Guild Wars 2

For those unaware this weeks Ready Up will give us “the first look at how the Dragon Hunter fares in PvP.”

“Ready Up has finished. Check the YouTube link below to see a replay of the stream.”

Thanks for the shout out!

I see traps being most useful in everything except full valor/meditation builds. We never really had a bursty-damaging utility so it’ll be quite interesting. I’m curious if any damage or mechanical changes were made since the ready up.

Excited!

Static npc thief for showing pvp trap skills?
That warrior in stream is bad….only one trap in pvp? GG

You saw dragonhunter with below mediocre warrior, what about skilled players??

Overall….bad. 2/10 (viable in pve)

with this 6/6/6 they destroyed most of our usefull builds like
2/1/6/1/4
0/1/6/6/1

Well that was disappointing…

• Medi Guard will still be meta in PVP.

• DragonHunters are over powered against Thief’s who stand there and do nothing.

• Traps still look horrible for PVP.

That’s about it, anyone notice anything else?

1st video :
Kill static afk target with traps = win in pvp. Love it. You made it this time. Hooray.
2nd video:
Below mediocre warrior vs DH – you saw what you saw → I am scared of those announced nerfs to a class that gets killed by hambow (I never die by hambow in pvp). I am scared for future of guardians with LB.

He didn’t seem to have much trouble getting his traps to trigger..

I don’t know why people have this belief that a trap or aoe is only good if the enemy is on it for the entire duration. You’re usually not using them for the damage. its for the conditions which stay after you leave the trap.

That video was very disappointing though..

only saw the fights versus the warrior – didnt see much new here. basic medbuild with hammer. the LB could changed to scepter/focus which perform better compare to what i saw.

so meta still be the meta….:(

i tough we could see some carrion build activities

One thing that caught my eye and I hope this isn’t going to be an issue but I saw a lot of “obstructed” notifications when Grouch was using Long Bow. I was hoping this wouldn’t be a huge issue since Scepter has this problem already.

He had 17k hp in the video. What amulet was he using? That seems a little bit high even for zerker.

messiah.1908:

the LB could changed to scepter/focus which perform better compare to what i saw.

This.

Sceptre/Focus would have been extremely superior over the LongBow.
He still uses Shelter heal, still uses Medi skills.
The only trap he used was the elite trap and with sceptres immobilize you could swap that out for something more useful like the new elite shout or the cookie cutter Renewed Focus.

Overall Dragon Hunter seems really useless in PVP.

Ok… seriously. How would DH immediately displacing the current Guardian meta be a good thing? What you’re describing would be pure, unadulterated Power Creep and it’s not a desirable outcome. New professions should introduce new interactions for the top players to be aware of, but honestly even the Devs don’t have a great feel for what the optimal DH set up is and comparing that newborn colt-level of performance with the alpha predator that’s been refined over the course of years is just silly.

They did this god awfull pvp video to show us how much DH sucks and they did it Plus they announced more nerfs haha funny thing Nerfing something that is already useless

Correct me if I’m wrong, but, last time I checked, Guardian wasn’t even a part of the meta.
What does this add to the Guardian, knowing it’s less optimal than Meditation Guard?

Nike.2631:

Ok… seriously. How would DH immediately displacing the current Guardian meta be a good thing? What you’re describing would be pure, unadulterated Power Creep and it’s not a desirable outcome. New professions should introduce new interactions for the top players to be aware of, but honestly even the Devs don’t have a great feel for what the optimal DH set up is and comparing that newborn colt-level of performance with the alpha predator that’s been refined over the course of years is just silly.

^This.

and if it had been so good that it would defiitely repl,ace the current fad there’d be people complaining that their builds were now obsolete..

you can’t please anyone…

Nike.2631:

Ok… seriously. How would DH immediately displacing the current Guardian meta be a good thing?.

I agree with you, but keep in mind that Guardians have been ignored since launch of the game, Medi guard is the bread and butter for everything and after two-three years it has become extremely stale (at least for me).

I didn’t expect Dragon Hunter to be superior to Medi Guard, but i was hoping it would have at least been a viable option.

As it currently stands Dragon Hunter is considerably weaker then our Core Traits for both PVP and PVE.

A few minutes of DH video and no real game play or actual theorycrafting but DH is considered useless?

I saw something completely different that works very well with Meditations just based off of the footage. Now if they showed group play through the DH perspective, that’d have been better but at least we saw how traps will work, amongst other things.

Did anyone notice that they kept the 3 stacks of might you gain per block trait.

When they were showing the new traits the devs were thinking of changing it but kept it so far for in the dueling demo they just showed.

