cleave and AoE, and if they had longer duration and cooldown that goes down along with summoning them, then it would be just okay to run it in all aspects of the game.

There are many changes that could improve SW and leave them as they are now. (Well not really)

When casted without target they appear next to you. When casted with target Sword and hammer spawn at foes location immediately executing the command skill. Shield woul cast bubble right away when in combat, Bow cleanses condis on summon.

The cast needs to be instant or at least only 1/4 second

I like the idea of Spirit Weapons being tethered to you – as in you summon the Spirit Weapon and it’s chained to you – follows you around and attacks the targets you attack.

That concept art is one of the reasons I first made my Guardian over 3 years ago. I’d love it if Spirit Weapons could make a come back.

I think I’d rather they just became low duration damage and utility spells. Maybe last 4-8 seconds and just do something basic. Sword could just be a spinning AoE attack that follows the target its casted on. Shield could float around the Guardian and pulse AoE stab/Aegis to you and your allies. Hammer could be single target damage and CC. Bow could remain as a condi clear. Make them immune to damage since they have short duration. Could still keep the trait to add burning to spirit weapons to make them useful for Condi builds.

Although i like Minion based playstyles very much i actually never enjoyed SW.
When they stand still they look awesome, as soon as they wobble about… it becomes comedy…

So i would redesign them, not from scratch but…you will see what i mean:

1: The active commands are pretty nice, so get away from summoning stuff and then commanding the SW. If you activate, lets say, the Sword. it just spawns on Target location or where you point it to does its thing and disappears.

2. Make an Elite skill that copies our weapon (i actually would enjoy just blue flames on my weapon) which then copies our weapon skills as we do them. Lets say 60 sec CD 10-20 sec duration and minus 50% dmg and half the condi duration from our base dmg/condi time. In WoW the DK once had just this as an elite skill.

Pretty boring but with this we would have most of the utility, although some gets lost, and some selfish offensive dps elite.

Changes to the Scrapper were just released and the change I quoted below in particular makes me hopeful that Spirit Weapons will finally get an often suggested improvement like the one Gyros will be receiving (especially since this idea was first posed in regards to SW).

“Gyros now start their cooldown upon summon rather than upon gyro death. "

Additionally, Gyros have now received a boost to their movement speed so they no longer fall as far behind the Scrapper. This is also a common issue with Spirit Weapons and absolutely needs to be changed as well.

Needless to say, if Spirit Weapons don’t receive these updates with the launch of HoT or very shortly after, I’ll take it as a clear sign that Guardian is being ignored. Clearly these changes are not beyond the abilities of the development team and could be enacted rather easily, since the Scrapper will see these changes and several more before launch.

If we could see the Spirit Weapons gifted with the effective targeting of the Necromancer Minions along with the above changes, I think we’d find this set of utilities to be in significantly better shape.

I really hope the Devs don’t let me down here. I’d feel pretty darn disheartened if they did.

Thanks xinkspillx for the information. If acted on this could be quite positive.

Mercurias.1826:

Cat Has Ducks.1982:

But we are in a good spot remember

Guardians ARE in a good spot. Whiners.

Right. Pointing out that we could use changes (and being validated while at the same time snubbed by other classes receiving those changes) is whining.

Very helpful – thank you for your constructive contribution to the thread.