I’ll gladly take 3 stacks of might per block over anything else for how insanely strong it can be with certain builds.

They should make the new courage virtue proc “block” so it can synagize with other blocking traits / runes .

Other then that I was hoping they would of showed different builds in spvp, while dueling the warrior that wasn’t meditation (no offense medi guards, just wanna see something new)

I can see both scepter/focus and longbow being a thing (lb+hammer or scepter/focus+hammer). I’m very happy that the virtues seem okay. At first they were terrible in my eyes but now it seems they are something worth taking.

So don’t play it problem solved for you and the people that want to play dh. I think the class looks great, I’ll play it. You don’t like it? Don’t play it. Everyone is happy

Nike.2631:

Ok… seriously. How would DH immediately displacing the current Guardian meta be a good thing? What you’re describing would be pure, unadulterated Power Creep and it’s not a desirable outcome. New professions should introduce new interactions for the top players to be aware of, but honestly even the Devs don’t have a great feel for what the optimal DH set up is and comparing that newborn colt-level of performance with the alpha predator that’s been refined over the course of years is just silly.

I agree with you here. It seems that Dragon Hunter isn’t even being used as a different playstyle, just a method to augment a current playstyle (medi-burst). It is also really lame the number of instants used in his burst, including smite condition proccing at the START of the heal (not only doing great burst during a nearly invuln heal, but also healing extra due to monk’s focus).

It seems all that DH is bringing to the table is a superior ranged option and extra mobility for what medis already use.

Of course, this was all just Grouch creating a build…now imagine someone that is VERY experienced with guardian trying to make something that is broken…

Well at least we know DH beats thief 100 – 0 when thief doesn’t fight back : P lol

I’m not convinced until I try it out myself.

I don’t end up in a lot of 1vs1 only situtations. I want to try that stuff out.

Sylent.3165:

So don’t play it problem solved for you and the people that want to play dh. I think the class looks great, I’ll play it. You don’t like it? Don’t play it. Everyone is happy

You do know he is talking about the 3 line restriction and how the elite doesnt make up for that loss right?

“[Hambow Warrior] is really strong again.” – Josh

Lets not forget he said the warrior was using a modified Hambow build. It’s stronger than your typical Hambow meta.

Virtues
These were stronger than I thought. We practically have a Gear shield and a 4k damaging peel. How do you not choose Renewed Focus for these awesome Virtues? Dragon’s Maw elite seemed like a gimmick in comparison. DM would need a cripple or slow effect for me to even consider it.

Bow vs Scepter
It’s was apparent that the Bow will be better utilized in Groups rather than 1v1 fights. Regardless, who wouldn’t choose Focus against a Hambow warrior? Grouch was practically in Scepter range all 4 fights and he didn’t do a great job negating Hammer bursts. Not that he could with a bow. Aside from that, the Bow performed about the same, if not better, than a Warrior’s bow. DH’s Bow is also more skillful… Grouch couldn’t aim True Shot to save his life! (literally)..

The match-up would have been more interesting against a Ranger or Mesmer.

tl/dr
If you’re 6 in Valor you might as well go full meditations. I don’t see any traps replacing any meditation utility. Not even the Elite. I still see traps being utilized in high bursty-condi builds; as well as, non meditation builds. The bow’s performance was as expected against a modified hambow warrior. The bow required more skill; it was definitely more unforgiving compared to gs/ham/sc/sw.

Ragnarox.9601:

Static npc thief for showing pvp trap skills?
That warrior in stream is bad….only one trap in pvp? GG

You saw dragonhunter with below mediocre warrior, what about skilled players??

Overall….bad. 2/10 (viable in pve)

with this 6/6/6 they destroyed most of our usefull builds like
2/1/6/1/4
0/1/6/6/1

I don’t have a problem with 6/6/6 way of doing things. Shout builds, Medi builds, etc. are still there. They just prioritizing what we already had. No need to weigh whether or not 2 in zeal is better than 2 in Honor or vice versa. Not to mention this will help below average guardians who like running weird builds like 3/4/5/0/2 or w/e…

I’m all for the new trait changes.

I will have to take a look at this when i get home, but I am assuming the build he used was blah, and all the players were all below average, just from the general reaction. I was hoping they would actually use some submitted builds from the forum, but it sounds like not.

I don’t think that Shield of Courage actually blocks but rather just destroys, maybe i’m missing something. Also the potential strafing of the LB auto is worrisome as well. I don’t think the new elite will replace RF, it’s too niche. Also, the remark of nerfing the immobilization was surprising to hear.

I noticed, that the virtues had a really low cooldown, they were at around 15/30/45 which is half of the normal cooldown.

Sakrasta.6538:

I noticed, that the virtues had a really low cooldown, they were at around 15/30/45 which is half of the normal cooldown.

He was specced into virtues so it should have been lowered but not by that much. Good catch.

Arnath.2319:

The only trap he used was the elite trap and with sceptres immobilize you could swap that out for something more useful like the new elite shout or the cookie cutter Renewed Focus.

Were tomes actually already replaced in that build of the game?

I don’t think the times had been replaced at that point, so DM was probably the best bet to show of the possibilities with such a skill. JI to DM was a good combo, being essentially a JI to RoW.

Also, DM does have the slow effect

Fashion Mage.3712:

Arnath.2319:

The only trap he used was the elite trap and with sceptres immobilize you could swap that out for something more useful like the new elite shout or the cookie cutter Renewed Focus.

Were tomes actually already replaced in that build of the game?

I dont think so, they are probably still getting feedback from the thread.
Was DM Ground targeted in the video ?

Arken.3725:

I don’t think that Shield of Courage actually blocks but rather just destroys, maybe i’m missing something. Also the potential strafing of the LB auto is worrisome as well. I don’t think the new elite will replace RF, it’s too niche. Also, the remark of nerfing the immobilization was surprising to hear.

I really hope you’re wrong. its annoying enough that zealots defense doesn’t actually block attacks on a class thats all about blocks and protection, but then change our aegis virtue to not block and kill any possible synergy with the traits..

rajule.8054:

Arken.3725:

I don’t think that Shield of Courage actually blocks but rather just destroys, maybe i’m missing something. Also the potential strafing of the LB auto is worrisome as well. I don’t think the new elite will replace RF, it’s too niche. Also, the remark of nerfing the immobilization was surprising to hear.

I really hope you’re wrong. its annoying enough that zealots defense doesn’t actually block attacks on a class thats all about blocks and protection, but then change our aegis virtue to not block and kill any possible synergy with the traits..

I think they mentioned it still gives aegis on use though

Vizardlorde.8243:

rajule.8054:

Arken.3725:

I don’t think that Shield of Courage actually blocks but rather just destroys, maybe i’m missing something. Also the potential strafing of the LB auto is worrisome as well. I don’t think the new elite will replace RF, it’s too niche. Also, the remark of nerfing the immobilization was surprising to hear.

I really hope you’re wrong. its annoying enough that zealots defense doesn’t actually block attacks on a class thats all about blocks and protection, but then change our aegis virtue to not block and kill any possible synergy with the traits..

I think they mentioned it still gives aegis on use though

It will still pulse aegis when it’s off cooldown, but activating it only creates the shield.

Saiyan.1704:

Virtues
These were stronger than I thought. We practically have a Gear shield and a 4k damaging peel. How do you not choose Renewed Focus for these awesome Virtues? Dragon’s Maw elite seemed like a gimmick in comparison. DM would need a cripple or slow effect for me to even consider it.

It does Slow It also basically creates a Ring of Warding when it’s triggered. I can see it being use in the same way, only you don’t have to bring Hammer to get that kind of CC utility.

I feel like the Medi Hambow build they were showing off wasn’t really the best example of what Dragonhunter could bring to Guardians, since as many people have pointed out, other than the virtues, what the DH can bring to Medi Guards, most current Guard skills/traits could work just as well, if not better. I’d rather see them do something off the wall, like a condi trap build, or maybe kind of anti-Thief bunker that used the revealed from Light’s Judgement to pop people out of stealth (which is what they kinda did at the start of the first video, but actually showing a Guard vs. Thief fight, not Guard slamming a passive Thief.) Sell us on something Guardians can’t do now, not a side-grade to something that’s already being done.

The very first clip intrigued me. With 4 traps that thief disintegrated, and though the guardian would be left without 4 skills, I could see that kind of #yolo defense to be deadly if the guardian could hide. People would have to be careful of any “empty” point, lest there be 4 traps and a guardian hidden behind some environment.

Ghotistyx.6942:

The very first clip intrigued me. With 4 traps that thief disintegrated, and though the guardian would be left without 4 skills, I could see that kind of #yolo defense to be deadly if the guardian could hide. People would have to be careful of any “empty” point, lest there be 4 traps and a guardian hidden behind some environment.

Or you know the thief could dodge through the 4 traps once and kill the guardian. If the thief is carrying a sword he can even ignore DM with shadow return lol. The trick might work once in a match but after they know you are not a meditation guardian you are as good as dead if you are running zerker.

Vizardlorde.8243:

Or you know the thief could dodge through the 4 traps once and kill the guardian. If the thief is carrying a sword he can even ignore DM with shadow return lol. The trick might work once in a match but after they know you are not a meditation guardian you are as good as dead if you are running zerker.

Yea why didnt they do pvp vs a thief and not the hambow warrior without skill ? Because they know DH sucks vs other classes.

Ragnarox.9601:

Vizardlorde.8243:

Or you know the thief could dodge through the 4 traps once and kill the guardian. If the thief is carrying a sword he can even ignore DM with shadow return lol. The trick might work once in a match but after they know you are not a meditation guardian you are as good as dead if you are running zerker.

Yea why didnt they do pvp vs a thief and not the hambow warrior without skill ? Because they know DH sucks vs other classes.

Guess you failed to see all the big numbers. are you upset because anet is gonna force you to land them and you know, play the game?

DragonHunter is actually gonna be really strong both 1v1 and team fights.

hambow because that’s hugh’s main.

google.3709:

Ragnarox.9601:

Vizardlorde.8243:

Or you know the thief could dodge through the 4 traps once and kill the guardian. If the thief is carrying a sword he can even ignore DM with shadow return lol. The trick might work once in a match but after they know you are not a meditation guardian you are as good as dead if you are running zerker.

Yea why didnt they do pvp vs a thief and not the hambow warrior without skill ? Because they know DH sucks vs other classes.

Guess you failed to see all the big numbers. are you upset because anet is gonna force you to land them and you know, play the game?

DragonHunter is actually gonna be really strong both 1v1 and team fights.

hambow because that’s hugh’s main.

have you ever played a staff necro? the #1 rule is never clump your traps together and #2 avoid pre-casting any marks except blood (short cd). Know why? because if you clump all marks/traps in 1 spot 1 dodge triggers them all at once for the grand to tal of 0 damage, 0 conditions. And if you pre- cast marks instead of dropping them on you enemy skilled players have an easier time avoiding them.

Vizardlorde.8243:

google.3709:

Ragnarox.9601:

Vizardlorde.8243:

Or you know the thief could dodge through the 4 traps once and kill the guardian. If the thief is carrying a sword he can even ignore DM with shadow return lol. The trick might work once in a match but after they know you are not a meditation guardian you are as good as dead if you are running zerker.

Yea why didnt they do pvp vs a thief and not the hambow warrior without skill ? Because they know DH sucks vs other classes.

Guess you failed to see all the big numbers. are you upset because anet is gonna force you to land them and you know, play the game?

DragonHunter is actually gonna be really strong both 1v1 and team fights.

hambow because that’s hugh’s main.

have you ever played a staff necro? the #1 rule is never clump your traps together and #2 avoid pre-casting any marks except blood (short cd). Know why? because if you clump all marks/traps in 1 spot 1 dodge triggers them all at once for the grand to tal of 0 damage, 0 conditions. And if you pre- cast marks instead of dropping them on you enemy skilled players have an easier time avoiding them.

One thing that’s different though is enemies can see those marks beforehand. with traps they’re not gonna know where they are unless they see you cast it.

rajule.8054:

Vizardlorde.8243:

google.3709:

Ragnarox.9601:

Vizardlorde.8243:

Or you know the thief could dodge through the 4 traps once and kill the guardian. If the thief is carrying a sword he can even ignore DM with shadow return lol. The trick might work once in a match but after they know you are not a meditation guardian you are as good as dead if you are running zerker.

Yea why didnt they do pvp vs a thief and not the hambow warrior without skill ? Because they know DH sucks vs other classes.

Guess you failed to see all the big numbers. are you upset because anet is gonna force you to land them and you know, play the game?

DragonHunter is actually gonna be really strong both 1v1 and team fights.

hambow because that’s hugh’s main.

have you ever played a staff necro? the #1 rule is never clump your traps together and #2 avoid pre-casting any marks except blood (short cd). Know why? because if you clump all marks/traps in 1 spot 1 dodge triggers them all at once for the grand to tal of 0 damage, 0 conditions. And if you pre- cast marks instead of dropping them on you enemy skilled players have an easier time avoiding them.

One thing that’s different though is enemies can see those marks beforehand. with traps they’re not gonna know where they are unless they see you cast it.

Not to mention that most of the traps do things over time. Its not all that initial effect. Even if they dodge through it if they want to get out there gonna have to dodge out. Which I would imagine is gonna hit them with the cage trap at the very least. Also if there in dragons maw its likely there just gonna get pulled back into the center while all teh trap effects are still pulsing.

The cage (cant remember the name) and the dragons maw trap do a good job of making sure the blade style trap and the reveal trap do there jobs.

Vizardlorde.8243:

Ghotistyx.6942:

The very first clip intrigued me. With 4 traps that thief disintegrated, and though the guardian would be left without 4 skills, I could see that kind of #yolo defense to be deadly if the guardian could hide. People would have to be careful of any “empty” point, lest there be 4 traps and a guardian hidden behind some environment.

Or you know the thief could dodge through the 4 traps once and kill the guardian. If the thief is carrying a sword he can even ignore DM with shadow return lol. The trick might work once in a match but after they know you are not a meditation guardian you are as good as dead if you are running zerker.

This might be true if all the DH traps pulsed once ala necro marks and almost every currently existing trap skill and that’s the end of it, but they don’t. Light’s Judgement keeps pulsing 25 vuln stacks and revealed for 10 second, Procession of Blades strikes multiple times before disappearing, Fragments of Faith leaves behind pickups you can run over for aegis, Dragon’s Maw leaves a ring of Warding, and it isn’t triggering Test of Faith that does damage, it’s trying to walk out of the area after it’s been triggered. That leaves just the Heal trap, which would still heal the Dragonhunter by at least 6k once someone triggers it.

And here I was hoping that we might actually get to see something interesting, and instead its “hey, lets make a guardian hambow build hur hur hur” I was REALLY hoping we were going to get a serious build that actually utilizes some different possibilities… but i guess i hoped for way to much.

These people know what’s up. Traps are invisible and they aren’t just one and done deals. It will be riskier once they know you’re full traps no doubt, but then each time they reach a capture point, they’ve got some decisions to make. Are there traps there or no? Are all the traps there, or just some, and which? Is the guardian there? Are other players there? You can make some mixups, you don’t have to use the same strategy every single time.

I’m not saying full traps is the be all end all either, just listing some possibilities.

rajule.8054:

Vizardlorde.8243:

google.3709:

Ragnarox.9601:

Vizardlorde.8243:

Or you know the thief could dodge through the 4 traps once and kill the guardian. If the thief is carrying a sword he can even ignore DM with shadow return lol. The trick might work once in a match but after they know you are not a meditation guardian you are as good as dead if you are running zerker.

Yea why didnt they do pvp vs a thief and not the hambow warrior without skill ? Because they know DH sucks vs other classes.

Guess you failed to see all the big numbers. are you upset because anet is gonna force you to land them and you know, play the game?

DragonHunter is actually gonna be really strong both 1v1 and team fights.

hambow because that’s hugh’s main.

have you ever played a staff necro? the #1 rule is never clump your traps together and #2 avoid pre-casting any marks except blood (short cd). Know why? because if you clump all marks/traps in 1 spot 1 dodge triggers them all at once for the grand to tal of 0 damage, 0 conditions. And if you pre- cast marks instead of dropping them on you enemy skilled players have an easier time avoiding them.

One thing that’s different though is enemies can see those marks beforehand. with traps they’re not gonna know where they are unless they see you cast it.

Marks can be laid under your enemy’s feet for an instant proc. Traps will be losing their ground targeting and will have an activation time.

I only caught the end of the stream with the duel against the warrior, but I was not at all impressed by the elite trap. One stunbreak and the guy was in the clear, and suddenly your elite skill is wasted.

The bow looks neat. I found it funny that the only trap he used in the warrior duel was the elite trap, and how incredibly ineffective it ended up being.

Overall, still not impressed. I’m really bummed that we won’t be able to just take the bow and leave the elite spec in the dust, because I have no interest in the traps or traits.

I just want to point out that if you stack the elite trap with the rest you can’t just dodge out since you will be CC’ed so will have to stun break. Also the elite’s viability really depends on the CD but I can see a gs/(bow or sc/f) medi guard build where you can actually land the full damage of gs #2 by setting up with Elite+JI. Although his build would suffer in the 1v1 but may prove to be deadly in teamfights.

I think the PvP portion was alright. He’s shown us that traps activate pretty much instantly if you Tele-drop them.

He’s also shown that the cooldowns of the virtues will be shorter for Dragonhunters and range spammer Guardians are probably going to be a nuisance.

Black Box.9312:

The bow looks neat. I found it funny that the only trap he used in the warrior duel was the elite trap, and how incredibly ineffective it ended up being.

Overall, still not impressed. I’m really bummed that we won’t be able to just take the bow and leave the elite spec in the dust, because I have no interest in the traps or traits.

Ineffective? He used it at several good moments that saved him from getting pummeled. Don’t let your judgement be clouded by the rest of the video being unimpressive.

I know we all wanted to see something that we couldn’t possibly come up with but I think that’s really up to us find out when the expansion launches.